ENG , sports events etc, don't have the time to deal with RAW, these productions commonly have fast turnarounds, a lot of the time there's no grading unless there's a problem (unless for a promo or sting). It's the cameraperson's job to get it right in the camera.

I'd shoot ProRes. You can toss a LUT on but don't forget Blackmagic Cameras can shoot Rec 709 rather than flat. 4.6k would have good value for sports as it would give you a big window on a 1080 timeline to cut to a close up on a play you couldn't get close to on time. Then there's the slow mo at 120fps I believe.

I'd shoot ProRes. You can toss a LUT on but don't forget Blackmagic Cameras can shoot Rec 709 rather than flat. 4.6k would have good value for sports as it would give you a big window on a 1080 timeline to cut to a close up on a play you couldn't get close to on time. Then there's the slow mo at 120fps I believe.

I suspect that a lot of the people who insist on shooting in RAW don't realize that you get access to the same dynamic range when you're capturing in ProRes that you do when capturing in RAW, since the capture mode doesn't change the sensor or the front-end image processing.

I wonder if adding LUT support is in the card for the Mini. It would be nice to be able to craft a look on set, Alexa-style, and deliver footage that's closer to edit ready than film LOG or rely on rec 709.

BMD site still says "Shipping in July" for all four versions, but the B&H site has been updated with "Expected availability: Mid September 2015"
From what some of you were saying, this was to be expected.

Mark

Blackmagic not shipping on time?!?!?

My heart... Can't take...

Oh wait, yeah BlackMagic. I'm going to say January.

So... You're an optimist ;)

Laughing... :)

I find there's no point in being anything but an optimist in life... except when it comes to camera shipping dates - then I add 0.5 - 1.5 years. Keeps me from being dissapoint!

True. The important thing is to not let a camera delay stop you from making movies. The truth is that anyone who can't make a great film using a BMCC simple can't make a great film, probably because they're too lazy to learn how.

That's the truth... The two most important lessons from the entire history of DVinfo...

1) The best camera is the one that feels good in your hands and you have with you.

2) The best camera to buy for your film is the one that you can buy today.

That's the truth... The two most important lessons from the entire history of DVinfo...

1) The best camera is the one that feels good in your hands and you have with you.

2) The best camera to buy for your film is the one that you can buy today.

Yes, both are true. It's why I ended up investing in a Cion. It's insanely user friendly, it's dependable (thank you, AJA) and the images I'm getting with it are gorgeous.

It will tide me over until I get my Ursa Mini. :)

3) The camera of your dreams will never be built.

4) If it does get built, you can't afford it.

;)

And URSA mini is delayed again now its somewhere mid September and i am not even optimistic about it, going by their old record on delivery times.

3) The camera of your dreams will never be built.

4) If it does get built, you can't afford it.



5) If the camera does get built and you can afford it, by then it will already be a better camera in the pipe.

-- peer

And no matter what camera you have, the most important part of it is behind it.

5) If the camera does get built and you can afford it, by then it will already be a better camera in the pipe.

-- peer

I think that should be amended to:
5) If the camera does get built and you can afford it, a better and cheaper camera will be announced THE DAY AFTER YOU BUY IT.

BlackMagic have announced a B4 mount for the URSA Mini at IBC.

For the $295 user upgrade they say: "simply take the PL lens mount off where it is normally removed for shimming PL lenses and bolt on the B4 lens mount." and "also features spherical aberration correction so customers can use their lenses wide open with no blooming effect."

Hopefully the existence of a B4 adapter means a Nikon F one can also be made.

Here's a review of the viewfinder.

Pro Video Coalition - Blackmagic's URSA Viewfinder Review by Brian Hallett (http://www.provideocoalition.com/blackmagic-s-electronic-viewfinder-review)

More on the lens mount options.

http://www.provideocoalition.com/blackmagic-extends-lens-mount-options-for-usra-mini

I remember the URSA Mini... from back in the olden days before the Red Raven. I still have it on pre-order... to cancel or not to cancel?

The sample video is beyond reproach. Now the question is, besides the wait, would you have the wherewithal, the time to promptly keep up with some essential firmware updates, and the right accessories to nail the shots? My short experience with the first BMCC and later the BMPCC makes me wary just by looking at the specs of the new camera. The lack of a built-in ND for example, is a start.

I remember the URSA Mini... from back in the olden days before the Red Raven. I still have it on pre-order... to cancel or not to cancel?
I briefly chuckled to myself when considering who was most likely to blow a deadline, Red or Blackmagic.

I briefly chuckled to myself when considering who was most likely to blow a deadline, Red or Blackmagic.

Me too. They sure give the competition plenty of lead time to develop competing products.

The lack of a built-in ND for example, is a start.

It's amazing how many people turned internal NDs into a critical feature just because BMD designed a camera with good handheld ergonomics.

Given that the URSA Mini is being marketed as a digital film camera or the Raven gets an cinema quality association, I guess it's hardly surprising that like film cameras, neither has internal ND filters.

Given that the URSA Mini is being marketed as a digital film camera or the Raven gets an cinema quality association, I guess it's hardly surprising that like film cameras, neither has internal ND filters.

Now you're just being logical. :)

As another BMD forum member pointed out, people irrationally expect MORE features in less expensive products than in high-priced specialized products.

I briefly chuckled to myself when considering who was most likely to blow, Red or Blackmagic.

Hey, I fixed that for you. ;)

I remember the URSA Mini... from back in the olden days before the Red Raven. I still have it on pre-order... to cancel or not to cancel?
before you cancel take a look at the footage from that ugly duck that Jared just posted on FB, looks terrible,
my i6 shoots better slomo :)

I was seriously considering the URSA Mini, but decided to go for the FS7. When price comparing the various set-ups, the Mini costs started to add up and narrow the gap with the FS7, so not much of a price advantage after all. Then reading about BMDs habit of late releases, and finally some people were saying BMD doesn't even service the gear they make put me off. I own one BMD item, the Hyperdeck Shuttle II. Apparently it isn't doing all the proper recording modes, as others say they are getting, but I am not. I have the proper software on it. When I bought the optional mounting plate, I removed the original back plate to put it on and found the PC board had signs of being repaired. There were some solder burn marks where the delicate mini SDI connectors are. Looked like I had been sold a refurbished unit as new. Contacted B&H Photo about it and they told me to take it up with BMD. So... that has put me off a bit as well. The URSA Mini looks like a cool camera, nice compact size, clean. But I've lost interest now and will wait until many are fielded and see what kind of feedback users report. I'd only be interested in the high frame rate capability. Good luck to you early buyers.

Mark

Mark, the FS7 vs Ursa mini is the most no-brainer of all no-brainers... The FS7 is the only pro video camera I'd actually spend my own, non company money on right now.
And of course... you can actually buy it. :)

before you cancel take a look at the footage from that ugly duck that Jared just posted on FB, looks terrible,
my i6 shoots better slomo :)

Fortunately, I'm not in the business of making images. :)

Mark, the FS7 vs Ursa mini is the most no-brainer of all no-brainers... The FS7 is the only pro video camera I'd actually spend my own, non company money on right now.
And of course... you can actually buy it. :)

It's not actually a no brainer, particularly once you account for actual tradeoffs between the two, one of which is the obvious availability issue. And if you have an interest in being able to capture raw, then the no-brainer part actually sways the other way, since you have to add a fair bit of hardware to the FS7 in order to enable raw capture on it.

Not a no-brainer for me. The Ursa Mini is supposed to do high frame rates, so I'm at least interested in it for that. Interchangeable lenses, 4K, now you're talking. Don't know what kind of high speed it does. Shot a lot of 120fps 1280x720 on the FDR-AX100, and I've been happy with it, but of course, I want more... So the FS7 says it can do 180fps at 1920x1080. Here's the catch, when in high frame rate mode, you lose the auto functions. No auto exposure and no auto focus. AX100 lets you have those two things. The FS7 is a handful of camera to heft around. Put the extension unit on it with a battery pack and then an external 6" monitor and it gets more cumbersome. Add the metabones and some Canon L glass and... well you get the picture. I stuffed the camera and everything I'd want to shoot with the kit lens and my Canon 16-35mm and it weighs 33 pounds, not including the 9 pound tripod with FSB6 head. So it remains to be seen if the Ursa Mini can trump the FS7 in the area of high frame rate, but looks like it could remain more compact. I tend to like lots of discrete buttons, and the Ursa doesn't have too many. The FS7 could use a few more, but so far it's working okay for me. I don't do this professionally, so none of my purchase decisions are constrained by any kind of business, money-making model.

Mark

Given the choice between a camera that exists in real life, and a camera that exists on the internet that you can't even buy... That's my definition of a no brainer, sorry.

If you absolutely NEED a 4K camera right now and don't have one, then yes. How many actually NEED 4K right now? Or even 14+ stops of dynamic range? Account for the people who are just using their cameras as marketing to get on set as camera dongles, and you're left with a relatively small percentage of camera buyers.

I did debate an fs7 instead of waiting for an Ursa Mini 4.6K, but in the end I decided that it would be worth the wait, mainly because of the color and dynamic range, plus the fact that it records raw internally with several compression options including lossless.

I'll make some popcorn and get comfy.

If you absolutely NEED a 4K camera right now and don't have one, then yes. How many actually NEED 4K right now? Or even 14+ stops of dynamic range? Account for the people who are just using their cameras as marketing to get on set as camera dongles, and you're left with a relatively small percentage of camera buyers.

I did debate an fs7 instead of waiting for an Ursa Mini 4.6K, but in the end I decided that it would be worth the wait, mainly because of the color and dynamic range, plus the fact that it records raw internally with several compression options including lossless.

That can easily become a never ending trap. Trust me, by the time
the Ursa Mini is actually released, rumors of the 'next big thing'
will be swirling. And I will debate buying a Ursa Mini but in the
end, will decide that the greater resolution, higher frame rates,
better dynamic range, plus the same recording options as the
URSA Mini but no loss in dynamic range or slower frame rates
when switching to global shutter, plus built in NDs, and not
'Touch screen' oriented ability of this new 'mega cam' means
that it will be worth the wait. And so the saga continues.....

Random thoughts.

... and if this "Mega Cam" were to hit the stores without any build-up announcement or fanfare, and then the Ursa ends up further delayed and even worse, missing some advertised feature, it's possible the Mini could be still born.

But odds of this are slim as I can't recall any past model that experienced a premature release.

Mark

Unboxing video of Ursa Mini 4K: Unboxing URSA Mini 4K EF - YouTube

That can easily become a never ending trap. Trust me, by the time
the Ursa Mini is actually released, rumors of the 'next big thing'
will be swirling. And I will debate buying a Ursa Mini but in the
end, will decide that the greater resolution, higher frame rates,
better dynamic range, plus the same recording options as the
URSA Mini but no loss in dynamic range or slower frame rates
when switching to global shutter, plus built in NDs, and not
'Touch screen' oriented ability of this new 'mega cam' means
that it will be worth the wait. And so the saga continues.....

Rumors of what was coming after have been swirling for months already. There are a lot of people using "the next best thing" as an excuse to not shoot with what they already have available, mostly because what they have now doesn't include a talent button, and developing one's own talent takes effort and dedication. It's easier to blame the gear.

There are several companies, including Black Magic and Red, who are counting on the obsession with specs to keep selling cameras.

Random thoughts.

... and if this "Mega Cam" were to hit the stores without any build-up announcement or fanfare, and then the Ursa ends up further delayed and even worse, missing some advertised feature, it's possible the Mini could be still born.

But odds of this are slim as I can't recall any past model that experienced a premature release.

Mark

In a way, that (and I'm going to regret saying this) happened with the Red Raven. Of course it's quite a different price point, but Red has, at least recently, not a bad track record of delivering on time, as opposed to BM being half a year late on a good year.

Of course... we couldn't possibly talk about waiting for a dream camera that you wait years for without bringing up the "3k for $3k" slogan. ;)

Info on a new user interface and OS for the Mini.

Blackmagic Updates the UI and OS in the URSA Mini (http://www.provideocoalition.com/New+User+Interface+for+URSAMini)

Review of the 4.6k version

4.6K Blackmagic URSA Mini Camera Review (http://www.provideocoalition.com/4.6K+Camera+Review)