Admin Note:This topic is obsolete -- please read the newer version "Free upgrade now official" located at http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=63294 -- post any replies there if you still have questions after reading it. Thanks! -- CH

This was posted on the Cinematography Mailing List today:

I don't know if anyone on this list has heard of this yet, but I just got back from a visit to EVS in Glendale to see what kind of price they could give me on the HD100. According to the head of sales there JVC has recalled all of HD100's in their shop. He said that there are issues with the camera, not the split screen thing that they had for a while, but with the camera integrating with Anton Bauer batteries as well as having issues with video hard drives.
Apparently there will be an "A" version of the camera in a week or two with which JVC has worked out all the bugs. At least that's what he said...

Michael Escher
filmmaker
www.ranchocalamari.com
Los Angeles, CA

WTF over...

"Anton Bauer batteries"?
I have not heard of anyone having issues with this or the IDX?

"Having issues with video hard drives"
The HD100 doesn't have an internal hard drive.

WTF over...

"Having issues with video hard drives"
The HD100 doesn't have an internal hard drive.

Yeah, but I'm sitting here waiting on the optional JVC hard drive I ordered a couple of weeks ago (made by Firestore?) and wondering if it's going to work when it arrives.

I use this camera with AB batteries. It has always shown the voltage way high like 15.6 or something and it slowly counts down and dies around 13.1. I always thought that was kinda wierd but maybe that has something to do with it. Do you think I should send my camera in or something?

I use this camera with AB batteries. It has always shown the voltage way high like 15.6 or something and it slowly counts down and dies around 13.1. I always thought that was kinda wierd but maybe that has something to do with it. Do you think I should send my camera in or something?

Interesting. I just worked on a 3-camera video and one of the HD100 was showing voltage around 16V. This was with the IDX package. I have the AB mount with a Varizoom battery and it's always at 7.3V

--
Paolo

Our Hd100 shows 16v with the IDX system. They have a max voltage of 16.8V according to the site, so that makes sense.

Do you think its a firmware issue or a real hardware problem?
My version info:
SYS CPU C1590 V0117
CAM CPU C1591 V0108
VTR CPU C1594 V0109
ENC CPU L1187 V0105

Package C1615 V0108
FPGA2 C1595 V0108
FPGA3 C1596 V0100
FPGA4 C1597 V0103

I dont know if any of that is relevent to anything but Ive seen other people post that info so I wanted to feel important.

I dont know about IDX but the AB gold mount supposedly converts everything to 7.2v. It doesnt seem like its doing that though.

"Advanced electronics inside the IDX battery bracket converts the 14.8 volts of the ENDURA V-Mount™ battery to the required 7.2 volts."

Who knows.

The thing with the AB mount is that the HD100 is supposed to translate the power in the battery to remaining run time and display it in the VF. I've never seen this with my AB mount, but I'm using SWIT batteries, so that may have something to do with it. I do however get a voltage readout (7.3V on full charge, 6.9V when dead) and my batteries last 5 hours in the cold.

According to the IDX literature, their mount is also supposed to reduce the voltage to 7.2V, but I think most people have reported 14V on the display.

The first AB mount I got didn't deliver enough voltage to power the camera with the wide lens. When recording and zooming I'd get a low voltage error message even on a fresh battery. Voltage would drop to 6.9, and while it didn't affect actual performance -- no dropouts -- it was disconcerting and obviously not right.

Anton Bauer sent me a "hotter" mount and it holds at 7.1 volts under all circumstances and through hours of shooting with no low voltage messages. The batteries seem to last the five hours advertized, but you know when shooting the usage is so discontinuous that it's really hard to say how much time I get.

My VF/LCD just displays the reduced voltage sent to the camera, in my case the 7.1v rather than actual battery voltage. The AB Dionic 90's that I use do have the LCD graphic readout of projected life remaining, but it would still be nice to have a battery life display in the VF/LCD.

Tip

I spoke with JVC this morning. According to my source the upgrade to the "A"version tackles two issues. 1st it fixed the AB info displayed in the VF. 2nd it maximizes the compatability with the hard drive recorder that JVC is getting ready to release. There may be some small bug fixes as well. This is a free upgrade to HD100 owners through July 31st. If you're not an AB user or plan on purchasing the JVC hard drive recorder, the upgrade isn't as necessary. I'll wait a month or so then send mine off for the upgrade because I do plan on using the hard drive. As far as battery mounts, I've used both and the IDX is better in my opinion.

I spoke with JVC this morning. According to my source the upgrade to the "A"version tackles two issues. 1st it fixed the AB info displayed in the VF. 2nd it maximizes the compatability with the hard drive recorder that JVC is getting ready to release. There may be some small bug fixes as well. This is a free upgrade to HD100 owners through July 31st. If you're not an AB user or plan on purchasing the JVC hard drive recorder, the upgrade isn't as necessary. I'll wait a month or so then send mine off for the upgrade because I do plan on using the hard drive. As far as battery mounts, I've used both and the IDX is better in my opinion.

Council, did JVC actually mention that this will be an "A" designated model, or simply another firmware update?
It doesn't make sense to me that JVC would designate a firmware update as an "A" model, especially when the current models can be updated.
I'm trying to confirm this from a third source now.

Hey fellas, according to JVC, it confirms Bradshaw's statement, that this is an upgrade for 3rd party compatibilty (VF, HDD, Battery), totally voluntary, not a recall. They are just trying to take care of everyone who wants these upgrades, to be a good manufacturer. They also said they will post more info on their site, in the FAQ section:

http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/faq.jsp?tree=&model_id=MDL101539&itempath=&feature_id=13

You'll have to send the camera out for this? Does it go to an authorized JVC repair place, or to JVC themselves?

Hey fellas, according to JVC, it confirms Bradshaw's statement, that this is an upgrade for 3rd party compatibilty (VF, HDD, Battery), totally voluntary, not a recall. They are just trying to take care of everyone who wants these upgrades, to be a good manufacturer. They also said they will post more info on their site, in the FAQ section:

http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/faq.jsp?tree=&model_id=MDL101539&itempath=&feature_id=13
Thanks Rush.
Will there actually be an "A" designation though? It doesn't make sense to do so if this is a simple under-the-hood firmware update.

I'm changing the title of this thread from "recall" to "update" so that everyone can stop freaking out when they see it.

FWIW I get a 16v reading on a charged IDX battery.
I've got a new HD100 coming and it will be interesting to see if this changes.

I just spoke with my sales rep at dvwonline.com and he informed me that JVC has replaced the HD-100 with the HD-100A. They have the new A version on the way. I was told that I will need to mail my old non-a version back to JVC for the upgrade. Does anybody know when I mail my camera in how long it will take? any details yet?

Do you mean that they are updating the camera you have or giving you a new camera? Is it just a firmware upgrade that you mean?

Stanley,
This is only a firmware upgrade.
No hardware change

Contact your local rep.

I'm waiting to find out when the latest firmware will be available.
I'm hoping JVC will post and let us know.

It will be an "A" update, and as far as I know, you have to send to JVC.

And if you buy the JVC now how can you tell i you have the update? Do they draw a big "A" on the side panel?

It will be an "A" update, and as far as I know, you have to send to JVC.

Great. I wonder if I can get mine upgraded at a JVC service center. I've ordered a DR-HD100-40 from B&H and it hasn't shown up yet, but I'm going to be out of town allegedly working on a project for the next 2 1/2 months. I figured I'd shoot to tape only until the drive shows up, but now I don't even know if the drive is going to work for me. Ugh. And I was so psyched about the IDX battery kit showing up today. I leave Friday and I was pretty happy about the fortuitous timing on the battery kit.

Interesting. I just worked on a 3-camera video and one of the HD100 was showing voltage around 16V. This was with the IDX package. I have the AB mount with a Varizoom battery and it's always at 7.3V

--
Paolo
I have the A/B mount with Swit batteries, Varizoom and Swit are the same and my camera is always at 7.1 or 7.0. The battery dies and the voltage doesn't drop from these numbers. A/B has a realtime display but it only shows when both A/B battery and mount are used.

The thing with the AB mount is that the HD100 is supposed to translate the power in the battery to remaining run time and display it in the VF. I've never seen this with my AB mount, but I'm using SWIT batteries, so that may have something to do with it. I do however get a voltage readout (7.3V on full charge, 6.9V when dead) and my batteries last 5 hours in the cold.

According to the IDX literature, their mount is also supposed to reduce the voltage to 7.2V, but I think most people have reported 14V on the display.
Tim, which Swit batteries model are yours? I have the S-8080A and the voltage info doesn't change, and there is no low voltage warning. The camera turns off when the batterie die and turns back on after a few seconds. Does it also happens to you?

Council, did JVC actually mention that this will be an "A" designated model, or simply another firmware update?
It doesn't make sense to me that JVC would designate a firmware update as an "A" model, especially when the current models can be updated.
I'm trying to confirm this from a third source now.

Tim, Yes it will be an "A" designated model. Once the camera has been updated JVC will replace the sticker on the bottom of the camer under the shoulder pad with a JVC GY HD100A sticker.
Also I forgot to mention that all the updates will be done out of the JVC service center in California. Not sure why, maybe because of the volume.

I just got my camera 2 weeks back, from a dealer Upstate New york, do i need to send it back to JVC to get this update.

Does it affect the view finder? i am planning to get the DR-100 HDD within the next 6 months, i have ordered the AB mount, and a set of swit batteries.

So, what is the protocol to follow: contact the dealer or JVC directly to get the shipping address, authorization code, etc.?

Luis

Hey fellas, according to JVC, it confirms Bradshaw's statement, that this is an upgrade for 3rd party compatibilty (VF, HDD, Battery), totally voluntary, not a recall. They are just trying to take care of everyone who wants these upgrades, to be a good manufacturer. They also said they will post more info on their site, in the FAQ section:

http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/faq.jsp?tree=&model_id=MDL101539&itempath=&feature_id=13

Thank God it's just an update. I bought mine yesterday and thought Sod's Law had struck me again! :)

According to the JVC Regional Manager I spoke with today, there will be a formal announcement monday about the upgrade option.

Spoke briefly with my dealer regarding the so-called upgrade today. He stated that it would make no sense to add the "A" unless there was some sort of harware difference. He speculates that at the very least, the new "A" cameras will be accurately calibrated before they hit the market, and the firmware updates will be recent, and JVC is crossing their fingers, that there these updates will no longer be necessary. Additionally, he is looking in to find out whether the lens will be upgraded to breath less, and be more light friendly. Even though they will never truly eliminate the SSE, the lens allowing more light in will decrease the risk of reoccurence. If JVC has indeed got their stuff together once and for all, it may be high time y'all started asking for exchanges for the "A" units, and for those who have not purchased the camera-now could be the time. Lastly, my dealer warned me to beware of what corporations in this boat say and do. They will not necessairily allow the left hand know what the right hand is doing. He suspects they will claim that there is no hardware improvments to the camera, in order to keep present owners at bay. He acknowledges that JVC has taken a lot of slack, and paid out a lot of money in shipping charges for camera's to be recalibrated, and updated. He's looking into seeing if I would be eligible for an exchange/upgrade given my unit has been plagued with issues from day 1. I hope this works out for all of us.

I know someone who wants to send it back, hes got all the invoice, and receipt, but hes missing the box, what does he do?

I talked to someone from JVC customer support on the phone today. The upgrades are apparently being done at the Cypress California facility. I'm driving from Santa Rosa to the east coast tomorrow to start a couple of months of production work and I'm going to stop in Cypress and see if they can upgrade the firmware for me while I wait. The guy I spoke to said he thought it would be OK. Hopefully it will work out.

take your receipt and camera box, and swap for a new 100a unit if they have em. I hope it works out for you.

take your receipt and camera box, and swap for a new 100a unit if they have em. I hope it works out for you.

I can take the receipt, but the camera box is pretty much gonna have to stay here. I'm on my way across the country in a VW Beetle. I barely have room for the production gear as it is. ;-)

Man I hope you make it in that Beetle bro :)

Man I hope you make it in that Beetle bro :)

HA!

Thanks, man. Last October/November I drove 7000 miles in it over the span of a little over two weeks. I picked up quite a bit of the footage I need to finish the project on that trip, but by the time I got home I was a zombie. Heh...not getting any younger, I guess. On the upside, it's a 2002 TDi and that little diesel engine got amazing mileage on the highway from California to Montreal and a lot of points in-between. ;-)

ADMIN NOTE: This was a new thread that I merged into this one. Tim

Hey all,

This may already be out on a thread somewhere....but I was sent an email from the NYC JVC rep. And they are going to announce next week some time details on sending out in the HD-100's (newly purchased I guess) to be upgraded to the "A" version. Below is a portion of the email sent me.


"I believe you are probably wondering about upgrading your GYHD100 camera to an “A” version? Correct?

The unit you received can be sent into JVC for a free upgrade to the current enhanced software and firmware. I will have shipping detail on Monday and I will tell you how to get this taken care of as soon as possible. We in the field have been told that it will be a 72 hour turn around time on these cameras."

Frustrating day today. Thursday I called JVC customer service and told them I needed to see about getting the 100A update done. The guy on the phone claimed that they just had to update the firmware and said if I'd send the camera in they could do it and get it right back to me. I told him I was hitting the road today and asked if I could take the camera into the service center before I left California. He said that would work fine, so I drove 400 miles out of my way and through L.A. rainy gridlock today and when I got to the service center the guy said he could have the camera back to me in 3-5 days. I said, "To flash the firmware?" He claimed that the upgrade involves "significant modifications to the hardware" and said there was a huge line of people waiting to be serviced before they could get to me, so I took my camera and left. He was unable to tell me if my camera will work with the DRHD 100 when it starts shipping, but said his guess was that everything would be fine. I think I developed an ulcer today. I just pulled in for the night in Flagstaff and I'm about as tired and frustrated as I can remember having been in 2006 so far. ;-)

Robert, I am sorry to hear your story. However this seems so typical of how JVC has been treating so many of their customers. There is an internal breakdown of communication that doesn't permit for efficient or clear answers to customer queries. I notice that a couple of people on the forum seem to get better treatment, I'm not sure what the protocol is but I'd like to be on that "A" customer list, where things are taken care of the way they should be. Do I have to be in JVC's back pocket and tout the hd100 despite it's numerous defects? It turns out that customer concerns and the cameras shortcoming are indeed not slanderous rumors. They are legitimate and widespread. And the release of the "100A" model supports this. Anyone who gets one of the new "A" units please keep us informed if there are upgrades to the lens. I have heard rumblings that the lens will be improved, but jvc does not wish to have thousands of cameras returned expecting an exchange or lens upgrade. In turn the new and improved lens will only be available to the second generation of "hd100A" customers, along with the much improved hardware upgrades and latest firmware. Previous customers I hope will still be entitled to the firmware upgrades, and hardware upgrades. Why bother with hardware upgrades? Why can't people just exchange their cameras? What a gong show? Sorry to vent but this is very frsutrating indeed. We deserve better.

Since there seem to be a number of rumors and speculations, as well as some confirmed information in regards to the "A" upgrade, it would be a very good idea for JVC to respond via some higher level manager.

The three main questions in my opinion are:

1. What exact software/firmware update is this and what issues are addressed?
2. What kind of hardware update or changes are performed during this update?
3. Does the new HD100A camera have any new/improved/different components? (i.e. lens, VF, etc.)

I don't believe that this request is unreasonable... let's think of it in terms of a software update, which usually lists changes and improvements and explains reasons for it. At least on the Mac side it does.

From everything I've heard, there will be an announcement on Monday.

I notice that a couple of people on the forum seem to get better treatment, I'm not sure what the protocol is but I'd like to be on that "A" customer list, where things are taken care of the way they should be. Do I have to be in JVC's back pocket and tout the hd100 despite it's numerous defects?


Well I assume that I'm one of those couple of people that you're refering to. I don't think it's helpful to suggest people are in someone's "back pocket" becuase they've spoken well of JVC's responsiveness. That's been my experience and I mentioned it. I also created a thread on SSE at 0db to inform people that as much as I like the camera, I had that experience. So it's also not fair to characterize people as ignoring the realities of the camera and somehow being treated differently.

Through people on this list I was pointed toward the people I should contact at JVC. I did so and got an immediate response. I was polite, professional and forthright with them and the two mgrs that I dealt with responded in kind. That's what happened. I have no special relationship and there is no "A" list that I'm aware of...I'm certainly not on it if there is.

I will say this. It seems that most first generation technology takes a while to stabilize through first generation user's experience. I've always prefered to be on that well recognized "bleeding edge" in building my studios over the years.
From first generation NLEs and cameras to the same experience in our recording studios. We were first adopters of the Mini35 and later versions of that proved more trouble free than ours.

However we dealt with the reality of 1st generation technology and produced a lot of great work with the first model...no regrets...I understand the issues at hand by not waiting for a more evolved tool.

So I felt the same way with the HD100. we have Xl2s and worked with Canons all the way from the first XL, so I knew the H1 would be a fairly stable "new" system. However, after comparisons and tests it was clear to me that the HD100 was the right new HD film making tool at this time.

I followed the threads here and elsewhere and was well aware of the potential issues of this first generation but our immediate production needs demanded HD now, and this was the best camera IMO. So we went there knowing what everyone should know by now if they decide to become early adoppters of a technology - and that is that they will be the ones that find the bugs and have to deal with upgrades etc.

I'm not being an apologist by any means, but I've been in this game for a while and I get a lot more out of being an early adopter of these things than not. What's important is that JVC moves quickly as issues like battery incompatability, or hard drive incompatability become an issue. They seem to be doing that and it seems that we're going to hear more next week.

They also have moved to refine the SSE calibration abd realistically, there have been very few people on these boards complaining about blown projects because of it. The few people that have had a demonstrable problem with it have been immediately encouraged (as I was) to contact JVC and get the new implementation.

It seems like they're responding to all of these things. Sure I don't like taking the time that I've had to to deal with this, but JVC seems to be dealing with it. Let's see what next week brings.

Let me preface this by saying that I'm strongly leaning toward the JVC HD-100, even though I own a Panny DVX. That said, I've read the posts from early adopters expressing their unhappiness over the problems they've had with their first gen HD-100's and more unhappiness over the fact that JVC is coming out with an "A" model that will address those problems.

As small business owners, you all most probably are already represented by counsel. Speaking as a Tennessee attorney, there is a provision in Tennessee law that provides that all products sold in Tennessee are sold with an implied warranty of merchantability and implied warranty of fitness for a particular purpose. Essentially, these provisions provide that if a product in Tennessee cannot operate in the manner that it was intended to be used and sold for that express purpose, the purchaser may have a legal claim against the manufacturer. I cannot speak for the law in other states, but it would not surprise me if other states had similar provisions.

If you have drawn the very short straw as an early adopter and have a camera with a boatload of CA and other problems, can't carry on your business because of these problems. and can't get a satisfactory resolution of your problems by contacting JVC directly, you might want to spend a hundred bucks or so for an hour's worth of your attorney's time and find out what other options are available. It is true that legal action is a pain in the ass and can drag out for years, but that's the system, for better for worse. My impression, though, is that JVC seems to be doing its best to accomodate customers' concerns.

I'm a prosecutor in Tennesse, so I'm not trolling for business, couldn't represent anyone in civil court for any amount of money. But I find that many folks are unaware of these implied warranties (though businesses are acutely aware of them.) So if your situation is a nightmare, (as opposed to just annoying), it's a possible remedy.

Somehow I don't think a class-action lawsuit is the proper course to take, considering that this manufacturer is not only improving their product, but will also offer this upgrade to current owners of their existing product. I guess I fail to see why that deserves litigation.

Are you saying that early adopters such as myself might not be eligible for the "A" upgrade?

Well, I'm sure we'll all find out when JVC makes their formal announcement (from what I understand, it's coming on Monday), but all indications are that the upgrade will be available for early adopters if they want it.

As small business owners, you all most probably are already represented by counsel. Speaking as a Tennessee attorney, there is a provision in Tennessee law that provides that all products sold in Tennessee are sold with an implied warranty of merchantability and implied warranty of fitness for a particular purpose. Essentially, these provisions provide that if a product in Tennessee cannot operate in the manner that it was intended to be used and sold for that express purpose, the purchaser may have a legal claim against the manufacturer. I cannot speak for the law in other states, but it would not surprise me if other states had similar provisions.

If you have drawn the very short straw as an early adopter and have a camera with a boatload of CA and other problems, can't carry on your business because of these problems. and can't get a satisfactory resolution of your problems by contacting JVC directly, you might want to spend a hundred bucks or so for an hour's worth of your attorney's time and find out what other options are available. It is true that legal action is a pain in the ass and can drag out for years, but that's the system, for better for worse. My impression, though, is that JVC seems to be doing its best to accomodate customers' concerns.

Good post and sound advice with any hardware. However, anyone who has given JVC a chance to "fix the problem" has been greeted with a good reception and a solution. The ones who had continuing problems seem to not cooperate in resolution, and really did not give JVC an opportunity to "make it right" (because of impatience maybe?). The ones that give JVC a chance, learn that JVC does back up this product and it's obvious that service and customer retention is paramount to JVC right now. I see JVC the way I saw Panasonic in the early 1990's. Up and coming. They've put together a really nice format (ProHD and ProHDXE) that is tremendously flexible with incredible quality for the $$$$. They know that (I'm sure) and it seems to me they will nurture the "golden egg" that is ProHD.

Thanks Chris. I've heard that JVC Regional Managers have been asked not to talk about the update on the message boards until JVC USA releases the full details in either a press release or on the FAQ.

...and more unhappiness over the fact that JVC is coming out with an "A" model that will address those problems.

Dave. There should be absolutely no unhappiness with the fact that JVC is improving their product at no extra charge to existing customers (assuming the rumours are true.)
Are you saying that early adopters such as myself might not be eligible for the "A" upgrade?
I think many people are assuming that what JVC is doing here is the same as what Panasonic did with the upgrade from DVX100 to DVX100A. The DVX100 did not have gain capability or auto-focus in progressive modes. Within months of the DVX100's release Panasonic released the DVX100A which added those features as well as some new gamma curves. Of course the original DVX100 owners were pissed (me included) because there was no firmware upgrade path. If you bought the DVX100, you would simply never have those new features.

JVC is offering an upgrade path for existing U.S. customers (there is no information from other regions yet,) and as far as I can tell, there will be no charge to the end user.

JVC has your back, don't dis them for it.

Somehow I don't think a class-action lawsuit is the proper course to take, considering that this manufacturer is not only improving their product, but will also offer this upgrade to current owners of their existing product. I guess I fail to see why that deserves litigation.
Chris, all Dave is saying is that consumers should be aware of their rights and options. I didn't feel that he was suggesting litigation. And I do agree with you that JVC is addressing the problems. Let's wait for Monday to see what the situation is... From my understanding ALL HD100 owners are eligible for the update.