Here's a question: I have rarely seen many people talk here about using a Merlin for any of their steadycam work on a wedding shoot. Has anyone used it more than once? Is it worth the money?

I've been looking at the glidecam 4000 and a few other stabilizers, but I am specifically looking for one that works with the wedding market, i.e. won't kill you if you use it for a relatively long period of time. I'll be moving to Utah soon and hope to break into the market there, so I especially would value any comments from fellow videographers in the crazy and brilliant Utah market.

Equipment: GL2 (perhaps looking to upgrade to the new XH-A1), Rhode Videomic, and the beafy batteries: BP-945. I really don't like to use any lights at all, so the whole set up is fairly light.

Thanks.

-Devin

":Merlin vs Glidecam vs... uhh... your arms for a stable wedding shoot. "

AAAAAAHAHAHAHA damn thas funny... its amazing how the truth is often the strangest sounding thing..

to be honest, id be focusing on the cam gear and tripod monopods before considering anything along these stabiliser lines.

From what iev seen within teh event market, these devices are great and offer a better alternative to luggin a tripod around. Im sure youve also seen copious amounts of footage shot with these devices and although the look is not new, it is rare to see good footage with these on a wedding...

I would recomend a uinit with a vest consdierng the longform nature of the work.. something like a magiqcam or glidecam with vest.

Personally i dont use them. I feel that the "raw" kinda feel handheld shots give you, often give that feeling of truth to what your shooting.
In todays market and with shows like CSI and the like, theres nothign wrong with a bit of shake, so long as the story isnt ruined by it.
Its all relative to the style of video u want to produce.. if u MUST have everythign perfect, then go for it, if not, invest in otehr elements to help the storytelling

I'll plug my fig rig at this point. I'm much more happier that I went with my fig rig instead of a device that is more linear. Although, I did have a rather liquored dude ask me not to 'ZAP' him when I came to his table the other day. And yes, I left it on the video.


I'm not from Utah, but I do know it's somewhere west of me. :} I would do some online searching of wedding services around the area you plan to go. You'll get an idea of what your niche will need to be.

May the schwartz be with you.

Hi Devin,

I use a Merlin, but I agree with Peter that at this point it looks as tho for now investing in some basic equipment, like UHF wireless audio, would put your funds to better use. Flying video might look neat, but not hearing the couple repeat the vows is what the viewers will remember.

I disagree w/Peter where he writes, "..these devices .... offer a better alternative to luggin a tripod around..." That may be true for body mounted stabilizers that you can wear for several hours, but the hand-held Merlin doesn't replace a tripod. You still need a decent tripod and an even better head. Particularly for weddings, IMO investing is a good tripod head would take priority over buying any stabilizer.

Using the Merlin is a learned skill. Unless you have some extraordinary talent, don’t expect to be proficient until you’ve practiced with it daily for several weeks.

There are quite a few Merlin discussions in the Stabilizers forum. Here’s one in particular that might help answer other questions you might have: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=64062 It started in March and is up to about 5 pages now.

yeah sorry tom, i shoud have been specific.. i was refering to the Vested units, not the handhelds (re tripod replacement)

I shoot a lot of weddings, which usually winds up being 8-10 hours of shooting for each event, and actually, have to agree with avoiding using glidecams and the such for wedding work. You will get much more use out of tripods, monopods, or other support type devices.

Which brings me to mentioning one of those support devices here.
Someone mentioned a Fig Rig, which does work great for handheld shooting.

I will take this a step further though, by mentioning the DVMulti Rig, which is a swiss army knife of sorts for shooting video.

You can literally shoot, Shoulder style, Fig Rig or Fig Rig support style, low profile, high profile, handheld, or handheld with support, and more. All of this all day long FATIGUE FREE.
Even better, the MultiRig can stay attached to yur camera, and folds up to fit right in your bag still attached to your camera.

Take a look at it here:
http://www.dvmultirig.com/

and a quick review here:
http://www.lafcpug.org/reviews/review_multirig.html

I don't work for, or have any affiliation to DVTecs or their products. But I am a firm beleiver in the quility and innovation of their products.
BTW, I also own and still use the DVRig Pro from time to time.

I have used both the DVrig pro, the figrig, glidecam 2000/4000 and Magiqcam which is a body mounted stabilizer. For the style I'm going for and the look I want, I was very unhappy with both the figrig and DVrigpro, so much so that neither of them lasted long. I'm sure they work for some people but they will produce a much more raw style than a glidecam or other stabilizer that is similar. The glidecam 2000 would definitely be your winner for price alone, as compared to the merlin. If your looking at spending that much on a merlin though, I would go with at least a glidecam and smooth shooter arm (I believe that is what it is called). If yor using the device for more of the creative shots and montage pieces such as preps, highlights, photo-session etc- a glidecam is the perfect fit. If your looking to film the ceremony and other longer events, I would stick to a tripod and if you really don't want to do that, get the dvrig pro.

You can also visit the stabilizer portion of this forum to find detailed reviews of the merlin.

Hope that helps.

"If your looking to film the ceremony and other longer events, I would stick to a tripod and if you really don't want to do that, get the dvrig pro."

Just so you know, I would recommend the DVMulti Rig before a DVRig Pro. This is because it's so flexible and configurable, incuding DVRig style shooting (as well as being less expensive).

I get what you saying Michael, I was lumping the multirig and the dvrig pro together as the same type of unit, while I understand they are not. In the end, I wouldn't recommend either for wedding work, unless your going for that specific raw style- which I believe is more of a minority among higher end wedding video is it not?

Ok, I'll throw my other two cents in. I think it would be prudent to point out that there are many aspects to a wedding in which you might want to use a variety of methods. I shoot ceremonies from a tripod. I get in the middle of the dance with either hand held or my fig rig. We get in the limo with the fig rig. It depends. I think people's strengths have a lot to do with it.

That being said, your style of shooting will have a lot to do with what you get. If you want super steady, then a vest and/or steadycam might be a good thing, if you need mobility.

I like my fig rig because it's a tight unit, but use other methods, depending on what I'm doing.

I think any type of discussion like this needs to be more specific, one tool won't cover the whole wedding, or will it? (that was rhetorical)

I think and most would agree, as tired as your are after these things, I'd love to have the option to use someone elses arms everyonce in a while. :}

I get what you saying Michael, I was lumping the multirig and the dvrig pro together as the same type of unit, while I understand they are not. In the end, I wouldn't recommend either for wedding work, unless your going for that specific raw style- which I believe is more of a minority among higher end wedding video is it not?

There is no replacing moving camera techniques like those employed by the Merlin or Glidecam. But even high end event shooters still will shoot stationary properly framed shots and use the moving camera techniques for dramatic effect.

I shoot and edit what I call Documatic style, a mixture of Documentary and Cinematic Style.
I do employ many moving camera techniques as well as stationary point and shoot footage.
But, I can get moving camera shots either hendheld or (because of the added freedom of configurations) with my DVMulti Rig. I'm not saying it will be of the ultra flowing quality of a glidecam on a Smoothshooter or a Merlin. But it can be quite good with proper footwork and balance. My clients routinely ask me if I shoot handheld or on a tripod because the footage is so stable.

I can see why you would lump the DVRig Pro and DVMulti Rig in the same catagory, as they are to an extent. But with the DVMulti you have much more freedom of movement to shoot with. And as such, you can get many more creative shots than you can with the DVRig Pro.

The DVRig Pro is like a pickup truck (load it up and shoot) for more point and shoot filming.
Where as the Multi Rig is more like a sportscar (shoot anyway and anywhere you like) for a variety of stationary as well as creative shooting.

The fig rig or DVMulti Rig are the most versatile units and will get the most use in the course of a day. Not exclusive use, but the most use. If you are set on floating shots the glidecam/steadycam will do those much better but at the price of long set up times and very limited use during the day.

No rig will replace a tripod, but they can complement one for the times that you need to shoot "off the shoulder" with a smaller camera or you shoot for a specific planned shot for the highlights.

The "Rigs" provide a completely different look than the "cams" and it's a production choice for which is going to see more use in your production. I personally need a "rig" shoot much more than a "cam" shot. I also appreciate the faster setup time, ease of use, and versatility with the rigs.

Ben

Ok, I'll throw my other two cents in. I think it would be prudent to point out that there are many aspects to a wedding in which you might want to use a variety of methods. I shoot ceremonies from a tripod. I get in the middle of the dance with either hand held or my fig rig. We get in the limo with the fig rig. It depends. I think people's strengths have a lot to do with it.

That being said, your style of shooting will have a lot to do with what you get. If you want super steady, then a vest and/or steadycam might be a good thing, if you need mobility.

I like my fig rig because it's a tight unit, but use other methods, depending on what I'm doing.

I think any type of discussion like this needs to be more specific, one tool won't cover the whole wedding, or will it? (that was rhetorical)

I think and most would agree, as tired as your are after these things, I'd love to have the option to use someone elses arms everyonce in a while. :}

Steven that is a great point. As you are exactly right, that the tools do dictate your shooting style and there is no one tool that can be used for everything.
This is why I prefer the Multi Rig so much.
As it allows me to shoot in so many different configurations and styles, from shooting processionals handheld down the isle, then when bride is handed off place my unit on a preset tripod for lockdown ceremony footage.

Get very compact like shoting in a limo or car as you do as they leave the church or reception.

Or I can fully load up my rig (lights, mic, and wireless) for a reception shoot and shoot in from a tripod or handheld for dance footage.

I have enough equiptment to bring along on a shoot as it is and as such try to keep my setup that I bring as compact as possible (audio: wireless, digital recorders, mic stand and video: cameras, tripods, multirig).

A smooth shooter is just too large a setup for a one man outfit like myself to add to my setup. Which is why I settled for the versatility the Multi Rig.

Everyone has their own style of shooting and the Multi just happens to suit my shooting syle.

The fig rig or DVMulti Rig are the most versatile units and will get the most use in the course of a day. Not exclusive use, but the most use. If you are set on floating shots the glidecam/steadycam will do those much better but at the price of long set up times and very limited use during the day.

No rig will replace a tripod, but they can complement one for the times that you need to shoot "off the shoulder" with a smaller camera or you shoot for a specific planned shot for the highlights.

The "Rigs" provide a completely different look than the "cams" and it's a production choice for which is going to see more use in your production. I personally need a "rig" shoot much more than a "cam" shot. I also appreciate the faster setup time, ease of use, and versatility with the rigs.

Ben

Ben, Thank you, I couldn't have said it any better.

I tend to be long winded and wordy when trying to amke a point, in case you couldn't tell.

A lot of good replies here. I have a Glidecam Full Rig w/ vest, arm, sled.....and rarely use it on wedding shoots. I hear about some who have used stabilizers and full rigs all day long.....I see no point in that.....and what I do see is way over-use off the stabilzer. There is a time and place for it but all day is overkill to say the least.

If I were going to invest in some gear and had the money for a full rig.....but did not own the best audio gear......I would opt to buy a lectrosonics true diversity set up.....YOU will not be disapointed! and having the best audio gear is way more important than having an "extra" like a stabilzer.

IMHO....stabilzer shots do not seperate quality wedding videographers from average one's......I've seen much better final vids with no use of stabilizers over one's who have used stabilzers, so that says something about the producer.

If you are going to use a stabilzer whether it be handheld or full rig(vest, etc.)....."plan" when you anticipate to use it......random use of stabilzers is not the way to go.
Make sure there is room to use it......one can easily get distracted by watching the monitor and not being aware of what is around you. Its real easy to knock into soemthing like a table with a 4 foot vase full of water and flowers.

Outdoor photo sessions are a great time to use a stabilizer of you cover the photo shoots.

and if you want advice on the use of stabilizers....how to train, etc etc. post something in the stabilizer forum within dvinfo. Charles Papert who is a professional "Steadicam OP" in Hollywood and works on the biggest shows. movies.....and Mikko and a few others are extremely current and they really know there stuff. Im not downplaying the guys in the wedding forums but these stabilizer users tend not to be "pros". I think you'll get much better replies from the stabilzer forum area.

good luck.

"and what I do see is way over-use off the stabilzer. "

THANK YOU!!!!

I think i mentioned once that your own work here joe was a reflection on the comment above.. ;) being that you DONT

glad someone here agrees with me though.. lol

I think the Merlin is the perfect tool to enhance weddings shots. Depending on what cam, it is very light and easy to use for 15 minutes. There is no wrist strain. It is more arm strain, but the Merlin can be supported with 1 or 2 arms and arms can be switched when the other tires. Ceremony & formal shots, Processionals, dances, & Love Stories can all be enhanced with the Merlin. Plus, if it is a multicam shoot the Merlin is perfect for one cam. If the ceremony is 15 minutes, the Merlin can shoot the entire service. The Merlin is absolutely amazing.

Another great feature is the setup time. I can set a Merlin with a vx2100 in less than 2 minutes. Set it back on the tripod and then use the pd170 with shoulder support.

I've never used any of the other Stabilizers, but the Merlin is a fantastic choice.

I do 2 cam wedding shoots using 2 tripods and a Glidecam 4000 with Bogen qr mounts for fast and easy transfers. I sometimes use an armbrace with it, depending on the length of the shoot--got a vest for it but have yet to use it. I and my b&g's truly love the footage I get with it and I use it for pre-ceremony, aisle shots, photoshoots, intros, dancing, you name it. It provides great contrasting silky smooth shots to the tripod footage. I almost never go handheld, and don't think shaky footage is a style that looks good in a wedding video, but that's just me.
For an affordable price and with a good deal of practice, you can't beat the glidecam for weddings (or for building your arm and shoulder up...)

I think the Merlin is the perfect tool to enhance weddings shots......
Ahh, finally another Merlin user responding. Richard, I agree w/most everything you write except for using it at a ceremony. Maybe ok at an outdoor (if there's zero wind), or a very informal indoor ceremony, but not in a church, IMO. The Merlin shows it's stuff when the camera is in motion, and I + cameras are locked down during the ceremony. I do nothing to attract attention.

... stick to a tripod and if you really don't want to do that, get the dvrig pro.
I'm also a DVrigpro user, and it's great for moving around with a camera & all attachments for literally hours w/o any arm or back strain. Run & gun type shooting where you need a steady shot for an extended time but there's not time to set up a tripod. But, it's not a stabilizer and it's not a total replacement for a tripod -- not for me, anyway. In fact, I bought it thinking i could ditch the tripod.

With the DVrig, you are the tripod. So, any motion on your part -- shifting weight from foot to foot, breathing, looking around, scratching an itch, or God forbid you have to cough or sneeze or shoo away a wasp -- all will show up on the video. The camera movement might be very slight, but it's there nevertheless. And, of course, the more you're zoomed out, all body movement is more noticeable.

(For any DVrig fanatics reading this, I know about shallow breathing and various techniques to minimize movement. But, IMHO, if you prefer tripod-like rock steady footage, use a tripod.)

So getting back to the Merlin, it'll definitely give you footage that'll look cooler than anything shot by Uncle Joe with his hand-held minicam. However, if I was just getting started in this business, I'd invest in good basic stuff, and put this or any other stabilizer on the wish list.

Ahh, finally another Merlin user responding. Richard, I agree w/most everything you write except for using it at a ceremony. Maybe ok at an outdoor (if there's zero wind), or a very informal indoor ceremony, but not in a church, IMO. The Merlin shows it's stuff when the camera is in motion, and I + cameras are locked down during the ceremony. I do nothing to attract attention.


I'm also a DVrigpro user, and it's great for moving around with a camera & all attachments for literally hours w/o any arm or back strain. Run & gun type shooting where you need a steady shot for an extended time but there's not time to set up a tripod. But, it's not a stabilizer and it's not a total replacement for a tripod -- not for me, anyway. In fact, I bought it thinking i could ditch the tripod.

With the DVrig, you are the tripod. So, any motion on your part -- shifting weight from foot to foot, breathing, looking around, scratching an itch, or God forbid you have to cough or sneeze or shoo away a wasp -- all will show up on the video. The camera movement might be very slight, but it's there nevertheless. And, of course, the more you're zoomed out, all body movement is more noticeable.

(For any DVrig fanatics reading this, I know about shallow breathing and various techniques to minimize movement. But, IMHO, if you prefer tripod-like rock steady footage, use a tripod.)

So getting back to the Merlin, it'll definitely give you footage that'll look cooler than anything shot by Uncle Joe with his hand-held minicam. However, if I was just getting started in this business, I'd invest in good basic stuff, and put this or any other stabilizer on the wish list.

Tom you are spot on saying that a tripod is the only and best way to guarantee rock solid shooting.
But, you say that when using the DVRig Pro, there's not a way to place the rig on a tripod, when in fact there is one. If you purchase the tripod/light stand adaptor you will be able to place the entire rig on a tripod for lock down shooting.
I used to shoot this way all the time when shooting Ceremonies, as I would shoot the processional center isle on the grooms side, then place the entire rig on a preset tripod for lock down shooting.

I mentioned that I used to shoot this way, because I now use DVTecs new DVMulti Rig, which is smaller, lighter, multi configurable, and much easier to place on a tripod, the same way.

Some great advice here! Thanks for all the tips. This place is the best to come to for advice and "camera tech" talk.

I'm leaning towards the glidecam 4000... just because I see myself getting a heavier camera than my current GL2. I really only want to do some fluid movements for 20-30 minutes (outdoors, possibly windy at times) during the photo shoots.

All your replies have been great to read!

Thanks again.

My QUICK 2 cents

-tripod first, which is to be used for all the essential footage (ie ceremony/speeches)
-Steadicam shots used only to enhance video artistically.

With that said, here is a highlight reel of a wedding I did using a Merlin for the first time.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?p=600709#post600709

I see your points. I never used a Merlin to date at a ceremony so I am still deciding how and when. I plan to shoot the guests before the procession & the bridal party after they receive Communion and the guests are still receiving.

I have shot shoulder mounted 15 minute weddings and find it much better for me than using a tripod. I like to be free.

Yep, always invest in a set of good basic equipment first. My best investment ever was a set of wireless mic. It costs less than my Merlin but I cannot live without it.

I must say, I say stabilizers are incredible when properly used in helping create very slick and professional highlight reels.

Also @ CES the new Merlin vest is out!

Yep, always invest in a set of good basic equipment first. My best investment ever was a set of wireless mic. It costs less than my Merlin but I cannot live without it.

Hi Paul, your e-mail option is off, so could u please email me if possible? which wireless Mic set would u recommend? I've searched thru the forums & I'm trying to get as many reviews/opinions as possible, thank you!

Hi Michael,

I use and recommend the Sennheiser G2 100 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=9449&A=details&Q=&sku=324227&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation

Now if I have to buy again, I might buy a dual channel system. I found that I need dual channel most of the time. I think Azden has such system.

Hi Michael Wong

Here's another link that'll lead you to the same place as Paul's above, but gives you the bigger picture: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=pagination&A=nextPage&Q=&catId=9449&compareCatId=9449&shs=&ci=9449&ac=&al=&mnp=0.0&mxp=0.0&cmpsrch=&cltp=&clsgr=&bl=&sb=bs%2Cupper%28ds%29&sq=asc&fi=all&pn=2

I also use (and recommend) the Sennheiser Ev G2 100 Series. But, in case you're not familiar with wireless, you probably won't notice that Paul's link is only to the model with the "A" frequencies (518-554 MHz). If you click on page 3 of the link, notice there are additional choices for the B freqs (626-662 MHz) and C freqs (740-776 MHz).

In my part of the country, the C freqs are mostly open, so there's never a problem finding an unused freqency. The A & B freqs are pretty busy.

I see you're in Ontario, so before you buy any brand of wireless, you need to do some checking what the best freq range would be for you to operate in.

Thanx Paul & Tom,

You guys are super helpful and I thank u so much for ur help. I am deciding upon the Senn EW 100 G2 (with butt plug) or the dual channel Azdens' (here you go Paul):

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=9449&A=details&Q=&sku=383980&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=9449&A=details&Q=&sku=383985&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation

As tempting as it is to have dual transmitters for the Azden's, it is likely that I will go with the Sennhesier since its tried and true, and the reviews for the Azden product is far and few and are relatively unfavorable compared to the Sennnheiser.

s
But, in case you're not familiar with wireless, you probably won't notice that Paul's link is only to the model with the "A" frequencies (518-554 MHz). If you click on page 3 of the link, notice there are additional choices for the B freqs (626-662 MHz) and C freqs (740-776 MHz).

I see you're in Ontario, so before you buy any brand of wireless, you need to do some checking what the best freq range would be for you to operate in.

I've noticed that the wireless products are available for A/B/C frequencies but am unaware of how to find out which area uses which main frequency(ies).

In an attempt to no longer hijack this thread (sorry mods) I'm going to open a new thread to ask about this question. The link is right here.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=83955

Thanx again everyone!