Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Chris please feel free to replace camera links with Canon press releases. I can't find them yet.

Canon develops own video format targeting 4K professional video camcorders: Canon develops 4K video format XF-AVC at DV Info Net

Canon XC10 press release, US and UK versions: Canon USA Announces XC10 4K Camcorder at DV Info Net

Canon UK product pages for the Canon XC10: Canon XC10 - Cinema EOS Cameras - Canon UK

C300 Mark II press release, USA version: Canon USA Announces C300 Mark II at DV Info Net

C300 Mark II product pages, USA version: Canon C300 Mark II - Cinema EOS Cameras - Canon USA

C300 Mark II specifications brochure attached below for download.

Re: Canon new codec XF-AVC, XC10, C300mk2
 

Quoted UK price of £11,299 ex VAT. Available 3rd quarter of 2015...going go be a long 6 months!

Re: Canon new codec XF-AVC, XC10, C300mk2
 

The new family of codecs looks interesting, as much for what is (currently) left out as for what's included. The 10-bit 4:2:2 Intra-frame 4k is going to really excite some people, but why isn't there a long-GOP 4k version, and why is 30P the highest 4k frame-rate? I think there must be more to come as Canon fill in the rest of their 4k range.

The 1" chip in the new XC10 looks promising. I can imagine 4k XF200 and XF300 replacements being built around it, hopefully with more efficient long-GOP 4k recording and, maybe, 50/60 fps 4k??

Re: Canon new codec XF-AVC, XC10, C300mk2
 

I guess you're referring to the C300mk2, Andy? I expect the XC10 will be much closer to the Sony RX10 and Panasonic FZ1000 price - under £1000, once things settle down.

Re: Canon new codec XF-AVC, XC10, C300mk2
 

No Long-GOP option for 4K in XF-AVC is going to really hurt longform productions like concerts. We also don't need another XAVC that isn't compatible with Sony. It's Canon MXF all over again.

The XC10 looks like it uses 8-bit Intra only recording, not Long-GOP. It seems like it uses 310mbps for 8bit 4:2:2 and 410mbps for 10bit 4:2:2.

And big miss is the lack of 50p/60p on the C300mkII. It will not qualify for Discovery's acquisition requirements.

Re: Canon new codec XF-AVC, XC10, C300mk2
 

The rumors were spot on.
4K internal, fixed lens, C100 form factor, about $2,500. Exactly as I'd heard.
One odd omission: a hand strap. Pretty much every video camera/lens has a hand strap. Just so you won't be as prone to drop the camera.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Much appreciated, Monday -- as you can see, I have dressed up your post a bit. Many thanks!

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Kudos to Canon for making a companion video camera with proper ND filters in this segment instead of yet another stills camera. No doubt it's a quiet lens with AF, de-clicked and incremental iris as a video camera should be. Even leaping away from the DSLR "squeeze-to-hold" ergonomics and fixed back view screen.

Odd as it seems though, I think that lack of strap is ruinous. It's why I dumped all my DSLRs and won't buy another. The hand can't use the fingers when they are squeezing the grip and without the strap, the palm can't free the fingers as a proper video camera does by holding the camera. Yes, the left hand can hold the camera just like a DSLR so then what's the point? So close and yet so far. Hope I'm wrong and it ships with one.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

C300mkII actually looks a lot better than I had expected. I think they've certainly done enough to prevent a tidal wave of C300 owners switching over to the Sony FS7.

The XC10 has me on the fence though. On the one hand I love the fact that they have stepped away from the "hybrid" mentality of mirrorless cameras like the GH4 and A7s to make a purely video-orientated camera - and one which you should easily be able to pull out of the bag and start shooting on without switching lenses, fiddling with rigs and EVFs, etc. On the other hand, it baffles me that they seem to have taken some of the things we hate about shooting with DSLR's (poor layout, no XLR's, 8-bit) as well as the main things that caused us to abandon traditional camcorders (small sensor, fixed lens) and combined them into this thing. On one hand I can imagine this being in my bag as a grab-n-run kind of camera, but on the other hand I can't help wondering why this in not in a XF200 type body with proper audio and a camcorder-layout.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Canon USA "walkaround" video of the C300MkII.


Also, more detail about features here:

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

I like the xc10 for about $1500. For $2500.... Naaaah.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

I just wish the XC10 had a faster lens - or an EF mount so I could put any (Canon) lens on it...

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Agreed. I'd much rather have it shorter and faster with a continuous aperture.

Sony and Panny for example...

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

I guess that's where the price will settle, but not for a few months at least. Remember how much the Sony RX10 and Panasonic FZ1000 dropped over time. Plus, the price of the much-rumoured but not-yet-announced Sony RX10-Mk2, when/if it emerges, will have a big impact on the XC10's street price

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

This is going to be a wonderful camera and Canon will sell them like hotcakes.

My only gripe is I wish the OLED was located toward the back of the camera and on the camera body itself much like the C100. Being able to detach the top handle on the C100 is great for shooting with a low profile and not drawing a lot of attention to yourself.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

"C300mkII actually looks a lot better than I had expected. I think they've certainly done enough to prevent a tidal wave of C300 owners switching over to the Sony FS7"

"Hot Cakes"


Really ? - Why would you go for this when you can get an FS7 for £4000+ Cheaper and you get many more frame rate options.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

It's double the price, 8k for the fs7 vs 16k for the c300II according to B&H prices, I"m sure the c300 will particulary do well in rental houses.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

I'm HARDLY a Canon fan, having owned Sony and JVC cameras exclusively for the past 15 years but what Canon does better than both historically is motion, especially in 24P. Sony's FS7 is struggling with aperture control on EF lenses and is a pain to edit right now in certain codec choices.

I PERSONALLY think it's a little high and the value isn't there for a price tag twice that of the Sony but for those with a catalog of Canon lenses and the ability to pay for the camera quickly through work, it's a pretty amazing setup.

Price ONLY matters if you can't recoup it.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Plus the fact that you can actually buy an FS7 right now and the C300mkII will be... October?

Re: Canon new codec XF-AVC, XC10, C300mk2
 

The XC10 has an mechanical shutter to minimize rolling shutter effects

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

$2500 is really pricey for a camera that has a fixed, non-interchangeable lens with no power zoom, and offers a maximum resolution of only 12 megapixels. I realize megapixels aren't everything, as a well-engineered sensor that is sized properly can produce better images than one with more megapixels.

I've seen reports the suggested retail price of the XC10 is going to be closer to $1999USD than $2500.00. But the competing Sony and Panasonic models are going for around a grand or less - although the Sony doesn't offer 4K video.

Looks like Canon are just trying to cash in on the 4K craze and trying to charge more for it, as usual. It's interesting to see that Canon haven't even tried to offer a dedicated pro-grade 4K camcorder, while Sony and Panasonic have already done so.

Bottom line, Canon aren't going to find many buyers at their proposed price point. If they chop the price to $1299, they may have a chance of scooping up a few people who otherwise might opt for a Sony RX10 or Sony FZ1000, given that these cameras are consumer grade, as is the XC10.

Lately Canon have seemed to be in a pattern of being a day late and a dollar short and only offering incremental to modest improvements in their products.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

XC10 specs don't show 24p mode in HD. Also, no viewfinder.
Ken

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

"Really ? - Why would you go for this when you can get an FS7 for £4000+ Cheaper and you get many more frame rate options."


For me I think its a little overpriced as well BUT for the big boys RAW output, color modes to match ARRI, even more dynamic range, 2k and 4k output simultaneously, and a PL mount are probably enough to justify it. Its priced like a GoPro when you think about what the large and medium budget movie types have into the Alexa kits. Seems like it would be cool to own a "cheap" camera that matches your ARRI rentals

If you have Canon EOS lenses, its probably worth the IS and lens communication


If both cameras were available a months ago, things what would have got me to at least look at the C300 even though its more than I really wanted to spend...

C300 the better screen and EVF (my $200 phone and 3 year old $500 iPad have a better looking screen than my FS7 and FS700) this is ridiculous and at some point when I can get a quality image EVF like the Zacuto Gratical (sans all the LUT's, outputs and high end processing) for around $1200 I will.

Better AF and more important for me better focus assist tools. Also being able to move the focus point and magnification area around is a big deal.

The color profiles... for the stuff I shoot people do not know what to do with SLOG and just ask for a baked in look so the WideDR look of the C300 (real color, high DR but a bit flat not LOG) sounds pretty cool... something I could deliver thats a step up for tweaking but so easy to grade a monkey could do it.

For the doc style sporting events I shoot being able to do 1080 to an SD card would be amazing... I could keep a copy on CFA$T and they could just walk away with the SD I need a swiss army knife, most people probably don't

Also I end up shooting in bright horrid direct sun (motorsports) so the low 100 ISO, 800 ISO base or the extra ND would be really nice



Starts to eat up the price difference once you factor the RAW back option and a new EVF, but I absolutely hate the super tall Canons with the audio/LCD tower on top of that. and RAW is a bit out of my league so its cool to not have to pay for it till I need it (or even just rent it)

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Not as such, but there is a "loup" to go over the rear screen which has much the same effect

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

And at least the LCD display articulates, so that if you want to change the viewing angle with the loup attached, you can. That should make the loup an attractive and useful proposition for users that work in really strong lighting conditions and a simple viewfinder shade isn't enough.

Flaws aside, the XC10 is looking to me more like a poor man's C100.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Fixed that for you... :)

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Have to say I'm disappointed by the lack of a remote jack on the XC10... no LANC / Control-L. As you all know, I'm the poster boy for remote lens controllers. Although in this case I suppose you could gaff-tape your iPhone to the tripod pan handle and connect via WiFi.

But it just ain't the same!

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

The XC10 could be interesting for budget green screen work. It's 4:2:2. It's not 10-bits, but it is 4K. That could provide very clean detail for keys intended for 2K renders. (From an information point of view, quadrupling the pixels is similar to adding two more bits of information.)

Further, the 1-inch sensor is something like a 1.7x crop factor compared to APS-C. This may limit low light shooting and shallow DOF effects, but those aren't critical for green screen anyway. It's expected to light things well in a GS studio and it's generally better to keep the foreground object sharp for a crisp key.

Regarding the C300 mkII, it could be really sweet. I've rented the FS7 a couple of times and I love the high-speed shooting for b-roll, but I'm not in love with the look. It's not bad by any means, but there's something that says "electronic video" to me. With the new C300 offering 120 fps, killer dynamic range, less rolling shutter, native EF lens mount (I've broken a Metabones adapter), and the Canon look is a nice combination. I'll be curious to see the local daily rate...

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

The XC 10 has a strange mix of features.

* High bit rate proprietary H.264 codec (400plus Mbs) That should be fun to edit! :)
* But has a slow lense 5.6 on telephoto!
* Canon log - Make matching other C EOS cameras easier
* But no add on module for professional xlr and video ports

And requires expensive media CFast 2.0. at $400.

Comparable cameras from Panasonic sell for less than $1000.00 I feel $2,500 is way overpriced for the feature set.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Cfast cards will get bigger and the price will go down faster than the Sony cards.....also, after the C300 MK II comes out and you are out shooting in the sticks, or just not a big city, and you suddenly need to get a card reader, chances are you'll be more likely to find a Cfast reader at a computer store than a Sony card reader........

Jim Martin
EVSonline.com

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

I dont know what market its geared towards. The press release saysbit would be good for eng work but i have a hard time believing that. It looks like it has all the problems of shooting with a dslr. No proper audio, a viewfinder that doesnt swivel down, the lack of a hand strap really stumps me. No bueno canon, no bueno. This makes me want to keep wielding my xf305 even longer.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

This camera was made for helicopters, gimbals, small/ tight situations, and people looking for an easy 4K hybrid camera that can shoot real stills......complaining about it not being a full feature camcorder (like a XF305) makes no sense. We've already had multiple phone calls from people with Quadcopters asking about specs and availability.

Jim Martin
EVSonline.com

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Reliability, compatibility & familiarity. On many productions (and in rental houses) price often comes secondary to factors such as these (provided the Image quality is there).

For people wanting to shoot RAW, the price starts starts to go up on the FS7 (still not into C300mkII territory, but notably so). You also don't need to worry about lens adapters with the Canon, which means one less thing that can go wrong on set.

Personally I'd prefer the FS7 but I can see why others would be happy to pay double the price for the C300mkII.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Don't count on CFast taking off in terms of being able to find them. One of my NYC buddies took absolutely forever to find CFast cards for his URSA. They're still, at the moment, a rarity.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

I too, was surprised to see that the camera has no LANC facility. Come on, Canon, what are you thinking? Cameras costing half what the XC10 will cost have a LANC jack. Maybe they dropped the LANC fearing that if they included it in the XC10, it would cannibalize sales of the C-series cameras.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

I saw the video for the C300 MkII and it looks like an absolute powerhouse, with no less than 10 different LOG and tons of LUT settings, among other things. It looks like a worthy successor to the original C300, and Canon should have no trouble selling it to rental houses or well-heeled videographers.

I've always found Sony video to look much more 'electronic' and TV-like than anything Canon have ever marketed. Then again, Sony haven't been in the business of making higher-end still cameras for very long, but they've been making broadcast-quality ENG cameras for decades, so I would say their experience in this area tends to inform how their video output looks.

For what it's worth, I once bought a Sony FX7 camcorder that shot only 1080i and promptly sent it back because I didn't like the live-looking images it produced.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

I could rip the rc10 apart but I'm really saving all my energy for whatever blackmagic announces on Monday.

Having said that, I'll probably buy one when they hit a massive price drop like the M camera . It does look like a great consumer camcorder.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Maybe we can get VariZoom to build a controller using USB.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

The LCD panel does tilt down. You can add the viewfinder to it, if you like.
I agree about the hand strap. Strange omission.

Re: Canon announces C300 Mark II, XC10 and new codec XF-AVC
 

Forget that... I'll build you a controller using steam and some sort of geared chain drive.