Has anyone been able to try out the Rode's Stereo Video Mic yet?
Do you think it will outperform the AT822? - for about the same prize, maybe even being more practical?

I plan to get a stereo mic and have the chance to get a new AT822 for abt. 190 USD now, including the shock mount it would be about 230 USD. I wonder if I should grab it or wait for the release of Rode's SVM.

I haven't heard of the SVM. When is that supposed
to be out?

It's coming out in July. I hope to have a unit to review before then.

The success of the VideoMic has led to high expectations for the SVM. Tough call. But I believe that the SVM release has already been delayed at least once. So you may have a long wait. Personally, I'd go for the AT822. Chances are you can recover your full purchase price if you want the SVM later.

.....Personally, I'd go for the AT822. Chances are you can recover your full purchase price if you want the SVM later.

very good point!
I just checked the prizes I'd have to pay for the AT822 back in Austria, actually at online shops in Germany which is the cheapest place to buy for Austrians. It is 311 Euro for the AT822, another 64 Euro for the shock mount, + sending cost, which makes about 470 USD or double the prize I'd have to pay here.
The Videomic ist to be had for 99 Euro only, which is about the same prize as in the US if I am not mistaken, whereas the AT822 is about 200USD in the US, half prize than in Euroland. - Which, to find friendly words for these strange prizings, makes the AT822 an exclusive piece in the Eu.

I also have been looking at these two mics. Still can't decide but have the time to wait a bit. I am leaning towards the AT822. I would like to buy used, but ebay shows new ones, and I would be hesitant about a used via ebay anyway. And if I could recover most of the price as Fred says then it becomes even more attractive to get the AT822 new. And of course if everyone is so happy with the AT822 then I wouldn't see many used ones around, right? I would love to hear what you decided to do Andreas.

Thanks!

Leslie, I've had very good luck with eBay, even buying used camcorders for my video club. If you ever decide to go that route, just make sure that the seller has at least a 98+% feedback rating based upon a good number of transactions. And if there are any negatives, I read the details and make a judgement. Anyone might run into a crank buyer. I prefer private sellers who have a plausible reason for selling. I often email them to get a feel for their responsiveness and personality. I've never been burned.

I like to record band and choral concerts in stereo. As you may have found, there are a lot of approaches. There are single point x/y mics like the 822, single point mid-side mics like the 835ST and pairs of cardioid mics that you set up yourself in several possible configurations. I currently use a pair of AT3031 cardioids. I get very good quality (staggeringly good quality on my last outing using the ORTF configuration), but two mics are a bit of a hassle to set up and there are already lot of things to think about at a gig. I'm really curious as to whether a well-placed single point mic would be as good. Regarding stereo separation, there is a wonderful free VST plugin that allows you to adjust that after the fact. I think I may buy an 822 or 825 and see.

Leslie, from what I have learned at videoforums it seems that the Videomic I is the preferrred shutgun and the AT822 the preferered stereo mic for consumer videographers who decent quality but don't want to spend big pucks for more professional mics.

However, Fred, am I crazy craving for another stereo mic?
Let me explain:

I own a stereo mic, the Panasonic VW-VMS2. Recently I also bought two socalled 'iriver Giant Squids', mono omni lavs which I combine with a Y adapter trying to record stereo as well ( I wanted one to record voice to my iriver mp3 player/recorder, but then opted to get two trying to record stereo with them as well )

I had made comparative recordings but lacking experience with audio recordings I really can't tell which sound better, the Pana or the two Giant Squid combined. I never have found any review of the Panasonic VW-VMS2, but I really wonder how it would compare to the like of the AT822. I'd expect the AT822 to be much better! That would make the Pana mic obsolete which then I'd try to sell it via ebay ( - even though I had built that cute and well working shock mount for it which I am so proud of...)

Or, if wanting another mic should I not better go for the Videomic I since I don't have any shotgun mic?
But: All my shootings I do while travelling where I try to catch ambient sound, not voices. In case I need voice I was planning to use the Giant Squid recording to the iriver. And the AT822 could be my 'ultimate' mic for many years to come, whereas the Pana makes me grave for something better.

I also wonder how the AT822 would perfrom recording stereo to the iriver.

Leslie, from what I have learned at videoforums it seems that the Videomic I is the preferrred shutgun and the AT822 the preferered stereo mic for consumer videographers who decent quality but don't want to spend big pucks for more professional mics.

However, Fred, am I crazy craving for another stereo mic?
Let me explain:

I own a stereo mic, the Panasonic VW-VMS2. Recently I also bought two socalled 'iriver Giant Squids', mono omni lavs which I combine with a Y adapter trying to record stereo as well ( I wanted one to record voice to my iriver mp3 player/recorder, but then opted to get two trying to record stereo with them as well )

I had made comparative recordings but lacking experience with audio recordings I really can't tell which sound better, the Pana or the two Giant Squid combined. I never have found any review of the Panasonic VW-VMS2, but I really wonder how it would compare to the like of the AT822. I'd expect the AT822 to be much better! That would make the Pana mic obsolete which then I'd try to sell it via ebay ( - even though I had built that cute and well working shock mount for it which I am so proud of...)

Or, if wanting another mic should I not better go for the Videomic I since I don't have any shotgun mic?
But: All my shootings I do while travelling where I try to catch ambient sound, not voices. In case I need voice it would be rather for interviews for which I was planning to use the Giant Squid recording to the iriver. And the AT822 could be my 'ultimate' mic for many years to come, whereas the Pana makes me grave for something better.

I also wonder how the AT822 would perform recording stereo to the iriver.

I like Panasonic as a company, but I have no confidence in them as a mic manufacturer. Based on the assumption that the VMS2 is not too different from the VMS3 (for which there is an on line review), my guess is that the frequency response is poor and that the AT822 would sound better. As I said above, I intend to try an 822 or 825 at my next concert. If it doesn't sound as good as my two AT3031s I'll return it.

thank's Fred.
When will be your next concert? Please be so kind and tell me then how you liked the AT822

We have the 822, 825, Rode NT4, and other sundry stereo mics, and they're usable for many applications. If you can use a matched pair of properly spaced omni's, these mics aren't nearly as good, but in tight situations where a single point placement is required, it's an easy toss between them. I'd take the AT in almost all situations except for very close miking. The NT4 is very sweet for that sort of work.
YMMV

Doug, do you consider spaced omnis to be better in some/many/most situations than the various coincident and near-coincident pair configurations?

Room/situation dependent of course, yes, I prefer spaced omni's.

Can two iriver Giant Sqids omni mono mics be combined with an Y adapter to record stereo?
If so, what would be the best set up / positioning of the two GS? How for apart, X-ing position?

If the 2 GS could be set up well to record stereo, would you even prefer the GS over the AT822 for e.g recording concerts? or ambience?

When recording mounted to the cam when filming on the road there would be no way the GS could challendge the AT822, right?

Can two iriver Giant Sqids omni mono mics be combined with an Y adapter to record stereo?
If so, what would be the best set up / positioning of the two GS? How for apart, X-ing position?

If the 2 GS could be set up well to record stereo, would you even prefer the GS over the AT822 for e.g recording concerts? or ambience?

When recording mounted to the cam when filming on the road there would be no way the GS could challendge the AT822, right?

I can't imagine a situation where a pair of Giant Squids would be preferable to the AT822 for recording a music performance. A pair of omnis is without a doubt a good and often used approach to recording music but generally not with a pair of bargain-basement lavs. There's no way a pair of $25 mics is going to to a proper job. Not to put words into his mouth but I think what DSE was referring to was using a pair of studio grade omnis such as perhaps AT3032s, or any of a number of other professional omni mics from A/T, AKG, Neumman, Schoeps, etc. You don't need to spend a fortune - the 3032s are usually less than about $200 each - but you get what you pay for.

The "X" positioning (actually usually more of a "V" or inverted-"V") is for directional mics like cardioids placed in coincident or near-coincident arrangements. A pair of omnis are usually set up in a spaced arrangement called "A/B placement" where something called "the rule of 3" comes into play. This says the mics should be at least 3 times as far apart as the closest mic is to the sound source. So if you had a band on the stage and the mics were 5 feet out from the front row, the mics should be about 15 feet apart and equidistant on either side of centre stage.

And as I'm sure Steve knows, but didn't happen to mention, due to phase cancellation the stereo from A/B placed mics doesn't collapse down to mono very well, as may be desired in playback in many TVs. The virtual single-point pickup approach of the AT822 is better for that.

And as I'm sure Steve knows, but didn't happen to mention, due to phase cancellation the stereo from A/B placed mics doesn't collapse down to mono very well, as may be desired in playback in many TVs. The virtual single-point pickup approach of the AT822 is better for that.

Right you are ...

Steve thank's you very much for the clarifications and explanations...- many times I feel in some threads because information and knowledge for pros and a consumer/hobbyist like myself are mixed and my questions will be naive or seem to be misplaced.

Something I would still like to find out:
I have learned that there is no mic for all uses as many beginners would like to have, but that a shutgun like the Videomic seems to be the most recommeded choice as 'default mic' for a consumer/hobby videographer.
For the kind of filming I have done so far I have not had the need to catch e.g. voices but rather the ambience. Would you still recommend me the Videomic or could I be better served with - for my level - a very good stereo mic like the AT822?
Or in other words: In which situations, besides wanting to catch voices/conversations, a shutgun would be favoured over a stereo mic?

If I'd get the Videomic ( just found out that I could get it for less than 90 USD here in Japan ) is it possible to separate it's shock mount to use it with other mics, e.g. the AT822 ? ( well, I imagine that best I'd get both mics, and if they could be used with one shock mount only that would be great ).

If I'd get the Videomic ( just found out that I could get it for less than 90 USD here in Japan ) is it possible to separate it's shock mount to use it with other mics, e.g. the AT822 ?No, the videomic's shock mount is integrated into the design. You can't separate it from the mic.

Steve thank's you very much for the clarifications and explanations...- many times I feel in some threads because information and knowledge for pros and a consumer/hobbyist like myself are mixed and my questions will be naive or seem to be misplaced.

Something I would still like to find out:
I have learned that there is no mic for all uses as many beginners would like to have, but that a shutgun like the Videomic seems to be the most recommeded choice as 'default mic' for a consumer/hobby videographer.
For the kind of filming I have done so far I have not had the need to catch e.g. voices but rather the ambience. Would you still recommend me the Videomic or could I be better served with - for my level - a very good stereo mic like the AT822?
Or in other words: In which situations, besides wanting to catch voices/conversations, a shutgun would be favoured over a stereo mic?

If I'd get the Videomic ( just found out that I could get it for less than 90 USD here in Japan ) is it possible to separate it's shock mount to use it with other mics, e.g. the AT822 ? ( well, I imagine that best I'd get both mics, and if they could be used with one shock mount only that would be great ).

I generally think of "ambience" as general background sounds - babbling brooks, birds twittering in the trees, distant dogs barking, etc - that don't visually sync to picture. Shotguns are highly directional and reject those background sounds unless they happen to be coming from sources that lay directly in the direction the mic is pointed, ie, directly in front of the lens if the mic is mounted on the camera. In fact, rejection of ambient sound that would interfere with dialog recording is why shotguns were invented. For an on-camera mic the Rode is a viable choice but the situation where an on-camera mic is the best choice are really pretty rare - generally restricted to "run-and-gun" newsgathering where getting the shot is paramount. Shotguns are better used on a boom carried by an operator, on a stand just out of shot, or even hand-held by the talent. Getting the mic close to the voice is one of the keys to good sound. For ambience I'd suggest using a mic off of the camera so it doesn't pickup camera and operator noises and choosing a mic with a much broader coverage area, either a single point stereo mic like the 822 or a good quality mono omni mic - for ambience you want to caprture the sounds coming from most or all directions, not just from where the camera's pointed. For that matter, there's really no reason to record ambience in the camera along with picture at all and a small portable audio recorder such as the m-Audio Microtrak 2496 might be worth considering. Filmakers call it "wild sound" and you'd lay the ambience in against picture in post..

And BTW, if you are interested in a stereo mic, you might want to consider the AT825 as well. AT emphasizes that the 822 is for battery operation only but the 825 gives you the option of battery or phantom. power

thank you very much for your explanations Steve.

There is hardly any chance that anybody would hold the mic for me and I mostly will use it on camera even though I understand the warnings against it.

From what you say I believe that the AT822 could a better choice than the mono shotgun Videomic for me...

Just recently I bought myself an iriver iFP player/recorder and Giant Squid Omnis to be able to record audio independently. It is alright to record voice of somebody interviewed, in my case it would be more probably the voice of somebody in a documentation, but I don't like the recordings of sounds which come from more distance.

Do you think the AT822 would be a good mic to record to my iriver? ( my Pana mic is useless with the iriver )
BTW I wonder if the HD-MD really give superior recordings as the iriver H120 or H320 since they also are able to record in WAV. If using the firmware 'Rockbox' they even have live gain control and level meter! ( see my post at: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?p=504345#post504345 )

Doesn't the AT825 cost quite a bit more and is quite a bit heavier? Would phantom power mean having to carry - heavy - power supply? Or would the power supply come from a mixer which I'd then use?
What are the main advantages of being able to use phantom power? Specially good for recording loud concerts?
Well, many new questions... I will have to research other threads for that.
I had not considered the AT825 because of it's price and because I thought it would mean more weight and bulk and since I film mostly while travelling I try to keep the volume and weight of my equippment down..it is growing and growing though...

thank you very much for your explanations Steve.

There is hardly any chance that anybody would hold the mic for me and I mostly will use it on camera even though I understand the warnings against it.

From what you say I believe that the AT822 could a better choice than the mono shotgun Videomic for me...

Just recently I bought myself an iriver iFP player/recorder and Giant Squid Omnis to be able to record audio independently. It is alright to record voice of somebody interviewed, in my case it would be more probably the voice of somebody in a documentation, but I don't like the recordings of sounds which come from more distance.

Do you think the AT822 would be a good mic to record to my iriver? ( my Pana mic is useless with the iriver )
BTW I wonder if the HD-MD really give superior recordings as the iriver H120 or H320 since they also are able to record in WAV. If using the firmware 'Rockbox' they even have live gain control and level meter! ( see my post at: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?p=504345#post504345 )

Doesn't the AT825 cost quite a bit more and is quite a bit heavier? Would phantom power mean having to carry - heavy - power supply? Or would the power supply come from a mixer which I'd then use?
What are the main advantages of being able to use phantom power? Specially good for recording loud concerts?
Well, many new questions... I will have to research other threads for that.
I had not considered the AT825 because of it's price and because I thought it would mean more weight and bulk and since I film mostly while travelling I try to keep the volume and weight of my equippment down..it is growing and growing though...

There's not THAT much difference in size and weight - 5.8oz versus 8.5 and 7.76" long versus 8.4"

Phantom would be supplied by a mixer. a Beach adapter, or the camera if you eventually upgraded to something like an XL2.

Mics that offer phantom as well as battery general have slighty better performance on phantom.

Both would be good mics - I think DSE mentioned he uses the 822 among others

As for it being a better choice than the Rode, they have different uses. At the price you mentioned beforethat you could get the Rode at, I'd get both. Like a good Boy Scout, Be Prepared!

Does the 825 have a AA battery option?

Does the 825 have a AA battery option?

According to the A/T website, the 825 operates on either internal battery or phantom while the 822 is internal battery only and they have bold type warnings against plugging into phantom as they say it's likely to damage it.

The AT825 costs 46.800 Yen compared to 21.800 Yen for the AT822 ( 1 USD = 116 Yen )

The option to get into using a mixer is tempting, must study up what that would imply though.

thank you very much everybody, specially Steve!

Since yesterday I am a proud owner of an AT822.

When comparing the audio of my mics, the GS400 onboard mic, the Panasonic VW-VMS2 and the Giant Squid Omnis I found it difficult to say which I liked best.

That difficulty is gone for good, and I am happy.

( No first tests of the Stereo Videomic yet? )

In the description of the AT822 it says:


Warning: The AT822 is designed for battery operation only. Do not attempt to use when phantom power is present. Possible damage to the microphone may result.

I would like to use my AT822 with my audio recorder which supplies 3,7Volt line-in power, preferably even with an additional battery box which supplies 9 Volt power.

Does anybody know:
Do I risk damage to the AT822 if I plug it into my recorder which supplies 3,7 Volt line-power?
Could it even still be save to plug it into a battery box which supplies 9 Volt power?