Anyone know if any sample clips are available on the internet yet???

Since they are MPEG-2 I guess they will be easy to view on a PC like HDV clips. Or not? I read that they don't use a transport stream (m2t) but "elementary streams" - is that MPEG-2 (mpg) files?

I'd love to see how these 1/2 inch chip CCDs compare to the 1/3 inch ones.

Please read the press release... there's a copy of it here:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=58618

This camera isn't even shipping until March, so the answer is no, there isn't any downloadable video yet.

Hello,
As I said in another post, I went to the Sony Roadshow, two days ago, in order to see the XDCAM HD on a wild screen (Ruby videoprojector).
Pictures were maybe a bit better than HDV but far away from the awesome HDCam footage we saw just after that... The Canon zoom lense were not good at all (a lot of chromatic aberations). It was desapointing for me.
So for the moment, PDW 350 is like a Canon XL H1 which records on a Bluray disc...

This camera isn't even shipping until March, so the answer is no, there isn't any downloadable video yet.

Kaku had the Canon XL-H1 footage a month or two before it started to ship and there is also now footage of the cheap Sanyo HD Camera which won't ship until March either, hence my question...

Oh, you mean Kaku, as in Kaku Ito, the guy who is always the first to get the gear and who always posts the first video clips to DV Info Net? Well, that's different! Kaku could probably manage this, but I doubt if anybody else can. That's why I answered the way I did above.

On the Sony HDCAM HD Site (http://bssc.sel.sony.com/BroadcastandBusiness/markets/10014/xdcamhd_info.shtml) near the bottom left is a link to movie titled Overview Video Hi-Res (http://bssc.sel.sony.com/BroadcastandBusiness/markets/10014/video/XDCAM+HD+Promotiom+Video_L.wmv).

It is a very compressed file but contains a fair amount of footage shot with the F330.

My Sony rep is scheduled to demo one of the new XDCAM HD cameras for us on February 9th. With any luck I might have a few clips straight from the camera following the demo.

Scot, if you can do that then you'll be our new hero. Welcome to DV Info Net,

Any update? Would love to see actual footage from this format..

Does anyone have the details on this new flavor of 35 mbs MPEG. Is it a shorter GOP than standard HDV. Also is the HD-SDI output uncompressed HD 1080 4:2:2? Does the variable compression actualy compress 720p less vs 1080i and take advantage of the full 35 mbs?

The SDI output conforms to SMPTE 292M, of course. However Sony has told me that the CCD/DSP image is only capturing 4:2:0. The 4:2:0 signal is then interpolated to 4:2:2 to produce the SDI output.

Since we have an HDC-X300 (which has the same 1/2" CCD and image processing) Sony suggested we test the SDI output using the X300. We ran a number of tests including some green screen shots. The X300 SDI output definetely acts like you are effectively getting 4:2:0. Pulling a clean matte is difficult and it is virtually impossible to eliminate edge crawl on green screen shots. Certainly our Canon XL H1 performs better for any kind of post processing (chroma keying, wire removal, etc.).

I have still ordered the PDW-F350, and I am looking forward to its arrival at the end of the month. Like all cameras it has strenghts and weaknesses.

However Sony has told me that the CCD/DSP image is only capturing 4:2:0. The 4:2:0 signal is then interpolated to 4:2:2 to produce the SDI output.

That would tally with my experience of SDI from one of my colleagues PDW-510P. There was an improvement in picture quality because of far less compression. But there wasn't enough difference to pursuade me to get the SDI card for my camera.

Scot, if you can do that then you'll be our new hero. Welcome to DV Info NetMy Sony rep is scheduled to demo one of the new XDCAM HD cameras for us on February 9th. With any luck I might have a few clips straight from the camera following the demo.Any update?

Sony NZ and Panavision NZ did a combined roadshow recently with projected Z1, 350 and HDW-750 material.

All material was dubbed to HDCAM SR and played out through a SRW1 into a Sony VPLVW100 projector.

IMHO there was not a dramatic leap from the Z1 footage shown and the 350.
Certainly not the leap that was immediately apparent when the HDW-750 material was shown. Maybe a specific HD 1/2" lens would lift the performance.

Obviously viewing conditions were not ideal and it was a montage cut for the roadshow. Variable frame rate footage looked good.

IMHO there was not a dramatic leap from the Z1 footage shown and the 350.
Certainly not the leap that was immediately apparent when the HDW-750 material was shown. Maybe a specific HD 1/2" lens would lift the performance.Sorry my non-native english.. Did you say «lift down» comparing with the HDW-750?

Or «lift up», that is, it was presenting with a 2/3" lens maybe SD? (because there isn't 1/3" to that) and with a specific HD 1/2" lens (according its CCD) would it perform better? Is it that?

Sorry my non-native english.. Did you say «lift down» comparing with the HDW-750?

Or «lift up», that is, it was presenting with a 2/3" lens maybe SD? (because there isn't 1/3" to that) and with a specific HD 1/2" lens (according its CCD) would it perform better? Is it that?

In the footage that shown there was not a large shift in pq between the Z1 and 350 camera. Certainly not the difference between the HDW-750 and the other 2 cameras.

But...this was projected footage off what is basically a high end home theatre projector.

The XDHD 350 shot with a SD Canon 1/2" lens. The Z1 is 1/3" fixed and the HDW750 a 2/3" Fujinon HD 22x.

AFAIK there has been no info released on a 1/2" HD lens line up for the XDHD Cams(?)

I don't think it is possible to judge so much on apparent picture quality. There will be a big difference between the 330/350 and 750. However that is only the partial story.

What will not be immediately apparent from the demo you saw is how much more latitude the XDCAM HD has over the Z1, or how much more adjustability the picture has via the menus, depth of field characteristics, more robustness during camera movement due to the higher bitrate, uncompressed audio etc, etc. So it isn't quite as black and white as it may seem at first.

Its the same with my 510. Sometimes I'll see pictures taken from the newer handycams and think that actually they aren't that bad. Its only on examination that I see the defects in the lower spec camera that eventually have an effect on the whole production chain. High frequency detail, detail enhancement characteristics, latitude etc.

On top of this there is the convenience for the cameraman in actual use. The manual lens alone on the HD XDCAM makes the camera instantly easier and more controllable in use than the Z1 etc.

There's a lot to consider.

My dillemma is whether to wait for the 2/3" version. I think I probably will (and will aim to upgrade to a high def 2/3" lens this year), but I would imagine that it would be at least £22k UKP just for the body or more. And it isn't clear if there will also be two tiers for that version either. Perhaps Sony will say something at NAB. The XDCAM HD 1/2" version had a mock up available for viewing at last years show, and the previous SD version of XDCAM had mockups at NAB the year before release. So if Sony are releasing a 2/3" version next year it would seem consistant that they would do the same at this years show. Here's hoping!

I don't think it is possible to judge so much on apparent picture quality. There will be a big difference between the 330/350 and 750. However that is only the partial story.

What will not be immediately apparent from the demo you saw is how much more latitude the XDCAM HD has over the Z1, or how much more adjustability the picture has via the menus, depth of field characteristics, more robustness during camera movement due to the higher bitrate, uncompressed audio etc, etc. So it isn't quite as black and white as it may seem at first.

Its the same with my 510. Sometimes I'll see pictures taken from the newer handycams and think that actually they aren't that bad. Its only on examination that I see the defects in the lower spec camera that eventually have an effect on the whole production chain. High frequency detail, detail enhancement characteristics, latitude etc.

On top of this there is the convenience for the cameraman in actual use. The manual lens alone on the HD XDCAM makes the camera instantly easier and more controllable in use than the Z1 etc.

There's a lot to consider.

My dillemma is whether to wait for the 2/3" version. I think I probably will (and will aim to upgrade to a high def 2/3" lens this year), but I would imagine that it would be at least £22k UKP just for the body or more. And it isn't clear if there will also be two tiers for that version either. Perhaps Sony will say something at NAB. The XDCAM HD 1/2" version had a mock up available for viewing at last years show, and the previous SD version of XDCAM had mockups at NAB the year before release. So if Sony are releasing a 2/3" version next year it would seem consistant that they would do the same at this years show. Here's hoping!

Couldn't agree more on your comments Simon. Your dillemma is what a lot of us face.

Any owner operator running a 2/3" camera will be reluctant to climb into a 1/2" system because it will mean investing in 1/2" glass.They also have the choice of the DSR450, 510 or 530 if upgrading 2/3" and have no requirement for HD.

The O/O's I know are putting there investment into HD lenses which they can utilise with their existing SD rigs.

As a rental company the 1/2" system is a pain as well. A total 350 camera system including lenses and deck is up there with the cost of a Varicam or HDW750 body which can work with our inventory of 2/3" HD lenses. And with a shelf life of 18 months until a 2/3" version arrives, thats a small window to earn back the investment.

Also, have Sony signaled the arrival of a 2/3" HDV tape camera with the release of the new large tape format capable HDV decks? Is the DSR450 the last of the DVCAM line development?

Or does it mean a HDV camera based on the DSR250? or a 1/2" HDV tape camera?

Or simply, they made the new HDV decks so the could take large DVCAM tapes? :)

I also would second Simon's comments. The 1/2" will have greater performance than is evident in a simple viewing, and the 2/3" will be even better. When I tested our HDC-X300 (same 1/2" ccd as PDW-F350) it consistently had at least 2 stops more lattitude than the Canon XL H1. Vertical smear was also much better.

The Canon SD lens that Sony has been demoing with the PDW-F330 and F350 definitely limits performance. That is the same lens included in the HDC-X300K package. I switched to the Fujinon 1/2" HD lens and saw a great improvement in resolution and overall performance.

I am trying to work a deal with the local Fujinon dealer to borrow a 2/3" HD lense with the adapter for the PDW-F350. I will test it on my F350 when it arrives. If possible I would like to use 2/3" lenses on the F350 (Sony is pushing that capability with the adapters, which actually come from Canon and Fuji I believe). I am concerned that the 2/3" inch lenses have a larger Circle of Confusion (and therefore lower resolution), since 2/3" CCD's have larger pixels. I will let you know once I have been able to test this. If the 2/3" lens resolution is close to the 1/2" lens I will use the 2/3" lenses.

yep thats a review I would love to hear about. Like eveyone else caught in this dilema wondering which way to jump. I read somewhere that the 2/3" XDCAM HD will also provide 50MB/s and 4:2:2 colour. But how far away is it and at what cost. Infinity where you are you, has anyone got any news?

Cheers Ian

Sony has announced availability of the 2/3" XDCAM HD for June 2007. I have no data on what pricing will be for the 2/3", but I would guess it will be more than the PDW-F330/350 but less than the HDW-730/750. Just a guess.

I hope to have thoroughly tested our F350 before NAB (assuming Sony really delivers it by the end of the month) so that I know all the right questions to ask and requests to make when I am at NAB. Usally Sony is pretty receptive and understands the issues.

Creative Video have the new XDCAM HD's on their website http://www.creativevideo.co.uk

Judging by the prices I would reckon around £25-£30k for the 2/3" model now. I just saw that Gearhouse Broadcast are selling the HDW730 for £25k including an HJ17 lens!

Creative Video have the new XDCAM HD's on their website http://www.creativevideo.co.uk

Judging by the prices I would reckon around £25-£30k for the 2/3" model now. I just saw that Gearhouse Broadcast are selling the HDW730 for £25k including an HJ17 lens!

Wow we can't (in NZ) even get a DVW970 body for that!
Is that pricing a reflection of the demand for the HDW750 with it's 25p ability over the 50i/60i of the HDW730?

Still that is a very good buy if you don't require progressive.

I saw some footage taken on a XDcam HD and transfered to 35mm film, it looked very good.

I didn't ask any further info about the camera as I was taken back by footage from the Panavision Genisis camera - they screened split screen shots of the PV Genisis and a regular 35mm panavision camera, I could not see any difference. The super 35 ccd in the Genisis is BIG

Andy, thanks, but in the future it's better to do a short synopsis then supply the link. Pasting an entire post from another site usually isn't done around here out of courtesy.
Plus, it's way off topic even if informative.

Andy, thanks, but in the future it's better to do a short synopsis then supply the link. Pasting an entire post from another site usually isn't done around here out of courtesy.
Plus, it's way off topic even if informative.

Worse than that, it's an all out copyright infringement. You can not legally quote content from other locations without their permission. As Joe stated, it's better to paraphrase and then link to the content.

For those who are wondering what Joe and I are referring to, there was a long quote posted from another forum by Andy earlier in this thread. The posts have been removed from public view for now and may be paraphrased and reposted later, time permitting.

regards,
-gb-