Looking for a set of two powerful lights for FS700 slow motion use that won't cause any, or next to zero flicker.

Any recommendations? budget is £400.

I think you'd need to raise the budget a little but battery powered LED panels will do it!

Or go the other way and try a couple of PAR cans. They're certainly cheap, put out a lot of (tungsten) light, and should have filaments large enough that they won't produce flicker at 200 or 240fps. Of course shoot a test first!

Here's a link to a nice discussion of lighting for high speed video:

Lighting for High-Speed Video | www.creativeplanetnetwork.com (http://www.creativeplanetnetwork.com/digital-cinematography/news/lighting-high-speed-video/58709)

Thanks for the suggestion.

I've gone down the cheap route and grabbed one of those Amaran 500 led light panels and a Yongnuo 600 one to see how they do. I'll just put them back on ebay if they're no good.

The cheap-ish Genaray LED lights from B&H have been doing the trick for me...

For example, 3 light kit for $725 USD:
Genaray SpectroLED Three Light Interview Kit SP-AD75-3KI B&H

Or separately:
Genaray SpectroLED-9 Light (100-240VAC/12VDC) SP-AD35 B&H Photo

Genaray SpectroLED-14 Light (100-240VAC/12VDC) SP-AD75 B&H Photo


Tested to 1/1000 shutter speed and 960fps. Completely flicker free AS LONG AS they are running over 90% power. Dimming below 90%will cause flicker.

They are *very bright* compared to outrageously more expensive solutions from Lowel and others. Color is decent, no noticeable green or purple components.

I was initially pleased with my Amaran 198's off Ebay, and they are flicker free, however after multiple uses, they have started to MELT. Not good.

Lately I've been a fan of Yongnuo YN-600 LED lights, especially for only $160 per light.

I'd be curious about how the Aputure LEDs compare.

I've had two of the YN-600s for a while but I just decided to buy two more to replace my 2-bank fluorescents since the YN-600s are almost twice as bright at half the power, 1/8th the size/weight, and can be bi-color or daylight, come with a remote control, and can run on batteries. I tested them up to 1/10,000th shutter (maximum on my FS700) and saw no flicker at any dimming level.

They seem to have similar photometrics to a 4bank Kino Diva or an Arri 300 Plus Fresnel with a quality of light somewhere in between them but without color temperature/spike problems with dimming either of them. Not to mention the convenience of bi-color, remote control, and smaller cost and size. And no bulb changes. I've found the daylight units to be about 1/4-stop brighter than bi-color which makes sense as 3200k LEDs are usually less efficient (and less color accurate) than ~5500k LEDs.

One of my main concerns with the light was green/magenta spike, but I recently tested them and they already have less green than most other similar LED panels, but I found that 1/8th minus green gel correction to be just right for the 3200k LEDs and just a little strong for the 5500K LEDs, but generally for bi-color or daylight, I just attach the 1/8th minus green gel to the diffuser insert (only loses about 3 tenths of a stop with the minusgreen) and leave that in there permanently so no matter what color temp you are at, it's color correct within about 1/16th of a full magenta/green correction.

You can get the YN-600 on ebay for around $130 without AC adapter or $150 with, plus I buy a $10 stand/umbrella/tilt adapter to leave on the light since it only has a 1/4-20 on the bottom.

One other concern is the small fan in the back which does turn on when running the unit at full power, but I just stick a piece of tape in there to prevent he little fan from ever turning on and have never found it to affect the functioning of the light at all.

Noah ,
That Yongnuo YN-600 LED sounds pretty attractive at that price especially. I'm particularly interested for the remote as I like to use them as backlights for interviews and the remote is very convenient with a small crew.
Is the Daylight version only 1/4 stop brighter than the bicolor even when the Bicolor is set only for daylight output? That would make it pretty pointless. I often get daylight only LED's so I can have maximum output when I need it most, but 1/4 stop is hardly worth it.
How large in the front - close to a 1x1?

Also where do you buy them. I like a domestic seller so I can return it easily if there is a problem.

Thanks

Lenny

Sorry I wasn't clear. I was comparing them at full power, so ~5200k vs ~4000k. Of course at daylight or tungsten only, the bicolor is almost exactly half the output. Basically I think the 3200k (I measured closer to 3000k) LEDs are slightly less bright than the 5500k (I measured around 5200k) LEDs per LED. And of course running the unit at 3000k means turning off 300 of the LEDs, so it's at best half as bright as the daylight panel with 600 LEDs at full.

They are smaller and lighter compared to a 1x1. What's amazing is I can throw two YN-600s and a YN-300 in my camera backpack (in the laptop compartment) and pack in 3 lightweight stands and an umbrella softbox in my tripod case (with the tripod and even slider if I want) and show up to set with a 3 point light kit without even bringing any extra bags, just camera/lights on my back and tripod/stands in my hand and still a hand free...

As for domestic sellers, there are a lot on ebay and amazon, possibly elsewhere. The only problem I've noticed is that I prefer ebay but there are no US sellers (besides one, but I bought his last one a couple days ago) that sell the unit with the AC adapter included. And then only amazon has domestically available AC adapters, there are none on ebay. On the other hand, I see plenty of US sellers that sell the light for $125, and then you just have to buy the AC adapter from amazon for $24.

Here is what I bought recently:

YN-600 ($124)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/201094511830 (Did best offer and they only came down $1, but still the best price, and oddly they only have it with a random non-compatible battery, haven't received yet)
Previously bought two daylight YN600s from "yallstore" and bicolor from "jingjiniao20070922" (in china), link above is for "accmonster" which seems to be another name for yallstore as they have the same paypal name. No problems except "yallstore" ads tends to be ambiguous about whether they are selling bicolor or daylight panels but they seem to end up being daylight. I just realized the thing about "accmonster" so now I'm worried I ordered bicolor and they may end up sending me another daylight panel. I wanted to have two bicolor and two daylight panels and I might end up with three daylight panels.

Stand mount ($9)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=281356890582

AC Adapter ($24)
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00IM8DTPA

Lightweight Batteries ($21 for a pair, also helps get amazon order over free shipping minimum)
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00E95PHJ6

I purchased two of these YN600 light modules (they're brighter, cheaper than the amarans and have barn doors). They offer a cheap flicker free lighting solution. I wish they were much more powerful though. I want lights developed that are physically the same size as the YN600 but offer a ridiculous amount of lumens/brightness and cost under £350 (max) each. I can't see these lights being any good around a group of people. They're ideal for interviews but that's it.

Am I asking for too much?

I should also mention, I received a YN600 with dual colours (white/tungsten) and one that only produces a white light. I haven't bothered asking to change it for the dual colour as I have use for both as it is.

These are the best ones that are guaranteed to be bicolor, as a lot of the ebay ones send the wrong model:
Amazon.com : Yongnuo YN-600 Pro LED Video Light 3200K - 5500K Dual Color Temperature Version : On Camera Video Lights : Camera & Photo (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00EMYGODW/)

Good luck finding brighter lights anywhere near the same size and price. LEDs have to be cooled. They make denser LED emitters, but they still need to be cooled and powered, and in the end a brighter LED source will just need a bigger heavier heat sink and a bigger heavier AC-to-DC adapter and like many things will get exponentially more expensive for brighter models since the market gets smaller and smaller as you look at beefier and more expensive lights.

You could mount a whole bunch of these together, though. You could practically build a wall of LEDs out of these the price of one equivalent litepanels 1x1.

I just received my YN600 - 5600 only light and was really surprised by the output. I've been quite happy with my CN900 fro m photo but this seemed to be a little brighter while covering the same area. Also my initial impression was that the color was better. which for 5600 would make it even brighter because I have to add 1/8 - 1/4 Magenta to my CN900. It was certainly less green though I haven't tested color carefully.

I could see mounting 2 of these together and using it for a portable daylight fill. Even one would be helpful.
4 lights would be killer but maybe a pain to mount.

How do the controls work for the Bicolor units?
Can you set a color temperature ( or more precisely can you set a relationship of Daylight to Tungstun bulbs) and then dim the whole unit while maintaining color temp, or do you just have independant 3200 and 5600 dimmers so that every time you dim you will be changing color temps and need to adjust again?
Hope that question is clear.

How do the controls work for the Bicolor units?
Can you set a color temperature ( or more precisely can you set a relationship of Daylight to Tungstun bulbs) and then dim the whole unit while maintaining color temp, or do you just have independant 3200 and 5600 dimmers so that every time you dim you will be changing color temps and need to adjust again?
Hope that question is clear.

Yeah you do have to dim each bank separately, so you can't maintain color temp while dimming.

That's a drag and may make me stick w 5600

Last night I tried testing the color of the YN-600 and the results were peculiar.
I compared the color to a tungstun light with and without Lee 201 daylight gel. I like to compare to tungstun because because it is a known quantity without any green or magenta spikes .I just compared it visually without a camera or a color meter because the color meters seem quite inaccurate for matching and because different cameras sometimes seem to react differently. (Actually I just didn't feel like setting up a camera and a monitor last night.)

Anyway the peculiar thing was that at 5600 the YN600 seemed if anything to need a little 1/8 - green added to it to match the tungstun w gel - also it seemed to need an addition al 1/8 CTB - though interestingly what made an apparently good match on the white wall wasn't always a good match on my own skin.

The odd thing was that to match tungstun it seemed to only want a 1/2 Lee CTO (205) + a 1/8 magenta! The magenta I understand since actually a true 85 gel is slightly more magenta than a CTO , but why only 1/2?

I've done similar tests for my other LED lights ephoto CN900 and a nameless 312 LED and they both require full 85 correction.

Any of you guys have similar experiences? I prefer to stick to the full Daylight LED , so I can dim it without screwing up my color and so I have maximum daylight punch when I need it.

I guess the FS700 forum is an odd place for an extended discussion of an LED light but what the heck.

Lenny

You really need to evaluate with a camera or spectrometer. I don't believe you will see the spectrum of the lights in anyway near the same way as a camera does. I've lost count of the number of times I've seen light sources that look perfectly OK visually only to look terrible with a camera. There are not just spikes but also holes in the spectrum that our visual system will compensate for without us knowing.

I guess you'reour right about that Alister. I tested it today with a PMW-700 and it looked pretty good. Still somewhat odd but much closer to what I would expect. A little bit green and it seemed to take 3/4 CTO to match a tungstun light through a silk. I think that actual 85 will be better for this light than CTO for going tungstun though.
Actually I've also seen the opposite - lights that look way off to my eye look fine on camera.

It'll also change from camera to camera - I'm guessing because the CFAs are all a little bit different in their transmission characteristics and the sensors likewise react slight differently to different wavelengths (and the there is the different approaches to colour processing!) at present there is a drive to develop a successor to CRI as CRI is simply not accurate enough a measure with modern digital cameras, but even the successors seem a little inadequate, so there is even something of a project underway to try and identify which pro lighting fixtures work best with which cameras. ie if you're shooting I an Alexa, choose a kino celeb, if your shooting on a Red, choose a tru color (or whatever).

I use the YN600 daylight on a job today and it worked with Diva lights and tungsten great never needing any correction for green spikes. Shot with Sony 700. Also tested it at home with EX-1 and found with a 1/4 CTB added it was perfect at the cameras 5600 preset.

Oddly I found with a RED EPIC that I needed to add 3/8 minus green ( magenta) to make flesh tones look good at lest on the Red Color Red Gamma out put.

I did have some problems with the fan though . Ran it at first with the plastic diffuser in and found that after I put a stick in to disable the fan , it began to smoke after a while.I had better luck taking the diffuser out as that must allow it to breath more, but i was still very wary of letting it run for a long time with the fan disabled.

I am considering getting another and mounting together on a double header type arm for exterior fill- but I am concerned about the fan.

Update - tested it without any diffusion at home with a stick in the fan and no problems. Might be worse in the sun though.


There is now a YN900 in both all daylight and adjustable color for around $180 on the web. However its practically the same size so I'm concerned that the fan issues would be even greater. 2 if those would be killer though. I guess you could always dim it down to a 600 if the fan was a problem.