I finally received my new HD1 from the UPS guy tonight and it seems to be broke right out of the box. When I open the flip out screen and turn it on it shows all of the on screen indicators like record time left and still shots left but it is over a black screen. I can press record and take video or still shots but when I put them in my card reader on my computer the videos and stills are just black screens. On the video I can hear the audio playing but the video is just black. It is like what you would get if you were recording with the lens cap on and no I didn’t leave the lens cap on. Also when I switch to play back mode it comes up and says system error. I have tried with two different SD cards and I get the same thing. So am I missing something here or is my unit broke?
I will try and contact Sanyo support in the morning just to make sure, but assuming my unit is broke will I be better off to send it to Sanyo for repair or try and return it to the online camera shop from NY?

"better off to send it to Sanyo for repair or try and return it to the online camera shop from NY?"

return the camera, demand replacement, refuse repair...

RETURN it to the shop... promptly...! note the serial number and make sure you get another one. (smile)


Bo

www.bophoto.com/HDV

Just spoke with Sanyo service department and they are telling me that this is a common problem with this model and to boot they will not cover is under warranty becuase of the online vendor that I purchased it through. Happy Day!

Wait a min... Sanyo is 'NOT' covering it under warranty?? Because of what again?

So if you buy a new unit for $600 from eBay, you don't get manufacturer's 1 year warranty? hmm...

I hope you can get a replacement or your money back from that online vender.

WOW... guess the next question is WHO did you buy that from....?

Im suddenly feeling much better paying full pop at Amazon.com at least they are prompt on any problems I have had with pretty much anything so far.

Sounds like the place might have purchased the units at either a discount rate from Sanyo saying that they would carry the warrenty coverage them selves.. or have setup a parrallel import which positively is not looked at with kindness from the main manufactures.

Bo

www.bophoto.com/HDV

I wasn’t sure what the forum rules were about posting online vendors, but I want potential buyers to know what they are getting into. I bought my camera from Prestige camera out of NY. I got a good price on it and they have been fairly good to deal with so fare. I don’t want to bad mouth them to much until I can talk to them Monday and see about getting a replacement. Apparently they close at 1pm EST on Fridays. That is kind of early for those of us on the west coast.
The Sanyo rep that I talked with said that Prestige as well as some other online vendors did not carry a US warranty on the products they were selling. I have heard of this before especially from COSTCO. That is why COSTCO gives you a lifetime warranty on everything they sell. There is nothing about my camera or its packing that would indicate that it is anything other than a US version. I plan to talk to Prestige on Monday and see how the RMA process works out. If I have to go to plan B, I think I can get warranty converge through AMEX.
Has anyone else heard to this black screen problem?

Has anyone else heard to this black screen problem?
No, you are the first with this problem I know. I hope you solve it by the easiest way.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Sanyo-Xacti-HD-5-1MP-Digital-Video-Camera-VPC-HD1_W0QQitemZ7619263762QQcategoryZ48514QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I found two HD1 items of ebay with the blackscreen problem. Being sold as a spare parts. I guess it's not completely uncommon.

Just spoke with Sanyo service department and they are telling me that this is a common problem with this model and to boot they will not cover is under warranty becuase of the online vendor that I purchased it through. Happy Day!

Welcome to the world of "grey market" vendors, sounds like you've bought from one. Grey market dealers are able to undercut authorized dealers by importing product on their own - lord only knows from where - and bypassing the regular distributor. But it's the distributor who covers the cost of warranty repairs so if the dealer didn't obtain it though official channels and you need service, you're on your own. In the long run cheapest is not necessarily the least expensive. Reputable dealers will tell you exactly what you're getting.

Nathan, read this thread entitled 'Broadway Photo, Prestige Photo, 123Warehouse, etc.' written by a supposed rep from Sanyo....

http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/view_topic.php?id=87002&forum_id=27

Graham thanks for the link. I had read some reviews of prestige and had not read anything about grey market merchandise. I don't really understand grey market. Sanyo built and sold this camera for a profit and should cover it under warrenty it doesn't much matter what part of world it was supposed to be sold in. I hope I don't have any problem recieving an RMA from prestige. I will find out tomrrow.

Nathan,

Typically "divisions" of a manufacture, such as Sanyo USA, will in effect "purchase" their product from the division which manufactured the camera... the price is naturally less than you and I pay. the national division in in turn providing the "varrenty" coverage, typically by having a repair facility which will fix, and service cameras and or products. or by simply replacing defect products outright. All of this is done at the national divisions expense and the cost of this is then figured into what we pay for the product.

The result of the above. is if a company is purchasing a product directly from the factory or from another national divison, other than the US division, this division might have sold overstock, or simply deliberately purchased more cameras and are selling them at sub market price because they know they will not be required to fix any of these cameras in the future... the savings is pretty much reflective of how big a percentage of the sale price is though to be required to fix these in the first place. (smile)

Therefore grey-market is sketchy at best... its NOT supported by the national division which have not been paid to support these particular units.

Bo

www.bophoto.com/HDV

Nathan,

Except, that the excuse will be. that because, even though it is an American model, because it bypassed the Local American subsidiary company, who have to make their own profit to pay for repairs, it is not covered. Of course this could be arranged differently to provide world wide warranty, but you can appreciate, the warranty proportion of profit in a third world country might be much lower then in the states, because wages are much lower there. It also enables local companies set their own pricing/profit margins, along the old economic lines of what the user can bare to pay.

However, I can't remember, but I think that Sanyo's pricing is fairly even handed any way.

But seriously, I think every HD camera is over priced, and a realistic price for a 5Mp digital stills with HD video is a little more than one with VGA video (especially with out legit 25fps mode) and with the problems this camera has it should be priced somewhere between $200-$400,. If you don't believe me, just wait for the $799 H264 competition that should have started to be announced last month, but has obviously hot a snag and are extensively delayed.

Nathan- call your credit card company today and begin a "history" of this purchase. If the company( camera) refuses to cooperate , document the refusal by recording if must , and tell your credit card company to withhold payment- they'll then begin an investigation and most times , esp. thru these type of businesses , decide in favor of the client. If you must , withhold payment to the cc , until they have given you a favorable decision. Next time , buy from a real company like Chris' sponsors. This is exactly the reason why those type of dealers should be avoided. But , still they run full page ads in the most reputable mags , as if that in itself were validation for their trustworthyness. Truth said , those said magazines should be held partially responsible for giving an air of validity to these flybynight dealers, in my humble opinion. Kurth

Graham thanks for the link. I had read some reviews of prestige and had not read anything about grey market merchandise. I don't really understand grey market. Sanyo built and sold this camera for a profit and should cover it under warrenty it doesn't much matter what part of world it was supposed to be sold in. I hope I don't have any problem recieving an RMA from prestige. I will find out tomrrow.

I agree with you completely that that's the way it should be. Unfortunately that's not the way it is. It affects me directly because I want to purchase a Canon from one of our DVINFO sponsors one of these days in the not too distant future. Unfortunately they're all in the States. I'm in Canada and even after the currency conversion and paying the sales tax I'm still money ahead buying south of the border so I'd really like to go through them. But alas, Canon Canada tells me I'm on my own for service if I purchase from anyone except a Canadian dealer and they won't do warranty service on a camera purchased in the States from anyone, even from a Canon authorised dealer.

Thanks everyone for all the advice. I called AMEX last week and had them make some notes on my account about this purchase just in case. I called Prestige today ready to do battle, but they were very pleasant to deal with. They gave me an RMA number with almost no questions asked and said they would include some kind of LCD cleaning kit with the replacement for my trouble. My wife is due in 11 days so this is going to be cutting it close. I hope they are true to there word and don't give me any grief over the return and send out the new unit promptly.

I had the same problem !! tapping the camera against something hard gently but firmly "jarred" it back into proper functioning but now a few days later its worse

still images are useless (banding horrizontal like old tv reception) and video requires max ISO even in broad daylight. its hosed.

the ny vendor time2envy NOW tells me its a grey market import and won't replace it. I am disputing the charge on the credit card and desire a US VENDOR with the US VERSION with the option of an extended warranty.

Suggestions ?

Chris Taylor
http://www.nerys.com/

I'll save Chris the effort, http://www.bhphotovideo.com/.

Maybe they have US versions. Basically, if your version has this, the US version might have the same.

Well I finnaly got my return unit in last night from Prestige and I could tell just by looking at the box that it was a used repacked camera. The battery was fully charged and the date and time were allready set. Not a good sign. It seemed to work OK at first but after playing around with it it will not go into playback mode and after a couple minutes of use the the screen becomes all blurry. If you tap it against something it will work for a minute and then goes blurry again. So I will be returning it for a refund and will be calling AMEX to make sure the charge is removed. I wish I could just buy local but I don't know of any store in San Diego that has it.

Nathan

If you want a brick and mortar store, try Frys. Several of the stores in LA/Orange Coountry have them. Just don't expect internet pricicng.

Also, Best Buys has them in their distribution center, but not the best price.

well I started the dispute process with the credit card. I don't expect any issues since they never told me it was grey market import (a nono) I am just going to wait till I get the money back and order it from amazon. its $120 more but its from a reputable source and they have a reasonably priced 4 year warranty for it.

Chris Taylor
http://www.nerys.com

Jeff,
I just checked at the Frys here in San Diego two days ago and they did not have one on display. I did see an add in the paper for Ritz Camera that showed a picture of the HD1, but I don't know if a local Ritz store actually has them in stock.

I called Prestige again and got an RMA number for my second defunct camera. I have been unhappy with the merchandise and the fact that it is grey market, but I must say that Prestige has been easy to deal with and I don't think I will have any problems getting my money back.

I called several Ritz stores here in San Diego and none of them carry the HD1. Can anyone confirm that the HD1 from Amazon.com is a legitament US version camera? I might have to order from them.

Now that I have gotten to play with this camera a little bit I really like it and the quality is much better than my old DV camcorder. My wife immediatly noticed the quality improvment as we watched a clip on our PC. Not to bad for a "toy".

Do they allow you to order one from the Fry stores and they get it sent in (quickly)?

Nathan,

I got my HD1 from Amazon and it seems to be a US market model. They have been great to deal with. I also picked up the spare battery and a card.


Bo

www.bophoto.com/HDV

Nathan,

Look for a warranty card in the box! I originally bought a gray market HD-1 (after telling the sales person I wasn't interested in a gray market cam--he lied). The only difference between the gray market product and the one I subsequently bought from Apple Computer is the presence of the warranty card in the legit product. I returned the gray cam.

-Cal

I just went to order from Amazon.com and was reading the user comments. The top 3 comments mention either the black screen or system error problems that I was having, so this appears to be a fairly common problem with this model. I loved this camera for the two days that I had it and it was partially working, but now I am wondering if I should just wait for something diffrent. Maybe the Sanyo HD2 will have all the bugs worked out. Any thoughts?

Hi,

One of my friend was also seduced by this little cam and has ordered one in Germany (NURTEC.de), at reception, the camera was not working (black screen) and he sent it back to the internet shop waiting now for a new one.
Sanyo germany is actually offering a 3 year warranty.

Hi,

I also experienced the 'Black Screen' problem with my Sanyo VPC-HD1, after it had operated normally for two months.

I had purchased the camcorder from Amazon.com and it came with a Sanyo warranty on Labor for 90-Days and Parts for one year.

First I tried Sanyo's Warranty Option 'A', which used www.sanyoservice.com, to locate a Sanyo repair center close to my home, which is in the San Francisco East Bay. That showed one Sanyo repair shop in San Francisco, but unfortunately, that shop no longer repairs camcorders.

I next tried Sanyo's Warranty Option 'B' which had me call their 'customer support center’ at 1-800-421-5013. They sent me to:

Customer Care Clinic & GSC, Inc.
Mid Valley TV & Electronics
11343 Moorpark Street
Studio City, CA 91602
818-508-0947

I sent my camcorder there via UPS. They repaired it by replacing the "LENS ASSEMBLY", and sent it back to me via UPS. I received it today and every thing seems to be back to normal. They even added a "Service Guarantee for same problem: 30 days labor on work performed and 60 days on part(s) replaced.

I was surprised to find out that my problem was with the "LENS ASSEMBLY"!

Maury

"lens assembly" might include the chip attached to the back of the lens.. kind of... :-)


Bo

www.bophoto.com/HDV

The repair only lasted one day!

Today, it is back to the constant 'Black Screen' state.

Back to square-one.

Maybe it got jolted around in transit to the center and caused a loss connection/component to reconnect (or maybe a faulty component discharged). They might have then thought it was something to do with the lens assembly instead.

It is unlikely to be iris or shutter multifunction. Probably best to explain that no menus or screen data appears at all.

OK, I'll have to admit that when I first glanced _very_ quickly at this thread I thought the original poster just didn't know how to turn the camera on (you know, "black screen"). But the other day I pulled my HD1 out to try to take a picture, and now I've got the exact same problem. It's as if there's no light on the CCD - though I never took a picture with the lens cap on to make a precise comparison. P-Autoexposures maxed out to f/3.5 and 1/2 sec, and only recording black in movie or picture modes.

I'll be interested to see how effective the "repair" is for other people, so please let us know!

OK, I'll have to admit that when I first glanced _very_ quickly at this thread I thought the original poster just didn't know how to turn the camera on (you know, "black screen"). But the other day I pulled my HD1 out to try to take a picture, and now I've got the exact same problem. It's as if there's no light on the CCD - though I never took a picture with the lens cap on to make a precise comparison. P-Autoexposures maxed out to f/3.5 and 1/2 sec, and only recording black in movie or picture modes.

I'll be interested to see how effective the "repair" is for other people, so please let us know!


Oh my! This "black lcd" problem seems quite widespread. It's gotta be either a design flaw or a manufacturing flaw.

Why doesn't Sanyo just recall the whole shebang and start over?

To add to this: I was at a Fry's Electronics in the San Francisco area yesterday and they had an HD1 on display.

Guess what?! That display model had the "black lcd" virus as well. Quite frustrating as I was there to hold the unit in my hand and see how it feels. I love the form factor and small size.

Too bad about this black lcd disease.

Oh my! This "black lcd" problem seems quite widespread. It's gotta be either a design flaw or a manufacturing flaw.

Why doesn't Sanyo just recall the whole shebang and start over?

It shipped with bugs and we are yet to see a firmware update. Hopefully they can do a recall. I have stopped advising people to buy the camera, it was obvious that this bug might be wide spread.

OK, looks like I'm going down the same road that Maury already did above: I'm supposed to ship it to Studio City in order to change the "lens assembly." I'm thinking that this is going to be as successful for me as it was for him...

Rhett,

Keep us posted please. This is really becomming a concern, mine have not shown any problems "yet" living in my backpack, but Im starting to think its only a matter of time.


Bo

www.bophoto.com/HDV

While we are talking about the screens, please note that they are very delicate. Mine has two small gashes now that reflect back in gold when the sun hits them, and I have no recollection of hitting it, though it is perfectly possible I did in my active use of the camera.

Sanyo should have better business sense than this. To keep selling a product that they know is defective will only give people a poor view of the company.

The buyer deserves a well tested product. He/She shouldn't be a "beta tester" for the company.

While I was at Fry's yesterday, I also held and played with a Panasonic SDR-100. It's similar in form factor to the HD1 (although I admit I like the HD1's pistol grip better).

This Panasonic only captures DVD resolution video but I can see myself getting one of these when Panasonic finally incorporates the AVCHD standard into it as they have stated they would.

Good things going for the Panasonic:
-3 CCD
-Optical Stabilized lens (which I hear works great)
-lens made my LEICA

I am now on my third camera. The first two from prestige both had this problem. I just recieved my third camera from Amazon and it seems to be working fine so fare but I am just waiting for the black screen to come back. Does anyone know what the labor cost is to have it fixed if it is out of the 90 day labor warranty?

It may be good to compare serial numbers on failing units. I got mine in Feb and it's running strong. Not a grey market unit.

Scratching

For a few years there has been a dvd coating that is virtually scratch proof, not even steel wool, and I read a report of one guy that attacked it painfully with a swiss pocket knife in order to scratch it. Chemical diamond coatings have been around for 2 decades, so it is not very acceptable, except in the case where it is the anti-reflective or glare coating getting scratched, that would have to go on top of such a coat. But is is pretty obvious this does not have such a coat.

Have had it for about 2 months pulled it out to video tape and black screen is all I got. Looks like I will begin the process. We should get a petition going for a recall. This is ridiculous. Is there a head count of how many this has happened to? Add me to the list.

While I was at Fry's yesterday, I also held and played with a Panasonic SDR-100. It's similar in form factor to the HD1 (although I admit I like the HD1's pistol grip better).

This Panasonic only captures DVD resolution video but I can see myself getting one of these when Panasonic finally incorporates the AVCHD standard into it as they have stated they would.

Good things going for the Panasonic:
-3 CCD
-Optical Stabilized lens (which I hear works great)
-lens made my LEICA


After seeing my HD1, a coworker bought the FX01 Lumix, which (I believe) has the same Leica lens and optical stabilization and shoots in SD 16:9 at 30fps on a single CCD. From what I've seen of this thing, including comparison shots with the HD1, the results are VERY impressive. He took some hand-held shots that were incredible. The FX01 owner says that his shots look as good as my HD1 when blown up to the same size, and I have to admit qualitatively he has a point sometimes. I know there's a difference in the number of pixels, blur and the "diagonal problem" really work to degrade the image of the HD1 except under controlled conditions.

That said, I'll be VERY interested any attempts by Panasonic to add HD to this platform, even with a single CCD at first.


It may be good to compare serial numbers on failing units. I got mine in Feb and it's running strong. Not a grey market unit.


I meant to post the serial number before I sent it out for repair, but I completely forgot. It's a US model bought from Amazon in the middle of May. It's had little use so far, and no abuse.

That said, I'll be VERY interested any attempts by Panasonic to add HD to this platform, even with a single CCD at first.

I'm very interested if their will be a HD Lumix version too, even using X3.

Have you heard anything about HD versions, or any connection to AVCHD.

Hi All,

I've been following this Thread since May when it started.

Anyway since then, I have basiclly bought 2 Sanyo VPC-HD1's and a Sanyo VPC-C6. I thought I'd share my experience with the world on my own blog. Seeing how this is directly related to this thread, I thought I'd post the link - http://www.cubicgarden.com/blojsom/blog/cubicgarden/socialsoftware/online/2006/06/25/The-endless-hassle-of-the-Sanyo-HD1-Camcorder.html

Once I get the broken and working HD1 shipped to me over here in the UK, I'll post the serial numbers and join the shout for Sanyo to sort out this problem. Its funny because I had a problem with my Sanyo S750 phone and Bluetooth a year ago, till Orange (my phone operator) finally caved in and replaced the phone with new firmware.

Fingers crossed the blank screen problem is limited to a very small batch.

Just called Sanyo and they gave me addres to have fixed. they said that all the orginal batch of hd1 has the bad lense mech. They have replaced the problem lenses with the new ones they are sending out.

"[Sanyo] said that all the orginal batch of hd1 has the bad lense mech"

Hope I don't treat my unit with such respect that the lens only goes after the 12 month warranty has expired.