I can't help it, I've got to ask. Trust me, no dealer has put me up to this... nor Canon... I'm just curious, for our members here who while not constituting the entire market for these camcorders, certainly do account for some particular slice of it...

If you're actually thinking about buying one of these, which one do you have your eye on? The basic A1 for $4000, or the SDI-equipped G1 for $7000? I just want to get a grip on where the primary interest lays among our membership.

If the answer is "neither," then please don't vote. But if you're seriously considering one, then I'm wondering which one it would be. As for myself, I went with the A1. It's all I need.

To be honest, the Genlock is the most important one to me.
The ability to plug into any profesional (or non profesional) system and have it available as a source is big news for me. Just as with the XL-H1, coupled with the SDI output, this makes this camera a $7000 fully conectable studio camera. After the Canons, the next camera caiplable of dooing this costs tens of thousands, not counting the lens. - And PAL/NTSC switchability costs even more.

- Mikko

As a filmmaker, I'm a one-camera man, so I don't need all those extra features, though they are nice.

Do both cameras come with component out?

heath

Yup, component out on both, see http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showpost.php?p=518204&postcount=121

I'm mainly interested in the A1. At this point the A1 fills every requirement I have for a small "B" camera: long run time, small form factor, inexpensive (relatively), and a wide to very telephoto lens. The improved AF and the OIS are also great bonuses.

I'm glad that Canon is pricing these cameras aggressively. The A1 MSRP is basically the same as the DVX100B! I don't know why anyone would buy the DVX100 now. These cameras are going to totally dominate the prosumer market unless Sony or Panasonic responds. I know I'm getting one.

Can't see the logic of the A1. If you are looking for the SDI features surely you'd pony up for the H1.
Conversely there'd be plenty of demand I'd think for a H1 minus the SDI connectivity, should work out at around the same price as the A1.

I think there are two ways of looking at the A1 vs G1 dilemma. The first model says that wow....Uncompressed SDI for $7 grand...that's unbelievably cheap. The second model says Canon added a $300 board to the A1 and is charging $3000 for the pleasure, which is unbelievably overpriced. I have to say that I'm inclined towards the latter opinion. With the overall raves about canon's HDV encoding, I think I'm gonna go with the passive twin.

I also think canon will sell 10 A-1's to each G1, yet if they had put the G1 in at a lower price it would hurt the H1's sales. Which begs the question of why the G1 at all? Probably because it makes a great companion to any studio already having an H1 plus it's got $2700 in extra profit thrown in.

My only real complaint is that it's not available sooner...I just came into the cash to get into HD and I really need to spend it now before something else distracts me. I'd probably pick two A1's over the H1 if I could right now. I sure miss the old days when canon announced the Xl2 and Gl2 two weeks before they hit the shelves.

Buy the XL H1 if you want a better lens option + the ability to change lenses, mount 35mm prime lenses, etc.

heath

Hey Chris,
I'm considering the A1 alot. I'd go with that one.

Heath...

There are a lot of reasons to buy either camera, but for me the most influential one is what is available now. I recently had a break-in at my studio, and I lost my entire arsenal of video cameras. All has worked out for the best as my insurance company (like a good neighbor!) came through for me this week. My main fretting now has been deciding between the canon and the panasonic...but honestly the feature set of the a1/g1 has me seriously hot under the collar (an Iris ring on the lens? someone is yanking my chain).

An interesting notion for me now is that the a1/g1 has probably pushed me in the direction of the H1, if only that I'll have a less expensive B-camera option in october (or november)..

Buy the XL H1 if you want a better lens option + the ability to change lenses, mount 35mm prime lenses, etc.

heath


What lens options will there be?
And how much $$$$$$?

-e

Eric,

Only the XL H1 has the option to change lenses. Visit the forum for more on the Canon XL H1:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisplay.php?f=101

heath

Oh waiter! Two A1's please.

If I want SDI, I'd need a lens that would resolve everybit of wow I could get, and the H1 suits.

Still, if I could swing it, I'd maybe get both an A1 and the H1 (skipping the G1). If the video would intercut nicely, then I'd have portability and studio quality.

I'd have to say an A1 for me. No need for those lil extras on the G1 in my work so far. But that nice upgrade to add PAL is something I will look into
for my other customers/clients.

I'm just happy to see the new releases by Canon, been waiting quite a few years for them to pop up! October is by birthday, so gonna be like a "kid in
the candystore" like I was when I first bought my GL2 and FX1.

Mmmmm...doughnuts....

I think the A1 is a killer offering - as in FX1, DVX killer for sure...

Heck, who wouldn't pick the XL-H1? But money money money... Alas...

So yeah, the A1 is my choice now.

Up until today, I was figuring I'd have to hold out and settle for the JVC GY-HD110 or new 200 series come this fall... the HVX P2 thing is just "silly" and Sony seems to have an aversion to 24p - damn, those new AVCHD's could have really been something if 24p was on them - it's FX1/Z1 all over again...

But now I figure Canon has put themselves right back in there!

This is great news - fabulous. When Canon declared "no more mini-dv" - wow - they MEANT it.

A1 makes me think of the Sony, and that Sanyo HD1 makes me think of the JVC.

hwm

I think I might get one of each.

Seriously. I need the SDI I/O for some composite work I have to do. Ever try to do a difference key on DV, HDV, DV50 or any compressed format ? It pretty much leads to roto.

On the other hand it'd be great to have two cameras I can match nicely for work I can complete using HDV, which after all is the bulk of my work.

I was considering ponying up for an XL-H1 late this year, but these cameras change my mental calculus. Instead of spending MSRP $10000 USD, and getting one nice camera then having to fight to find any other HDV camera as a B unit, I can spend $11000 USD MSRP and have two nice cameras well matched for A/B shooting, and still get the SDI output I need to feed Shake.

If I could interchange set-up files between them it might be tempting to try and get an XL-H1 and then buy a one of these as budgets permitted down the line. Canon should fight a bit to uprate the XL-H1 a touch to make this possible.

I would get probably the A1. I need a B camera for my HVX, for action Stickypod shots and long form documentary work, and the a1 seems to fit the bill. It should take reasonable stills too... Now my only concern, still, is FCP support for 24f and canon HDV...

Seeing the poll here I think it could be a good idea for Canon to make a version of XL-H1 without HD-SDI output. I think a version like that would attract a lot of customers. Canon should also upgrade the XL-H1 with embedded audio and timecode on SDI.

I would probably get the A1 first, then the G1 later if I'm pleased with the footage. Here in London where widescreen has become almost mandatory, I work with lots of Z1 and H1 footage and tend to like the Canon footage more, it seems to have a more gradual dynamic range, even shows up on the scopes. Could be the lens, could be the way shooters have set up their cameras. Either way, shooters here are squeezing all they can from HDV with the H1. If the A1 and G1 produce an image anything like the H1, I'll bite.

Truth be told, the iris control on the lens has really hooked me. Never thought I'd see that on this type of video cam.

Seeing the poll here I think it could be a good idea for Canon to make a version of XL-H1 without HD-SDI output.

Hmmmm...could that be the upcoming August 2nd announcement?

Since I'm just getting into (or back into) this arena, I would choose the A1. With the $3k difference I can buy add-ons that I'll use much more than the G1 upgrade will offer me.

Let's see... wireless mic system, tapeless capture, upgraded software, better tripod, platform add-on for the Merlin - yep, that $3k is going to go to good use.

...the Canon footage more, it seems to have a more gradual dynamic range, even shows up on the scopes...

It's why I favored a Canon XL1s, despite the lower resolution to other cams in it's class. It's also why I'll wait before getting a Z1U.

Two A1's here please. For just a little more than what it cost me for getting into video in the first place with two PD170s I can now switch to HDV and still retain all the pro features plus add some. Albiet, low light performance still has to be proven. This is what I've been waiting for. This tells me that HDV is starting to get a good enough foothold on the beach head of video production for me to invest soon. We'll see what comes of the reviews and low light performance.

Eric,

Only the XL H1 has the option to change lenses. Visit the forum for more on the Canon XL H1:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisplay.php?f=101

heath

Sorry if I continue to ask dumb questions, but are you saying there aren't even attatchment adapters to achieve wide angle shots.

Yes, there will be a 0.8 wide adaptor for the XH cameras, the WD-72:
http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=SNAModelSuppliesAct&fcategoryid=818&modelid=14057

oh sweet mary - I think my cars' worth about $3999- that will be my choice - anyone want to buy a ford all widow van ???? seriously , canon , when it finally comes to the table , kicks axx don't they ? At 4k the A1 should even puts the chills on the fx1 and will probably really hurt sales of the zbaby. I'd love lens interchangability , but for 3k less , the A1 is my choice sword. Kurth

I put a vote on the A1.

Uncompressed HD SDI out is nice, but at an extra 3 grand, too expensive for me. If you really need that for 1 shoot or something, you can always hire a GL1 as a b cam.

As soon as I can preorder an A1...I will.

This is the camera I brought up and envisioned in Area 51 back on jan and now my dreams are coming true.

Next summer I will shoot my first indie feature.

You know in the past I would have went for the SDI in a heart beat. Now I'm not so sure. The new bottom line Decklink cards now have component HD built in. I'm not sure if I would really be able to tell the difference between uncompressed SDI and uncompressed analog component. Considering that HDV on the CANON cameras already looks great I do not think the SDI would blow me away when compared to component. I realize there will be a slight level of noise and softening but I will be using some pretty short cables anyways. I might change my mind by October but for now I think the A1 will be the way to go for me. Besides at this price point when I do need to get a second HDV camera in a few months I will either then go for the SDI version or go all the way to the XL-H1s. If I do get into SDI compared to analog uncompressed I'm sure I will not need both cameras to have SDI.

Besides I already have a analog uncompressed SD editing system so I will be able to capture live uncompressed SD with either camera so I might as well go with the cheaper one.

I would go for the cheaper one. What I would use this camera for would be primarily documentary style work, so no need for the SDI options.

Pretty interesting, out of 83 votes so far, 88% choose the A1 and 12% choose the G1.

And it's a good thing for filmmakers that Canon didn't learn from Sony how to dumb down the cheaper model by removing XLRs, etc. You want SDI and genlock, chances are you're more of a studio or multicamera outfit, so you can afford it; you don't need those features, you can still get a camera with the features you do need. Giving people what they want...what a marketing concept! It'll never catch on....

Why do they look like Cannon took the Z1u skin and wrapped it on the Gl2?

Because it's painted Professional Photographer Flat Black?

Why do they look like Cannon took the Z1u skin and wrapped it on the Gl2?

Haha, okay it was a joke.

I've noticed most cameras that are around the size of the Z1 look alike, for the most part. Except the Z1/FX1's tape transport is on the left instead of the right.

heath

ok, next time I'll put a 'haha' behind my jokes.

i would go for the G1. simply because i have and H1 aswell and being able to synch them together with GENLOCK and both outputting HD SDI. it would better suit me.

I also picked the A1. $4,000 will be more in my price range and no other camera's needed right now. Still need to read up on the 24F.

As some other posters have said Canon is really missing it if they do not bring out a version of the XL-H1 that does not have the SDI output and genlock so that it is affordable to many of us.(Who is going to complain about $500.00 to $1,000 more than the XL-2) At first it was thought that dropping these features would not result in significant savings, but from the price difference between these new cameras it is obvious that this is just what those of us need who use long lenses for wildlife and do not need the other features. Please let this be the August 2nd announcement.

I'd opt for the G1 since I'd like the ability to "future proof" my purchase and skip the HDV stage if some other better (and protable) solution comes available. I do think that $3000 is a little stiff price jump for a few extra BNC connectors and a SDI board. I'd be willing to bet that the street price for the G1 will be lower than we think... I hope so.

I chose the A1 as it should make a great B-roll cam. I've already got the XL H1, so using the A1 as B-roll and a deck makes the most sense.

I also voted for the A1, 'cause I don't need those jacks. I've already got two dv cameras Panasonic (GS150 and DVX100) and a 16mm (regular not super Eclair NPR) - I'm a film student/aspiring filmmaker.

The Canon is the camera I've been waiting on, though I would like to have the option of a VTR and full editing support before I actually buy one.

I've got nothing to complain about, tho maybe the LCD really should be bigger.

I'm looking forward to seeing some footage shot with this baby and also, how much running time you get with batteries.

K.

Run time is about five hours with the included BP-950G.

As a dedicated GL1 user, I was assuming that if Canon was gonna make a GL3 they would certainly hit us up for the same 5-6k price for this "GL3" that panasonic is asking for the HVX. I assumed this 5-6k "GL3" would have the usual "kid brother" CCD deficiency that has existed thus far between the XL and GL series.

Between the unforgiving "rebate exiration date" watching, and wearing a virtual groove in the canon website, the endless wait for this camera started to wear down my faith that any of us would ever see a GL3. I have to admit, out of desperation, I was kinda starting to fall for the HVX. Especially given the 9k price tag on the HL.

But Canon knew just what to do to erase my naughty HVX desires and win me back, far surpasing my expectations by giving us the same CCD's as the HL within our favorite GL form. The GL series seemingly has grown up.
I always felt like the quality gap between the GL - XL series was odd, so its good to see it maybe has ended.

At a MSRP of $6800, the G1 should end up being around 6k on the street. So for about the same as the HVX I get better resolution, Canon optics, cool manual iris ring on lens, and uncompressed HD. Wow. And the A1 should be a real HVX killer at 4k and no golden P2 cards to buy and better resolution to boot.

So I think I will be getting the G1, since I already had put away that amount for an HVX.

Jack you should post more often. Totally off-topic by the way, but ain't it a shame that the Back Room is finally closing doors tomorrow. Think I'm going to drop by and drown a Shiner in retrospect. I lost part of my hearing at a Ramones show there back in '89.

Hey, well I did gush a bit, but it really was all to build my case and give a little background info as to why I was making my choice to buy the G1.

P.S. I hope your poll doesnt sway Canon to not release the G1! (at least before I get mine)

I also feel like the G1 looks too much like an in-between solution compared to the A1 and H1. I suspect most folks who are serious enough about wanting Gen-Lock and most importantly SDI out will also want to go all out for the lens interchangeability of the H1 as well considering it's not much more expensive, and most people who don't have a need for those extra connectors like me will look at it simply as 2 A1 for the price of 1 G1. I fail to see where the market is for the G1.

i would go for the G1. simply because i have and H1 aswell and being able to synch them together with GENLOCK and both outputting HD SDI. it would better suit me.

Then why would you not buy an other H1 instead? Genuine question, I want to know who would buy the G1 and why. It doesn't make sense to me, but maybe does to you.