Hey guys -

I feel rather dumb even asking this. I'm generally the one up-to-date on this stuff. But as I've been very busy in LA and happily using my XL2, I have been totally oblivious to these new releases.

So here's my thing. The specs of this look pretty compelling, and having used the H1 (but not being able to afford it) I am considering ditching my XL2 for the A1. I would like opinions from you guys on this topic.

Does this thing have filmic gamma similar to the XL2 and DVX? I hear the chips are all the same as in the H1, is there any reason to assume that the picture quality would be much worse? (Or at least worse than the image of the XL2?)

No contest, in my opinion, the XH A1 would trump a stock XL2 even in standard definition recording. The only exception I can think of is an XL2 fitted with a Mini35 and motion picture glass... that would be tough to beat. But if you're talking straight out of the box, the advantage goes to the A1.

Thanks, Chris, I appreciate it, especially since I'm sure this was a redundant question. The specs and price looked great; on paper it easily looked better than the XL2, but often in practice, there's something I miss.

Mini35 is out of the question on my budget. I'd be an out-of-the-box guy for sure. The only "customization" i did with my XL2 was opt for the 16x manual lens. So I may in fact be holding out for this bad boy.

I sold my XL2 few weeks ago for the upcoming HD (A1 or V1). Yes the XL2 is great but I dont like the form factor.

With the A1 or V1, you can mount them on a steadicam Merlin and get a far better shot than the XL2 on the shoulder. XL2 would require a very expensive stabilizer.

With a lightweight tripod(cartoni focus + miller solo vj), a FF, MB and m35 would make the A1 or V1 look extremly professional.

then again since you have one you might just wait a few weeks and see what the reviews are first. Then unload the XL2 or just keep it if you don't need the money.

I look at it this way.... I was planning to purchase the XL2 with 20x lens for doing wedding videos and such, having sold my XL1s a few months back. Then this bad boy A1 got announced. At $500 more than the XL2 with the ability to do HD, same 20x lens, OIS, and now an iris ring on the lens (!) I was sold.

I'm now selling off the rest of my SD equipment to buy 2 of these A1s later this month. I'm doing it strictly for the HD, but I've heard that you can downconvert to SD and make a better picture than the XL2, so that may be a selling point for you.

Plus I agree with Jason on the stabilizer, much easier to find one for the smaller cameras that's affordable for the average consumer.....

Hi all,

I'm a newbie here, but it seems lots of you are well clued up on this and I need some help.

In the next couple of weeks, I'm going to buy a camera. I've narrowed it down to the XHA1 & the XL2. (AG DVX100 was a possibility, but I've now written it off)

I want to use the camera primarily for making films & shorts, but I also want to be able to shoot documentaries & weddings too.

Is the 25f (I'm in the UK tf PAL) as good as the XL2's 25p? I'll be honest, from what I've seen the XL2's 25p looks infinitely better, than the 25f on the A1, apart from one video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTPCytbcK1s&mode=related&search=

Can I overcrank XHA1 footage, like in the XL2 (or has the XL2 footage I've seen been slowed in PP..?)

Does the A1 have equal, less or more of the features as the XL2 in terms of messing with the image & picture? (can't get a definite answer to this on the net. E.G. I've seen footage of DVX footage being manipulated in temperature from warm reds, to sort of Bourne Supremacy cold blues... Can I do this with the A1!!!???)

I just really need some advice with people who have had their hands on both cameras... I keep seeing videos which show incredible footage on both, and then bad footage on both and it's really confusing my decision making. I'm a student and am paying way more than I should be for this camera (my parents think I'm only spending £1000! Can't even afford good editing SW at the moment!) but, I'm pretty serious about my filming and I know what I want, and I need a camera which can help me achieve this, and it's going to be either the XL2 or the XHA1.

These are a couple of the videos of good footage of both (not helping my cause):

XHA1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTPCytbcK1s&mode=related&search=

XL2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1btIs1Ra9Is&mode=related&search=

I'd be grateful for any advice...

Regards,

Giles B

Does the A1 have equal, less or more of the features as the XL2 in terms of messing with the image & picture? Much, much more.

A1:

1) 60i, 24f, 30f (same as progressive XL2 except how the frames are produced)
2) HD picture (sharp and gorgeous, screams HEY IM HD !!!)
3) More manual control than XL2 (including XL2's stuff + more)
4) No interchangable lens (I dont care for that)
5) Solid body for all around shooting (XL2 is NOT run and gun)
6) Lighter
7) Native 16:9
8) 1080 HD vs. 720x480 SD (1.2aspect)
9) LCD is bigger
10) $3500

XL2:

1) 60i, 24p, 30p
2) SD picture (awesome picture but its not HD)
3) awesome manual control
4) Interchangable lens (expensive however)
5) film camera form factor (unbalenced unless messed with)
6) heavy (arm fatigue unless you have a support for it)
7) Native 16:9
8) 720x480 SD (great picture however)
9) LCD is a pain to focus with and see with
10) $3200 or so (depends)

Ide say A1 for you, I just sold my XL2 to get the A1 for the reasons shown. You get an XL2 like camera, shuved into a GL2 type body, thats solid, native 16:9, more manual control than the XL2, a bigger LCD, and its HD. For cripes sake get the A1, the price is almost the same!

- Kyle

For about the same price I'll take the Canon A1 over the Canon XL2.

I was thinking that, since most of my stuff ends up in SD anyway, that I am actually considering an Xl2 as B-roll, for the A1 because they are so inexpensive currently and it looks more professional (for when clients need it).

Don't get an XL2. You'll be stuck with it as it will end up with little or no residual value.

Go for the A1 and don't look back!

Imagine you go to your car dealer to look for a new car. He has two that you like, both never left the showroom and both in pristine condition. One is the latest model BMW 530, the other is a 5 year old model (but never used) BMW 320, now already succeeded by a newer model. Both have around the same price. What would you choose?

Awesome... I'm sold!

Nice analogy on the last post too. Though I could add to it as I can't afford, a tripod let alone an editing program such as Premiere or Edius yet. They will have to come later.

Also, I read somthing about a good tripod in a book I've got and this guy was like, "you want to invest in a decent tripod, such as a Miller..." so I go on to the internet and look up Miller tripods......... £750! hahahah on your bike mate. That would be over a 1/3 of the cost of the camera. I just can't do that.

It seems the problem with investing in expensive high quality equipment is that everything else has got to be high quality and expensive too...

Oh well, still can't wait to order my A1 ;) Cheers for the advice all.

Regards, Giles

You might look at Libec tripods. I believe they are a British company. I got the model 22, which was only about $400 (USD), and it's nicely matched to the XH A1.

Back in the day, I was guilty of this as well, but here's my analogy regarding tripods...

Take that BMW purchase... let's say it doesn't come stock with tires... you have multitudes of choices & the very least expensive tires you choose are re-treads (not sure those are even made any more :).

There ya go :)

I know a couple of people still to this day that have 15-20 lb. broadcast cameras & using ancient Bogen gear & that old mini "fluid" (I call it "grease") head, or whatever it's called, that really is designed for lightweight camcorders of the past weighing less than 10 lbs. or so. It cracks me up at times.

I agree though. Libec makes the best tripod value for the buck & am thinking of selling my Cartoni AlfaII & buying the Libec LI-38, if not the 22.

Bill

I've used Libec tripods for years, and they are really good - especially for the price.

To continue on the automotive analogy, consider the tires to be your camera, used to roll. Consider the car to be your tripod. The lifetime of your car (tripod) is far longer than a set of tires (your camera). The investment in a good tripod with a good fluid head is one that will last you for many, many years and through multiple generations of cameras. The HDV quality you can get now also makes the investment in a high quality tripod/head combination that much more important, because every unintended movement will be much more distracting than with older generation cameras. I've heard people saying that in the past the price ratio between the camera and a tripod, as a rule of thumb, was around 4 to 1, but with the new generation may now have to go up to around 3 to 1 or even 2 to 1.

My suggestion is to get the camera, extra batteries and a good tripod and take your shots. In the future you will have all these fabulous films and can then start to edit. Why invest in HDV editing software now, when there is hardly any affordable way to deliver the quality? Just wait a bit. Easier on the wallet/credit card too.

Ok, thats all good. I've got a whole list of things I'd like to get at some point. Putting them in priority order is the next task, and as others have outlined, it would seem a tripod is a pretty smart next step, extra batteries are essential too.

I'm not actually too fussed about the HD at the moment. I just like the fact it's there and I'm ready to switch when I need to in 1 year, 2 years or however long into the future.

So, what NLE SW could be looking into, to edit the SDV footage from the A1? Do they still sell the old versions of Premiere Pro? (I'm a windows user BTW) I also once read that, a legal version of Premiere Pro can be installed on about 5 pc's if i'm not mistaken. Or do all of the pc's have to belong to the owner?

I could ask about and pay somebody half the price maybe...?

All this advice, has saved me days worth of wasting time on the net! It's brilliant!

Do they still sell the old versions of Premiere Pro? (I'm a windows user BTW) I also once read that, a legal version of Premiere Pro can be installed on about 5 pc's if i'm not mistaken. Or do all of the pc's have to belong to the owner?

I think it would be pretty likely that the license is for a single user on up to [x] number of PCs.

But you're a student, so you could get an academic version, which are quite a bit cheaper?

Extra batteries you can find on eBay. Search for BP-945. You can get 6600mA versions, which have a better battery life than the (expensive) Canon BP-950G batteries for about £15 each. I have 4 (plus the standard battery), but I only ever seem to use about 2 in a day.

And you'll be surprised how quickly you'll want to switch to HD. I wasn't interested in HD until I got an HDV camera, and that quickly changed my mind. With so many cheap flat panel TVs around, it won't be long before HD becomes the norm.

I'm looking for some advice from those with experience about which camera it would be better for me to buy - the XL2 or the XH A1. From what I can gather about the versatility of the two, the XH A1 seems like the better camera, and indeed it is the newer model, but it is generally less expensive than the XL2, so what are the main pros and cons of having one over the other?

No doubt the answer depends hugely on what I want to shoot, but I figure it might also depend on the other resources I might need for editing, etc.

I'm pretty good with technology and what factors this kind of decision involves, I'm just not experienced with cameras.

I may want to shoot fast moving images and may not always have the ability to light my subjects as well as I'd like to.

I might not want or be able to shoot in HD with from the outset or indeed for a while, even if I do go for the XH A1.

I have a reasonably good though not Rolls Royce PC on which to edit, and an awareness that I might need a whole raft of peripheral equipment to convert and process images, but if so I want to be able to do that as economically as possible.

Any help would be very gratefully received!

Donal

Get the XH-A1. Why pay almost the same for an XL2 when you get the XH-A1 with DV shooting and HD. The technology is better, the picture is better, and you have everything you need right now. And, I have had both units, and the XH-A1 feels like a higher quality unit.

The A1.

B&H is selling them for only a $100 difference. Unless removable/ interchangeable lenses are an issue -- I'd think it's a pretty clear choice.

I'm a new owner, and the A1 can do everything the XL2 can do and more. Aside from its HDV capability, it has some very nice features that the XL1 lacks...

The primary differences that the XL has over the XH:

a. interchangeable lenses, not an issue for many people
b. four-channel audio (vs. two-channel on the XH)
c. entirely different form factor (shoulder vs. handheld)

HD HD HD!!!!

:::pants:::

Hey Donal,

I had exactly the same dilemma as you literally weeks ago and I've finally got an A1 in my hands.... OH S*** This camera is SWEET! The only thing the Xl2 has over the A1 are the interchangeable lenses... that is it!

I too am only using the SD at the moment, and my god does the footage look good! I've heard people talking about shooting in HD then down rezzing but I don't know how to do that yet... + there are less problems with grain & focus when shooting in SD, though I know the grain can be sorted out, but I'm just playing with the SD at the mo.

Being a student, I was quite lucky in the fact that I was able to get Adobe Production Studio for £250 which was awesome too.

I spend weeks trying to figure out which one to buy, I will save you the wait, as have the previous posters... Get the A1! Don't look back, I haven't...

Just one word of advice, DO NOT buy it from Television Mall (.co.uk)!!!! I did and it arrived a month later! Worst customer service I've ever experienced!

Giles (UK)

Thanks for all that guys, that's a great help. And yes I was looking at Television Mall but I'm now contemplating a shopping trip to Hong Kong!

GO buy the Canon XH-A1.

SD is dead.

Even in SD, few cams can match the A1. It's just a great design. Get the A1 over the XL2. A1 is much more flexible, more capable.

Hi Folks - I was hoping to get some guidance and outright outspoken opinions (!) here about whether to buy a Canon XL-2 or go for the XH A1. I wanted to upgrade from my old GL-1 (keeping it as a second camera) and was convinced an XL-2 was the ticket. My thinking was that it was a little too soon for HD and, just as important, I would save moneyon this "outgoing" camera. Imagine my surprise when it I shopped and found out the two aren't that far off in price. I am finding the XL-2 for around $2800-3300 and it would seem the XH A1 can be had for around 3200-3500 (?). First Q - do these prices seem realisitic? And, if they are in the ballpark, which one should I buy? (FYI - editing on a dual 2GHz PowerMac on FCP5.

Thanks for any input.

TVH

Prices should be checked against our trusted site sponsors (http://www.dvinfo.net/sponsors), several of whom are authorized Canon dealers. Their prices are "real world" prices.

Since it seems to be a frequently asked question, I have merged several "X2 or XH A1" discussions into a single big one. This is now the official XL2 vs. XH A1 thread.

I've been helping a friend out on a documentary, shooting with his XL2 for about a year. After I got my XH A1, I did one shoot for him with that, in SD, 24p, and he said it looked significantly better than the XL2. All the shoots I've done for him since then have been my camera, and he ordered his own XH A1 last week.

One big thing I don't think has been mentioned is the lens on the XH A1. It is wide enough so you really don't need a wide angle adapter except maybe in very rare situations. The XL2, on the other hand, really needs a few mm more on the wide end. I found it difficult to use in normal situations in offices and smaller rooms because of the lack of good wide angle. While the XL2 does give you 4 channel audio input capability, its XLRs only take mic level in, I think. The XH A1 will do mic or line in.