This is my first (of many) threads, and first of all i would just like to say how much insight and knowledge these discussions have given me, so i want to say thank you, to all of you.

so...

-within the next month i have somewhat of a large music video shoot taking place overnight in the exterior and interior of an abandoned warehouse, and to be set in a snow storm (might be burdened with doing it artificially). With that said i will be in upstate new york, and it will be very cold, most likely somewhere around 10-20 degrees. i was wondering what precautions if any would need to be taken to protect the equipment. We will be shooting with a canon xl h1 and xh a1 and the canon hdv tapes. Will the cold have adverse effects on equipment and tape stock?

i think the batteries will just last a lot shorter than they normally would, other than that, i thinkyou will be fine.

Benjamin, I live in northern part of Europe experience lot of cold from time to time. Recently I upgraded from Canon XL-2 to XLH1 so my experience is made from both camcorders.
It's a very robust and sturdy camcorder which stand the cold very well. I have not experienced any issue with neither lens or tapemechanism even after several days out in the cold. I use the large 970G batteries which is very powerful.

The only thing I will point is the viewfinder which can be very difficult to work with as this thread shows:
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=84881
In the cold you will experience even more smear than normal. As mentioned in the thread above using small heaters around the viewfinder will help. Putting a camcorderjacket around the whole body with heaters will also keep it healthy, extending the battery life.

Also be careful when going from cold to warm environments due to condensations. In any case let the camcorder get proper acclimatization before use!

thanks guys

when dealing with with rapidly changing weather, (such as walking from a warm interior into a very cold exterior, or vice versa) it is important to keep an eye out for fogging in the lens... it will go away but it could cost you some time. the solution is to let the camera change temperatures gradually. at rock concerts for instance it is typically pretty warm and humid on stage so usually i'll bring the camera out from backstage a good 20 minutes before the band starts so that if the lens fogs it will have time to clear up.

I shoot with a portabrace polar case and heat packs in cold weather. It's not just the camera its also your hands, you can't operate a camera with gloves. When going from cold/dry to warm/humid condensation can form inside the camera rendering it inoperable.

Per - I watched your musk ox vid, great work and the beaver safari. What sort of tripod/head do you use? Do you use any brace for shooting shoulder mount?

Per - I watched your musk ox vid, great work and the beaver safari. What sort of tripod/head do you use? Do you use any brace for shooting shoulder mount?
Doug, my tripod system is a Miller Arrow HD:
http://www.millertripods.com/products.cfm?sectid=20&subsec=2020&productID=224
This "beast" of a tripod-system gives me nice footage even when I use large ef-lenses and focal length.

I know it can seem a bit overkill to place a small Canon XL-series on this tripod, but when using ef-lenses, I also need to use a rail to support both lens and camcorder. I use the Ronsrail-system: http://ronsrail.com/ This gives a total weight of the camcorder + accessories up to 8 kg (16 lbs)

If you take a look at the muskox part V video:
http://video-film.no/snutter/muskox5.html or http://video-film.no/snutter/muskox5.mov (for downloading),
there is a severe wind blowing in the end of the film. In the scene where you can see the muskoxen laying and a small youngster struggle in the wind, I have used a Sigma 300mm f/2.8 lens. This give a focal length of 2340mm on the Canon XL2. I don't think I could have managed so steady footage without this rock steady tripod.

Best;

Per - using that rig you cannot be using a polar case, what temperatures are you shooting in? How do you keep hands/camera warm?

Hey I was hoping someone could give me some good advice. I'm currently working on a project and will be shooting with the Canon XL H1 in the North American Rockies. Temperatures will range from -20 to 30 degrees farhenheit, and it will be very snowy. I've already read this thread and gotten some good information, but is there anyone who can tell me what I need to make sure to have? I just want to make sure I don't screw up the camera, and this will really be my first "feature length" if you could call it that so I'm not sure of what to buy. I was also looking at a shotgun mic that hooks on to the camera so I wouldn't have to worry about holding one. Also, I know this may sound very novice, but what is the smear on the viewfinder that everyone keeps talking about? Sorry guys, I'm new! : ) Can anyone help me?

(A list would be excellent!)

Thanks,
Anthony

for the camera its very simple - you need a portabrace polar coat, handwarmers and plenty of extra batteries. Keep spare batteries and tapes inside your clothes.

Standing around shooting in those temps is no joke. I did a shoot for Porsche last winter outside Vail (9000 feet) - temperatures dipped to the lowest on record.

Slightly off topic but does anyone know if the FU-1000 suffers from the same "smearing" as the LCD when in colder temps? If not, then I'd highly recommend this or some other monitor as the default one becomes mush if it is too cold.

Peace

Yea I'm going to be shooting at Keystone, which is roughly an hour east of Vail and sits at 10,400 feet at the base. So it will definately be cold. Does it matter what kind of batteries I get? And how many would you recomend for maybe 5-10 hours at one time?

I shot for a few weeks up in the Yukon/North West Territory, and the village of Tuk. Outside temps -35 at times. 3 hrs on a dog sled, hanging outside on the vehicle. The XLH1 really performed well. After the dog sled adventure, the lens was quite slow and had a hard time focusing. I used and have the Porta Brace winter jacket along with the heat packs, this helped quite a bit. But mostly I shot without it while up in Tuk and the ride back home to AZ. MY hand were generally frozen ( hard to wear even the silk gloves.)

The Canon BP-970G Lithium-Ion Battery Packs (7.2v, 7200mAh) really surprised me at how well they held a charge. I didn't notice any drop in available use time. The tape and transport did not give any issues. We did keep the vehicle cold while driving to keep the lens condensation to a minimum.

The camera and lens are much more robust than I first thought it would be.

you can read about the trip and see some footage - http://desertdudefilms.com/

Can you tell me exactly which model of Portabrace winter jacket and which warming packs you used? I went to the B&H site and couldn't find a Portabrace specifically for the XLH1.

We'll be shooting in Big Bear California at night for 5 nights. That's not exactly polar . Is a Portabrace really necessary if we keep the batteries warm?

Many thanks,

Harry

Harry,
I think you'll be fine without any heat solutions for the batteries! Just find a jacket who will fit your H1, take a search at B&H for XL2 jackets too, their exactly the same camcorder in size!
My tips about batteries is to store them in a warm place when not in use. If you're out in the wild, keep them in pockets inside your sweather/jacket and you'll fine!
The BP-970G are very long lasting, even i though winter conditions,

Johan,

Thank you very much for your highly practical advice which I take seriously, given where you live.

Best wishes,

Harry.

Johan, do you think I need the full cold weather jacket, or will the "rain slicker" model be enough. I guess that my question really is at what temperature does a Portabrace padded jacket become necessary in your opinion?

The location I'm shooting is a ski resort in California in Jnauary, not the North Pole.

Many thanks---

By the way, great stuff on your website.

Best wishes,

Harry

http://www.portabrace.com/productB-POL-25

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/239726-REG/Porta_Brace_POL_25_POL_25_Polar_Bear_Heated.html

Heat Packs - http://www.portabrace.com/productC-PHP-2

Its a bit cumbersome to get both hands inside the jacket, due to the knitted ring at the end of the sleeves. I put approx. twelve heat packs inside the various little pockets to spread the heat around. (This was at -35F)

I found that I was comfortable at -15 - 0 F without the jacket once the camera and I acclimated - But I admit I have a high threshold for outdoor discomfort, and in my experiances the camera does too.

Johan, advice matches my experiences - the BP-970G last even in the cold.

[edit] I also have the rain slicker and use it - It is essential under the rain and wet conditions (even dust) - it would do very little in the cold - think of it like wearing a heavy nylon shell, instead of an insulated down jacket.

Harry,
I've used this jacket toghether with the xl-2 and now the xlh1 for many trips out in the snow:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/350684-REG/Porta_Brace_RS_XL2_RS_XL2_Rain_Slicker.html

It's very practical to use, there are zippers to open for access to the knobs and lens, I'm satisfied with this even in really cold weather.
To give you an impression of how it can be out there look at this short sample of a couple of muskox in a real blizzard:
http://www.video-film.no/snutter/blizzard.mov (2.4 MB)
In this conditions you need to wear real thick gloves and easy access to your gear is essential for getting any footage at all!

Makes me cold just looking back at the photos;

http://web.mac.com/desertdude/iWeb/ddvideo/Photos_files/slideshow.html?slideIndex=21

http://idisk.mac.com/desertdude-Public/DDVM/640x360/iWeb_Dog_Sledding.mov

Thanks very much for the info. But at what temperature do you think it becomes necessary to use the Portabrace? Canon says that the camera works ok down to Zero, but do you think I'm asking for trouble not purchasing this when working a "few" degrees below zero? It sounds very cumbersome.

Many many thanks for your advice.

Harry

It sounds very cumbersome.
Harry

I found it extremely cumbersome, but got used to it. I did not always have the jacket or slicker on the camera. In the three weeks up in the Arctic, I discovered it was more about frozen moisture than extreme dry cold. The camera can handle the cold quite well. I did not always have the jacket or slicker on the camera. (and had no issues.)

Once we arrived down in Washington State, with the wet snow and drips of rain, I was glad to have the slicker on.

Dog sledding was at -20 and it was wet and we were moving fast, snow from the trees, slapping me on occasion.

When up in Tuk, it was -35f I was outside for nearly an hour shooting the tire chains for a product endorsement, without the jacket. The camera had no issues, as it was extremely dry. (This was at about 9:30 PM sun going down)

I used very thin silk gloves at times, but my hands were still cold.

...but do you think I'm asking for trouble not purchasing this when working a "few" degrees below zero?
Hope you mean degrees celsius? I have used mine down at -25 degrees celsius both with and without the jacket. Often I only use a towel around it when not in use.
In the area where I film the muskoxen there can be a long way from civilization and staying in tent is the only way. The temperature will in such conditions be very low all the time both inside and outside the tent. I have been staying like this for 3 days without experiencing any issues to the camcorders lens nor tapesystem. The only thing is that viewfinder often blur in strong cold and there can be a real hazle to focus properly.

So my answer to you will be: I don't think you gonna be in trouble at all. Just be carefull for condensation when moving from cold to warm areas.

The only thing is that viewfinder often blur in strong cold and there can be a real hazle to focus properly.

I found this to be true as well...

Very many thanks to you all for your time and useful advice.

Harry.

the XLH1 is rated to 0C that is 32F. So -35F is 67 degrees below what the camera is rated for.

The theory with li-ion batteries is to store them cold (in a fridge) but bring to room temperature before using. This will maximize life and run-time. Always use canon batteries, statistically they perform better then the off-brands. If you want more info on batteries in cold temps search the net or drop by Rocky Mountain Film Video when you get to Denver. They build battery belts and their techs are very knowledgable. They also rent polar coats for the XLH1.

For me the big thing with battery life in cold temps is that I tend to leave the camera running a lot more. Controls are much more difficult to access by feel when your fingers get numb, and you can't wear gloves.

Also practice using the camera by feel. Smear and focus problems will be minimized if you shoot at 60i. Have your gear stowed well. Anything you drop in 3 feet of snow is likely to stay in cold storage until the spring.

FWIW daytime temps at Keystone are rarely below 0. Most of the camera mountain camera crews work with just the normal protective cover a lot of the time. Not much to film on a ski mountain in a blizzard.

Wind chill has no effect on inanimate objects but it does on your face and hands.

Two feet of snow in my drive this morning. Slopes should be great if I can get out.

As everyone is sharing: - btw this was shot with an XL1 precisely because I didn't have a coat for the larger camera.

http://timberlinevideo.com/clients/porsche2007/porscheSDE0207.html

the XLH1 is rated to 0C that is 32F.
All camcorders I'm aware of is. I wonder why. Is the manufactor doing this for a specific reason, anybody knows?
In my country you could not film outdoors more then half the year if you gonna follow the recommendations which is nonsense!

Per -

Take a glass of water outside when the thermometer reads 0F. Did it freeze?

Put your camera in your freezer set to 0F - leave it in there for a day. Does it still work?

Obviously cameras work when the ambient temperature is below 32F. But if the core temp of the camera itself drops below 32F and stays there any length of time any moisture inside the camera will turn to ice with potentially catastrophic results.

If you leave the camera running the heat generated will keep the camera from freezing in very cold temperatures for quite some time, especially if the humidity index is low.

Canon could put in all sorts of provisos with regard to minimum operating temperature. But if you want one number without any qualifications that number is 32F.

Wow thanks for all the info. My shoot this season should be a success with the help of you guys!

Peter- I didn't even think about the fact that wind chill doesn't count for the inanimate things! And I was including that in the temp. range I listed for Keystone, so you're right. The temp. when I was out there last season in January was about an average of 0-15 degrees fahrenheit (without wind chill). Just thought I would clear that up so I didn't sound like a complete idiot.

Anyway, thanks again. This is a great thread.

Slightly off topic but does anyone know if the FU-1000 suffers from the same "smearing" as the LCD when in colder temps? If not, then I'd highly recommend this or some other monitor as the default one becomes mush if it is too cold.

Peace


Marty,
I have a FU-1000 and do not see smearing. It's a CRT...and I don't see the smearing that others have mentioned in previous posts. Honestly...I have only used the viewfinder once. IMO...it doesn't give me a SUBSTANTIAL improvement over the color viewfinder.

I was shooting in studio this week...and literally had to constantly check focus on talent with our HD monitor AND the expanded focus button on the camera....to 'tweak' the focus. The LCD simply could not tell me enough information whether I was in focus or not. Only the monitor. The FU-1000 was the same way.

It seems to me that the FU-1000 is much better for accurate manual focusing than the stock finder, but peaking must be turned on. The peaking on this finder can be adjusted so it is not as obnoxious looking as that on the color finder.

I don't like the size of the image in this finder-it is like looking through a small hole compared to the color finder.

No, the FU-1000 does not smear in cold weather. I used the color finder during warm weather, but just changed back to the other because the smearing was driving me nuts since the weather turned cold. It is actually only in the 20's Fahrenheit, but that is enough to cause problems.

Just want to share my experience with you guys.

I just came back from a 2 day shoot in the mountains here in Norway. We spent the night in a tent. The temperature dropped to -15 Celcius at night with strong winds. I had to leave my XL-H1 in the camera bag outside overnight.
I was a bit worried as it was my first time in the cold with the camera, but it worked without problems.
Except the viewfinder which was just a blur at times. The smearing is really quite bad. Thankfully we are delivering SD and I used a wide angel and deep focus a quite a lot.
I had no cover on the camera and it felt bone frozen, but ran like a dream. We didn´t even have to use the generator, the 3 batteries I brought lasted more than enough.
I was filming a Randonee trip and carried the camera around my neck for most of the time.
It can really handle the cold well (not the veiwfinder though)

hi,

I tell my experince with cold weather. I used XL2 at -30 C many times. canon have a dual charger-holder, name should be CH910 or something. I put two bp 970 battery on it, and I put it on my waist under my clothes(cover it with a piece of long cloth) . then plug the power cable from your waist to the camera. so battaries are all time warm near body temperature. at - 30 I can shoot nearly 8 hours all day !

only thing you should care is you need to be close to the camera because of the cable length. but this is the easiest and the most sturdy way of handling extreme cold temps.

thanks.
alkim.