Today I was playing with my V1E in a very quiet environment, and I noticed a strange, grinding noise in it - it's most audible with zoom at telephoto, and it's not the zoom motor (I can hear this one, too - but it stops after I stop zooming, and the other one is still there). Any ideas?

could it be the focus motor? in case you're using AF....

No - I should have added the focus was manual.

Stabilizer perhaps?

Stabilizer perhaps?

Yep, it is the stabilizer! It's gone when I switch OIS off. Also, it's loudest at full tele, when the stabilizer is working hardest... But is this noise normal? I mean, it's not "nice" (technically).

Anyway, thanks Douglas!

it's the gyro, and it's completely normal. Pursuant to another thread, the gyro is quite loud compared to the DR60. Neither will affect your audio recordings. OIS makes some noise on all cameras, it's much worse on some than on others. I'd put the V1 in the "barely audible" category.

Yes, it's quieter than the VX/PD170. That VAP needed much more energy to overcome the inertia of the plane-parallel element, with a consequential increase in noise.

Lots of Leica lensed Panasonics 'clonk' when they're switched off and the camera's rocked, and this is due to the electromagnets holding the OIS elements shutting down. All perfectly normal.

tom.

Thanks again!

I just realized that I haven't had much experience with optical stabilizers - the only one before the V1 was on the Canon A1 I had tested, but never put my ear to it:)

Again about noise, but zoom this time:) I'm aware it cannot be noiseless, but would like to confront my observations with those of the other V1/FX7 users here. When I use the fastest zoom possible (usually to fully zoom on the subject in order to focus on it properly), during the last stage of zooming (some 75%-100%) the motor noise is quite audible, and is picked up by the mic and recorded. In fact, with my left palm supporting the lens body, I can feel vibrations accompanying the noise at such range and speed of zooming.

Is it normal with all V1/FX7 machines out there? Please re-assure me, or I'll be calling Prime Support...

Calling Prime Support, Prime Support.

Piotr , if it helps I can tell you my V1E doesn't have the problem you describe. I made a short recording in a very quiet room with the audio set to full gain/manual with wind filter switched off. I also removed the Dead Cat muffler along with the foam layer so as to have a completely bare mic.

The only noise I can hear on playback from my HDMI connected HDTV with volume turned up far more than normal is the slight whirr from my whisper quiet Core2Duo computer next to it, plus the slight rubbing noise from my finger on the zoom lever as I alternately zoom in and out.

I was going to say it looks like you have a problem but then I remembered I am using the Rode NTG1 which is mounted on a Rode shock mount, this has two rubber bands which isolate the mic from camera vibration. Perhaps this is making a difference but then I also don't hear any noise from the cam body as I zoom not do I feel any vibration.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for the feedback so far. I must admit I am very picky and have a very good hearing, considering my age:). When I play back my clips through the (good) PC speakers (suppose similar to average TV ones), I can't hear anything either. This is why I haven't noticed it for so long. But, when I connect to my Home Theatre system with subwoofer on, it's there - just at the longer end of the zoom, and only when zooming full speed.

Could anyone spare me a moment, and try to re-create these circumstances?

I took the test I made into After Effects to look for any noise.

Here is a 1.5MB Quicktime movie with the audio overlayed over the video, apart from my "toot toot toot" whistle at the start of the zoom and a click from my finger on the zoom button at the end there is no zoom noise in the waveform.

Thanks Claire. Even though I can hear the noise only when using a hot microphone in the V1E's own holder, I guess I'm facing a problem:(.

I assume you were zooming fully, at the max speed.

PS. With my V1E, no noise is recorded when using the stock mic. This might cause difficulties with convincing the Sony servicemen anything is out of order...

Yes, I was zooming fully, with the Sony W/A lens in place, maybe that would mean the zoom would take more time? Anyway it was the fastest speed it would go. Regarding the stock mic I see your point, this was a big disapointment for me and like others I immediately replaced it with the Rode.

Out of interest what mic are you using now?

Claire, I'm either recording with the Edirol CS-50 stereo shotgun for ambience or musical performances, or the stock mic in one channel plus wireless in the other for interviews, dialogs etc.

Just one more kind request: holding your cam usual way, please put your left hand underneath the lens body (just supporting it slightly) and zoom full speed to the max - don't you even feel any 'needles and pins' in your left hand fingers, when the zoom goes through the 75-100% range?

Nope, cannot feel a thing... I also removed the W/A with it's huge hood in case it made a difference but still nothing, even when I explore carefully using my fingertips gently around the lens and barrel.

If I place my ear flush against the barrel I hear the very slight constant zoom noise, ie: constant from start to finish of zoom, that is all.

Maybe these cams vary? Mine was purchased in February, 25p mod done by Sony before sale.

You've got me convinced. Hearing is very subjective (when played through my Home Theater, your clip *does* contain this very slight, constant whirl); however I can feel it with my hand very, very distinctly.

Yes, our cameras definitely are not identical, it seems. I'm gonna take mine through as hard testing as possible (reasonably), and only then will send it to Prime Support for an overhaul. I'm not so much worried about the sound I'll have recorded in the meantime, because - the noise being only evident during extreme zooming - most of those fragments will get edited off, anyway.

Thanks again, Claire!

For the reference of those interested (and comparison with their units), here are the links to a short clip:

http://rapidshare.com/files/34270248/zoom_noise.m2t

- and just its sound track:

http://rapidshare.com/files/34259792/zoom_noise.mpa

Again, please listen with a full spectrum equipment. The zoom noise is audible at the end of the rapid zoom, even though the ambient noise level is quite high.

your clip *does* contain this very slight, constant whirl)

Piotr, just my thoughts.. if the noise you hear in my clip is constant I expect it is the soft whirring of the fan on my computer. To my regret in my haste this was just below the camera, otherwise if it was zoom noise it would surely disappear after the first zoom in during the moment when I am paused.. then zoom back.

No, Claire - I can hear the zoom motor as well. I say "constant" because - unlike the noise produced by my unit - it's there all the time you zoom in, then stops, and returns with zooming out. It's much, much lower than mine; considering how quiet the ambience was in your clip, it's negligible.

For the reference of those interested (and comparison with their units), here are the links to a short clip:

http://rapidshare.com/files/34270248/zoom_noise.m2t

- and just its sound track:

http://rapidshare.com/files/34259792/zoom_noise.mpa

Again, please listen with a full spectrum equipment. The zoom noise is audible at the end of the rapid zoom, even though the ambient noise level is quite high.

Piotr,

Here is your audio taken into Sound Forge alongside my own "V1E Zoom noise test.mov" file I uploaded earlier. I had to convert your mpa to wav to be accepted and I also had to increase amplitude to see both more easily.

The black shaded areas are where I made selections and on yours (at left) this is where I hear the zoom motor, I think this does corrospond to your video.

Mine is at the right and the selected area is where I can tell from the little video preview along the top that plays that I am zooming, there is no change in the audio that I can hear or indeed observe from the waveform unlike yours where the waveform suddenly drops as you complete the zoom. Interestingly I can even hear your zoom motor beneath the louder background noise burst where your zoom starts.

Informative?

While I'm very grateful to Claire for the time and effort, I'd appreciate a comment from somebody, who - like me, unlike Claire - is using a mic hotter than the stock V1 mic, but in the V1's own mic holder. This might make a lot of difference. TIA!

I think the better solution is to simply move the mic away from the source of the noise. A mic on a camera is never a good thing, it's almost always too far from the source of the desired sound and and too close to unwanted sounds. There are some mic such as the ones from Sanken designed to mount on cameras but they're hard to find and expensive and even then it's not an ideal solution.

Apart from the proximity problem you've also got the problem of the camera possibly moving when the sound source isn't, this can rather mess up the recording, as a shotgun pans across the sound source not only does the level change but also the frequency response, just look at the polar plots and you'll see what can happen.

If you have to have a mic on a camera then a good shock mount is important, plenty of them to choose from and I'd use a fabric covered lead too. Vibrations can travel up rigid mic leads. Perhaps mounting the shock mount / mic on a Noga arm would help too.

The other thing I've noticed is the standard Sony mic holder isn't much good. It might be OK with that plastic mic that comes with the camera but heavier / fatter mics will compress the rubber nodules inside the mic clamp rendering them useless.

In general, you're absolutely right, Bob. Sometimes however, I'd like to record stereo ambient sound without too much fuss; my Edirol CS-50 is the size and weiht of the stock mick, so this should not be a problem.

Also, you're talking about remedies to a problem, while I'm not sure whether I'm actually having one. The Edirol is way more sensitive than the stock one, and the dynamic, rich sound comes for the price of more unwanted sounds recorded as well. However, this is only natural, and by itself is not a reason to send a camera for servicing...

What I'm trying to establish is whether or not my zoom motor works like in any other V1, or is malfunctioning. Have already contacted Prime Support and they of course are ready to accept my camera for testing. But before I send it, I'd like to know for sure - perhaps I'm oversensitive mysef?

Have you listened to my clip?

Since I can't edit my previous post anymore (BTW, what is the time limit for that? Sometimes it seems the "Edit" button disappears quicker than usually...), here is a couple of new facts. I don't have easy access to another V1 unit, but I tried a brand new FX7 which shouldn't differ from a V1 in this respect, and while the actual noise of the zoom motor is more or less the same as in my unit, there is virtually no associated vibration. My problem is that were it the audible noise that's a problem, I could convince the Prime Support engineers much easier than with vibrations! One must hold the camera thae way I do to feel it.

Do you have a suggestion on how to objectivize vibrations from the zoom motor to Prime Support engineers, so that I won't be sending my camera for servicing in vain?