Okay, I have many P2 volumes backed up on my iPod, then I would want to backup somewhere else. I talked about backing up each volume consist of 4GB to DVD-R, but it takes quite a long time to do this every time.

So, what I'm doing now is to copy these to a larger hard drive connected to my Power Mac G5. First, connect the iPod that I'm using for backing up the P2 data in the field with HVX200. I have a G-tech G-RAID (Firewire 800), so I made a folder, named "HVX Archives", then make a folder inside of that with the session name like "060101_01night shoot", then directly copy the contents of the volume from iPod. This means the "CONTENTS" folder and "LASTCLIP.TXT" file.

Then when you boot FCP5, go to the P2 import menu and direct the location to the appropriate location. It worked.

So, I would continue to accumulate all the footage in the G-RAID, and maybe make a AIT2 backups on tapes or just get another Hard Disk Drive like G-Drive.

By the way, I tried to use a PC-card/USB2 card reader with P2 card by I/O data and it did not work.

Kaku, your Ipod is Mac formated, right? Probably that's why it can't be recognized by a PC. How about archiving in dlt tape? What's the time of transfer to these tapes? I worked with them once, but don't actually know the speed of transfer...

Kaku, your Ipod is Mac formated, right? Probably that's why it can't be recognized by a PC. How about archiving in dlt tape? What's the time of transfer to these tapes? I worked with them once, but don't actually know the speed of transfer...

Here, I'm talking about the P2 card not mounting using the I/O data PC-card reader using Macintosh. iPod is working fine as HVX formated volume, otherwise you wouldn't have seen the files I uploaded here in the forum...
However, copying the contents from mac mounted iPod to the drive is taking longer than I thought, this is probably due to the slow access speed of iPod itself. Too bad. I will search for faster portable battery operated firewire hard drive, but probably faster to buy Cineporter or focus Firestore.....

AIT2 is maybe little faster than normal DLT. But it is maybe about 6MB/per sec. I would use this to backup my main archive volume while the system is not used for editing.

I have decided to purchase G-Tech G-RAID 1TB, to make the copying process faster to bring in the files to FCP5. I have to see what happens when I trash the media files after I finish a project, find out how "offline" media files are connected to the original footage file from the backup I make.

Other than the very latest (SDLT), DLT is a bit old in the tooth. LTO has a 400MB capacity/tape and handles about 60MB/s (compressed). It's much faster than all versions of DLT.

This is very popular choice/preference for enterprise (meaning large data sets) backup. Either is much faster than AIT2...

Thanks Dennis,

I'm so out of it with tape streamers. Sony didn't do much more with the AIT drives it seems. The drive I have is from maybe about over 5 years ago. AIT is now AIT-3 I believe. Panasonic is providing ATI solution for backing up P2 footage though.

Things like video data won't compress much tho, so what is the fastest tape drive around now? Ultrium (i guess it is based on the same technology as LTP)? It says 800GB max for the size and 80MB/sec for the transferring rate.

I think I just keep buying hard disks for now.

What do you guys think of the following product as a long term archive solution:

Iomega
Price : $ 329.95
35GB/90GB Rev USB2 Backup Drive

Also, you've mentioned other archive solutions. What are the prices/costs for each?

And...

I purchased the Sony HC1 HDV Camera months ago (it's my run and gun family video camera). It can be used as a player/recorder. Could I use it as a recorder after editing HVX200 footage in Final Cut Pro? I'm not crazy about HDV, but it would give me a portable way for me to show my movies on other peoples HDTV's (perhaps this is a solution until HD DVD recorders come out)? I'm assuming all I would have to do is change my sequence settings from DVC Pro HD, to HD, render and output to the HDV camera? Maybe this wouldn't work with progressive footage? I'm not sure.

Any other crazy ideas?

You could certainly use it as an output device, yes. Finish your timeline in FCP, and then tell it to render and output an MPEG-2 HDV stream. For 1080 it should convert fairly straightforward; for 720p there would be some scaling/stretching going on, but FCP5 is reported to have a very good scaling algorithm, much better than before, so that should be practical.

Another way to go would be to author a WMV9 DVD (not sure if Apples support that); WMV9 high-def DVDs can be played on PC-compatible computers and are probably the most portable/low-cost high-def distribution method available, but -- it would have to be played back on a computer, not on a set-top DVD player (although there are a couple of DVD players out there which can handle the format too).

What do you guys think of the following product as a long term archive solution:

Iomega
Price : $ 329.95
35GB/90GB Rev USB2 Backup Drive

Also, you've mentioned other archive solutions. What are the prices/costs for each?

Barry already addressed the DVCPRO to HDV issue pretty well... But as for your backup question, I would not trust REV drive cartridges. They are nothing more than magnetic hard drive platters. The REV is just the next generation in the tried but true method of placing a hard disk platter into a simple plastic cartridge and keeping all the other drive components within the actual drive unit. ...Started with solutions like the SyQuest EZ-66 and EZ-135, then on to the Iomega Jaz 1/2GB etc.. Cartridges are much more reliable than a full HDD as they don't really break down, but they're still vulnerable to magnetic forces and other potential hazards. Tape should be more reliable and optical disc even more so.

If you can hold out until April/May, we should have both HD-DVD and BluRay recordable solutions to consider. Until then, a good tape drive solution is probably the way to go. I'd do a redundant mirror (RAID-1) on your capture/edit system and then have an automatic backup to tape overnight. Same solution applies to HD-DVD/BluRay or even something like the REV. Just the disk media replaces the tape.

As for cost... Figure a second HDD for the RAID-1. If you're running a RAID-0 stripe right now (many people do these days), backup your stuff and reconfigure with RAID-1.

Tape drives range in price from a few hundred to several thousand $$ depending on what type and features. But you can get an external USB2/SCSI or internal ATA/SCSI tape system for about $500 that will serve you very well.

HD-DVD/BluRay recorders will hit the market at about $800 it seems. Discs will be expensive at first, but will rapidly drop as more people buy into these solutions.

YAnother way to go would be to author a WMV9 DVD (not sure if Apples support that); WMV9 high-def DVDs can be played on PC-compatible computers and are probably the most portable/low-cost high-def distribution method available, but -- it would have to be played back on a computer, not on a set-top DVD player (although there are a couple of DVD players out there which can handle the format too).

Barry,
Flip4Mac Studio Pro HD ($179) can make WMVHD on the Mac. Works in Final Cut Pro, FC Express, iMovie, Quicktime Pro, Cleaner 6, Squeeze 4.1, Compressor 2. Works nice! BTW the Flip4Mac Player 2.0.1 can play WMVHD in Quicktime. The Player is FREE. I was a beta tester.

another one we can use is D-VHS, but it is not so popluar already.
Sony should make inexpensive HDV walkman.

Thanks guys for the info!

Make sure you back-up to a RAID5 or mirrored drive. Backing up to a single drive is like playing with fire. I have a feature doc that had a striped raid die and the external back-up die both within 6 days... Best solution is a mirror or RAID5.



ash =o)

Make sure you back-up to a RAID5 or mirrored drive. Backing up to a single drive is like playing with fire. I have a feature doc that had a striped raid die and the external back-up die both within 6 days... Best solution is a mirror or RAID5.



ash =o)

Oh yeah, Ash, I mentioned G-RAID primary and to single drive for backup. And probably on HD-DVD or something to tripple make sure.

based on my 10 years as a pc network admin, i would not recommend any tape-based format for archiving, because it's very expensive, and the standards become obsolete too quickly... you'll be stuck with a tape drive that has no software to control it, because the new pc's won't run the software, and no compatible hardware port to plug it into.

iomega solutions? several months ago i threw my old iomega drive away, because it's too small, and the new computers don't have the serial/parallel ports to plug it into anymore... another dead standard.

raid? what hardware standard is it using to plug the controller card into? does it depend on a computer o.s. to run? how long will that be around? will you have to keep the ancient computer that controls it around forever?

i would not re-compress the source footage to another standard like wmv9, why compromise the picture quality like that?

tough choices... whatever course you take, plan on being aware enuf to update your backed-up material to the latest standards as they become available, so that you won't lose the data because of obsolete standards.

Dan,
I never thought the tape solution would run expensive, thank you for your input. I did have about 20 of those those AIT tapes, but not realizing the whole cost.

For the RAID I'm talking about, G-RAID, is a single box solution. So you can use it as a firewire hard drive like a single drive. Not sure if it is compatible with HVX directly (it does have both 800 and 400 depending on the model), but my workflow is HVX/P2 to iPOD/Cineporter to GRAID/G5. Check out the GRAID by G-Technology.

Yes, I would not recompress my backup footage neigther. But would be nice to have mastered clips to show to people. So, for that, I would use DV, HDV, D-VHS, H.264 as choices over SD-DVD (I'm just ingorant on WMV).

i checked it out, it looks like industrial-strength hard drive solutions... i'm kind of in the same boat you are, i have a bunch of fs-4 footage i've been trying to offload somewhere.

i'm going with the cheapest quality hdd i can find for now, until this hd dvd storage technology gets cheap enuf.

fwiw, i have seen threads on the 'net that detail how you can use a cheap camcorder to store data with, in a non-video format, but on a cheap dv tape... i have not pursued it, but it's very interesting as an interim solution.

Did you guys consider Blu Ray as a backup solution? It makes the most sense to me. It may be some time before they come out though.

G-RAIDs that we sold to customers, they been stable very much. G-Technology is a spin off from Medea.

And, Jay, yes we mentioned Bluray of course, but I'm in HD-DVD boat more than Bluray. When it comes to an equipment related with appreciating media (movies and music), I don't trust what Sony creates, because of that I tend to try to support other technology goes against it. What Sony did on CD was good because of Phillips was behind it. Phiilips is nolonger strong player in the appreciation media, Sony is really loosing its reference in quality, fidelity in music and video, but they still remain arrogant in manupilating media culture. I hope they do better in considering and listening to people about "reference" quality of things. Although after all of the problem they have been having with solid music players (spyware and music being played different length than original, but Sony says that is legitimate), I can't support what Sony is trying to set as a standard. I hope Sony makes something good with Bluray, but more likely that Mac would come with HDDVDR rather than Bluray drive, wouldn't it?

*edit* I killed this message, I didn't like it...