Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

I think you are better of with a m4/3 camera which has a 2x crop so it will double the focal lengths of the lens you use + you have a very usable ETC mode which adds another 2,5 times zoom, so if I calculate right a 200mm f2.8 lens on a full frame camera can become a 1000mm f2.8 on a panasonic g6.
see below video which was shot with the g6 and etc mode used.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Thanks Noah

I was just thinking of the 50mbs and the lightness of the camera i use a 320 and in these days i wonder if there is any need for such a big camera, got the RX10 but lacks a bit of zoom range great camera all the same

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Depends what you're doing - if lowlight performance is important to you, massive telephoto reach maybe less so, this may have a lot to offer.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

I tend to agree. Remember the A7s is a consumer camera so will probably be priced as such. If you want to do 'low light' really well, take a look at this John de Borman clip in the referenced article. Personally, I think this is what true 'low light' capability should look like and all this from a camera which is 'only' 2K! (not withstanding a great lens too...)

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

I could definitely make good use of the low-light capabilities of this camera. There were many times I'd shoot an event for a client where the available light was much less than optimum (like a candlelight vigil, for example). It would be really nice to get a clean image that looks well lit under those situations. Even opening the iris to maximum, lowering the shutter speed, or boosting gain on the camcorder won't cut it for some things I've had to shoot.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

low light without adequate latitude is useless.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Are you referring to the a7s? Or is it generally speaking?

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

(SR5) Sony Luxemburg leaks A7s and RX100M3 price (2295 and 849 Euro). Shipment in July. | sonyalpharumors

"A7s: And right now the official Sony Luxemburg store has listed the final A7s price which is set at 2295 Euro! Shipment will be late July! The same store sets the price of the A7r at 1899 Euro. That makes the A7s 20% more expensive. We can speculate the price in US to be 20% higher than the A7r too ($2295 here at Amazon). It would mean the A7s could price could be around $2750."

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Like probably many I was hoping it would be around the gh4 prize but for a full frame camera and taking the other a7 model pricing into consideration it was to be expected that this would not be the case. Now that I have seen how much cleaner the gh4 is at 6400 iso compared to the gh3 I"ll settle for that instead, for my kind of work 6400 iso coupled with a 12mm f2.0 lens should be able to get me through even the darkest receptions and still have a dof that is manageable. The canon 5dIII however seems to have a serious competitor now when it comes to delivering video and the low light throne will go to the sony instead.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Sonyalpharumors did their math wrong since the A7r price was a temporary discount, so based on the no sale price this signals a US price of closer to $2500.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Right on the money! B&H has the A7S for preorder at $2,498, body only. B&H Photo Video Sony A7S

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

DR is spec is stated to be 15.3 stops. Nikon D800 is DxOmark measured at 14.4 in still RAW. DxOmark DR measurement for RED Dragon is 14.8.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

But that's DR for a still vs a frame grab, right..?

-- peer

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Yes, so this issue is how much of still RAW DR transfers to the S Log 2 profile. Den Lennie says that the A7s has DR similar to his F5.

The real issue is that measured DR drops drastically as you go beyond base ISO. The A7s has outstanding performance at higher ISO, and this should mean that the A7s has less decrease in DR as ISO increases, so that it has the potential to be DR king above base ISO.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Limited supply of Sony A7s tracked to arrive today, Wednesday July 2.

Sony Alpha a7S

Just in time for the holiday weekend!

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Yes, but A7s on DxOmark (apples to apples) DR is only 13.2

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

S-Log2 can only hold 14 stops, so there is no way to record more than 14 stops with the A7s at this time.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

This card does NOT record XAVC-S on the A7s.

Panasonic RP-SDUC32GAK

This card DOES record XAVC-S on the A7s.

Panasonic RP-SDUC64GAK

Though this thread is NOT discussing it, this is also the case on the Sony FDR-AX100 4k camcorder.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

so the Panasonic SDXC DOES and the Panasonic SDHC does not. although both are U3 cards?

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

That's correct.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

The AX100 requires that the card be formatted with exFAT. SDXC cards (64GB+) are exFAT; SDHC cards, like the 32GB one, are not likely formatted that way. The problem is most likely the card formatting, not the physical card.

Check the formats of the cards.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

To shoot XAVC-s on the A7s you must have a 64gb card or higher. You can still shoot AVCHD on smaller cards, but not XAVC-s, regardless of speed. It's in the manual. I got two...killer cameras. Unreal in low light, great handling, etc.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

The manuals are quite clear on this, you need SDXC for XAVC-S, SDHC cannot be used.

SDHC cannot be reliably formatted using anything other than Fat16 or Fat32 as the controllers and error correction processes built in to the cards are designed purely for these formats. It is possible to format an SDHC card using another standard, but it won't be reliable and there is a high likelihood of data loss. So Sony won't allow it.

SDXC is designed to work reliably with ExFat which allows for the larger file sizes that are common when shooting using higher bit rate codecs such as XAVC-S.

As there is very little price difference between SDXC and SDHC there is little reason to remain restricted to small files, segmented clips and all the other issues that come with SDHC and Fat16 or Fat32.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

This A7s is NUTS! Really incredible camera and I'm VERY surprised that Sony actually made this thing.

The amount of internal Sony "cannibalism" potential between their upper models and this A7s seems to be unusually high for Sony to tolerate. In past years, I can't remember any $2,500 Sony camera challenging it's 10,000+ models so aggressively.

When I was at NAB 2013 I noticed that many Sony "pro" staff seemed a little "uneasy" when I asked them what they thought of the "consumer" A7s compared to their F3 / F5 / F55 / FS700.

This is NOT a direct quote, this just sums up the "feeling" I got from the Pro Sony guys: "Oh God, what is Sony doing to us with this CONSUMER DIVISION thing...are they mad?" lol

Anyway, Sony snagged another $2,500 of mine and I just added this to my existing Sony collection! ;-)

I did a quick Gain/ISO test. I simply scrolled up through the ISO values and spoke them out as I recorded them in XAVC-S. I then popped the card into my AX100 and noted the gain values that are displayed on playback.

Here they are with S-LOG2 turned on:

ISO 3,200 = 12db
ISO 4,000 = 15db
ISO 5,000 = 15db
ISO 6,400 = 18db
ISO 8,000 = 21db
ISO 10,000 = 21db
ISO 12,800 = 24db
ISO 16,000 = 27db
ISO 20,000 = 27db
ISO 25,600 = 30db
ISO 32,000 = 33db
ISO 40,000 = 33db
ISO 51,200 = 36db
ISO 64,000 = 39db
ISO 80,000 = 39db
ISO 12,0400 = 42db
ISO 128,000 = 45db
ISO 160,000 = 45db
ISO 204,800 = 48db
ISO 256,000 = 51db
ISO 320,000 = 54db
ISO 409,000 = 54db

Crazy....really really crazy numbers here...

Luv it

CT

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

This is not a very flattering video for the Sony A7s..... I'm considering a purchase but after seeing this I'm going to wait to see if someone comes up with a better video displaying the full attributes of this camera.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

My wife once had one of those very cheap handicams that could do 200x zoom...:)
From what I have seen 80.000 iso seems usable, once above that the noise becomes very noticeable but just the fact that it can is quite amazing. I have seen my ax100 goes to 33db of gain but iit looks like 24db of gain on my cx730, numbers don't always say all about sensitivity it appears as you probably have to take sensorsize into consideration as well.

agree, I have seen beautiful looking demos made for/by Sony but the "a7s looks" video you linked to doesn't even come close, in fact if that video was a representation of what the camera could do I wouldn't buy it at half the price, the a7s seems like a camera that requires some experience to get the most out of it but as shown before it can deliver if operated by the right persons.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Agreed. Looking forward to more samples of something besides S-Log. More of what the camera can do without intense color correction and grading.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Do you guys think the A7s could work as a deep dof run&gun type video camera in full auto? So like lock it at F8, put a native aps-c lens on there, set it to full auto and go? Given it's great sensor in low light I figure maybe that means it's auto focus in video could be more accurate than on other camera gear, so I could dual purpose it as a full frame shallow dof bokeh low light monster when needed but also use it for times when I need deep dof full auto good low light video performance. I wonder if this camera could be a master of both (for video, not stills).

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

I too wouldn't buy it based on this video but if you watch it in HD and stop it to gaze at various frames, the details in that low light footage is pretty amazing. To my eye, it looks like it definitely needs some grading but the detail is there. The darker scenes just need to have the shadows brought up and some chroma added back in. In the right hands, the A7S is an amazing camera. The whole "its a poor carpenter who blames his hammer," comes to mind but I believe this camera will prove to be a pretty decent hammer (not literally) for the cost of admission. I know I'm trying to justify buying one.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

dslr and full auto don't go together, especially not full frame camera's, I highly doubt the autofcus to be very efficient in dark environments. This is not a run and gun camera, focus is always tricky on a full frame camera. If you want deep dof and good auto functionality, sort of a set and forget camera then get a videocamera with a smaller sensor.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Noa is right the A7s is not at its best for run n gun auto mode, but you can stop it down pretty far in low light with high iso and still have a clean image, you don't need to film full frame either, it has an aps-c mode too.
This was filmed in asp-c mode with full auto


this is not my footage and it definitely has some issues but here's what the shooter said

"Our first shoot with the Sony A7S. Shot 1080p60 1/60th shutter with Picture Profile 7 (Slog2), with Color Mode changed to Cinema.



Graded in Premiere Pro CC using color curves and saturation, the same setting applied to all clips. The goal was to see how well the A7S handled skintones under very challenging, changing lighting conditions: low light, multicolor spots, etc. NR was only used on the first clip (very very low light).



Shot handheld using the Sony SEL18-200mm APS-C lens (FS700 kit lens), AUTO ISO, AWB, AF (center spot focus area), IS, manual zoom, built in mics. With this lens and settings, the A7S makes an excellent low-light live/event camera."

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Those subjects he followed are well lit but like Peter asked for "deep dof full auto good low light video performance" is asking a bit too much from any camera, even smaller sensor ones. I at least would never trust a dslr in autofocus or any other tracking mode when the lights are low.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

I guess I should have elaborated on what I meant by "low light", I meant more indoor type lighting and not a moonlight type situation. In my mind outdoors is good light, indoors is low light, and night shots are no light. My bad, I should have been more clear on that.

That video Ade linked is really interesting and is actually what I had in mind, going with aps-c lens to get slightly deeper dof, then keep the camera stopped down to f8-ish to get dof even deeper and hope the sensor can still scoop up enough light to have af work for video while tracking people. This is more for a backup cam really as I use the AX100 for everything and need a backup in case it happened to break on location. I thought of just getting another AX100 as a backup, but have been contemplating an A7s. My theory was that it could work as a full auto run&gun backup camera with indoor lighting if I used it with an aps-c lens and at f8, but then as a bonus I'd have an amazing full frame camera that I could use at f1.4 if I wanted to for other work. I wasn't sure how well the af would perform on it, but after seeing the above video it makes me think it might just work since my filming and lighting situations aren't as challenging as that fashion show video. Thanks a bunch for that link!

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Here is another video by this guy. Good lord! Everything looks bad here. I can barely discern a difference. I think he screwed up on his compression settings or something...... these cameras can't be this bad! If I had a choice though I'd go with the 5D3.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

I can't wait to get mine with the Atomos Shogun!

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

I don't think so either I mentioned this is my mini review of the A7s which can be seen on my website.
The camera shines on a tripod or monopod but once handheld you have to be careful on how you pan and move with the camera.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Really? I beg to differ. And if you shoot in 60P NO rolling shutter.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Michael,

Why do you say there will be no rolling shutter in 60p? The camera does not have a global shutter so no matter what mode you are shooting in my understanding is that you are going to get that lovely rolling shutter skew if you move the camera very much.

Philip Bloom makes it clear in his review of the A7s that is has pretty bad skewing with the rolling shutter and I think he would have mentioned if shooting 60p magically solved that.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

The Bloom review was a bit of a shocker. Interesting to note he preferred the APS-C format option with FF lenses connected via the Metabones Speed Booster and that's the way I would use it too.

Re: New Sony A7s to shoot 4K video
 

Do you see it in my sample clips? I'm hand holding it and doing some whip pans here. I'm not saying it's not there in every case but I really don't shoot zoomed in and whip the camera horizontally.