Just a thought, call it negative if you will.

Robert Rodriguez got lucky over a decade ago, he hasnt kept any secrets on the process that made him succesful, even writing a book about it.

The thing is,that in all this time, nobody else has done anything similiar. Sure people have made movies, and got somewhere, but, who's done what he's done, with full control, his own production cmpany away from hollywood, shot edit cut etc?

-shows just how unrealistic it is that anyone who makes a film ,even on 16mm, can go on to a career like his.


(on another note: RR says he uses no crew really, maybe another operater and a grip, sound guy. If you look on the credits of sin city theres gotta be like a 40 man crew)

I think aspiring filmmakers need stories like his to get them through, and its a good thing it doesn't happen that often because it lets new filmmakers think that just maybe it will be them next.

We all know the odds of it happening are extremely slim and then some but we also know that it can be done and thats enough.

Call me an optimist but I guarantee that there is a completely new and origional concept that can be done for next to nothing and it will make millions.

All we have to do is come up with it ;) and in the mean time we work.

Andy.

one can read all the books , make 1 or 100 projects - one can be very good at what they do BUT good isn't good enough to make it where RR has gone.
there have been others that came out of nowhere BUT they only had a one time hit/idea = they didn't make it after that because they had no other original idea's ...
RR had more then talent - he did his own thing !!! not somebody elses , he walks his own walk and talks his own talk = you can see his movies and they have RR elements... just like you can see a SP film and see steven speilberg elements = they have their own distinct "thing" .. the other 90% are just followers/copiers..
you may have seen the persons doing the indiana jones thing here on another thread few months ago. IMO they do show possible talent BUT they should be making their OWN project not a Seven S copy .. the SS copy only shows me they really like indiana jones = they could do their own project using some of the elements of IJ but a copy shows me they have no original concept = they are not going to be following RR ... do you think RR would have made it if he had done a Indiana Jones project instead of his original idea. = NO

People concentrate too much on the technical aspects of production and not enough on the business aspects.

Talent needs to meet hustle. Just like in every industry.

How many times have you met people who know what they are doing but don't have the courage or ability to reach out and work with others.

Part of the allure of guerrilla filmmaking is the ability to do everything on a smaller scale. But the flip side of that is ghettoization and insularity.

Filmmaking is not like painting, poetry or writing a novel. It is collaborative and it requires hustle. Even the screenwriting part of that is collaborative (which shocks many beginner screenwriters).

I guarantee you Robert Rodriguez can hustle or has surrounded himself with people who hustle on his behalf or whose interests coincide with his at convenient times. The genius of Hollywood is that it facilitates getting projects done, even despite the quality of content. All production centers are grist for the mill or the oil for the works. Against that, Craigslist postings are not going to cut it.

What about Peter Jackson? The Wachowski Brothers?
Sure, Jackson started much earlier, but was still realatively unknown in the early 90's when Rodriguez was getting started.
How about Pixar as a company (first feature film 1995)?

This are just a couple wildly successful (more so than Rodriguez IMO) storys of rapid rise in the industry over about the same time period. There are very likely a good number of additional stories out there that are less publicized.

This doesn't diminish Mr. Rodriguez's accomplishments. I certainly admire his approach, techniques and convictions (and my kids LOVE his Spy Kids/Shark Boy films). But his success is not entirely an isolated incident. It happend before with the likes of Wells, Kubrick, Spielberg and Lucas.

There is a unique story for every success in the industry ... so "replicated"? Probably not. Even with the same opportunities, individuals will have different goals and choose different paths.

Still, the "kind of sucess" he's had is probably not as isolated as it may seem.

they could do their own project using some of the elements of IJ but a copy shows me they have no original concept = they are not going to be following RR ... do you think RR would have made it if he had done a Indiana Jones project instead of his original idea. = NO

You have to give these guys a break........I think in the case of the IJ thing it has grown arms and legs. I don't think they expected it to get as far as it has and therefore you can't judge there origionality based on something they did for a laugh.

As you said they have talent and the drive to get up and do it. Anyway the guy that wrote it is still in Uni.....if I had a film like that back when I was in film school I would have been really proud of myself.Lets see what they come up with next.

Andy.

Well first off, Rodriguez has a big crew, but it's mainly smaller roles. He does have his go to DP, but a lot of his stuff he wants to have his hands on the camera himself. Same thing with editing, he has people who help with editing but it's still his cuts. When you see titles like, "Directed, Shot, Chopped" it doesn't mean he didn't have help, hence the 40+ man crews. However, it's still his movie, his ideas, his camera work and so on.

As far as no one else coming into success such as he did, I've been thinking about that for awhile. To me it seems like he was at the right place in time with the right ideas. In the digital time we are in now, anyone can make a "presentable" movie, it doesn't mean they know what they are doing, but at least it's not from a handycam. The market is so saturated with people that own thier own DVX or XL2, which can enable them to create wonderful pictures, but they don't have the ideas behind those pictures. RR was in a time when if you wanted to make a movie, you did it on film, which cut out all of the "wannabes" with the cost of film alone, not to mention you have to know at least a little bit to get a proper looking image from it. And he knew enough to make it look good, but more importantly, he was telling stories in a completely unorthadox way.

Keep in mind that we are living in a world where people want it fast and now. Sorytelling isn't what it used to be, that's why these new "independent" films are so popular, they are the only thing that resembles what film used to be like, a way to escape. Of course these new "independent" films are made with a $10million budget, but they still aren't considered Hollywood. Hollywood films now are nothing but major action sequences, real life conflicts, or dry comedies made by major companies under the facade of an "independent" production company.

Like Ken said, it's a business. If you are going to make it huge over night, you have to know what people are going to want to see, what the fad of the day is, and who know's that better than the people who have been doing it for years?

People still do it, unfortunately for us, it seems like the new fad is established people making thier "independent" film. But things happen for new people to the business everyday, so don't get discouraged. Did you know that in order to qualify for an Independent Spirt Award, all it means is that you made a movie without going through a major production company, eg. Mirimax, Dreamworks, etc..., and your budget was under $20million. $20million dollars! I know how much you can do with that much money, and it doesn't include thinking of creative ways to tell a story.

In my opinion, you have to consider that:
A- Only so many people can be at the top.
B- People who are at the top tend to stay there, so there are only so many new openings.

If you look at the barriers of entry, in some cases they have been lowered. This is mainly in the documentary field, where films like Mad Hot Ballroom, Murderball, etc. (and to some degree, Michael Moore's work) have had theatrical releases while costing "little" to produce.

You also have to consider that it takes huge sums of money to market and distribute films, so that favours big-budget films. Even for low-budget films, there are significant costs in clearing music, distribution, marketing.
Mad Hot Ballroom paid $140k in music clearance, which was 45% of their production budget.

While these budgets are nowhere of that for Hollywood films, it's also significantly higher than RR's. But looking at it another way... if you were talented, you'd try to work with higher budgets for subsequent films. So only the first effort would have an extremely low budget.

Like Ken said, it's a business. If you are going to make it huge over night, you have to know what people are going to want to see, what the fad of the day is, and who know's that better than the people who have been doing it for years?
I'd argue that "nobody knows anything". Hollywood sometimes puts out some really *bad* movies... the best example being the vehicle movies which get produced simply because there is star talent attached. Mariah carey / glitter, from justin to kelly, jessica alba / honey, saturday night alumni, etc. Some of these movies had rancid scripts and should've died at that stage.

On the other hand, you might be able to argue that it's rational to produce these vehicle movies even if the scripts suck. Some of these movies are profitable.

Very interesting thread, but doesn't this belong more in the Totem Poll board?

I think it is because a lot of the young filmmakers, don't want to learn the busniess aspect of it. And they are more focused on how to shoot the movie rather how to make a good movie, through telling a story. Also I think some just don't want to put in the effort of finding a good producer to help them get their movies done, and sometimes they never looks for helping hands to finish their projects. And I got to admit, I am a young filmmaker, and sometimes I do get caught up in the technical aspect more than the content.

Content is key, if you have a good idea and you get the right means of putting it into a movie, then I think you would be successful. As for why no one came to RR level, I think its because no one has challenged the system enough. And everyone, EVEN independents want to run their movie sets like the big guys and that is why RR is so unique he does not care for the rules of having like 40ppl behind the camera doing usless tasks that the camera operator could be doing him self.

Just my opinion, I love the RR approch of doing it your self, Write it, shoot it, cut it, and direct it your self. And that is the way I am going, and I think alot of young guys are going as well. I guess its just time before someone gets to that level. After all that is how they started out doing movies, even continued largly till the early 50's.

I agree with Michael that Robert Rodriguez was in the right place at the right time. He was able to shoot a movie on film when the sheer cost of the media kept a lot of people out. His genius (and I don't know if he was the first person to think of this) was to edit on video, bypassing a lot of the cost. Of course, none of that would have made any difference if the movie hadn't been pretty good and if he hadn't worked tirelessly to pitch it to distributers. The studios were just starting to search around for cool indie stuff at that time too. Would "El Mariachi" even get noticed if it were produced today? Hard to say. He's a big part of the reason that the bar has since been set so high.

i believe that making it as big and as suddenly as Rodriguez did, requires a combination of lots of things. I don't think that any of us are really going to be able to pinpoint one reason why nobody else has had that kind of success.

I do, however, believe that RR attracted a lot of attention to himself simply because he made a movie for so cheap, which is why i don't think we can count Pixar, the Wachowski Brothers, etc in the same category as Rodriguez.

Also, i remember reading a negative review of his book on Amazon from someone. He pointed out that Rodriguez got a LOT of stuff for free. He got his actors for free, the camera for free, even a city where he could run around with people carrying fake guns. Try THAT in the states and see what happens to you...

And didn't Steven Spielberg know someone in the industry that slipped him in? He went completely over budget on Jaws and almost got replaced.

I don't know what my point is... I think that in the end, it's all about luck and talent. Without luck, you don't get your first real shot in Hollywood, and without talent, you don't get to stick around long enough to make anything of yourself.

It's the luck part that has people frustrated.

I did a Google search for the phrase "luck is when opportunity meets preparation" and found it attributed to everyone from Oprah Winfrey and Vince Lombardi to Robert Evans. Regardless of who actually said it first, I think it pretty much sums up Robert Rodriguez.

I don't know why people make such a big deal about all the things he got for free. That's what every smart indie maker does -- take advantage of things you already have. I've seen Rodriguez speak, and that's one of the first things he said -- write your script around the resources you have available. I think he deserves a lot of credit for charming those Mexican police into letting him use their machine guns. Not a lot of people could have pulled that off. He used his charisma to secure the resources he couldn't pay for. Would it make it more valid if had shaken down a bunch of rich relatives to pay for the project? I'm reminded of the story of Melvin Van Peebles setting a real car on fire for "Sweet, Sweetback" so that he wouldn't have to pay rental on firetrucks. He just waited for the fire department to show up so he could film them.

I think too many indies are trying to be the next RR. He wasn't, he was just trying to recoup the cost of the self-training movie he had just finished. It was an accident that it actually sold. Someone got hold of it at one of the big distribution companies and passed it around, it created buzz, then a bidding war.

All of the successful indie films coming out now have some "catch". That doesn't make a good director or writer, just a good one-off movie that has a novelty to it. The novelty tends to wear off. I think independent filmmakers (film or video) need to tell a story. I saw IJ a bunch of times in the theater when I was younger. That makes money. SS keeps his job because he makes movies that people pay to see.

Indipendent filmmakers make movies for other independent filmmakers. Commercial viability is how you get and keep any job. If you want to be a successful filmmaker, forget the novelty stories and start making and self-distributing good stories...someone will notice. When that happens, grab on and take it for a ride. If you try to negotiate too much ownership, you'll lose the opportunity.

The key to this arguement is missing. El Mariachi was made at a time when action movies with "ok" plots were big. It was the 90's. Segal and Jean-Claude were huge. People wanted to see that kind of movie. Rodriguez made one on his own that was very similar to the big budget Hollywood films of the time. A lot of other people did as well, theirs were never screened and went straight to video at best. Some of them were better than El Mariachi but went unnoticed. So what was the key behind RR's success? Everyone would have you believe that it was the fact that he SHOT El Mar. for $7000.


The truth behind the story was that he met a man who knew an AGENT. RR got in touch with the AGENT on a good day and the AGENT happened to take a liking to his work and him. RR stayed humble and kept working hard and his attitude couple with the fact that he had one of the biggest agencies in Hollywood working for his exposure is what made him happen.


The AGENT (capitalized so many times for a reason) is the key behind his whole story. RR even says in his book that the agents he was working with told him at one point that they could decide who was or wasn't going to be "the next big thing".


His continued success is due to the fact that he always comes in under budget and ahead of schedule. When there is a lot of money floating around in rentals, insurance, interest, etc. RR's ability to come home early, with money in left in the bank makes him a very valuable man.

The two filmmakers that I aspire to be like are RR and Christopher Nolan. They both seem to be made of the same stuff—and work on a smaller scale. They both live the project when they make a film. RR edits the movie in his house... that's pretty attached. I think that both of them have qualities that other filmmakers lack. They are both artists.... not businessmen. George Lucas pays people to come up with his ideas while RR will go out with a home video camera and shoot and edit an entire film as a pre-visualization. Good ole' GL sits in a chair and watches a 50" plasma. Spielberg too. Nolan wants to be right there with the actor and behind the camera to capture the essence of storytelling. He gets entire scenes in 1 or 2 takes with the storyboard in his head... as well as the final edit (I wonder is he uses FCP in his head).

Anyways... I could go on forever, but in reply... RR isn't alone at being the greatest. To me he and Nolan are both up there.

good thread guys but I think people are completely wrong about nothing since robert r. You look at all the films at places like sundance made with the new sony hd camera, or look at the success of "tarnation", this was made with an apple home computer and a camcorder for best buy and made for 125$. Go to ifilm and look under success stories, loads of films made for much less than rr's and they led to great success,Made with digital and not film as well.How about the growing popularity of ifilm, atom films, www.youtube.com with the popularity of bowiechicks home video and myspace videos among young people . .We are at the beginning of the digital decade to use a phrase heard often now, rr accomplished alot but nothing like the arrival of digital and home computing editing. great thread guys!

i have to agree with john that things are just revving up. i mean, in phil morrison's directorial debut (not really, but...) "junebug"--one of the actors in that was nominated for an academy award for best supporting actress. it was a great movie, and we'll undoubtedly be seeing more of his work in the hollywood mainstream now that he's seen an indie hit. or miranda july--who wrote, directed, and starred in her own work, "you and me and everybody we know." and won a prize at cannes and one at sundance.

just because rodriguez is a household name and the others aren't, does not mean that there aren't a few other great success stories. i guess it depends on how you measure success. i love rodriguez's work--sharkboy and lavagirl make regular appearances with my five year old daughter. but his success marks the beginning, it's not some sort of anomaly, just maybe the most visible story.

Don't think I'll book myself into a drugs trial for funding any of my films.

Especially when about half a dozen guys almost died over here from trying a potential anti-cancer drug.

I thought we had to suffer for our art.

I don't think it has as much to do with the success Robert has had as with how much we know about it. It's true, others have gone similar paths. A lot of directors, actually. It's just that Robert has told us all about his journey, and others aren't as eager to let the world know.

Sonyboo covers it on their site. He had breaks and really did have a lot of experience before El Mariachi.

I respect him because he does encourage people to try. I also like that fact that folks he work with tend to have a loyalty to him, which means he probably treats them right. The fact that RR and Antonio Bandaras keep hooking up speaks to this, IMO. I could be wrong.

RR gets money for his films for 3 main reasons.
1. His movies are low budget by Hollywood terms. He does a lot of work in his own studio, but farms out stuff when needed.
2. He always stays within budget.
3. Every movie he's produced/directed has made a profit, even the stinkers (spykids3d anyone?).

RR knows his market, and with his low cost approach, the studio gets theirs back with DVD and broadcast earnings.

Basically he is very low risk, thus he gets financing and final cut.

he is also one of the few who Panavision actually sold their lenses too, usually you lease them.

I wonder if he is using an F900 or the newer 950. If you were filming greenscreen it'd be easy to just go HD-SDI. If space is tight, he could put the HDSDI recorder under his hat!

Sorry James, but I think it's unfair to say people like "George Lucas" are businessmen and simply pay other people to come up with their ideas. He worked his ass off in his younger years writing, directing, editing, etc. films like "Look at Life, "Freinheit", "THX 1138 4EB", "American Graffiti", etc. This was when he was at USC and poor like most other Uni students. He made his millions because he was passionate, persistant and talented - just like "Robert Rodriguez".

Personally, I think Rodriguez and Lucas are very alike. They are both amazing problem solvers. They both love what they do, and will work out ways to pull it off. Now days they both have huge houses full of really expensive high tech gear.

George Lucas was never in it for the money. He made THX because he loved his story. No one else seemed it - in the end it caused "American Zoetrope" to go bust!

James Cameron is another person I have great respect for. Like Lucas and Rodriguez this guy just loved making movies! That's what makes people like Rodriguez and Cameron special. They were the kids you see running around the streets with crummy video cameras under their arms. They didn't care if what they made was crap. Why would they? Tomorrow they'll be filming something else! That kind of passion is what makes them special.

Peter Jackson is another great example. He used to cause chaos in New Zealand filming all kinds of crazy films! He didn't have any money, so he improvised!

All of these people just loved the power of the big screen since the moment they were born. They knew what they wanted to do - so they did it. They started off with the very basics. In most cases, Dad's underutilised handycam. They edited using whatever they had access to. Normally to VHS decks hooked together. No budget - no worries! Improvise!

I think what made all these people suceed was that they had great supportive families. They had amazing friends who have so much belief in their abilities. They all came from families who had access to some kind of "moving image recording device". They went to good schools and got a decent education. Nothing fancy - but they were hardly living in the streets and eating cat food.

I think the only way you can follow Rodriguez footsteps is if you're born that way. This may sound offensive, but I seriously doubt people like Rodriguez or Lucas would spend time "surfing" forums like this one. Instead they'd be outside with a camera in hand filming whatever moved. If they came across a problem, they would try to solve it themself. I think you have to be kind of selish and stubborn to fit their mould. You have to learn by yourself. It's obviously not the easiest way to do it - but I think history shows that most of the people who make it have these charactistics. Cameron wanted to do everything himself. He wanted to be across every aspect of his films - and still does today. This personality nearly "killed" the crew of Aliens and Titanic!

I think all of the people I've mentioned know how to use technology to help them achieve their visions - but don't get caught up in it. Lucas founded Pixar and ILM, but he wasn't the one drawing circuit diagrams and typing code onto a computer screen. Rodriguez has an Avid suite in his bedroom, but I think the important thing to remember is that it's only a tool. He uses it so he can get his vision "out there" as fast and as easily as possible. Lucas's team invented the first Avid's so that they didn't have to waste huge amounts of time mucking around with film.

These people arn't in it for the money or the fame. If they wanted that they would have become actors. The reason they are so famous, well known and respected is because they work hard and love what they do. Making films is what they are good at - so that's what they do.

Yes, the reason Rodriguez gets his money NOW is because he makes "Hollywood low budget films", "stays within budget" and "makes a profit". But the reason he got to where he is, is because he loves films. "El Mariachi" was never intended to be successful. He made it to get experience. He planned to make a sequel to again, get experience. He planned for his third film to make him rich and famous so he could continue to get money to make films.

Yes, Rodriguez was lucky. There is no chance in hell I could walk up to my local prison and get permission to film there. The local cops would probably lock me up if I asked if I could use their guns for a low budget film I'm making. I don't know anyone who owns a restaurant, or a ranch, or a truck. But I'm sure, if the situation was different and all Rodriguez had was a bag of chips, his grandparents old house and a neighbours dog with one eye, he would have put all his heart and soul into making a movie about those things.

Persistance and dedication is the key. Rodriguez edited "El Mariachi" using 3/4" tapes. He edited all his earlier works using two VHS decks. Originally he only had access to a video camera without a view finder, so he hooked it up to the TV and was limited to films around the living room. Lucas had the same kind of dedication. As did Jackson. And Cameron. These people choose their art over there health (no sleep, medical trails, lying on train tracks as the train comes to get that perfect shot, etc).

I think the point I'm TRYING to make is that people like Rodriguez are special - one in a billion. That's the reason why you don't see them popping up everywhere. Anyone can read Rodriguez book and attempt to follow in his footsteps. But you can't "learn" what these people have. It's something that is written on their soul. It's the same reason people work behind the scenes in the "rock and roll" industry. The lack of sleep, extremely hard work and normally unattractive pay is far from appealing. But they do it because that's what they do. They love everything about it. Even if a lot of it sucks.

Who knows. We might be lucky. One of those "diamonds in the rough" might be sneaking around these forums, absorbing all the information so they can make their masterpeace, establish their spot in limelight and go on to build their own "Skywalker Ranch" or "Troublemaker Studios"...! Let's hope so.

Brendan: During post-production of Spykids at Skywalker Ranch, George Lucas introduced Rodriguez to 24p HD film-making and Rodriguez was immediately converted. He owns two Sony HDW-F900 cameras, the same model used by Lucas on the Star Wars prequels.

Oh, and finally, if you read this far congradulations.

Chris!

Lucas for me did film makers the biggest favor he could have. He made Episode 1, and the mystique of Lucas died.

In the light of what even the man who wore the Darth Vader costume called a 'toy commercial' much of what Lucas did well started to unravel. He's not a genius, he used to have drive and he used to have good ideas but he's been contaminated by the money. The original star wars was a very good idea and some incredible luck (Harrison Fords last moment chance, the rewrite on a whim that sent Alec Guinness to another plane of existence and also forced the creation of Yoda - all iconic events).

When he reedited the original star wars it was like he was ashamed of it. He took the Han Solo bar sequence and made Solo 'honorable', turning a decent sequence with a streetwise Solo into an old cliche. The Hero always lets the bad guy take the first shot, even if it makes him an idiot. Redo all the model work in CG and then lock up all the old versions. We liked the original and Lucas is making sure we can only ever buy his re polished painted over the bad bits version.

In the light of Episode 1, we can even see where the Ewoks came from, another cute toy, and the way they behave in the film is only designed to make people want to buy them - getting hit in the face by their own bolas - for example.

And of course the mother of princess lea can't be a proper queen, no. That would endorse a monarchy, So queen has to be a short term thing, and she gets elected to, err, I know, a senate! All advanced civilizations would do what America is now doing, there can be no other way.

And of course the force can't be a religious thing anymore, that might offend Christians, so its now an *infection* you can be tested for. He's taken the central, most mind blowing concept of the trilogy and turned it into a disease. I can't do gym today, the force is strong with me, but I've been given some antibiotics and we'll kill of those bugs by tomorrow, signed, my mother.

Lucas has become detached from everything except making money, and not offending anyone that might want to buy his toys. In doing so he's cracked open many of the things that made him seem godlike at the time.

THX is mentioned every time someone brings up Lucas. When I saw it seemed unimaginative, not very well scripted, boring, the sets and the characters are unattractively done and the ending is unsubtle, a let down and stupid. Oh, they chase you until the budget for your capture runs out. So I guess if you break windows and kill people as you run they give up all the sooner? I thought this film deserved to do badly.

If you want Dark visions of the future you wouldn't have done well going to Lucas even in his prime, you could go to Terry Gilliam, now why hasn't he been mentioned in this thread so far. He spent a decade making animated comedy shorts for python with next to no budget and ended up directing some real gems like Brazil, Time Bandits and Twelve Monkeys.

Although I detest the new Star Wars movies (the second part of episode 3 was a bit enjoyable, though) and I consider Lucas not to be such a good director or writer, I agree with Chris' post about Lucas: I've you've seen documentaries about this man, how he put all his effort and money into cinema, you can having nothing but respect for him, even if he blew up the new star wars series. He LOVES cinema and movies and he did a lot for the industry!

And I would add Steven Spielberg also to that list of filmmakers you named :-)
People act like those people are money-eating wolves because they have much money now, but if you read some biographies about these people, watch some documentaries: they got there because they truly earned it: they loved cinema, had a deep passion for making movies and did all they could, used all their talents and made it happen.

Although off topic, I would propose that you guys are looking at the Star Wars series with a jaded eye. If you show 1-6 to kids who never have seen it, they will not usually jump up and down on how fantastic episode 4 was. That was us. It was groundbreaking and our memories of it became the standard. None of the other episodes could live up to the emotion we got with it, because it was so groundbreaking on fertile ground that was yet untapped. That is also why folks are offended at the changes George made. He is messing with their memory of those moments.

Personally, I like 1-3, but I like to go to the movies to be entertained. I think I own most of the major animation movies that have come out in the last 5 years just for that reason. Monsters Inc, Shrek, and The Incredibles should have gotten best picture award nominations. Some folks are too stuck on 'art' to see it.

I met Robert (briefly) in the mid 80s. The guy lived and breathed the work. He had a lot of hustle. I remember friends of mind in the business asking me if I knew him. He was already being talked about before the fame by those who met him. Can you see it coming ? At some point I think we help to create our right place, right times. Robert was like a walking forum, always ready to talk about every aspect of film ready to share ideas.

Rand





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failure can not contend with persistence

I think you have to keep in mind that the "Star Wars" series were films that Lucas made for himself. He was just lucky that the story worked, he had good actors (Ford was a fulltime builder - not a fulltime actor at the time!) and a good team behind him. He wasn't in it for the money. He did it because he loved films. Unfortunately the technology at the time and budget restricted him from translating the images in his head, to what appears on the big screen. When his team finally had the technology and budget to do what he always wanted, they re-released the originals. You might have liked the originals better - but they weren't actually what Lucas was after. I'm taking a shot in the dark here, but I'm guessing if you told Lucas in person you love the originals and hate the new releases, I think he would say "tough". He wouldn't give a stuff. It's his films - he'll do what he wants. That's what he did with "THX 1138". Everyone, hated it. Tough. He liked it. So he got his team at ILM to head down to Warner Brothers and the Lucasfilm vault, grap the original films and digitally remaster it. After a HUGE amount of time repaired the extremely damaged film, he released it. I'm not sure, but I'm guessing maybe one or two people in the world have purchased it. Nah, seriously thought, I don't think too many people who put it on their "Top 1000 Films to Watch" list. Lucas did what he did because he loved his film.

I honestly don't think Lucas is in it soley for the money. I don't think he's in it for the fame - I don't think any "behind the scenes" person is. I truly think he just loves films. That's why he lives in a "movie makers heaven", the Ranch. That's why ILM exists. Now that he's getting on, I think he's main focus in life is to ensure that people continue to make movies. He wants people that were once like him, to be able to just pick up a camera, shot and share their stories with the rest of the world. That's why he's so enthusiastic about high definition technology. That's why he supports and funds so many films schools and young movie making ventures.

I think the reason people like Terry Gilliam haven't been mentioned in this thread is because they are not in the same league as people like Lucas, and Cameron. Sure they're great. But unlike people like Rodriguez, they are not household names. The point of this thread was to answer why there hasn't been another Rodriguez, even though he's been very open in how he did what he did. Why hasn't someone just read his book, followed his "ten minute film school" rules, and become a millionare?? The reason I believe, is that you need to be special. The people who are special, woudn't read Rodriguez's books. As suggested in my previous post, it's my firm belief that to fit in with that crowd you need to have the attitude of, "I'll do it all myself". You have to be a control freak. That's why Rodriguez has his home studio. That's why Lucas set up ILM - so he can do everything in-house, having control over EVERYTHING. If you're a control freak, your not going to listen to what other people (ie. Rodriguez) has to say! Prfff.... You're going to do it YOUR way.

Yes Mathieu, I agree. Spielberg can be added to the list. Amazingly, I think most of the people that came out of USC at the time of Lucas and Spielberg can be added to the list. And the whole "American Zoetrope" troop. I heard people ask, how can some many talented people all come from the same place at the same time?!? The reason, I think the sheer love for movies people like Lucas have is like a virus. You can catch it. I think some of the people at USC at the time weren't special. They LIKED making films and WANTED to make films - but it wasn't their life. But when they were around people that had that amazing quality that makes you choose movies over life, I think your sucked in to their world and their way of thinking.

The amazing thing about all these people is that they are all inter-related in one way or another. Lucas and Spielberg both went to USC. Lucas introduced Rodriguez to the amazing world of high def. It's amazing how all these talented people are "drawn" together.

Finally, something Rand brought up, all these people share their ideas. If you asked them a simple question about making films, they would crap on for hours and probably forget what you asked them in the first place. It's this passion that makes them special. They love their work and they want everyone to jump on the speeding train that they're all on.

My prediction is that the next BIG person is going to come out of Australia. There are now so many films schools and the film industry is starting to grow. Sooner or later, one of those rare personalities is going to surface "down under". They'll make a huge hit, something that's new and exciting (like Alien once was), shot on film (because they'll be stubborn and want to learn the ropes by beginning at the basics) and then later befriend someone like Peter Jackson who will introduce them to the world of digital technology. Soon after we'll have a Lucasfilm Ranch-type setup in Oz. If I'm right, and only time will tell, I just hope I can get a job there (even if it is just sweeping floors)!

Chris!

Hi Chris,

I should tell you that Spielberg never went to USC.
Or maybe I'm wrong, but he definately never went to film academy, like Lucas did.
Spielberg got rejected twice, if I'm not mistaken, and went on to follow English classes, but got in the television business.
I think other people (Steven Awalt maybe ;-)?) knows this better.

Best regards,

Opps! My mistake! Thanks Mathieu for pointing that out. Now to dig myself out of that hole....

Back in 1968, Spielberg went to the USC films screening and saw Lucas's student film "THX - 1138 - 4eb" (which is not the same as the "THX" film he later released). He was so impressed by it after the show be went backstage and met Lucas and Coppola. That's were they first met and there relationship started. So USC brought them together...

Hah! And you all thought I was stuck in that dig forever!

Many years later Barwood and Robbins helped Lucas get back in contact with Spielberg (who was almost part of the furniture at Universal Studios - the initials US are close to USC!) and their relationship was re-established.

Never-the-less, it's safe to say, that all these people are inter-related.

Chris!

Behind every powerful man is a woman hand...find out who his wife and you'll see why RR is so successful. She is the hustler.

His wife, from what I have seen and researched has very little to do with his success. Rodriguez built his career with Mariachi and him coming down to LA to sell his first movie, "El Mariachi". In his book, Rodriguez NEVER makes a mention about his wife being involved with his endeavor to sell the movie. It was all him and him making his own connections.

Sure, now that he is successful, I'm sure she is a big part of his continouing success, but not in the beginning.

EDIT: I think people are trying to hard to be like others. Rodriguez had a vision and like many others have mentioned on this thread already, that is what made him unique. People focusing on being like someone else and to duplicate the steps one man took to become successfull will make that person trying unsuccessfull. That's my point of view. It was a different time and he utilized things and methods that others coudlnt' think of at the time. He was INNOVATIVE. Today, it's hard to find that innovation because everything is easily accessable.

Don't try to duplicate and strive to make your own story. Place your own mark in the industry. Instead of digesting one mans success, digest your own abilities and expand them to the fullest until you acheive your goal.

With Rodriguez you have the perfect match of Hustle, Talent and Technical Knowledge. After reading his book I came away with one very important point and that is that the film industry is inundated with a "you cant do that" mentality. He urges the readers to make films within their means instead of trying to make a film the way they think they should.

A good example of this that I have a number of friends that went to proper film school while I choose the route of New Media Design. After working in post production for a number of years and shooting all digitally I have an apreciation on how you can make a film with a a decent camera a decent computer and some creative planning. My friends however are endlessly talking about the film that they are going to make as soon as they can raise the 10,000 for their 20 minute short. They still spend entire days lighting scenes and refuse accept the digital revolution.

I have not doubt that in 20 yrs they will have comfortable union jobs and will have still never made the film that they wanted to make. On ther other hand my co-worker and I will probably have our first short under our belts by the end of the summer.

Takashi Miike is another good example of a filmmaker who really generates and works with what he has at hand. His films vary greatly in budget (and in quality - though there is no correlation). He's shot in MiniDV, BetaSP, (not sure about HD yet) and film. His output is crazy. Like average 4 films a year. I think he is shooting so much because he knows that life is short.

>>Yes, the reason Rodriguez gets his money NOW is because he makes "Hollywood low budget films", "stays within budget" and "makes a profit". But the reason he got to where he is, is because he loves films. "El Mariachi" was never intended to be successful. He made it to get experience. He planned to make a sequel to again, get experience. He planned for his third film to make him rich and famous so he could continue to get money to make films.<<

Chris, I never meant to imply he was only about the money. I meant that he knows how to manipulate the Hollywood system to his own advantage.
There isn't some commitee some where deciding the final cut of any of his movies. Thats a great place to be in. I don't envy him, I admire him.
I know he loves cinema and digital tools to create with.