OK, heres the deal...
I have a path in front of me...
I can either take the left path which is down HDV highway with video. Meaning that i would sell off what i have and upgrade the cams for HD delivery. This includes getting rod of the Z1 and DVX100 (wahh) as to me, the Z1 was pulled out to beat everyone to the line.. and the DVX... well it was good workhorse, but i think its on its last legs...

My cam choicese at this time is the Canon XHA1, or the HVX.. more than likely, i'll go canon for price and my current system build (ie HDV ready)
Then theres the delivery options coming soon.. which are of no issue to me.. i'll go with both.. i really dont care as theyre the same codecs... they only difference is the playback device and media

On the right though, i have the Stills area.. where my compositions in video have offered me copious amounts of job offers to shoot for and work with photographers. Many a time, have my compositions been copied (im brave and take risks and dont fear asking people to do things for a shot) and so photographers like to shoot over my shoulder. As im usualy traversing the streets on my shoots, i come across many familiar faces and many a business card and coffe date has been exchanged..
Now, equipment wise, this is the cheaper option than video. One video camera is equivalent to a decent kit with several lenses..

Now tossing the two...
which road do i take.. ?

If i go down the HDV road. it means that my current video workload will remain the same or even increase to accomodate these new format needs. Now that doesnt mean prices for the product will change.. as for now, prices are a struggle to maintain and i have to bend over backwards to score these prices consistantly... On average, were looking at 40-60 hours within an edit in post. On average i hit about 40 to 60 jobs a year.. this year i hit 39, and we havent even hit the Sept Oct Nov rush yet..
You can imagine my editing stockpile here...

OK, now on the flipside.. shooting stills..
My idea is to ofer a service not many people provide.. and that is to shoot and provide HQ RAWS on DVD. Basic colour correction but thats about it.

Im tryin to work smarter, not harder... Id rather shoot 4 weddings at $1000 each and give the client a DVD within a week as opposed to shooting 2 videos at $2500 each, and taking months to deliver.

Now with photography, people are happy to pay for good work. Compared to video, demand for the product is also highly sought, as the negative stigma on video remains. Also price differences are predominant, in turn, the there is an ability to earn more income from stills due to the market demand and client attitude to the profession.

In addition, post production is not as intense, and one is allowed to lead a normal life and still maintain a good decent workflow without working stupid hours. At the moment, i work between 16 to 20 hours day...

OK, so if you were to come across this choice which would you take?

As an aside, ive already made up my mind, but im just wondering how many people out there have been or are in my poistion at this time.
Its a tough decision, and a big investment (Money, emotions and risk), but i feel that with photography, i can be a little more brash with my ideas, and be a little more flexible with regard to work and home life.
Now in my situation, i have to continue to hang onto my cameras until September next year, as i am booked solid up to then... so thats about a year of sitting on equipment i cannot sell and equipment which will continue to depreciate each day.

So what would you do?

Gee Peter. I'd do both. Seriously, I'd adjust the prices and such to do both. Heck, you already work very hard to get to that point of setting up shots, etc, and even though it requires an extra pair of hands, I'd just do both. If you adjust price to a workload that is more comfortable, then you would still have the flexibility of offering both services and being able to pick and choose more the jobs that fit your schedule etc better.

I think we will be in a similar situation next year, and will probably step into both fields.

That's just my two cents. I think the one common thread you have is talent, just plain right out talent to set up shots, artistic expression etc. So hell, if I had the talent you had, I'd do both.

Photography. All the way. And I'm not saying that because I'm a photographer. I'm a videographer. But we're looking at expanding into photography and it seems to make much more sense. Exactly for the reasons you said. Workload is much more "normal", appreciation for the work is much higher, equipment expenses are lower. If you're already setting up great shots for video and aren't afraid to interact with people like that then I'd go for photography.

There is a point where you can either adjust (read: reinvent) your company to fit current demands, or you can move along to something else. It sounds like you've got more than enough work for yourself, but not enough time or money to do it all. So I'd either hire someone to help, or I'd step into photography. Just my thoughts on it.

Peter,

I seem to remember posts where you were really upset or frustraited about the videography, and wondering why you got into it. The equipment is so much more expensive and you need to constantly upgrade it and the software you edit on. Then you don't know what format, HDV, SD, or some new one you will need to deliver now and in the future and what the customer wants. Also, the photgrapher seems to make more money, for a lot less work, and tends to try and get in your way, (but something tells me you don't let them)!

If you can keep yourself busy and making a living with photography right now, I would go with that. My personal opinion, for what it is worth, is that many people get into wedding videography because they love the equipment and want to make movies. But, the bills have to be paid, so weddings it is!

All the best of luck to you whatever you choose. Just remember that you only have one life to live and some end way too early, like Steve Irwin's.

Mike

Take some time off, and spend a week at Disney. Relax, and give it a little thought when you aren't so stressed out. Then, when you get back, if you have any money left over, you do what you can afford ;)

"What would you do if you felt you were working too hard?"

stop.

"What would you do if you felt you were working too hard?"

Hire someone to help. Find an editor you trust and just do all the shooting (or vice versa).

I got my camera two days ago, so quite simply, I'll have to say photography. I haven't been in videography for a long time. I don't have many dollars already invested in a cache of equipment, so it's probably an easier decision for me to make. I know I won't have the money to accomodate the changes in video technology until the prices come way, waaay down. So getting into photography now is the best decision. I bet most photographers aren't going to offer videography, so those who can provide two services instead of one, may get more solid work. The one thing I know is that 100% of wedding clients book photographers. I don't believe the same is true for videographers.

Hey Steve, yes, I should have mentioned that I scrapped the Nikon D80 idea, and bought a Canon 20D instead. I couldn't wait for the D80 to arrive, and after consulting pros welly-versed with both Nikon & Canon lines, I thought it wise to invest in Canon. I'm kind of overwhelmed with the camera already. There's so much to learn. I spent all day at a parade capturing live shots and I'm completely unsatisfied with my technique. I'm booked to shoot a wedding this Saturday, and I wanted to be proficient enough to get a few photos in, to start a wedding portfolio. I think not...I need a few classes and a few more lenses at this rate.

Thanks Michelle, please report back and let me know how it does. Obvously, you'll be perfect. :}

thanks for your thoughts guys..
a bit of background.. audio engineer for 13years now.. editor for 6, corporate/commercial video for 5, and weddings for 3

I love what i do, theres no doubt about the creative freedom allowed within this field.. compared to corporate, weddings IMO can be fun, and to me they are.. i enjoy editing, i enjoy shooting however its the amount of time away from my family and my own health (ie stupid works hours) which is killing me.
Money.. well it would be comparable with my current workload. Basically im earning the same as if not more than a photographer would, however the hours i put in are much longer (and harder)... also my work peaks as opposed to being a plateu (sp?) of stability.. so during peak time, i can hit 8 to 10 weddings a month (which i no longer do) and some months i may have none at all..

reason i got into is because my business slowly evolved to it. Theres also the regualr money factor which does help, but i also offer afew thngs which to this day other companies are still to catch up with , so i have a leg up on that..
The work doesnt frustrate me, but its the expectations of the clients which upsets and frustrates me. they dont understand the intricacies invovled in video.. its not looking at a shot and deciding whether its good enough to keep... for us, we have THAT .. we decide what we keep, but then, we have to work out how were going to use it, where its going to go, how it will fit in with the rest of the piece, and what relelvance it has to the entire production... theres alot more thinking invovled, which is ok, but time consuming... theres also teh expectation that you can make changes at teh drop of a hat... and there are the moments where clients dont beleive a contract is valid even though it is airtight.
Compared to photos, video requires much more energy in every respect

These attitudes and ideas are slowly starting to change.. I tell the clients what i do and how i do it and i hammer it so far down their throats that its on the verge of being "to mcuh info" but in the end, i know that so long as i keep at it, they have no reason to complain. Now thr might be one in every 20 or so weddings who gives me a hard time because mroe than likely they dont understand their contracts.. n fact it IS becuase they dont understand their contracts...

I guess for me now is the viability of continuing with video... For me, its not about the gear, although it can be fun... and funny enough, with all this gear, i really havent even filmed my own family, which is really rather depressing..
Ive never been inclined to want to make movies (although ive made afew short films for Uni and training purposes and worked on may others) but to be truthful, back then it was a way to make easy money with next to no trouble at all.
Now that video is in the consumer light consumers and clients have a certain air of expectation. They see the "olook how easy it is to make your own video" marketting techniques and believe that our work is the same. Dont get me wrong in many cases, it is, but our level of work is far more intense with absolutely no room for error.

I mean i love video and i'll continue to do it, but i was hoping that if i get into stills, it would help me break away from the demands of video. In addition to that, i cant take upa day job with the current demand for work and current backlogue of work..
With regard to hiring people, i have afew uni students who have been keen. Theyve come in and learnt and so on etc etc, but most have the attitude that theyre too good for it. I also cant afford to have somene here to do my work for me.. although i wish i could... its not economically viable at this time... and just stopping is out of the questions..

I think the most profound thing i have needed to consider amongst all these thoughts is what Mike has said..
"just remember that you only have one life to live and some end way too early, like Steve Irwin's."

Hey Peter, that's some pretty good honesty. If you ever have a project that doesn't need a lot of brainage, feel free to send it over here, I'll hack away at it for you. I'll do it just to get tips from you. :} Seriously, you could always outsource the one's that are really a pain.

Btw, sorry to hear about your mate, I'm pretty sure he's somewhat of an icon in Australia.

He was huge. they even had counsellors going round to the schools.. the media here hasnt done anything to help the situation, moreso in a rush for ratings as opposed to leaving the family to mourn...

I guess im just really REALLY tired tryin to keep my customers happy all the while forgetting about my own happiness...

He was huge. they even had counsellors going round to the schools.. the media here hasnt done anything to help the situation, moreso in a rush for ratings as opposed to leaving the family to mourn...

I guess im just really REALLY tired tryin to keep my customers happy all the while forgetting about my own happiness...

Don't forget my offer, for just a plane ride and some exotic food, I'm so downunder.

Hey Peter,

Sorry to hear you're getting bummed out from video. Stills are always great. A lot less intense. The photog I was working with last weekend was using a 12mp Canon 5d. She shot nearly 1400 pics if you can believe it! She told me she needs about 8 hours editing/post for each 1 hour of shooting.

Anyway you can always pick up a 20d and do either for awhile. See which feels better in the long run.

Good Luck.

Thnx Steve, chek ur email mate.. ;)

As for the Photog who shot 1400 pics, IMO thats overkill... 800 is ALOT however of those photos, how many are gold? How many are worth looking at and how many are worth putting into an album.

Working smarter, not harder is the ultimate goal...

See this is it goes awry, coz alot of people think, oh you shoot XYZ amount, so you must me working harder.. no in fact it doesnt make a difference.. i can stand around and shoot all day long if i have to, or i can take my time and be meticulous with my shots. Be picky and choosy and set up what i think would work, then shoot as candidly as i need to.
To say 8 hours for every hour of stills taken is too much IMO. Shes either doing something wrong, or shes just hammering away and hoping for the best..
I dont know, but if a photog told me they took THAT many, id really be worried... Also i wouldnt want to be on the late end of camera.. With the way shes going, she wont even hit the 100 Wedding mark without the shutter giving out..
I already do alot of post work for photographers (which is why im jumping ship) and ive seen good stuff and crappy stuff. To be honest, of the photos i review and decide to keep, it takes me no more than 10 hours to hammer out over a thousand pics. Then if im going to get all fancy about it, i usually dont have to spend any more than 2 to 5 minutes on each one (usually pics destined for the album no more than 400)
Then to put the album together (which i dont do) would take about 10 hours
From here looking back id say no more than 25 hours for each job.. Most of the time, as the photogs know what theyre doing, theres no need for correction.. only touching up zits and snot stains... ;)

as for the 5d, brilliant unit.. very sturdy and amazing in quality, however even with the 500bux cashback, ive decided to go for the 30d, as for now, i can get a lense on top of the body, as opposed to a 5d body only.
Maybe if it picks up, ill grab a 5d later and keep the 30d as a backup.. who knows...

hey peter....have you considered recruiting some "good"(hard to find i know) help ie. maybe a producer/cam op/editors...you get the picture. YOU do the stills and the hired help keeps the video company rolling???
You still make money from the video stuff but perhaps very little work involved???

I have a friend who did this for many years as he took on much more hollywood work..... he finally sold the video company to one of the crew members for a nice price. he had some very reliable crew members who shot...edited....met with clients, etc. he still collected a pay check from it and did little of the work.

the reason i say this....you seem to a busy guy over there down under.....and it would be a shame to see your video empire evaporate after all the hard work of building your company.


anyway, this is what i would highly consider given similar situation.

Hi Peter,

I've enjoyed reading your posts over the months that I've been around DVi. You seem to have a nice attitude about what you do, a healthy respect for your own abilities, etc.

Have you considered jacking your video prices way up? Sure your bookings will fall dramatically, but perhaps the ones you do get will make you enough to want to continue. From what you say, you seem to have enough of a reputation and a following to be able to bear a major price hike. To me, if you are working so hard that you can't keep up, you are charging too little. I mean, 60 weddings a year for one guy is insane. Wouldn't you rather book 20 at 1.5x or 2x the price? This would still leave you room to do photo work and spend time with the family.

I find the guys I shoot for a bit in the same boat. They can't say no to a contract. They'll wheel and deal to the max to get it, then freak out cause they have to deal with 120 cut-rate weddings. It's crazy.

Anyway, just a thought. Best of luck with your decision...

Its funny you know..

In the past i used to take on anything which came my way.. best way to work with word of mouth... get the name out there kind of thing..
Now though, im rejecting jobs. left right and centre.. not because im booked, but becuase the clients are already giving me a hard time with demands, without even seeing the work... i want this i wnt that, i need by this date.. blah blah

I mean what ive noticed now though, is that the bargain basement hunters, and more importantly, those who are not happy with the photos, as the ones that cause the trouble

I'll explain..
Bargain hunters. Usually using their own budgets for the wedding.. usually further away from central CBD areas (cheaper receptions u see) cheap photographer and and pretty much a "less than 20k" affair.. my price to them just under 2 grand, so im not that cheap... BUT cheaper than the photog in most cases..
The fact that they paid upfront, is an issue coz its THEIR money... OK, so an abundane of work is there... so i educate them now...
Mid/Low cost = accessability of product to client = bookings = workload
Peak season = management = preparation/customisation= workload
Updates = Communication to exisitng and new clients = a deduction of edit time = workload
Health = efficiency= workload...

u get my drift...

so why then, after KNOWING this and agreeing to it, is there a problem?
Because after 4 to 5 months, theyre out of pocket with "nothing" to show for it... the hype of the wedding has died down and theyre paying off teir debts bought on by the wedding.. no social life.. nothign much to do really in this time.. especially for those couples already living together..

Other times, its due to alcohol (memory of the day) and in many cases noone else at the wedding is with a camera. So they are desperate to have SOMETHING
And THATS what gets their goat...

Then there are the others. As they have not seen the video, but have recieved their photos, 90% of the time, if theyre NOT pleased with them they automatically assume the worst from the video.
This has happened many times with bargain basement people, but also with some higher end clients.
I must say though that the high end 4k+ video clients are not as susseptable to making assumptions like this, as its THESE clients which appreciate and understand the work thats invovled (hence the ok for the hefty price tag)
But i have found that if a client ends up with dark or ugly photos, they assume that the video will be the same, so again, this desperation to see the work is comes to the fore.
No matter how much trust or how the contract is laid out, it doesnt matter. They have made their decision based on assumption from an unrelated profession and product. Despite their similarities, they ARE different..
Theyre made to believe they are.. the only real association, is composition. The gear is different even though they may have related elements... But still the client has no idea..

A couple of times (in my case) i have been told by clients that the photographer "advises" them to check with the video to see if those "environemntal elements" also afected us. This is a way to pass the attention away from their shoddy work... It happens.. here in aus anyway..
Not always, but its there..

99.999% it hasnt affected us. In fact, with video, there is MUCH more flexibility with lighting.
You see, video is alot more lenient/flexible than stills when it comes to exposure.. especially if a cheap arsed Photog is using the wrong lens'...
But still, the clients do not know this, so they assume the worst. And the longer it takes to get the work out, the more agitated they become.
All because of misplaced IDEA which had either been put into their heads by another, or by the fact that theyre just not happy with what they got so far.

In most cases, they pay photogs 1/3 to over 5 times what they pay for video, so if a Photog stuffs up who was more expensive than us, they automatically think "if i paid 4k for my fotos, but only paid 2k for my video... and my fotos turned out shit... how shit will my video be... "
Its an automatic association, and for most people its a justified assumption, albeit uneducated, you can appreciate THAT concern.

Not all clients are liek this.. 99% of are OK, but its the very few who make it hard to keep wanting to continue..

I think these 2 variables play a key role in customer expectation and satisfaction.

These are all subliminal and not elements which affect the day to day running, as i have clients who KNOW the quality of product, and are happy to wait. No matter how much they paid... it is of no concequence when they recieve the fnished goods.
And those that HAVE paid the higher amounts, understand that the 2 are totally unrelated. But those that do not know and those fotogs that know nothing about what we do and how we do it, also assume the worst, puting doubt into the minds of other uneducated people.

I mean im sure noone here will hack a job out just for the need for speed.. i know i dont.. and anyone who has pride is also of the same mind.

To me, i honestly think that photogs and retail's misguided ideas of video have made things much more difficult.
Down here at least..

Joe your idee aof getting others to shoot and edit, is a good one.. but i know what i am like.. I will need to see and tweak the video before i can deliver it if i am to put my name on it...With that i dont know how viable it would be, but depending on how stills go... It has been something ive been considering for a while now... I'll just have to see how it goes...

It has been something ive been considering for a while now... I'll just have to see how it goes...


I still hold that you might want to think about highering a partime business manager. Someone to buffer. That way you can concentrate more on the art, not the bs. :}

Thanks for the email btw, it was very encouraging.