maybe thats the color science? original dvx was known for over the top reds, right? so maybe...

Almost every image parameter is user adjustable. Reds too strong then dial them down.

More 4K footage. Recorded on a DVX200 with Atomos Shogun.

https://youtu.be/aU7WyzZXDu0

Thanks Andy! Do you recall what profile you were shooting in? Have you tried V-log? Interested in seeing V-log original footage.

Jeff, not my footage...

I can never tell watching stuff on Youtube if it's not great because it's the camera or my cheap laptop... How did that look for everyone else?

OK, sure it's not going to compete with a C300 MkII regarding superb image quality...and it's still not a finalised camera used with optimal, fine tuned set-up etc.... and of course YouTube compression issues aside...but it certainly looks very promising to me. I think it will suit my shooting style perfectly/may suppass my Sony PMW-300 as the main go to camera for fast paced work.

Biggest dilemma I have is this:

Do I buy a "cheap" Sony X70, a "cheapish" JVC LS-300, especially after the JVC Log news this week that might help highlight handling (this is to be confirmed)... or (more likely) the Panasonic DVX200 to test the water with my clients regarding shooting 4K, reframing flexibility etc. (I expect it will still be 1-2-3 years before I ever deliver in 4K). DVX200 could certainly be "good enough" for me to make money.

Or do I just "be done with it" and buy a C300 MkII (I also have a C100 and lots of Canon glass).

I can easily afford any one of them - in fact all of them as so much work is coming in right now - but what I am agonising over is which one makes business sense at this point in time.

Of course, I could just sit and wait for the perfect 4K cam to appear. But that's no fun - and will never happen anyway!

I would seriously wait until IBC next month. You can be certain there will be some new options for you to consider from there too.

I'm in a "holding pattern" myself. I'm ready for the Sony A7sII and maybe a "pro" version of the Sony NX100.

Let's see what else comes out.

Since the DVX200 won't be available for about 2 months at best, I'd wait and see if anything else gets announced in that period, especially with IBC before any DVX200s are in the shops. I'm not sure why Panasonic announce new product so long before it's available to actually buy, that must be of benefit to their competitors in terms of planning to compete, surely? Most other companies seem to announce a couple of months at most before actual availability.

[EDIT - I see Cliff is thinking along similar lines! Realistically, it's plausible to imagine something with the back end of the Z100 (and hence XAVC), with the front end derived from the tech of the latest RX10/100. The optics of the RX10 would be pretty good - just needs more video friendly power zoom etc.

Although the words "digital zoom" normally fill me with horror, then it could work very well for such a camera. Although the optical zoom is only just over 8x, then because the 20Mp is so heavily super-sampled for 4K, a digital zoom extension mode could conceivably work very well to give an effective doubling and more with no quality loss. In other words, to an operator it could theoretically seem like a 20x zoom with no quality drop at the tight end.]

Yep, all good advice. The way Sony are spitting out new cams we might have a X100 and FS70 to consider by then!

If you want 50/60P UHD then you choice is more limited and I do not think the C300 has these higher frame rates. FS7 or see what else comes out other than the DVX200 for larger than 1/3" sensors of the HC-X1000, FDR-AX1 and the PXW-Z100

Ron Evans

Yep, all good advice. The way Sony are spitting out new cams we might have a X100 and FS70 to consider by then!

Here's hoping their global shutter tech Pregius makes it into their new XDCAM 1'' lineup cameras. There's supposed to be a 1'' sensor at the end of the year that can do 4K 30p, the IMX255. Current figures show a single sensor can have 70DB SNR. (Still needs 60p)

Pricing now added at B&H - it's about what was predicted, maybe not as low as hoped.

i think the disappointed folks re: price were too unrealistic to begin with...when has something this fully featured ever been that low ($3500) when introduced? and please no more about the color space or i will commit bodily harm to myself.

Gotta love that someone already posted a review on B&H without having the camera!

those damn time travelers are at it again...

Just got the marketing bulletin......the sell price is going to be $4195.00!.....about where I thought it might land....so give us a ring if you'd like to pre-order....
http://www.evsonline.com/panasonic-ag-dvx200-4k-handheld-camcorder-with-four-thirds-sensor-and-integrated-zoom-lens.html



Jim Martin
EVSonline.com

I think it'll sell like hot cakes over your side of the pond, especially at that price.

Ouch!! Anything that is $4195 in the USA will automatically be close to $6K down here by the time they have fiddled with exchange rates and sales tax ! I assume is will be just as expensive in the UK ??

At the moment most of the good pro video dealers here (CVP, H Preston etc.) still have it listed at the pre-order price they initially posted after NAB.

It's currently at (or very close to) £3,416 plus VAT (at 20% UK rate) which is £4,100 with that tax. My business will just claim back the VAT.

Hopefully, this will now drop a bit over the next few days in view of Panasonic's pricing update :-)

Caught this footage today, looks a bit better than previous clips that I have seen online.
First Look: Test Footage - Panasonic AG-DVX200 on Vimeo

Anybody know what the pixel count is on this sensor?

Is it a photography or video sensor? Is it the same one as the GH4?

If the image comes from more than 8 megapixels, is it a 1:1 readout or is it over sampled from a higher count. Does it line skip or use Sony's "every pixel" scaling engine?

I think that some of your questions were answered in previous posts in this thread

Anybody know what the pixel count is on this sensor?

Is it a photography or video sensor? Is it the same one as the GH4?

If the image comes from more than 8 megapixels, is it a 1:1 readout or is it over sampled from a higher count. Does it line skip or use Sony's "every pixel" scaling engine?

I think I have read the following to your questions:

1. It is real video-sensor with same technology as the GH4-sensor.
2. It has a different format than the GH4-sensor. DVX200 sensor is 17.8mm x 10mm (16 : 9 format), GH4-sensor is 17.3mm x 13 (4:3 format).
3. The DVX200-sensor has 17.2 Megapixel (total) with 16.05 Megapixel effective.
I do not know an answer to your last question.

Joachim

Thank goodness for a native 16:9 sensor, however I'd never leave the aperture wide open on the wide end of the zoom, since it gives really nasty "orbing" that looks nothing like a prime or a 24-70.

V-Log Test https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i181MgfdTOU&feature=youtu.be

Some wedding footage After wedding Raisa & Traian powered by AutoK9 - YouTube

I think I have read the following to your questions:

1. It is real video-sensor with same technology as the GH4-sensor.
2. It has a different format than the GH4-sensor. DVX200 sensor is 17.8mm x 10mm (16 : 9 format), GH4-sensor is 17.3mm x 13 (4:3 format).
3. The DVX200-sensor has 17.2 Megapixel (total) with 16.05 Megapixel effective.
I do not know an answer to your last question.

Joachim

17.2 million pixels in a 16x9?

So they are doing roughly a 2:1 over sample and scaledown?

Hmmm...could this be the first time Panasonic over samples like this? We know Sony does this very well but hasn't Panny has typically done mostly 1:1 readout out until this point for 4k?

If this is a video only camcorder, I wonder why they felt they needed to have the pixel count this high.

17.2 million pixels in a 16x9?

So they are doing roughly a 2:1 over sample and scaledown?

Hmmm...could this be the first time Panasonic over samples like this? We know Sony does this very well but hasn't Panny has typically done mostly 1:1 readout out until this point for 4k?

If this is a video only camcorder, I wonder why they felt they needed to have the pixel count this high.

Just like Sony they can zoom like "Clear Image zoom" and have pixels free for image stabilization. At least that is two reasons.

Decent color grade of footage
Panasonic AG-DVX200 on Vimeo

An action scene shot with the DVX200
Scene Shot on a pre release Panasonic DVX200 on Vimeo

Panasonic DVX200 4K - #DVX4Ktour on Vimeo

17.2 million pixels in a 16x9?

If this is a video only camcorder, I wonder why they felt they needed to have the pixel count this high.

The tentative spec from Juli says 17.2 Mio pixel with 16.05 Mio effective. In a video from Panasonic's Michael Bergeron at Las Vegas NAB he mentioned the size of the sensor is the same as the one in AF100 series, which is 17.8 x 10 mm. This gives a pixel size of 3.2 x 3.2 micrometer.

In other Panasonic documents I found various crop factors for the different record modes.
Full HD: crop factor 2.1875, which gives minimum F of 28mm (transformed to 35mm film).
4K/24: crop factor 2.305, which gives minimum F of 29.5mm.
UHD/30: crop factor 2.39, which gives minimum F 30.6mm.
UHD/60: crop factor 2.929, which gives minimum F 37.2mm.

With these values I have calculated the actually used sensor size for each record mode, based on a pixel size of 3.2 micrometer:
Full HD: used sensor size 16.45x9.25mm, 5140x2890 pixel.
4K/24: used sensor size 15.62x8.23mm, 4881x2572 pixel.
UHD/30: used sensor size 15.05x8.47mm, 4705x2647 pixel.
UHD/60: used sensor size 12.29x6.91mm, 3840x2160 pixel.

These values are calculated based on various information available from Panasonic. They may not be exactly right, however deviations will be marginal. It is only a few weeks now, until we will have clarification, when first DVX200 will be delivered.

Joachim

So that's how they achieve 60p... That's very primitive to have a high pixel density then implementing crop factor using a 1:1 pixel readout in 60p mode, defeats the purpose of a MFT sensor.

I'll skip then. The FS7 reads the full sensor in 60p and if this has such a bad crop factor in 60p (which is what I'm using it for) this is too bleeding edge.

So that's how they achieve 60p... That's very primitive to have a high pixel density then implementing crop factor using a 1:1 pixel readout in 60p mode, defeats the purpose of a MFT sensor.
Well.... you get (nearly) the full sensor area in most modes - it's just QFHD 60p with the severe cropping and loss of wide angle ability.

Technically, I think it's wrong to call it "primitive" - it's a step up from previous large sensor designs around the price point (quite a big step up). At least it seems to be fully deBayering what it's reading before rescaling to output resolution. Fundamentally, it shows the limit of read speed off the sensor. Read at 60 frames a second and it can't read the whole sensor each frame - so has to crop significantly.

But at least it's likely to still deBayer/scale properly, so in this mode I wouldn't expect the quality to change appreciably - the performance hit is limited to losing the wide angle for QFHD 60p.

Losing the wide angle matters to me trying to avoid using extra lens attachments when 1080p can get 28mm equivalent without any modifications.

If the difference in crop factor is too great, I'm not a fan.

I shot two features that were theatrically projected, first one with the DVX100 and the second with the HVX200A. Always loved the "panny mojo", the short fall of internal 10bit on the DVX200 takes away from the potential of this camera. It does state that the specs are preliminary on their PDF's, hopefully the final product is different from what's currently being represented online. Nothing really extraordinary so far.

With the the current and upcoming camera offerings, the DVX200 needs to kick it up a few notches.

Panasonic DVX 200 Internal Codec Tests on Vimeo

For that video, make sure you are signed into Vimeo to download the original file to truly evaluate it. The web version is only 720p.

Through some video compression, I'm seeing a TON of dark noise and fixed pattern dark noise for that matter (unless that was H264 playing tricks). This will not be a good low-light camera, I remember historically the HVX200 being quite noisy as well so 1st gen cameras tend to suffer this effect. Any Odyssey captured footage that can delve into this dark noise matter further?

hopefully the final product is different from what's currently being represented online.

It won't be different.

For that video, make sure you are signed into Vimeo to download the original file to truly evaluate it. The web version is only 720p.

Through some video compression, I'm seeing a TON of dark noise and fixed pattern dark noise for that matter (unless that was H264 playing tricks). This will not be a good low-light camera

You're absolutely correct. The section starting at 1:33 on the steel girders looks terrible! Even the leaves on the trees at 1:59 look noisy and soft. At 2:33, in diffused bright daylight, the traffic light pole is very noisy.
I'd hate to see what this camera would do when shooting a theater or wedding event or ENG in low light.

I noticed things in the video that I did not like, I downloaded the original and when I looked at the bitrate stats in VLC for the file I saw that it was encoded using a VERY low bitrate. I don't know why someone would bother to do all that testing then upload a low bitrate file that makes it difficult to determine what the actual quality of the picture is.

I don't know why someone would bother to do all that testing then upload a low bitrate file that makes it difficult to determine what the actual quality of the picture is.

I typically upload projects to Vimeo in ProRes LT. I feel weird about uploading a H.264 that Vimeo will re-encode to H.264.

Yeah, this sample was H264 at 20mbps in full Cinema 4K at CBR. The fixed pattern noise was probably the compression playing tricks.

What's your judgement about the colors in this video. It was filmed with a GH4 and a DVX200 on October 15th. Can you tell the difference between the two cameras?

Woodstock and Coudland Road in the Fall on Vimeo