Good thing they weren't in a rush, eh?

Meet Vimeo Live: professional live streaming for events (https://vimeo.com/blog/post/vimeo-live-is-here-professional-live-streaming)

It’s a beautiful thing to live in the moment. And now, it’s seriously beautiful: the launch of Vimeo Live means that you can now get professional live streaming for all your events. We’re thrilled to reveal live streaming because this request came straight from our community, and it’s designed to help creators tell their stories in pristine quality. So whether you put on lectures or concerts, car races or conferences, Vimeo Live has the tools you need to deliver the best live stream to your audience.

Looks like they are pinning it as an uber-premium service, and is priced accordingly.

Andrew

They also bought out Livestream Andrew!!! Yeah their hosting is very pricey ..something like $75 a month with restricted hours too!!

https://techcrunch.com/2017/09/26/vimeo-acquires-livestream-launches-its-own-live-video-product/

I can't possibly think as to why I would be paying that sort of money to be live streaming through Vimeo. I'm already a bit over them as it is.

Andrew

Yeah I really cannot see the point ...$100 a month and you are restricted to 5 hours a month ..are they crazy?? Two local footy games would eat up your "quota" so to get unlimited streams you need their business package at $380 a month .... even crazier!! MY LS account is $499 a YEAR and I share it with a mate on the Gold Coast ... we get unlimited views and unlimited streams for $22 a month each.

Don't know much about it, but I think Livestream has catered to a different kind of market in the past. My daughter works for a large advertising agency and they have used them for years and have been happy.

I do think they have some things in common. Livestream and Vimeo focus more on creative art events rather than the podcaster/self caster type shows you see on YouTube.

Livestream moved away from that as they went from Mogulus to Livestream (old) to the New Livestream (which had set some serious limits on free use). Basically they both discourage casual use "small operator." They both don't use free ad based revenue models. Livestream's studio in Brooklyn has a great live event space (I live near there) which probably was under utilized.

I think Livestream was hoping for some upscale corporate use but, unless one deliberately wanted some restricted viewership, Youtube provides much better reach if it's a public event. That the upscale corporate didn't really materialize may have made Livestream an attractive purchase for Vimeo.

I know Livestream was hopping to attract an arts community as a client base. This is something Vimeo has.

I suspect the client base they looking for will be performance oriented such as live music and maybe even drama.

Given that YouTube and Facebook operate so well in the 'free' domain, other players have no choice but to find other niche markets that will pay.

Andrew

Livestream currently has 3 FaceBook Groups and after I posted my dis-satisfaction with feeble excuses about new pricing the support staff have gone to ground which is a sure sign they are gunning for the smaller professional operator with the hope they will be happy with the 600% increase in plans!

As I put in my post "complete silence from support staff seems to indicate they don't want to talk about it any more" ....Previously they were quite happy to put up posts saying everything would stay the same but when challenged they quickly kept quiet!!


For those of you stream who uses what service and why?? Will be interesting to know!!

Sounds like their marching orders have been updated now that the new management have taken over.

Their lack of responsiveness is very telling indeed. So glad it's not my problem.

Andrew

They actually came back eventually and said things will stay the same ..this is from the ex CEO of Livestream who seems to have been re-assigned as General Manager of Live Streaming so the real CEO of the company will have the final say! If it remains as it is then good but I cannot see anyone using the Vimeo live at their current prices

Are you still streaming to YouTube Live Andrew?? Any issues or hassles with them??

YouTube Live works well. I do notice that (when monitoring the stream from the YouTube site) that there is a bit of motion jumping when at sub-1080 resolutions (480p for example) ... almost like a frame rate conversion in PPro without selecting the "blended frames" option.

But I'm not concerned with it because it's only more noticeable with sports action content and it's a YouTube thing. What I send to YouTube is a good quality stream and that's all that matters. (YouTube's processing of what they receive is not my issue as I can't do anything about it.)

Andrew

Just for interest, if I upload a wedding ceremony that has copyright music they send me an email and then put an ad on the video.

If you are using You Tube Live do they physically stop the stream if they detect any music or do they do much the same as an uploaded video clip?

I should not admit this. But I watched a live Boxing fight on Live Facebook with someone pointing their camera at the TV. I came across it and many others transmitting the same fight in the Facebook Livestream map.

I'd settle for a multi-video player from Vimeo..... SMH No idea why they did away with it.

Multi-video?

Andrew

Sorry for my limited description. Too much post work today. Brain fried. Vimeo, according to Vimeo, doesn't provide any player that will play multiple videos in one player. Not sure why other than my suspicion that Vimeo is limiting their bandwidth to reduce the load on their servers. But that's just me being a glass half empty guy.

One video at a time tends to work well.

Andrew

We upgraded (downgraded?) our Vimeo Business account to Vimeo Live (turns out we didn't need the Business limits). The reason we went with Vimeo for Live is because our apps for Roku (100,000 subscribers) and Apple TV are both already powered by the Vimeo API. It's more efficient to use Vimeo to stream to our site, then it's immediately available to all our viewers on our branded platforms as well. We plan to incorporate Vimeo Live into our TV apps as well, once they make the API available (which they say is coming.)

We simulcast the stream to both Vimeo Live and YouTube Live. (Screw FB and their TOS.)

I do agree, the Live hours they allocated aren't enough for the money, though for our current-use they are fine. We picked it up specifically for a half-hour talk show format that won't come near the 5 hours they provide.

I used Vimeo for a stream last week via Wirecast. It was really user friendly and strightforward. A little light on the features but it did everything I needed it to do.

Is Vimeo Live going to give the same ambient music rubbish that FB and YT are giving Nate??

FWIW: Our quality control viewer watched both the YouTube and Vimeo streams from within our office and it turns out they both had the same 5-second delay from action to viewing. (Pretty darn good, imho.)

Just for interest, if I upload a wedding ceremony that has copyright music they send me an email and then put an ad on the video.

If you are using You Tube Live do they physically stop the stream if they detect any music or do they do much the same as an uploaded video clip?

Youtube re-encodes as you stream. You'll be instantly hit with a strike and your stream will be geographically restricted instantly. Just don't do it, it's not worth risking your account.

I'd checked out Vimeo Live on their site once or twice & am a vimeo member/user of regular hosting. Anyway just got an email from them asking to fill out a survey, I suppose via tracking.

Seems their intentions (reading between the lines) is to ask why ppl maybe aren't signing up for it. I answered as honestly as I could, that it was price, and basically price only. $75/mo is far to much for prosumer users who aren't streaming corporate events imho. Or people looking to test it out and grow with it (weddings, sports etc).

Just figured I'd pass this along if any of you wanna check if you got an email from them & submit a survey expressing your thoughts.

Hi David

We are with Livestream and they have supposedly been bought by Vimeo but we have had nothing at all from either about surveys or the take-over ... I wonder if they are backpedalling now as their initial costings were very expensive and limited compared to what we pay on Livestream ?

Very quick Google came up with this. Vimeo acquires Livestream. https://techcrunch.com/2017/09/26/vimeo-acquires-livestream-launches-its-own-live-video-product/

Thanks Chris, yeah I read in this thread the bought out or merged with Livestream a while back, but didn't notice they increased the rates significantly. Wow. In fairness, it could be something like Livestream had a great business model & brand recognition, but wasn't yet profitable. (No idea, just throwing it out there). I recall hearing Youtube was losing something like a million dollars a day when Google still chose to buy them years ago. Just the potential & brand name.

My guess is they do some tracking & probably send an email campagin out months ago, to which I clicked on it, viewed the site & package info, then never signed up. They're likely just sending a followup survey to people who did just that, inquiring why they clicked on it (showed interest), but didn't sign up or even check out the demo.

Being that you're a member you likely won't receive the survey, I would think. Just curious though, do you use it primarily for weddings. I recall you writing in the weddings thread being in Australia you have alot of B&G's from off the island whose families cannot travel to attend, so you have a bigger market for livestreaming, right? How's it work out, pretty seemless or is it alot more to worry about with wifi, internet connections, streaming issues etc.

Hey David

Yeah, after the initial announcement there was a comment from the Live Stream CEO that very little would change and we were safe to continue as normal. I was just surprised at the huge costs offered by Vimeo ...one would have thought they would have been on par with Livestream ...almost double plus severe hour restrictions seemed very impractical ... We currently pay $499 per year with Livestream and that gives us unlimted viewers and unlimited storage.

Yep, we mainly do wedding ceremonies for both local and overseas couples but also funeral streams too! So far we have done around 85 streams with no real issues at all. I'd love a decent upload on our 4G network so we could offer a really high quality stream but for now it's a mere 720P at around 2 - 3 mbps but clients are happy and they also get a copy on USB as we also record the event to SD card. Where we are 4G is the only real option sadly as most places only have ADSL2 so your upload if you are lucky is maybe 1mbps at best!!

We are actually running a funeral right now on 4G live https://livestream.com/videohouse/events/7980296

One big benefit of Vimeo live streaming vs. Livestream.com is that Vimeo lets you use Wirecast (or any other encoder, via integration or RTMP) on any plan. This is huge if you want to broadcast on Macs. Livestream.com only allows you to use 3rd party encoders with their most expensive option.

I would like Vimeo to have a player that stays 'open' -- doesn't transcode the footage then revert to being a player only, closing off the stream. That's the biggest downside (outside of encoder options) compared to Livestream.com.

Can't you use DaCast with Wirecast? Seems a cheaper method. Also, is Youtube Live a potential avenue for this, or is it too consumer level?


Thanks for the info, I'm looking into livestreaming & actually have the demo version (30day trial) of Wirecast.

Just for interest if you have a Livestream.com account (the cheapest is $499 a year) you also get a full version of Livestream Studio unrestricted which also allows you to stream to your event page as well as Facebook or YT at the same time.

Yes you DO need a dedicated encoder if you dont want to stream from your computer but we find by hooking up the Teradek to your laptop as a 2nd monitor you can let it do all the hard work!

However what we really do like about Livestream (apart from no limits in storage or views) is the fact that each event has it's own event page and you can create it with details and images even a year before the event and send people the link .. AFAIK no other CDN has the event page feature so for us it presents very well to the client!!

Livestream Studio is PC only. So it doesn't do any good for Mac owners.

However what we really do like about Livestream (apart from no limits in storage or views) is the fact that each event has it's own event page and you can create it with details and images even a year before the event and send people the link .. AFAIK no other CDN has the event page feature so for us it presents very well to the client!!

Agreed. That is a huge feature..

Sorry Ryan

I had no idea that their software would not run on a MAC .. that's a little shortsighted from the software developers ... What is a little amusing is their new product the MEVO camera was only available to run on iPhones or iPads and much later after much crying they offered an Android app but the majority of users use Apple products still. Makes you wonder why Livestream Studio was never made for a MAC???

Mac users only get the Producer software. Which means I can at least feed in cuts off our ATEM... it's basically the same as the app they provide to iPad. I agree, very short-sighted, especially since they don't allow me to use Wirecast.

I see OBS do a Mac version of their switching software and it's free! The interface isn't quite as innovative as LS Studio but it does work well and amazingly has the best chroma keyer I have ever used! It can actually stream anywhere but still needs the producer app on the computer to be able to stream to Livestream! Have you ever used it Ryan??

I see OBS do a Mac version of their switching software and it's free! The interface isn't quite as innovative as LS Studio but it does work well and amazingly has the best chroma keyer I have ever used! It can actually stream anywhere but still needs the producer app on the computer to be able to stream to Livestream! Have you ever used it Ryan??

Never used it. I've had a Wirecast license since 2009. Currently using Wirecast Pro 8. To use it with Livestream.com you need their Enterprise package (about $8000 per year). They don't allow any 3rd party encoders on smaller subscriptions.

I just signed up for DaCast for streams where Vimeo Live won't fit. (If I need a perpetual stream address or a channel playout.) So far it's looking good -- but I've only done limited testing and haven't yet done a real event with it. Very similar to a platform called Scale Engine I used to use (they're great, and cheap, but are better for developers since they have only a very basic web interface.)

Wirecast (including Wirecast on Mac) now supports Livestream directly.
Livestream stopped being restrictive. Granted one may have to be an Enterprise customer.

And Wirecast supports Vimeo too of course.

“Stopped being restrictive”
“Requires ($8000/yr) Enterprise Plan”

I thought I covered that exception pretty thoroughly in the previous posts. It’s the plan restriction that makes Livestream.com a hard choice to make for Mac users (unless they have a LOT of clients to justify the expense.)

I just signed up for DaCast for $2k a year with full Wirecast support and many of the same features as the Enterprise version of Livestream. Even if I blow the DaCast data cap — that $6k price difference buys a fair amount of data. Between that and Vimeo Live I’ll probably be set for 2018.

You would have to have a massive viewing audience (and paying one) to justify $8000 a year Ryan! As far as business overheads go we like to keep them as low as we can especially as our audiences can vary from anything for 15000 right down to a tiny 10 -15 views when it comes to weddings and funerals. For us $8000 simply wouldn't be viable.

Sounds like you have the right plan with DaCast .. but sadly they seem to charge on viewers and again don't have the very convenient "event pages"

Resurrecting this thread since a lot has changed since 2017.

Vimeo now offers an unlimited Premium package for $900/year with restream options to the majors, it allows for keeping a “recurring” stream (doesn’t end when done) and you can have up to three live streams coming the platform simultaneously at that level.

Also, the livestream studio software is now available on Mac and PC.

I’ve been using Dacast with Wirecast Pro but am considering upgrading my business Vimeo account to the new Premium level. One of my Vimeo accounts has the basic Live still (only 10 hours a month of streaming) though I haven’t used the live portion since early 2018. This past week I’ve given it a test and it seems to work pretty good. Much more reliable than when they launched it.

What is everyone else using these days? Anyone else do big events with Vimeo Live lately?

I only did a small event & used Dacast since all the others required annual fees/monthly billing. I think their minimum buy was only $200 or $250 & the TB lasts for a year, so I can do another with whats leftover if needed.

$900/year seems like a good rate, offhand do you know the restrictions on bandwidth or streaming hours?

I called Livestream about it last year, they were too big, but they do have 'resellers' who seem authorized & they recommended. TBH tho even they seemed to want pretty locked in rates & usage, not a one-off. Just seemed like marketing guys trying to make a buck. Essentially, they buy the minimum, the sell the minutes or whatever here & there to other people.

I went ahead and jumped in with an annual Premium account on Vimeo. I already use Vimeo for client reviews and archives, as well as a second account to power one of our TV apps. So, consolidating and gettin more features made sense.

Here's what I found out since signing up last week:

- For $900 a year you get three upstreams and UNLIMITED streaming (unlimited viewers, unlimited bandwidth.) The only restriction is you are capped at a MAXIMUM stream time of 12 hours per day.

- It includes decent syndication tools, allowing to distribute the same stream to Facebook, YouTube (not at the same time as FB), Twitch, Periscope and any other RTMP destination.

- You can use the Livestream Stream Studio Application for both Mac or PC. A license is included at the Vimeo Premium tier. I've played with it a bunch this week (I also have a Wirecast Pro account.) And though it is VERY different from Wirecast, being more like a tradition broadcast workflow, it is excellent for the 5 broadcasts I've done with it. Current version on mac is more efficient than Wirecast in CPU use for similar layouts and camera feeds. I was also able to map hotkeys through my Stream Deck making single user operation pretty easy. Its also very configurable in terms of SDI In/Out and recorder configs. Has social widgets for all majors built-in too. Of course, Vimeo will also work with Wirecast, OBS, etc.

- Livestream.com is now officially Vimeo. You can no longer buy a Livestream.com account even if you wanted to. Also, the more minimal Vimeo Pro Live account on Vimeo is also no longer available to buy. There are only two live stream options from the new Vimeo Livestream and thats Premium (which is that $900 option) and Enterprise. Enterprise is a "call us and well tell you the price" level. But it also includes caching appliances, micro sites and other things that are truly specific to Enterprise clients.

- I love that I can embed a chat widget along with the video player on whatever site I want. Also, they now have both single use players, as well as reusable ones.

Ryan

does anyone else have experience with Vimeo streaming? and for the price point what are the alternatives? looking for a service for embeds on a web site.

I looked into alot of this earlier this year and would just point out, almost all streaming providers are 'Monthly' recurring billing' for 12 months (ie. $99/month for 1 year)

Except Dacast. They offered an 'Event' option where you only pay for TB at a reasonable rate (I tried doing the math, its complicated but might've come out to $.07/hour per person). Anyway, the minimum buy was $200 or $250, far more than I needed or used but it was reasonable. Sales was great & helpful to speak with, and chat support sufficient. Plus you can practice beforehand for little bandwidth cost. Just enter your server into Wirecast or OBS or whatever, and they do offer embed code <script> tag & <iframe> plus FB share code and you can upload a thumbnail for the standby screen.

Anyway, it was great. If you have any questions feel free to ask or pm me.