Shoulder and Handheld stablizers.
 

Hey guys, I was wondering what you would recommond by way of Shoulder or handheld stablizers for the XL2. I was looking at Steadicam systems but I don't have $7,000 to spend on this at the moment. Is there anything which is a little less costly and can produce similar results?

Oh and, would you recommend this one?

Thanks ahead of time,
Mike

That won't produce Steadicam-like results. However, there are a number of systems that are less expensive than the Tiffen Flyer (Steadicam) that use the same principles, such as the Glidecam 4000/Smooth Shooter, the Magiqcam and the Varizoom Hollywood Lite.

I suggest you check out the FigRig from Manfrotto. It's a very hot item right now and is certainly worthy of the attention it is getting.
Dave M.

The FigRig may be a great idea for smaller camcorders, but definitely not for larger cameras like the XL2.

Hi Chris,
As I have not used it, but have only read about it I'll take your word on that.
Thanks,
Dave M.

thanks alot everyone, this will steer me in the right direction for sure.

Ho-hoo! My DV Rig Pro XL is arriving from B&H any minute now. I'm going to go shave and shower before I put it on!

Spider Brace. Simple and inexpensive. Moves the weight nicely to the shoulder. Uses your arms to float. Trivial to put down when not shooting.

"Ho-hoo! My DV Rig Pro XL is arriving from B&H any minute now. I'm going to go shave and shower before I put it on!"

Jack you will love it. I have the DVRig PRO as I shoot with Sony VX cameras, and the build of Danny's units are fantastic. Danny from DVTech, the builder is also a frequent visitor to these forums, so if you have any questions or suggestions, feel free to ask him, as he is very helpful and prompt with his replies.

Michael

It certainly looks sturdy, however the warning,
"CAUTION! READ THIS FIRST!
The support pod is spring loaded! Handle with care.
To avoid possible physical or property damage to your body..."
etc., etc., has kinda put me off for the moment. I put it back in the box.

Also, a little disappointed that there is no case at all - not even a cheap one. I eventually saw that it is an optional accessory, but couldn't find it at their web site or at the B&H site. Emailed them and they said they didn't make one and referred me to the Porta Brace site. No biggie, though.

I'm looking forward to using it in the real world. I think I'm going to need someone to hold me by the belt for guidance when I do. I've been know to walk into things and fall down the stairs and I sure don't want to do it wearing 20 lbs of cam and gear!

Disappointed
 

Well I tried it out for about half an hour and my right arm feels like it's gonna fall off. Over at DVXUser.com, they did a review with pix and really liked it, which is one of the reasons I bought it. Toward the end of the review, they said something like, "...after you've tweaked a few knobs and shifted the brace around a little, the camera should balance on it's own with your hands off." Well, that would be wonderful if it could be that balanced, but they were writing about the DVRig Pro (2 handles), not the DVRig XL (1 handle), so maybe it's not to be. Truth be told, I'm a little disappointed, 'specially for $550.

Balance shouldn't have anything to do with the number of handles, it's all about weight distribution of the components. A properly balanced shoulder stabilizer should result in the camera sitting in place such that you don't have any weight to speak of in your hands. Unless I am misunderstanding the dilemma.

Misunderstanding? Well, yes and no. I do have a problem balancing the thing as I described. The 1-handle/2-handle thing was simply to describe the difference between the reviewed DVRig and my own.

A professional Steadicam and a $14 DIY one can get you the exact same results if you know how to use them. It's simply a matter of getting comfortable with the equipment. Don't let the first use discourage you from using it again because it's not as easy as advertised. Just keep using it and it'll feel natural in no time.

The rig Jack is talking about isn't a Steadicam-style stabilizer but a shoulder mounted rig. Since I haven't used one these (played with it at a trade show a few years back but don't remember it well enough), Jack, does it use a weight at the rear that is intended to counter-balance the camera, or does it simply rely on the front spring-loaded pole to support the weight?

Regarding your thoughts, Mark, if by $14 DYI you might be referring to that popular set of plans that has a pipe sticking out the side, I'm afraid I can't agree that it can ever be as subtle a device as a true gimballed stabilizer. For a snappy walking shot where the subject is large in the frame, shots done on both styles of rig may be comparable, but under more challenging circumstances the "camera on a stick" DYI stabilizer will show its limitations, no matter how good the operator. .

Outside of that, your advice is mighty fine!

Charles, it does have a weight - a kind of free-rotating 3/4 disk, but my problem is not in the fore-aft axis, but rather the port-starboard axis, or if you prefer aviation terminology, roll rather than pitch. Here are some pictures to help you visualize the rig.

http://www.varizoom.com/pages/dvrigpro.php
The basic rig is the same on these - mine is the last from the bottom.

The design is really very clever - it sits easily on the shoulder and the brace is not at all uncomfortable resting on the hip. The problem seems to be that it always feels like it's about to slip sideways off my shoulder and I have quite broad shoulders. The result: I'm gripping the handle for dear life - not the way to get smooth steady shots, nor to wear the rig for more than a few minutes at a time.

It may be entirely psychological, but the axis combinations are infinitely variable and the included "guide" is not much help.

Aviation terminology good--in the Steadicam world we use "roll" also!

May I suggest a simple addition to the system: a nylon strap with Fastex buckle that attaches to the shoulder pad area and then loops under your left arm? This might serve to "lock in" the system. Depending on how the rig is trying to escape from you, it might be preferable instead to have this loop attach to your belt on the left side and/or right side which will give additional resistance. Obviously it makes an extra step in getting in/out, but for long shooting periods it should be a help.

Does the system allow for shifting the weight of the camera/counterweight to the left at all?

The strap idea is appealing. It would have to loop around the shoulder pad/mount, as there are no attachment points. The problem would be at the other end - attaching it to the padded rig belt. This would only work with some kind of buckle at each end which would enable looping around the belt at the front and back. I'm not sure what a Fastex buckle is. I don't necessarily need to be able to position the rig with a strap, but use it as a safety precaution against the whole thing hitting the sidewalk. An ideal situation would be a pair of rings just in front and just behind the right shoulder and another pair in front and behind the left hip and a couple of adjustable length straps with snaffles at each end.

As far as shifting center of gravity (I believe that's what you're suggesting), the counterweight is fixed in location, but rotates freely. The XL2 viewfinder determines where the whole rig is located along the yaw axis.

Fastex buckles are the plastic snap-in type that are used from everything from fanny packs to camera bags. That's a particular company name but there are many other similar brands. An Army/Navy store should have them in various sizes. I would think that you could take short lengths of webbing and wrap them around the belt with D-rings at the top, which would give you your attachment points for the shoulder strap, and then make up the strap out of webbing with small carabeeners or plastic buckles at the end. Pretty easy to make.

If it seems frustrating to have gear not work perfectly out of the box, perhaps it's worth mentioning that a great deal of pro grear benefits from customizing also. Visit any given Steadicam operator on set and you'll see no two rigs looking alike, and often a good number of personally designed modifications. Any time you are talking body ergonomics, it's very hard for manufacturers to make a one-size-fits-all design.

Tthe corporate world moves on--the parent company of Fastex has apparently moved their plastic buckles into a division now called Nexus. (see them here.

Thanks, Charles. I'll work it out somehow.

It did occur to me that I could simply buy a sleeveless vest like the guy in te product photo is wearing, only one with the button-down tongues on the shoulders for adding epaulets like on uniforms and some shirts. If I can't find one, get another that I like and a length of Velcro and get my local Korean laundry lady to sew it on the shoulder for me.

Hi All,

Before trying any modifications, Adjust the position of your holster. Swing the belt left or right to achieve the correct balance.

Danny Natovich
DvTec

Hi Danny,
I see that is says "DV Rig Pro" under your name. Does that mean that this is your product? If so, I want to say that it is cleverly designed, really well built and quite comfortable, except for the problems I am having. That said, the user instructions leave a lot to be desired, specifically step-by-step illustrations for setting it up and putting it on.

I will try your suggestion. It know it has to be something as simple as moving the holster toward my hip to push the rig away from the edge of my shoulder.
Thanks

Jack,

Feel free to contact me direct with any issues you have. at: natovich@inter.net.il

Best is maillning me few front and side photos of yourself with the rig at shooting position. I will then guide you to the best posture.

Danny Natovich
DvTec

There may be a few shortcomings in the instructions.. but i've gota say, you can't beat customer service like this! ..Where the product reps find and contact the customers with help?

- Mikko

Thanks Mikko,

Unfortunatly, most of my customers are not active members of any forum, They are "read only" members.

Wish more will ask questions...

Danny Natovich
DvTec