I'm posting this here because you are the guys that have used the H1, so I figured you could pass the best judgement.

Based on your experiences using the H1 does a GL3(GLH1?) seem more realistic now?

You know because you guys have worked with 24f, the hdv codec, the colors and whatever else.

I'm just curious if now that the XLH1 is out if the a GL3(GLH1) is really a realistic option. Before the H1 handn't been released but now that is has would a 20x Zoom, HDV, probably non xlr, 24f, GL-type model for what I figure would be around a Z1u's price seem likely at all?

Now that the XL H1 is out can that really be squeezed into a next generation GL(GLH) body or is that just mechanically impossible or unlikely?

Last month, a Canon representative in Europe told me that Canon will apply exactly the same strategy as they did with the issue of the XL1 and the GL1, when I asked him about a "GL3". He can't say me more, of course.

Does anyone remember how many months have slipt by between the issue of the XL1 and the GL1 ?

If it has XLRs it will be a VERY interesting camera!

Canon must work with Panasonic to squeeze the 24p circuitry into a GL3(GLH1), until that's done, There would be no 24p on the GL3(GLH1)

why does canon need Panasonic?

^Panasonic provides the 24p and 30p chipsets for Canon. (at least I heard someone said that.)

There is no such thing as 24p and 30p chipsets. You have the CCD chipset, the processor chipset, etc. No need to work with Panasonic or anyone on 24p. Sony put 24p into CineAlta's interlaced recording before Panasonic did it in their DVX.

What I would like to see is for Canon to make their own CMOS chips for the new cameras. They make their own CMOS. If Sony can make CMOS camcorder chips, Canon should be able to do the same.

Canon does not make CCD's though and buys them from Panasonic and Sony, I think.

Besides Sony, JVC and Canon, no one seems to be too excited about HDV. Blu-Ray introduction is around the corner and it has at least the same bit rate, no dropouts, etc. I think that Blu-Ray cameras will be introduced this year by Panasonic, Sony, and Canon and will eventualy replace HDV.

Canon shouldn't have a problem creating cmos chips using their existing cmos production facilities that they currently use to manufacture their dslr chips. granted it would also be a higher chip-per-wafer ratio, making it cheaper.

the problem would be in making the cmos chips fast enough to capture hd. currently, they're capturing 2336p at 8.5 fps. now if they could just capture 1080p at any fps up to 60...

with the introduction of the sanyo consumer hd camera (or still camera with hd, if you like), i'd like to see more consumers asking themselves "if i have an hdtv, why can't i make my own hd material?" ive had alot of wows from dad's when they ask about my sony hc1, so i'd expect the market would be pretty big.

i believe blu-ray is just taking the stage this year because of the impending (or present?) war between them and the hd dvd camp.

Evan, everything is going HDV. So Canon will bring out a G2-sized HDV cam to compete with Sony's small HDV cams.

is there a chance Canon will be introducing an SD successor to the GL-2, or will they just go directly to an HD update - what are everyone's thoughts on that?

Canon's representatives said, at the XL2 lauch, that it was the last SD cam they will produce.

Well I hope it comes within the year even though that's probably extremely whishful thinking considering they just got the H1 out the door.

I also pray it keeps 24f when it drops.

Jean-Philippe, oh yes indeed!

And that was how long ago? And even then they must have been, and again for sometime, been sticking on the HD logos on the latest version. Who's gonna tell us that at that time they weren't also wrapping up an XM3HD?

. .and yes the clock IS ticking, Mr Canon. Sony has their lower budget HD CMOS.

Surely Sony's F1 has to be tempting/tempted exsisting GL/XM-2 owners?

"Show us the Money! Show us the money!"

. . tick tock . . tick tock . . . tick tock . .

Grazie

Surely Sony's F1 has to be tempting/tempted exsisting GL/XM-2 owners?

Not just tempting: I already have two FX1s and am debating parting with all of my Canon gear. The FX1 puts the Canon GL1/GL2 to shame in terms of image quality, plus it looks more professional and has a wider selection of control features. I'm surprised that no one has released anything to compete with the FX1, which is arguably the most amazing value in a prosumer camcorder ever. Not perfect, but an impressive camera for the price.

I would have rather had a Canon GL3 shooting HDV with a nice 20X zoom lens, but Canon was giving no hint of their plans at the time I started moving to Sony, and I can't wait forever.

I'm also hoping to have it this year - I'd like to actually own one by the end of June so I can use it for work in the summer. I'm thinking they would release it PMA or NAB this year, which means my dream of owning it by June could be a reality.

Not just tempting: I already have two FX1s and am debating parting with all of my Canon gear. . . . .

I would have rather had a Canon GL3 shooting HDV with a nice 20X zoom lens, but Canon was giving no hint of their plans at the time I started moving to Sony, and I can't wait forever.

Kevin - exactly! You can't wait forever? Neither can I! More to the point neither will my Clients who presently may NOT have HD abilities but WILL want HD compliant future-proofing.

Andrew - I wouldn't bet the farm, or any blade of grass, on it pal! Maybe June 2007 in the US and then late '07 in Europe. Tell you what though, I'd dearly love to eat my hat over this.



But what do I know?

Grazie

. . Mr Canon? I wanna XM3HD with 20x and native 16:9 and XLRs.

I'm still thinking it's likely to happen (maybe I'm just optimistic). The Gl3 is 3 years old now? I would think Canon would be eager to replace it, especially with so much competition from other manufacturers.

The XL-H1 release shouldn't have anything to do with a GL series HD cam because the price would be much less, so I don't think that's a reason to not release once sooner.

But just like others, I can't wait forever - if June comes around and I need a camera, I'll probably be considering a different camera.

My vote is in - come on Canon, give us a GL3HD with 20x lens, 16:9 sensors, XLRs and while you're at it, throw in 24p.

Basically a Canon GL-H1 with 24F and XLR inputs would be everything people really wanted from the Sony HDR-FX1, with the exception of non-resolution compromized 24p.

Does anyone know how much it costs to put the HD-SDI on a camera?

-Steve

Basically a Canon GL-H1 with 24F and XLR inputs would be everything people really wanted from the Sony HDR-FX1, . .
-Steve

So we shouldn't be so naive? Yes? Is that right? As SONY have their Z .. is that it? OK . . well maybe Canon could just wave a couple of digits at them! Yah never knows! Pigs might fly? Genetic engineering and all that?

Does anyone know how much it costs to put the HD-SDI on a camera?

-Steve

Do you? Do you know? Ah, go on now . . give us a clue? You knows you want to? I bet it is a humongous, filthy, disgusting, outrageous amount . . Tell you what though? . . I don't know. Mind you, I don't know how much it costs to make a camera SD.

Grazie

Does anyone know how much it costs to put the HD-SDI on a camera?
Not that much, at least when compared to the other HD upgrade costs, particularly the glass. The price is a major concern, considering they practically doubled the price between an XL2 to an H1, there's a high probability that we'll see the same course of action with the GL series.
Price could be around 5 grand, even though in IMO, it shouldn't be priced above 4 grand.

Basically a Canon GL-H1 with 24F and XLR inputs would be everything people really wanted from the Sony HDR-FX1, with the exception of non-resolution compromized 24p.

As far as the FX1 is concerned, all it's missing for my purposes is a better zoom range and maybe slightly better low-light performance. What you described would be an alternative to the Z1U at (presumably) a comparable price, which costs enough more than an FX1 to be a problem. Give me an HDV version of the GL2 in a black housing for under $3000 and that'd be fine with me. I could use one more HDV camera to complement the FX1s...

. .and yet ANOTHER "budget-end" SONY HD camcorder . .

http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/Sony-to-Announce-Lower-Priced-HDV-Camcorder-HDR-HC3.htm

Mr Canon! Please drop the other shoe. GL3/XM3 HD . . .

Tick tock . . Tick Tock . . .

Grazie

It sure is taking Canon a long time!! I'm sure it's not that big of a deal to put a GL3 HDV together! It's not going to hurt the sales of the H1 because not everone can come up with $9,000.

I saw a picture of the prototype on the web last year. Unfortunately I didn't bookmark it, maybe I posted it in news, but don't remember.

Anyway big ugly silvery looking thing (like those Panasonic prototype pictures posted in the news forum last month). Don't know how big it really was, but sort of had that impression (sound like Fry off of Futurama now :( ). I think the silver thing is just to hide the colour scheme. Slightly similar concept to the present (which is cool). So I too, imagine it aren't to far away (like upto Christmas).

My guess is a GL3 with HDV/DV 24F this spring. It would be a good move by canon if it was $3,000 or under. I think there is a big market for a camera that can do HDV and DV with native 16:9. HDV/HD is on the way but I think there is a big market for people with widescreen TVs who would like to watch anything wide. Not stretched, or letterboxed but the real thing.

The Sony A1U is ok, but kind of small in my hands. I would also like the 24P or whatever Canon is using just incase.

I don't know if anyone's noticed, but this is a line from the generic camcorder FAQ on canondv.com:
"What is required to download high definition video from my HDV Camcorder to my computer running Windows XP?"

That's right from the consumer FAQ along with MiniDV and DVD items. They're getting close...

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That's right from the consumer FAQ along with MiniDV and DVD items. They're getting close...




Yeah well, Peter, Canon DO have the very non-consumer priced XL H1. I suppose they WOULD have to respond to somebody asking that question of a $10k machine? - "I bought this machine, how do I get what I shot onto my PC?" - I bet they get asked this question ALL the time by this profile of buyer.

Nah, Peter, it's those buyers, not the consumer end. They will need ALL the help they can get.

Grazie

Someone from Canon in France told me yesterday that they have not plan for an immediate release for a GL3/XM3. Canon's strategy seem to wait in order to see what happens now there are so much low budget HDV cameras on the market. They have the hi-end one (XL-H1) and Sony has the cheapers (HC1 and HC3 soon) and the "middle ones" (FX1 & Z1). So no need for an intermediate camera for the moment if they are not able to offer some key features at a low price.
Of course I explained this guy that we need a GL camera with a 20x zoom, for wildlife fiming for instance, with a true progressive mode. He just told me "well, we'll see... maybe during the second semester"...

I would think with so many other prosumer hd cameras out there, Canon would already have a good idea of what's working for people and what isn't and therefore, would want to add their own so they don't lose sales in that area - not everyone (myself included) can pay for an XL-H1 at the moment and therefore, we're going to others for our needs.

the key phrase in what canon france said, "no plan for an immediate release" I guess you could say then they have a plan for a release, just not immediatly. That could be in a few weeks. Months. But it's not a no plan at all. You never know what a canon person will tell you. I got a e-mail once telling me that Canon wasn't going to do the HDV. Then looked what they did!

Of course, Bob, there will be a GL3 HDV camera one day. Even the Canon had admit it. But I doubt that it will issue before this fall, unfortunatly...

Of course, Bob, there will be a GL3 HDV camera one day. Even the Canon had admit it. But I doubt that it will issue before this fall, unfortunatly...

I would like to see this summer.

Could there be any benefit to Canon holding back the release of, this much sought after, product beyond them not actually having the camera ready for production? It seems that they risk losing a hell of alot of money by delaying the release.

It seems that they risk losing a hell of alot of money by delaying the release.

I'd say they're almost certainly losing some money by not having such a camera available. I've been using Canon DV cameras for several years now and would love to have an HDV GL3, but I got tired of waiting to hear Canon's plans and have two Sony FX1s instead. If the GL3 has better low-light sensitivity and similar controls I'd consider trading, but I'm not holding my breath on this.

they market seems good for something like a GL3. I can't afford the $9,000 one. The Panasonic HVX is nice, but again with a few P2 cards your at $10,000 plus.

Didn't Canon basically say the same thing abouot the XLH1? That they had no immediate plans to release an HDV camera, and then a few weeks later showed off the prototype of the H1?

With NAB coming up, I'd expect Canon to at least announce, if not have ready to ship, an HDV camera to replace the GL2. They could pull another XL2 on us all.

Of course, Bob, there will be a GL3 HDV camera one day. Even the Canon had admit it. But I doubt that it will issue before this fall, unfortunatly...
I looked at your website. What kind of camera are you using now?

With NAB coming up, I'd expect Canon to at least announce, if not have ready to ship, an HDV camera to replace the GL2. They could pull another XL2 on us all.

That wouldn't be too surprising, and would be about darn time. The Sony FX1 has been shipping for well over a year now and still has no meaningful competition at a comparable price. Unless JVC or Panasonic has something new up their sleeves, Canon is the logical company to offer an alternative. Two months and counting...

That wouldn't be too surprising, and would be about darn time. The Sony FX1 has been shipping for well over a year now and still has no meaningful competition at a comparable price. Unless JVC or Panasonic has something new up their sleeves, Canon is the logical company to offer an alternative. Two months and counting...

Kevin! Exactly!

And let's NOT forget that SONY have 2 (?) HDV cameras Sony HDR-HC1 HDV. OK CMOS and not 3 chips - but these have now been on review AND on the high street for nearly 1 year now.

Mr Canon! Sort it!

Tick . . Tock . . Tick . . Tock . . Tick


Grazie

I looked at your website. What kind of camera are you using now?

I used a Canon GL1, but since I didn't want to wait for an hypothetic HDV GL3 I got to buy a Sony FX1 last summer... But I'm ready to sell it if Canon would be kind enough to release a GL3 wih a 20x zoom...

I used a Canon GL1, but since I didn't want to wait for an hypothetic HDV GL3 I got to buy a Sony FX1 last summer... But I'm ready to sell it if Canon would be kind enough to release a GL3 wih a 20x zoom...

Mr Canon? Did you hear that? Did you?

Tick . . Tock . . Tick . . Tock . . Tick

Grazie

I used a Canon GL1, but since I didn't want to wait for an hypothetic HDV GL3 I got to buy a Sony FX1 last summer... But I'm ready to sell it if Canon would be kind enough to release a GL3 wih a 20x zoom...
Nice stuff on your website but my french isnt' to good.

If Canon released a GL3 with similar/exact specs that the HDRFX1 has, but include xlr imputs, I would be sold on it.

agreed - similar to the FX1, but hopefully with the same 20x zoom range as the Gl2.

Let's not forget, Canon needs to add their 24F to it as well! That would definately sell me on it... Of course, getting to 24f in post works too, but Canon's built in 24F would be icing on the cake.

If and new GL3 came out, and more than likely it will be HDV/DV what is your best guess on the cost? I know that a tough guess, but make one anyway. $3,000?

If and new GL3 came out, and more than likely it will be HDV/DV what is your best guess on the cost? I know that a tough guess, but make one anyway. $3,000?

I heard one rumor somewhere that the price of an HDV GL3 might be more like $4-5000, which makes sense given the pricing of the XLH1. If such a camera had XLR inputs and a 20X zoom lens it could be worth that much; if not it would be a tough sell compared to the FX1. But then images from the XLH1 look grainy in low light as is the case for other Canon video cameras, so I'm not sure I'd pay $5K for a GL3 if it has the same problem. Basically Sony has pretty much nailed what I need from an affordable HD camera and already gotten my money, along with who knows how many thousands of other videographers. At this point I'd rather wait for the FX2 than the GL3, and I'll just stick to Canon for still photography. (Love my Rebel XT.)

I wouldn't pay $5,000 either.

$5000 would have to be my top end price as well. Especially when looking at the Z1 or the HD100.

I think Canon will have to price an HDV GL at around 3K. Even at 4K it would be too close to the HD100 and Z1 and would need to have some compelling advantages. If I were to guess (something I do a lot of here in Area 51), I'd say the GL3/HDV will price at about 3-3.5K and compete with the FX1. Probably no 24F and maaaayyybee XLR inputs (love to be wrong on both counts though). Then to compete in the hot 5-6K market will come a stripped down XLH1, ie an XLH1 with no genlock, SDI, etc.. Just HDV recording and component output.

But hey, I'll probably be very happy with an Optura HDV.

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