I think this was covered in another thread, You don't need to shoot everything, don't cover every actor with a CU if you/re not going to use them all and you've got MCUs or other shot sizes. however, make sure you've got overlaps to allow choice in cutting points and the actors to ramp up their performances.

Oh well sometimes I feel I need to shoot enough coverage though. For example one of the short films I did before, every take of the master shot was slightly out of focus I noticed later. So I had to scrap the master shot completely and rely on the close ups. But if I didn't have those close ups, then I couldn't have done that.

Emotional beats? Not quite sure I understand what you mean?

I must admit I'm often confused now between genres. My favourite US TV series is NCIS, and watching it last week noticed a very unusual shot and I'mnot sure I liked it or not. Two people have a calm and serious conversation, and the camera went round in a circle around each actor - but it still did the usual cuts between them as one stopped speaking and the other started, but they blocked it so that as the person out of shot's head appeard about to block the face, they cut, then repeated it over and over again. This isn't conventional TV, but it's not really cinema either? I don't know that I liked it - I found it a bit intrusive. It made me think about technical aspects, and stop following the plot?

Oh that's interesting. Well in my experience with other filmmakers I worked with they will get a master and CUs, but if there is an emotional change in the character or situation, I feel that the shot should be changed along with that emotional change sometimes, but they never do it, which made me think I should have shot changes like that marked throughout the script, rather than allowing the same shots, to carry the entire scene if that makes sense?

I've still not understood Ryan - the shot should be changed with the emotional change? I have no idea what you mean?

I think I've just lost the plot here.

It's up to the DP/camera operator to call soft shots. On a wide shot, with shorter focal length, there can be issues like the back focus being out, however, this should be checked before the production starts shooting. If they can't spot the shot being soft, it's probably due to the monitoring not being up to the job, which is likely given the budget levels.

You don't need to cut or have a change of shot for an emotional change, the actors are capable of doing that with their performance. It all depends on the nature of the scene, there's no rule.

Oh well what I mean is, is that sometimes if the director wants to change to do a different emotional perspective, they will change the angle of the shot, if that makes sense?

Allow me to (attempt to) translate Ryanese:

I believe he means a scenario (and this is cheesy and hamfisted I know) like two women friends chatting merrily. Maybe we’re going back and forth between 2shot and medium CUs of each. One casually says something about seeing the other’s husband at a bar other night. Mood changes... other lady says wait, her husband said he was working late that night! This line gets a closer CU/maybe more dead on angle than we’ve seen before in the scene thus far. I assume THAT’s the kind of thing he means

Yes that's what I mean. The filmmakers I have worked with will not change the shot based on changes like that and still have the same CU for example run for the entire scene.

It's a bit soap opera, but you can do that, it really depends on the scene and the nature of the production. There's no rule about what you do, a wide shot be used as well, the camera can crane, everything can freeze in stillness, it depends on the dramatics of the scene. .

Oh okay. What I meant was is that it's soap opera-ish when filmmakers do not change up the shots when the emotions change and they go for those same master and CUs for the entire scene. I don't feel I can do that like they do, when it comes to my own shot choices...

Soap operas usually do change the shots because they're so on the nose.

I do it too but in my defense all I've ever done are comedies and they can be a little intentionally cheesy/cornball and it works.

Oh well soap operas do do a lot of obvious cutting but what I mean is, but I feel like they are using the same types of shots over and over, where as I like to change it up, unlike filmmakers I worked with before. Soap operas and sitcom cut on emotion but they use the same types of shots over and over, rather than more original shots based on the situation if that makes sense.

Soap operas have extremely tight shooting schedules, so they have to work fast. However, they usually have multi camera set ups and the larger budget ones have experienced camera operators, so they can do pretty complex stuff at key emotional moments. They also have actors who are generally very good and can work fast.

The Queen Vic: Best Moments | EastEnders - YouTube

Lower budget ones will have greater limitations, with less experienced directors and writers and even tighter schedules. .

The films you seem to be working on have all of that, plus shooting single camera with inexperienced cast and crews

Instinct seems to be lacking here. Am I the only one who decides things on the fly, when they happen unexpectedly. I mean the lightbulb that goes on and says - ah, pull out a bit and let that sign into the frame, or go in a bit to capture 'that look', or go up with that thoughtful expression, or drop down and look up for the evil response - all that kind of stuff. You look at the scene, you look at the monitor and change things there and then. No planning - it's just obvious. In live work you get quite good at watching the frame and predicting events, and get ready for them - and if they happen, you aren't surprised and capture them. Intuition, second sight, I don't know how, but somehow you just know. Of course sometimes it doesn't work, but that's fine.

That does happen. even on dramas. Everything is usually planned, but it tends to be a case of being covered in case we can't come up with something better on the day. Camera operators will make suggestions, which do get picked up and get added or the actors do something and it gets added.

I've worked on dramas and the coverage was being made up as we went along.

Oh okay. I did a shoot like that a couple of times, where script changes where made on a tight schedule and didn't have time to redo the storyboards, so we just made the shots up as we went along. It went okay, I felt, but I look back and feel it could have been planned better, so I always like to plan if I can of course.

I guess I don't like the multicamera set up, that I have worked with on other people's shoots before, because the cameras are all on one side of the room, pointed in a certain way towards everything, where as the single camera set up, I can put the camera wherever I want.

On soap operas and sitcoms, all the angles are very diagonal looking, which is good for some shots, but all of them are. This gives the movie a very limited feel for me, and do not want all my shots looking diagonal, if that makes sense. I'd rather just put the camera where I want for any emotional beat in the script.

Soaps are about speed, some of the old 1960s TV dramas shot with video cameras in multi camera studios have more cinematic camera work than your films.

Oh okay. Well, what was I saying was is that I find myself not being able to use the same styles as the people I have worked with, and wanted to do my own, even though, I have less experience with it, compared to working with them, if that's best. But then again, with a multicamera set up, it captures continuity better when cutting, so there is that...

You don't need to use the same style as the people you know. However, it does need to be consistent with the story your trying to tell.

I don't think I have ever copied the style of any director or movie creator. I always tend to find style you develop yourself, using established guidelines far more creative. It's the same with music. I work closely with a concert pianist - and in our separate projects we bounce the completed thing off each other, and this morning he mentioned one of my pieces that is doing quite well and he said, after that diminished chord, why did you pick the second inversion of G Major and not just move the B down to Bb? I had to really think - and then said I dod it because I liked the effect. He said I'd never have even tried that, but it works doesn't it? If you do something and it works - it's good.

I really cannot imagine studying a moviemaker's output and trying to copy shots - surely each one is chosen because it's right in that context? Change the context and the shot might fail?

Oh well I just meant it was said before to learn from other directors on sets, but when I am on set, I tend to go very different than they do so far, is just what I was saying.

Directors do things in different ways, you keep looking for rules, when there's only a basic grammar which you can take and run with.

Some people have the idea, then the courage, to go in different directions. They trust their own judgement, they know things will work. The team under them respect their judgement.If, at the end of the day, the thing fails badly - the lower levels of the pyramid are unaffected - the person at the top could be, or could ride it.

It's down to that person's ability and stature.

Sadly - irrelevant now really, as we're losing so many of our industry currently with everyone out of work, and the immediate future not good.

Perhaps now is a good time to NOT going into this business.

Yeah it seems the rental stores for equipment are closing lately, but others say I should make a bigger project now and be proud of it and finish it, before the situation gets worse. Do you think they have a point, that it will just get worse later, so I should do it now?

It really depends, if it was a short it mightn't be an issue, however, if you're shooting over a period of a month, things can change very quick;y. If you find yourself in a hot spot everything can go into shut down.

If you're ready to shoot next week it might be worth having a go, but, if not, the bell curve will come rolling in. Feature films need outside services, so shooting when people are fighting over toilet rolls may not assist you on the resources front Given how poor the advice of some of the people you know actually is, it should be treated with caution

The other thing to consider is if you film is going to appeal in the post COVID-19 market place.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/coronavirus-covid-19-canada-world-march19-1.5502505

"Saskatchewan also declared a state of emergency to tackle COVID-19, and the province's top public health official is urging people to take social distancing seriously. The province announced four new cases Thursday. It banned public gatherings of more than 50 people, said restaurants and bars need to keep half their seats empty, and said businesses that are allowed to remain open — including grocery stores, pharmacies and gas stations — must have processes that maintain "one-to-two-metre" separation. Read more about what's happening in Saskatchewan. "

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatoon/covid-19-sask-1.5502735

One thing springs to mind - now is the time to get decent professionals to make your movie, bceause they have no work, so if you dangle modest money, they will bite ON YOUR TERMS - so you can ask for specific guaranteed dates, the rental stores will let you have kit cheap and for you, it's an ideal time. People need to feed their families. If you have the budget set aside - they'll love to work for you.

Problem will be the scale and available timescale for you to organise it all.

He will, of course have to block his shots so that no one will ever be closer than 10 feet to anyone else, no one can ever touch anything anyone else touches, and every scene will have 20 seconds of hand washing for each character

That's fine - Ryan is always a long way away so he can use his zoom lens.

That's fine - Ryan is always a long way away so he can use his zoom lens.
lol.

I think Ryan will need to replan the entire movie for social distancing

perhaps instead of a serial killer its someone who psychologically tortures people to death via Skype

If he was in Italy he could do a Rear Window version of that.

that’s another great idea...perhaps all the characters can yell at each other from opposing balconies.

I’m surprised he hasn’t asked what telephoto lens they used in Rear Window.

I was recently watching MST3K Manos: The Hands of Fate. That movie was made by fertilizer salesman to win a bet he couldn’t film a feature. Made me think of Ryan.

Heard of if, never seen it.

Heard of if, never seen it.
Only watch the mst3k version and its so bad i couldn’t watch without skimming through it.

I just saw this it’s hilarious and more to the point. Script Cops

https://www.google.com/search?q=script%20cops&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1-m

Im getting a privacy settings error

Im getting a privacy settings error
it doesn’t allow embedding but you can google script cops

I’m surprised he hasn’t asked what telephoto lens they used in Rear Window.

LOL That's easy to find: https://www.lookbackandhanker.com/rear-window-camera-and-lens.html

Ironically the director is the only one who doesn’t look impressed.

Follow up question. Can you use it with BMPCC camera? :p

If you've got the right mounts ;-)

That Vimeo clip was brilliant - loved it.


Especially that huge warehouse full of scripts at the end.

One thing springs to mind - now is the time to get decent professionals to make your movie, bceause they have no work, so if you dangle modest money, they will bite ON YOUR TERMS - so you can ask for specific guaranteed dates, the rental stores will let you have kit cheap and for you, it's an ideal time. People need to feed their families. If you have the budget set aside - they'll love to work for you.

Problem will be the scale and available timescale for you to organise it all.

Yeah I guess so, but all equipment rental stores are now closed too, so I will have to get the equipment from somewhere else then.

Professionals may have their own kit, what type will depend on the requirements of the local market. However, if they will expect you to working in a professional manner.

Failing that, you can start on another script and/or check out the online film courses with high end professionals that are either free or offering deals over the next 3 months.

You're going to have to wait for the virus to go away before you do anything. Look at current broadcast. Peoploe trying to interview at a distance, and reporters suddenly discovering their audio skills can't capture distant audio properly, and everyone standing apart. I'd have thought there's no chance of getting this together for a while, because collecting people together is seen by others as irresponsible. I've seen a couple of worthy events designed for corona isolation people at home fall over because people won't take part.

Yes, mic booms have come into fashion for TV news reporters.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-51943591

It's also a great training aid in how not to do it when the reporters wave the 414 vaguely in the direction of the interviewee's mouth and miss. One in a factory the other day on the news in the morning managed to miss the mouth and capture the shredding machine in the background.

Well can't they boom by using a really long pole but getting in real close above the frame of the camera?

No Ryan, they can't. It's difficult for a trained boom op, but these people are journalists, not technicians. Could you hold a boom above your head, and read your notes, and deliver your questions?

Oh I meant when they bring a boom op with them, like you see some journalists have when the press is trying to question someone on the street. Yes, if they don't have a boom op, then they cannot.

Nor does it matter if the mic is in shot, since the wind shield has a station ID. They also want to be able to ask questions with the same microphone, which is easier in the lower position.

There is no boom operator or sound recordist these days on news, possibly, they might be shooting the news item by themselves using a locked off camera on a tripod. Alternately, they will be working with a one person crew, who operates the camera and sound.

Oh okay. I've applied to news stations as a boom op before, but I guess if they want one person to do everything...