A scope isn't going to tell you what kind of camera the footage was shot on necessarily, just certain qualities of the video. CCD's being used is not one of them.

As long as it looks "airable," content is king.

You should see the kind of stuff that makes it to air where I work sometimes.

A single viewing of any episode of Discovery's "The Planet's Funniest Animals" will quickly reveal that fifteen-year-old video shot on VHS or 8mm is perfectly acceptable for broadcast.

It's all about content.

In Chris Hurd's overview, he writes:

"There's a Cine color mode available as well, which can be used with or without 24p. It's actually based on one of the Custom Presets included with the Canon XH A1 and G1 camcorders, number 8 (Cine.V.) The parameters of that preset are Gamma: Cine 1, Knee: Low, Black: Stretch, Sharpness: -4, Color Matrix: Cine 1, Color Gain: -20, Color Phase: +5, Red-Blue: -5, Green-Red: -5, Blue-Red: +5, and Red-Green: +12. When the HV20 begins shipping in April, it'll be interesting to see how this Cine color option matches up with Custom Preset 8 from an XH A1."

Assuming it is close to the Custom Preset 8 of the XH A1, and with the idea of shooting as dynamic an exposure as possible, for either better color correction in post or for a film out, does anybody have an opinion as to how this Cine Color Mode stands up?

Thanks,

Canon has started the last 6 months to introduce it's own DSLR CMOS sensors in it's camcorders. This is a big move! From what I understand (I am not a technical guy), it is significantly different to built a sensor for a camera than a camcorder. If I were Canon, I would definitely want this move to succeed (so that I stop buying my sensors from others) but also be very careful to built experience in this, before I throw my new technology into "pro" equipment. A failure in pro equipment will hurt Canon's name much more than a failure in a consumer camera! Remember that Canon has only one division which builts camcorders. No separation between "consumer" and "pro" divisions. IMHO, HV10 and HV20 are Canon's "test tubes". HV10 test their first camcorder CMOS sensor and its ability to capture interlaced. HV20 will test their HD progressive capturing technology from this sensor to the tape. No 24 full frames on tape, like 24f. Instead, 24 full frames in a 50/60i stream. A much better format for studios with decks ready to read this stream. It is a conservative, step-by-step approach, but it definitely makes sense! If HV20 comes through succesfully, I would expect a 3 CMOS implementation in an interlaced/progressive "pro" camera from Canon pretty soon!

P.S.2 This is what Sony did not do (testing on a consumer product their CMOS progressive capturing technology before going pro) with the results of V1E's progressive performance...


I've been traveling and just caught up. I have been reading in this forum long before I even signed up. I still have yet to buy a camcorder, been using my friend's old GL1, and was waiting for something cheap with 24p. I THINK YOU ARE RIGHT ON! I don't want anything too pro (yet) but I have a lot of ideas and want that film look.

Also, your comment about Canon testing their conversion to CMOS on the consumer market is correct as well. Why risk losing your cult following through claims of being used as lab rats. Everybody has been picking apart this cam since the forum started. Imagine a pro cam!

Thomas

P.S. Qatar! sweet

the only barrier to using this on indie/negative budget shoots is getting cast/crew to respect the size of the cam. it's so small that they'll just brush it off as a VERY amatuer/youtube production and not a "real" indie with a bigger cam like pannie dvx100 or any of the larger xl series from canon.

the only barrier to using this on indie/negative budget shoots is getting cast/crew to respect the size of the cam. it's so small that they'll just brush it off...
Unless, of course, you are shooting a 'Bowfinger' style movie where your lead actor does not even know they are in it!

get a redrock or cinevate adapter and get rid of your 3ccd cam. :))

so besides 24p, what other progressive modes does the hv20 record at?

so besides 24p, what other progressive modes does the hv20 record at?

Reading the manual, the only option besides 60i that seems available is "pf24" which is 24p put into the 60i signal through 2:3 pulldown (although the manual doesn't say all that.)

so besides 24p, what other progressive modes does the hv20 record at?24p is the only progressive mode on the HV20.

As Jesse points out above, it is referred to as pf24 in the camera menu.

Well, there's 25p too. . . ;-) (I know I'm referring the PAL version LOL)

BTW, is there any information on the shutter speed over 25p? Chris?

Has anyone been able to confirm that we are definetly going to get an uncompressed feed out of the HDMI when shooting? If so I'm going to pull the trigger on buying one right now.

Well, there's 25p too. . . ;-)My apologies... I am embarrassed now. Of course there's 25p. Sometimes I forget just how large the European and Australian readership is around here! I haven't seen a copy of the PAL / 50i version of the HV20 owner's manual yet, so I'm not exactly sure what the shutter speeds will be. Certainly it will have 1/25th and 1/50th though.

For Rob, I don't think it could be anything other than uncompressed output over HDMI, but of course nobody knows for sure until the camera comes out or Canon says something (in my experience the former usually happens before the latter).

I am assuming that is has to be uncompressed as well, Otherwise there would be a time delay on the signal. The other thing that I am trying to figure out is if the signal coming out of the HDMI is 4:2:2 8 bit. I am planning on grabbing it with a Blackmagic Intensity and I know that is what is supported by the card. But what I am wondering is if the card is recording 8bit off a 10bit signal or if the signal itself is 8 bit. Eitherway this will be a mind blowing setup.

My apologies... I am embarrassed now. Of course there's 25p. Sometimes I forget just how large the European and Australian readership is around here! I haven't seen a copy of the PAL / 50i version of the HV20 owner's manual yet, so I'm not exactly sure what the shutter speeds will be. Certainly it will have 1/25th and 1/50th though.

For Rob, I don't think it could be anything other than uncompressed output over HDMI, but of course nobody knows for sure until the camera comes out or Canon says something (in my experience the former usually happens before the latter).

I am really hoping that 25p will do higher than 50 shutter speed - 120 would be really useful for the saving private ryan style shots. The hv10 already looks progressive at 25 shutter speed

In this or another thread someone has asserted that using a 1/30th shutter gives you a 30p progressive picture. Is this true?

I often use 1/30th shutter on my GL-2 (in frame mode) to give me another stop of low-light capability. The motion signature looks about the same, even for high motion subjects such as dance. The only drawback is that the auto-focus suffers.

so how is panning in 24p? will it be a little stutter as opposed to 30p/60p(which isn't avail)?

Reading the manual, the only option besides 60i that seems available is "pf24" which is 24p put into the 60i signal through 2:3 pulldown (although the manual doesn't say all that.)


Is this correct? The Canon 24F in HDV is not recorded this way on the XLH1. It is recorded to tape as 24F in HDV. It is recorded 60I with 2:3 Pull down in 24F DV. The camera does output HD this way through the SDI port but firewire outputs a 24F file.
Sony's new HDV 24P does record 24p to the 60I signal with pulldown so the recordings are not compatible.

so i've read all and any info on the hv20. so am i correct that the camera shoots only in 1080 60i and 1080 24p?

what about the suggestion from above about 1/30th shutter. will this be the same as the gl2's 30p frame mode?

my use is mainly shooting interiors of homes consisting of maily slow pans and zooms and using the homeowner's lighting lamps and flourescents.

so lowlight and panning are a concern for me. is this the right camera for me? thanks for any feedback. =)

The camera also shoots in regular DV mode (480). PQ of the HV10 is superb, so we expect at least that from the HV20 except for improved lowlight, 24p shooting, mike input, headphone output, HDMI out etc. It should be superb! Yes, if you like HD, this camera is for you!