I have a (non-canon) 6600 mAh battery, and I can get a good 5 to 6 hours continuous filming out of it. (6 tapes)

I had a BP970 in my Canon XhA1 last weekend and I got more than 8 hours out of it. I couldn't believe it!

I have a A1 for almost a month now. Yesterday i made recordings at the first Dutch Podcast Event. Three tapes filled in almost 4 hours and after that I did some filming in the neighbourhood of Amsterdam and Schiphol airport. After that i played a full tape before the camera said: 'Hey, this battery is almost empty. Please exhange'. Around 5 hours was the total amount of time.

I want to buy a 970, expecting to use it a whole day. Somewhere in June we leave for London to do some recordings at a concert on the 'Battersea Barge' and with any luck (they are hard to get over here) I will have it. Otherwise I'm going to get another 950.

I'm very well pleased with the 'user time' of the battery's.

One tip: I try to use them as long as I can. I charge them on the original device from Canon and use it until it's almost empty. With Lithium Ion there is a simple rule: You can recharge them for xxx times. (xxx=?). Every time you recharge the battery is ONE. So if you recharge it, when it's at 50%, that still counts as 1 complete charge.
I read that xxx is about 300-400 times. But that amount was not meant for the Canon battery.

I have used the Lithium-Ion battery's of my Sony camera for almost 7 years now and they still run a looooong time. I realy hope the new ones do too.

Succes,

Gert

One tip: I try to use them as long as I can. I charge them on the original device from Canon and use it until it's almost empty. With Lithium Ion there is a simple rule: You can recharge them for xxx times. (xxx=?). Every time you recharge the battery is ONE. So if you recharge it, when it's at 50%, that still counts as 1 complete charge.
I read that xxx is about 300-400 times. But that amount was not meant for the Canon battery.

I have used the Lithium-Ion battery's of my Sony camera for almost 7 years now and they still run a looooong time. I realy hope the new ones do too.


Thanks, so it seems that Canon's promises are in actual working conditions, about 1 working hour pr 1000mAh of battery.

Regarding recharging: The old NiCa rechargeable battereries had memory, you had to charge it completely first time or they would never reach 100%, and they have a memory effect which meant that you have to discharge the battery completely before recharging to maintain maximum capacity.

With Lithium-Ion batteries this is different. You can fastcharge the battery to 80-85% of capacity, but the remaining must be slowcharged to avoid overheating. Lithium-Ion does not suffer a memory effect meaning you do not have to discharge the battery completely before recharge, nor do you have to charge it completely before use. They will very slowly degrade to about 80% of original capacity, then capacity will drop rapidly.

I found this link on Lithium-Ion battery care (see tips at bottom):

http://www.batteryuniversity.com/parttwo-34.htm

See also Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_ion_battery

What is interesting is that Li-Ion batteries age from the time of manufacture, not just from number of charges. To avoid this loss, it is recommended to store batteries at 0C/32F at 40% charge.

For this reason, these pages recommend that you do not get a second battery unless you really need it. If you need to shoot 10hs a day and cannot get a recharge, get a second battery, else recharge when possible.

Cheers, Erik

The old NiCa rechargeable battereries had memory, you had to charge it completely first time or they would never reach 100%, and they have a memory effect which meant that you have to discharge the battery completely before recharging to maintain maximum capacity.

More specifically, the battery cells may may suffer a ~10% voltage drop at the "memory point", and this may be enough to fool voltage sensitive things, like a camcorder, to think the battery is discharged, signal same, and shut down. The charge is in the battery, you just can't get it with voltage sensitive devices. (Note that the battery reconditioner can get it out because it uses a lower voltage cut-off point.) The reson for the voltage drop is reported to be a chemical phase change in one of the components in the cell. In typical camcorder batteries, this effect maybe induced by over charging (e.g., leaving the battery on trickle charge afte it has reached full charge).

Deep cycling tends to cure it because it consumes the phase-changed chemical and on the subsequent recharge it returns to the higher voltage phase.

I get a bit confused here because you quote my part regarding NiCa batteries. I mentioned NiCa merely because recommendations for these batteries are often repeated for Li-Ion, but these do not apply. If your comment regards NiCa batteries, then this is not relevant for camcorders since these use Li-Ion batteries. Could you please clarify?

Some sources did recommend deep cycling once every 30 charges for batteries that are frequently charged. As I understand, this does not change the capacity of the battery but rather the reported capacity, such that you don't experience batteries run out prematurely. Is this the effect you refer to?

Cheers, Erik

in my experience, canon batts live longer and last longer than the cheaper brands.

There is a very good article about LI-Ion batteries at Apple's website:

Check it out:

http://www.apple.com/batteries/

Greetings

Gauer

I have a lot of BP-945's.
Anyone using these with the A1?

How long do you think a BP-970 will run an XL1-S?

As stated above. It's always best to stick with Canon batts.
They run longer and last longer.

Just used an A1 with the 950 battery on saturday for a shoot that started at 2:30pm and stopped 11 hours later (obviously not continuous shooting). Used one battery, went through at least 4-5 tapes (I wasn't in charge of tapes). Near the end, I started putting it to standby to save battery life.

Russ

I try to avoid having to use it if possible, but I do have a spare Impact battery (and another cheap generic, which I pray I never have to resort to) that I've used with the A1. And yes, it did get stuck.

I paniced at first, but the solution was pretty simple. Just hold down the release button until the entire battery is out. If you just press it and expect the battery to release, it will get stuck. If you try to pry it out, you WILL be sorry.

Again, just hold down the release button until it's all of the way out and you'll be fine...

One tip: I try to use them as long as I can. I charge them on the original device from Canon and use it until it's almost empty. With Lithium Ion there is a simple rule: You can recharge them for xxx times. (xxx=?). Every time you recharge the battery is ONE. So if you recharge it, when it's at 50%, that still counts as 1 complete charge.


This is not true, in fact cycle count is based on amount of charge removed during use. If you use a battery two times, discharging to 50% each time (removed one full charge), it counts as 1 cycle from aging point of view. In fact Li-Ion cells do not like to be fully discharged, so it is better not to run them all the way down.

Some sources did recommend deep cycling once every 30 charges for batteries that are frequently charged. As I understand, this does not change the capacity of the battery but rather the reported capacity, such that you don't experience batteries run out prematurely. Is this the effect you refer to?

Cheers, Erik

This is true for the batteries that have a built in fuel gauge, which measures the amount of charge going in and out. I know of only one brand that has it - Anton Bauer 14V batteries. This high end feature makes them more expensive to make. I am not aware of any 7.2V batteries that have a fuel gauge electronics in them.

It's not the fuel guage, but the battery chemistry.

Nickel cadmium batteries can develop a "memory" effect if they are repeatedly partially discharged. Deep cycle charging them periodically helps to prevent this.

Lithium ion and nickel metal hydride batteries are not subject to the memory effect. On the other hand, they cost more to purchase and don't last as many charge cycles as a properly cared for nicad, so there's your tradeoff.

Li-Ion batteries are also said to suffer from a gradual decrease in total capacity over time, about 10% per year, irrespective of usage. However, I only have this from one source and haven't confirmed it.

Li ion has a operating life of 2 to 4 yrs. You do see a depreciation of capacity over that time, but that is the same with any chemistry of battery.

fwiw, anton bauer warrantees their dionic bricks (li-ion) for less time than their nimh and nicad lineup. haven't used dionics, but user reports seem to indicate the battery will eventually fail after a couple of years. their big advantage, however, is their light weight. on the other hand, i know people who have been using the same propac bricks (nicad) for a decade.

soap box note: nicad batteries are the worst for the environment, and proper disposal of all batteries should be observed. radio shack, for one, will take old batteries. and rathbone, and other companies, will recell/recycle them.

getting back to the xha1, if anyone is interested in using an anton bauer power solution with this camera, or any other camera that uses canon bp-style batteries, switronix makes a cable with a 7.2v canon battery mount on one end and a 12v powertap connector on the other.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=Search&A=details&Q=&sku=416044&is=REG&addedTroughType=search

you just need to cut off a little plastic nub on the connector housing with an x-acto knife or razor for it to fit on any standard ab gold plate. cable lengths are available in 20" and 48". i'm currently running the xha1, marshall lcd, ab light, and, occassionally, the redrock m2 off a single ab brick.

Li-Ion batteries are also said to suffer from a gradual decrease in total capacity over time, about 10% per year, irrespective of usage. However, I only have this from one source and haven't confirmed it.

This is true, and documented - you can check wikipedia. The capacity loss depends on how the battery is stored and if it is fully or partially charged. It appears to minimize the capacity loss, battery should be stored cold and dry, some 10C is ideal, and charged to 40% capacity. Then annual loss will be 2%. The necessity to charge the battery partially is to avoid deep discharge.

Cheers, Erik

[Quite]As I understand, this does not change the capacity of the battery but rather the reported capacity, such that you don't experience batteries run out prematurely[/Quote]

I've seen this feature in documentation for some NiMH-powered devices. The remaining run time display system (e.g., on a laptop computer) required an occasional deep discharge cycle with the installed battery to recalibrate the displayed remaining time system to the condition of that a batttery.

The standard BP-950G that comes with the A1/G1 has 5 metal contacts on the end.

I bought my A1 with an optional battery and upon further inspection the battery says it replaces the BP-945. It's a 6000mah battery. The concern I have is that the battery has only two contacts vs. 5 on the battery that came with the camera. The three in the middle labeled T,B and G on the standard battery are missing but the two longer contacts on the ends are there. The camera works fine with the battery but I was wondering what the three middle contacts do...

I only paid $75.00 for the 6000mah battery so this seems to be a cheap alternative. Just making sure it's acceptable.

Thanks,

-Jonathan Gentry

I found a few posts about the difference in the number of contacts on these batteries (2 vs. 5) but no answer as to what the middle three contacts do. It looks like others are using the 2 contact batteries with no problems so I won't worry too much.

If anyone finds out what the three contacts in the middle do let me know.

Thanks!

-Jonathan

Hey guys... Usually I remove the battery pack from the camera when I stow it away out of use, but this past time I left the battery in the camera for a couple days without use.

Yesterday when I took the camera out of the bag, I noticed the battery was completely dead when I tried to turn the camera on. And this is the big 3.5+ hr BP-950 Battery pack. The odd thing is, the battery had a near full charge when I stowed it away. I did not leave the camera on when it was stowed away.

Does anyone know if this is normal... and if not, what could have caused this? It seems odd that the battery discharged itself like that. Thanks for any thoughts.

I left mine in for several days and it didn't seem to discharge very much at all, if any. Might be a problem there.

Mine doesn't discharge noticeably, so I don't think it is normal.

Richard

Left it in for a couple of weeks with no noticeable discharge - and that's on the smaller one that comes with it.

Hi,
As a digital still camera tech, this fault is quite common, with regards to faulty power pcb..Dark current (power off battery drain) is way beyond manufacturers specs...So this would not be normal for a camera, in terms of correct operation.

This MAY be the case with your camera...Dont mean to scare you.

Might depend in part on the charge state of the internal back-up battery. If it is discharged it will draw power from the removeable battery to fully charge it, but that should be the main draw when the camcorder is otherwise turned off.

Hi,
As a digital still camera tech, this fault is quite common, with regards to faulty power pcb..Dark current (power off battery drain) is way beyond manufacturers specs...So this would not be normal for a camera, in terms of correct operation.

This MAY be the case with your camera...Dont mean to scare you.

Hey guys... thanks for the thoughts. Ivan, any suggestions on what I should do? What if it doesn't persist as a problem? If it does persist, should I be worried and should I take it somewhere for a checkup? Thanks.

Deke,

What we do ( NOT SUGGESTING TO DO THIS! ) to diagnose the fault, is hook it up to a powersupply with amp meter (directly to batt contacts)..and check that its drawing a particular amount of current, something like 300 uAmps when turned OFF...Cameras usually go off the scale when faulty, drain batts very quickly.

IF, it is the case with your camera, meaning you can reproduce the fault, I would definatly send it in to be checked....First off I would try another battery...It could be the battery/Charger.

I just want to make it clear..The above comments relate to digital STILL cameras...and may not be relavant to your camera.

Funny. A Lenmar LIC941 I bought in 2001 fits, but some I bought in 2004/2005 stick and need the gaffer tape trick to pull them out. Bummer.

The 2001 battery is questionable, and headed fopr the recycle bin, as are some smaller batteries dating to 1999.

I was reading up the other day on the LOCK / STANDBY feature. I was wondering if when in LOCK (the switch that holds the settings you were at but powers down the camera) if technically the camera is still 'on' and drawing battery life. I used the lever yesterday and later wondered if I'd left it on LOCK and if it was drawing juice while packed away.

I couldn't find battery info in the manual in reference to the lever.


Trish

Before you get into sending for repair and fancy testing, try this to make sure the battery has not gone bad.

1. Fully charge the battery that was in it and let it sit for a good period, off of the camera and test it again.

2. Try a different battery in the camcorder, and see if the problem is still there.

It may be that you just have a battery going or gone bad.

Mike

Hey all,
I'm going to be using the XH-A1 at a wedding for the first time next weekend and I'm a bit concerned about something. I have the stock Canon battery and the Impact BP-970. I'm wondering if these two batteries, fully charged, will be enough to get through a full day of shooting. The wedding is outdoors and I doubt I will be able to plug the camera up or recharge either battery and I want to be reasonably sure that these two batteries will be enough. Any and all opinions will be appreciated :)

Thanks,
Doug Chambers

That's about ten hours of endurance, but I would add a third batt just to be on the safe side.

Don't worry, the batteries really do last for ages. I did a wedding 2 weeks ago and only switched from the stock supplied battery at the start of the evening reception. I reckon the larger BP945 would have seen me through the whole day easy.

If shooting for money, you can never have too many blank tapes or too many fresh charged batteries with you - you can only have too few. No one knows or cares if you have more than you needed, but the client gets mighty upset if you have one less battery or tape than you needed.

I would say plan on at least one good charged battery (e.g.., BP950) for each 1 hour tape you plan to shoot. You will not need that many if you use StandBy/Lock during long pauses in action at a typical wedding. Adjust this ratio as you gain expereince with your gear and shooting techinque.

Keep in mind, the more you shoot at a wedding, the more you have to sift through as you edit and the longer it takes to produce the end product.

Thanks for the advice. I just went ahead and ordered another BP-970. It hurt the wallet a little bit, but it will be sure to save me tons of worry. $130 is a decent price for peace of mind, isn't it?

Does anyone have this battery? I`m confused about its usage. It comes with the A1 package, but the description is it works specifically with the G1/2 Xl 2. If you mount it under the camera can you not use a tripod? Or can a quick release attach to the battery, but won`t that mess with balancing the camera since the weight will all be in one little point under the cam? Also once the battery is under the camera...how does the power get into the camera?



http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=Search&A=details&Q=&sku=437763&is=REG

The battery has it's own tripod hole, so you can still use a tripod. The power gets to the camera by way of a dummy battery. In the picture from the link, it is the bottom right thing, beside the charger. As long as the A1 has the same battery as the GL/XL series, this setup should work.

The battery has it's own tripod hole, so you can still use a tripod. The power gets to the camera by way of a dummy battery. In the picture from the link, it is the bottom right thing, beside the charger. As long as the A1 has the same battery as the GL/XL series, this setup should work.

Does this mean you have to shoot with the battery door open then? That seems like a broken part waiting to happen. I love my XH A1 but the battery design makes me scratch my head.

My guess is that a 970 battery is going to be more than enough and this one is a little overkill.

Actually, if you look a little closer at the battery door, you will see there is a slot for snaking a cable out. Also works with the AC adapter.

My bad - thanks for the heads up.

Still don't like the door thing though

Considering the price of that battery, I would invest in a few 970's.
Exchanging those batteries should not be a problem because you also have to exchange tapes. Except when you use a harddrive solution ofcourse.

My 950 battery runs for about 4-5 hours. More than enough for me.
I think a 970 will run for 6-7 hours. So with three of those you could almost run 24 hours.

Next to that: with two or three you also can reload the empty one in between.

I agree. With the battery that comes with the camera and a second 970, you can pretty much shoot all day. Buy a third battery and you're cool for about anything. That big Anton Bauer battery is probably about as heavy as the camera. I don't see any need for it.

Does this mean you have to shoot with the battery door open then? That seems like a broken part waiting to happen. I love my XH A1 but the battery design makes me scratch my head.

My guess is that a 970 battery is going to be more than enough and this one is a little overkill.

Check that manual. That door comes off.

Check that manual. That door comes off.

Huh? Say again? Where does it say that in the manual?

Bill

Check that manual. That door comes off.

I tried to pull it off with a screwdriver and hammer... No luck... Just kidding... I don't believe it is suppose to be removed...

I just got the Anton Bauer system for my XL-1. I had a belt mounted Bescor battery that gave decent battery life (maybe 3-4 hours) but it weighed a tonne.
Anyway, I have been using the elipz for the past three days and have been very pleased with it. Now admittedly the XL-1 is a heavier and possibly more power hungry beast than the XH-A1, but the battery pack itself is very lightweight and I didn't feel that it added any weight to the overall rig.
I also really like the fact that I just don't need to worry about running out of juice. As is the case with all external batteries I've used, you lose the battery meter function in the camera and there's no real level indicator on the battery pack itself other than a "have charge" light - I would prefer a Mac-style battery meter on the battery.
The other advantage is being able to run the elipz on-camera light at the same time with no additional battery. The biggest issue I found is that the system uses a stacking power connector and the connector for the light is quite lose. Unfortunately, this has to go in before the camera's dummy battery connector and I found myself unplugging everything inadvertently on a couple of occasions. This is nothing that can't be solved by velcro tape or gaffer tape, but it is in my opinion a design flaw. Power connectors should really be locking.

I am about to purchase an XH A1 as I have sold one of my XL2 cams, I just wondered if someone could tell me if my XL2 batteries will work with the XH A1. What model comes with the A1? Are they interchangeable with the XL2? Thanks.J

The A1 runs on a BP-930G/950G/970G, as does (I believe) the XL2.

I kept my 2 spare batteries when I sold off my XL2, and am using them with the A1. And the charger that comes with the A1 is the same part number as the XL2 charger.

Richard