There are 3 things that make Macbook Pro several steps closer to being a stable HVX-capture device:

1) SIIG is now making an Express Card 34 to FW400 adapter: http://www.siig.com/news.asp?pr=49 , with the FW800 version out soon.

I'll be picking up a Macbook Pro myself within the next few weeks and will put it through the same testing programme that I gave the Powerbook setups.

If you read the Powerbook setup guide I published here you understand the need for creating a separate physical Firewire bus - one for the drive to connect to and one for the camera. Although there are PCMCIA to USB 2.0 available, the idea of using that interface for one side of the "separate bus" connectivity means you'd lack the stability of Firewire on one side of the data chain. Not a great idea. This new adapter card from SIIG would solve that problem.

2) All the information about third party compatibility with apps like Photoshop was to expect lower than "normal" performance in Rosetta until the Universal versions were available. However, I just spent an afternoon in the studio with another photo-pro and he's using the Macbook Pro with 2GB of RAM and PS CS2 without a hitch. It's not as fast doing certain operations as it might be on the Powerbook, but it's stable. So far. I did note that his Macbook Pro still has the standard 5400rpm drive - my guess is that with the installation of a 7200rpm drive and big RAM that it would really wake up performance on hungry apps like PS and FCP.

3) With today's release of "Boot Camp" http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2006/apr/05bootcamp.html which gives the Macbook Pro the ability to dual-boot into either OSX or, Win XP this makes for limitless possiblities for video editing and file conversions. "This changes everything".

I also already have a MBP - and, in fact, just finished loading Final Cut Universal on it. A massive undertaking. Something like 7 DVD-Rs. But Photoshop cruises right along without even a burp or sneeze, as do the native apps.

Thanks for the post about the card... I was getting ready to start looking for one.

My camera is still on backorder, along with several other components. I expect to have all the pieces and parts in around 4 weeks, and hope to start contributing to the knowledge base here, since I've already found it incredibly helpful.

I ran to my Apple store yesterday within hours of seeing the BootCamp announcement. I'm a Windows developer by day, and I needed a good laptop, and I needed something that could better handle HD. This release solved the problem with a MacBook.

So far I've installed Windows and Visual Studio 2005. But I'm so impressed with the responsiveness of OS X. I can't wait for FCP to come by way of FedEx.

What is the best way to use the Macbook with the HVX if I want to employ P2 cards? Must I really buy a $2000 P2 card reader?

What is the best way to use the Macbook with the HVX if I want to employ P2 cards? Must I really buy a $2000 P2 card reader?

Something like this might work. http://www.superwarehouse.com/Kingston_USB_PC_Card_Reader/FCR-HS2_ATA/p/455939

$28.99 not bad. Probably will work with the Mac unless it requires some special driver.

I also already have a MBP - and, in fact, just finished loading Final Cut Universal on it. A massive undertaking. Something like 7 DVD-Rs.

I second your comment. The upgrade is a long and painful process. And the space requirements if you let it loose are huge. I keep a little stack of SIIG firewire housings with Seagate 160 and 100GB drives. I use one drive per project for editing, then back the project up periodically to a big RAID. I set the scratch disk to the SIIG drive so the project is fully self-contained. I dedicated one whole 100GB drive for all the stuff that doesn't need to be on the Macbook, like Motion templates, AudioLoop files, Livetype files, etc. etc. With the crossgrade and the stuff from optional Soundtrack Pro upgrades, the 100GB is full. At least this lets me do all the routine stuff on the MBP and I just mount the 100GB for the special stuff.

The crossgrade modifies your projects in a way that makes them incompatible with earlier versions so this upgrade process is a one way street. Make those backups first until everything is running smoothly.

Also be sure you have all your old serial numbers from your most original versions of all the component software. I had to dredge up serial numbers from Final Cut 1 and the first version DVD Studio. It reminds me of the time with Adobe that I needed a COSA AfterEffects serial number about five years after COSA had been closed.

So far the performance of FCP on the Macbook seems impressive. I'll try some compression soon which should tell the tale.

$28.99 not bad. Probably will work with the Mac unless it requires some special driver.
None of those USB devices will work with a P2 card. P2 cards use 32-bit Cardbus, and those USB devices are all 16-bit. The only USB-capable card reader that works, right now, is the $2500 Panasonic one. Sure would be nice if someone made a low-cost adapter, but as of yet we haven't found one and there are lots of us looking!

Is it possible that SIIG or some other company will make an afordable P2 adapter for the Expresscard 34 slot? All it really needs is an adapter for using 54 cards in the 34 slot, am I right? or is it more complicated than that?

Is it possible that SIIG or some other company will make an afordable P2 adapter for the Expresscard 34 slot? All it really needs is an adapter for using 54 cards in the 34 slot, am I right? or is it more complicated than that?

You're mostly right... An Expresscard to PCMCIA Cardbus adapter should be relatively simple and they will probably exist at some point. However, The Expresscard comes in three different form factors, designated by the number after the Expresscard name (34 in the case of the MacBook Pro). Expresscard also comes in 54 and 72, which is the card width in millimeters. Unfortunately, the Expresscard 34 is only about as wide as a Sony Memory Stick so any adapter to PCMCIA will require an external interface or card holder to slide the card into. Not a big deal, but just one more issue that will add more effort and cost to such a device as Expresscard 72 is the only one that could potentially support a PCMCIA card with an adapter internally within the slot.

Is it possible that SIIG or some other company will make an afordable P2 adapter for the Expresscard 34 slot? All it really needs is an adapter for using 54 cards in the 34 slot, am I right? or is it more complicated than that?

Three emails over the last month on this issue to SIIG.

No responses from the company

the missing link. FW in, eSATA-II out to drives.

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Vydeo-Announces-Dual-Port-eSATA-ExpressCard-34-For-MacBook-Pro-21050.shtml

Just to reiterate someone else's earlier post (my apologies, I don't remember who authored it... I think it may have been Robert Lane): satasite.com has a nice, fanless (i.e., quiet...just remember to keep air flow around it) aluminum eSATA-II enclosure that looks great with the MacBook Pro. Complete with cable, enclosure and Hitachi 250GB drive, it comes to 50 cents per GB of storage. That's getting competitive with tape, especially if you shoot native mode or DVCPro 50.

I'll probably just buy these as if they were tape and shelve 'em until other options (like BluRay?) become competitive in the coming year or so.

On a gray-haired note, I just had a passing memory of the original Avid R-MAGS, at $2500 per GB....<<shudder>>

the missing link. FW in, eSATA-II out to drives.

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Vydeo-Announces-Dual-Port-eSATA-ExpressCard-34-For-MacBook-Pro-21050.shtml


Indeed, the missing link...

Indeed, the missing link...

I really believe the real "missing link" is a USB or Firewire 32-bit reader for p2 cards.

For under $200.00

I just picked up a MBP this weekend; my FCP crossgrade discs shoud be here Monday. I'll be testing the capturing abilities this week and will respond with results.

Since I'm in the middle of my big project I won't have time to try mutliple setups as I did with the Powerbook but will share as much useful info as possible.

Today was the first working day for my MBP. It has the "standard" 2ghz config: 1GB RAM and the 5400rpm drive. I don't yet have FCP loaded so I haven't started testing captures yet, but the laptop is screaming fast.

I've also loaded boot-camp and have been running XP Pro all day without a hiccup - and switching between OS's is a snap too.

On the Windows side of things I've always used Microsoft Flight Simulator 2004 as a benchmark of just how "fast" a system is since it's high-demand video-like motion graphics put the maximum strain on CPU, RAM and MB throughput. With all the quality sliders to the max and screen resolution to the limit I can "fly" around a big city like NYC and motion is completely smooth at 34 fps or better. That's with dynamic scenery at the limit, and a full sky of traffic.

For those of you who aren't familiar with Flight Simulator, the short version of the above is that the Macbook Pro runs XP Pro apps as fast as my "real"
Win-Tel tower - and that's really saying something.

I don't own any Windows video editing software, however PS CS2 is also running like a champ and churns away on filters will almost as much speed as my Quad-core G5.

I have made one change so far to the hardware: I installed (2) 1GB RAM sticks that was purchased from my PC parts vendor (see my Powerbook setup guide) and that has sped things up even more on both the OSX and Windows side of operations. The next step will be to install a 7200rpm drive. I think if this thing get's any faster the screen will melt. (^_^)

So far, I'm couldn't be happier with the performance of the MBP and, I'm actually pleasantly surprised at just how well everything works.

The next test will be with FCP captures from the HVX. That will be a different thread.

I really believe the real "missing link" is a USB or Firewire 32-bit reader for p2 cards.

For under $200.00

I'll concede that point! <fingers impatiently strumming on desk>

Robert, did you install Motherboards & Upgrades (upgradeit.com) memory sticks even though they are made specifically for the PB (as you said in your other thread)? Are you still getting the same performance increase from using that brand over apple's?

Was your copy of PS universal?

R.K. -

Mike Komar at www.upgradit.com has designed new RAM modules specifically for the MBP since it uses the newer, faster RAM type than the old PB did.

The 2ghz MBP shipped with (1) 1GB RAM stick - when I put in the custom-cofigured RAM from Mikey's shop there was a noticeable speed bump in boot time - and even more when both his 1GB sticks were installed.

I do not have a Uni-version of PS CS2 - I don't believe they are available yet.

As for further testing, I just realized yesterday that I didn't get the fastest MBP available, which is the 2.16ghz machine, so I'm returning mine to the retailer and ordering the 2.16 version from Apple. It will be the newer machine that I will test HVX captures with.

NOTE: Many MBP users, myself included have noticed several small but annoying issues with these machines:

- A high-pitched whine at idle
- Sound issues
- Case getting hotter than normal during usage.

Apple has addressed these issues: If you take your MBP to the Apple Store for warranty repair you with these issues you will likely get a MB upgrade/replacement when it comes back to you. Newer machines ordered directly from Apple will already be coming wih the revised MB.

NOTE 2 ABOUT SAME: Do not take the word of the typical floor-sales-person at the Apple Store that there is no fix for these noted issues; let the Genius Bar techs handle it. There is plenty of documentation both on the web and in Apple's own tech support about these problems.

See www.barefeats.com for more info on this "silent" upgrade for the MBP.

Well it looks like the serial number on mine puts me in the quiet motherboard group. That's a relief. I haven't heard any funny noises from it yet!

Just to reiterate someone else's earlier post (my apologies, I don't remember who authored it... I think it may have been Robert Lane): satasite.com has a nice, fanless (i.e., quiet...just remember to keep air flow around it) aluminum eSATA-II enclosure that looks great with the MacBook Pro. Complete with cable, enclosure and Hitachi 250GB drive, it comes to 40 cents per GB of storage. That's getting competitive with tape, especially if you shoot native mode or DVCPro 50.

The aforementioned eSATA drives and enclosures arrived today...Hitachi Deskstar 250s. I see that last week Hitachi announced a new line, Cinemastar, aimed at DVR and other video applications. Designed for robust performance in the demanding video environment, and built to be quieter during both operation and idle. I hadn't been aware until this week that SATA drives run cool enough that a fan isn't required in an external drive enclosure... god bless engineers! Fan noise in the edit suite has been my constant demon for as long as I've been an editor.

The only disadvantage to the above setup is that the enclosures are SATA only, so if you don't have a SATA card in your workstation (or a SATA express/34 card--just announced but not yet shipping), you can't connect these drives via FireWire. I assume the Express/34 card will be available soon, so I'm not sweating it. One would hope that the next generation of MacBooks will include SATA-II, since FireWire 800 has been totally ignored by the marketplace.

The enclosures seem well-built...the only modification I'm going to do is to put a thin layer of clear nailpolish on the 6 little screws that hold the front and rear panels to the case. They look like they'd easily back out with even routine transport vibration in a Pelican-type case.

Scott, is there a reason why you went with the Hitachi desktar instead of the less expensive Western Digital hard drive? I see that the WD 500GB hard drive is $100 less than Hitachi's.

Scott, is there a reason why you went with the Hitachi desktar instead of the less expensive Western Digital hard drive? I see that the WD 500GB hard drive is $100 less than Hitachi's.

I'd read that the Hitachis had NCQ and the Westerns didn't. I'm not enough of a technogeek to know how important that'd be in our kind of environment, but I figured I'd go with it. Also I think the price on the two manufacturers in the 250GB size (what I bought) is closer than that.

My 2.16ghz MBP isn't scheduled to arrive until later this week or beginning of next. Once it arrives I'll begin the setup tests.

FWIW: We've tested the Hitachi, Seagate and WD 500gb SATA HDD's; we're going with the WD's for our 5-TB SATA-RAID because they have the same performance as the much more expenisve Hitachi's and, with the years of flawless performance we've had with all iterations of WD drives I have no worries as to their reliability.

The test results mirror what Bare Feats, AMUG and other independent sources have shown: all these drives are within nanoseconds of each other with respect to performance, and real-world tests show that you cannot humanly discern a performance difference between them. We chose the more cost effective route.

My MBP just showed up today however, it has the internal "whine" so well documented on the web. I'm sending it in for service for the MB replacement and will test when it returns.

I paid the extra $99 for Pro Care, so hopefully the promise of a 24-48 hour turnaround will hold true.

Stay tuned...

Thanks for doing these tests, RL. I read that there's a good chance Apple will announce the 17" MBP at NAB and then release it soon thereafter. Are you going to give that a go when it's available?

All the Mac-forums have indicated that Apple does not yet have a fix for the whine and other minor bugs with the MBP. So, rather than have downtime on a new machine that seems to work just fine other than being a bit noisy, I'm going to just get to work.

I'll have some test results for direct capture by the weekend.

No, I'll be sticking with the 15" inch version; after having the 17" PB a while I've noticed the slightly smaller size is a bit easier to tote around and fits a bit nicer in my APC Powercase (laptop briefcase).

Well my new MBP has some pretty weird deal-killer issues. It doesn't boot reliably and things like Software Update just don't work, period. I've taken it in the to Apple Store Genuis Bar to be looked at and they have no answers, which means I'd have to be without it for weeks while it get's sent to who-knows-where while Apple techs pour over the problems.

Unfortunately I'm smack in the middle of a huge project and don't have time for long troubleshooting or being without a laptop, so the unit is being returned to Apple and I'll just use the PB.

In a few months I'll pick up another MBP, hopefully all these bugs will be worked out by then.

Hopefully somebody else will be able to pick up the HVX-to-MBP capture testing programme and have some answers for you guys.

Best to all.

The 17" has been announced....

It has fw800...

:)

I haven't seen this mentioned, but if this has been mentioned, here it is again. ;)

Kaboom - www.barefeats.com/hard71.html

Nice. :)

I haven't seen this mentioned, but if this has been mentioned, here it is again. ;)

Kaboom - www.barefeats.com/hard71.html

Nice. :)


OK, that does it. the MBP is now THE capture device for long-form studio work (save the Cineporter). Wow. Add that to the 17"-incher and I'm in HVX heaven.

Once I'm caught up with our shooting schedule it'll be testing time with the new SATA interface.

April 21st - Well my new MBP has some pretty weird deal-killer issues. It doesn't boot reliably and things like Software Update just don't work, period... In a few months I'll pick up another MBP, hopefully all these bugs will be worked out by then.

April 25th - OK, that does it. the MBP is now THE capture device for long-form studio work (save the Cineporter). Wow. Add that to the 17"-incher and I'm in HVX heaven.

Robert thank you for all of the constant updates.

So, are you getting one or waiting? I'm only asking because I'm thinking about ordering the 17" at any time now. But I agree with you in that I don't have the time (or the patience) to help Apple troubleshoot.

Should anyone wanting a MacBook Pro 17" to use specifically with a HVX -
go for it now :)
or wait a month or two :(

Especially since it will be a few months until DV Rack has their new HVX version out? (if you plan on using that program)

I plan to wait, Derek. The idea of a screamin' fast 17" inch MBP is appealing but I think I'll wait until Q3 when the next PowerMac is released. By then they'll have the major bugs smoothed out and, more 3rd party support both hardware and software will be in place.

Personally I don't see the need for DV Rack because if you're using FCP for direct capture then you have all that functionality built-in already, plus the added bonus that it deals with P2 footage as a native codec. I think DV Rack will be indispensable for PC-based capturing especially when the HVX-compatible version is out.

What would be really, really interesting to try and test, would be to have a MBP setup with Boot Camp, boot into XP Pro and run DV Rack from that setup capturing HVX stuff.

I tell ya, when the big bugs are ironed out for the MBP - and more importantly when the next PowerMac comes out - there'll be no reason to ever purchase another Win-Tel machine ever again. This changes everything.

(First Post, of a new member)

Just picked up my HVX and the 17" MacBook Pro should be shipping on May 11th. I plan on shooting directly to a External Harddrive via the MBP for the next few months until the cineporter becomes available. The reason for choosing this production workflow stems from these forums threads and specifically Robert Lane's contributions.

I was saddened to hear that Robert chose to pospone further tests, but am still excited and waiting to start my own.

I've been able to shoot a few things while hooked up to my G5, and like what I've seen so far. Until my MBP arrives I am confined to shooting in one room and with tapes in the field. I've just had a day to play around with the HVX setup, and am still keeping a close eye on this thread.

Lets keep it alive!

Thanks guys,
Paul West Jauregui
MYOVER INC

What would be really, really interesting to try and test, would be to have a MBP setup with Boot Camp, boot into XP Pro and run DV Rack from that setup capturing HVX stuff.

FYI, at the Serious Magic booth at NAB, the floor demo for DV Rack was the 15" MBP running XP via Boot Camp and the operator said the performance over the last few days was flawless...

Regards,

Jim Arthurs

I plan to wait, Derek. The idea of a screamin' fast 17" inch MBP is appealing but I think I'll wait until Q3 when the next PowerMac is released. By then they'll have the major bugs smoothed out and, more 3rd party support both hardware and software will be in place.Good points. I'm not sure if I'll get one now or wait. But you can be sure I'll be posting about my experience with it if/when I do!
Personally I don't see the need for DV Rack because if you're using FCP for direct capture then you have all that functionality built-in already, plus the added bonus that it deals with P2 footage as a native codec. I think DV Rack will be indispensable for PC-based capturing especially when the HVX-compatible version is out.Very true. I was just thinking since of using it since I already had it anyway and would just have to get the upgrade version.
What would be really, really interesting to try and test, would be to have a MBP setup with Boot Camp, boot into XP Pro and run DV Rack from that setup capturing HVX stuff.If I end up getting both, I'll do so. It would be good to see which works best, shooting straight into FCP or DV Rack.
This changes everything.It amazes me everyday and I'm thankful that I can be right in the middle of all these incredible changes.

Bit the bullet and ordered the 17" MacBook Pro today. I had a few reservations about getting something so new. BUT, I ordered it from one of the sponsors here, Guy @ http://www.dvestore.com who's been the best DVinfo sponsor I've worked with to date (and they are all good, so I guess he's the best of the best). Anyway, I know if I'm not happy with any issues he'll make sure Apple takes care of it. Thanks Chris Hurd for getting quality sponsors for your site.