These will all be arriving April / May 2014:

Cinema ATX 11-16mm T3.0 Micro 4/3 $1899
Tokina Cinema ATX 11-16mm T3.0 Micro 4/3 Mount (http://www.omegabroadcast.com/product-p/tok-tc116m43-90-4783.htm)

Cinema ATX 11-16mm T3.0 EF Mount $1899
Tokina Cinema ATX 11-16mm T3.0 EF Mount (http://www.omegabroadcast.com/product-p/tok-tc116c-90-4782.htm)

Cinema ATX 16-28mm T3.0 for PL $4499
Tokina Cinema AT-X 16-28mm T3.0 for PL Mount (http://www.omegabroadcast.com/product-p/tok-tc168p-90-4781.htm)

Cinema ATX 16-28mm T3.0 for EF $4499
Tokina Cinema AT-X 16-28mm T3.0 for EF Mount (http://www.omegabroadcast.com/product-p/tok-tc168c-90-4780.htm)

11-16mm f/2.8mm

Product Highlights

- Super-wide angle T3.0 zoom lens (APS-C)
- Proven and Award Winning Tokina optical design
- Rugged All-Metal lens housing
- Geared Focus, Aperture, and Zoom rings
- 4K approved
- Super 35 and APS-C coverage
- Minimum focus distance of 13.8"
- Available in Canon EF Mount OR MFT Mount

Built around the original, award-winning Tokina 11-16mm f/2.8mm DSLR camera lens, the NEW Tokina Cinema AT-X 11-16mm T3.0 brings its superior optical performance and distortion free optical design to professional and independent film making. Tokina engineers developed a special all-metal cinema housing that provides geared manual focus control with easy to read distance scale, a de-clicked aperture ring for smooth iris pulls, and zoom ring for use with remote control systems.

Built to meet the demanding needs of hard working cinematographers, the Tokina 11-16mm T3.0 utilizes 2 Super-low Dispersion and 2 Aspherical lens elements to achieve excellent contrast and sharpness while minimizing flare and ghosting. A bayonet mount, petal-type lens hood is also included.

16-28mm F/2.8mm

Product Highlights:

- Full frame super-wide 16-28mm lens
- Fast T3.0 aperture
- 4K approved
- LDS (Lens Data System) support is possible.
- Common 114mm front diameter for matte boxes
- Minimum focus distance of 11.03"
- Available in Canon EF Mount OR PL Mount

Built around the highly innovative Tokina AT-X 16-28mm F/2.8 FX full frame optical design, the NEW Tokina Cinema AT-X 16-28mm T3.0 brings its award-winning performance into the film making arena. Tokina rehoused these superior optics in an all new cinema housing that provides geared manual focus control with an easy to read distance scale, geared zoom ring, and a de-clicked aperture with 9 curved blades that yield beautiful out of focus highlights while reducing the chance of diffraction at small apertures.

To deliver the results that working professionals demand, Tokina incorporated 3 Aspherical lens elements and 2 Super-low dispersion glass elements in the optical design to achieve excellent contrast and sharpness with minimizing lens flare, diffraction, and ghosting. The lens has an industry standard 114mm front diameter for attaching a variety of matte-boxes.

Any word on whether they'll offer the 11-16 in a PL mount at some point soon?

For those prices, I can take quality lenses including Tokina's and Sigma F1.8s and have them cine rehoused and have huge chunks of cash left over.

For those prices, I can take quality lenses including Tokina's and Sigma F1.8s and have them cine rehoused and have huge chunks of cash left over.

Actually, you cannot.

Actually, one can and many have.

Customized cine lens (http://www.pchood.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=45)

Actually, one can and many have.

Did you? I don't personally know anyone who has any lenses modified by that company, and when I reached out to those whose opinions I rely on in my investigation into getting some cinemods done, I was informed that these were very poor in quality.

This (http://www.glcinemod.com/english.html) and this (http://www.ducloslenses.com/collections/duclos-1/products/duclos-11-16mm) are the ones I typically hear about that are great buys. And they are substantially more.

It's ok if you are unfamiliar with this company or their product line. But as stated and demonstrated, one can have standard lenses cine modified for quite a bit less than Tokina's cine lenses.

They charge about $600 USD for prime lens mods, and about $1000 USD for zoom cine mods and they do the popular Tokina 11-16.

Alternately for those on a budget, there is a guy in Ebay who machines up very tight fitting one piece focus gears. He can make either low profile or large diameter gears, the latter of which would give more precise focus puller control. About $30 per custom gear.

On the reviews I've read on the Cinematic lens conversion say that it's more a cosmetic modification to make the lens look good. It seems that with the modified Canon prime there are no end stops on the focus scale, which make.the focus markings meaningless and these marking I gather are inaccurate.

They seem to be relying on the original still lens mechanics, rather than going the more expensive route of building new mechanics for the cine lens. With the Cinematics it seems you do need to pick the right lens, with good mechanics,

Perhaps effectively that's no different to putting on a gear ring onto the stills lens, I've done the latter with Zeiss Contax lenses, but they weren't the same as a modern cine lens with an accurate expanded focus scale. Nice lenses if you can get a set, they're very well engineered.

You need to physically compare these Tokina cinema lenses to other lenses or lens conversions and see how well they operate. Price wise they're a bit more than the high end modified stills versions, you'd need to check the focus scale and other mechanics to find out if the difference is worth it to you.

It's ok if you are unfamiliar with this company or their product line.

Well, that's a misstatement of my post. I have not physically touched this item because there is no one in my circle that has these, but I am familiar that this company exists and mods these lenses at these prices.

But as stated and demonstrated, one can have standard lenses cine modified for quite a bit less than Tokina's cine lenses. They charge about $600 USD for prime lens mods, and about $1000 USD for zoom cine mods and they do the popular Tokina 11-16.

This is a mere cosmetic shell with no overlay (I did ask if you had purchased one of these mods, I guess the answer is a "No, I Dave Allen have not purchased any of these mods, nor do I have any actual experience with them"?) It doesn't add accurate focus marks, manual aperture control, or, in the case of the Sigma 18-35 from GL Optics, a 300 degree focus throw. In the case of the Tokina 11-16, I am very interested in having that lens with a manual aperture, so can you please link to me where I can get such a thing for less than the Tokina Cine lens?

Alternately for those on a budget, there is a guy in Ebay who machines up very tight fitting one piece focus gears. He can make either low profile or large diameter gears, the latter of which would give more precise focus puller control. About $30 per custom gear.

Actually, "precise focus puller control" is not accurate. Gears like this make it easier for a follow focus unit to turn, but it doesn't add throw. To add throw, the lens has to be modified internally, so, no, it's not at all anything like the much more expensive units I listed.

If you don't have experience with this, don't you think you should before you randomly google up cheaper prices for poor mods?

Since you seem to have a penchant for rather less than diplomatic replies, allow me to respond in kind; So you have never seen one, handled one or used one? Like I said, it is ok if you are unfamiliar with the product and thus not in a position to be familiar with it. So an accurate statement would be "I, Gary Huff, am not familiar with the product to any degree.".

Actually, "precise focus puller control" is not accurate....

What is not accurate is your removal of the context of my statement which was: "the latter of which would give more precise focus puller control. " meaning more than with a smaller diameter focus gear.


Gears like this make it easier for a follow focus unit to turn, but it doesn't add throw. To add throw, the lens has to be modified internally,

You, Gary Huff, have made another erroneous statement. lol

By employing a larger focus gear and keeping the drive gear the same, the ratio changes, thus making for more precise control than a focus gear that is closer to the size of the barrel diameter.

Brian Drysdale, I completely agree with your post. Zeiss has told me that some of their most popular cine primes are just rehoused existing still cam glass at a much higher pricepoint.

It will be interesting to see the reviews of the new Tokina cines as they work their way into the hands of users.

Since you seem to have a penchant for rather less than diplomatic replies, allow me to respond in kind; So you have never seen one, handled one or used one?

No, I made it very clear I sought out the opinion of those who had whose expertise I trust.

What is not accurate is your removal of the context of my statement which was: "the latter of which would give more precise focus puller control. " meaning more than with a smaller diameter focus gear.

You are implying that it gives you more throw. Do you know what focus throw is? It does not give you more throw.

11-16 in PL is NOT on the price sheet. I am looking to see if it is in the product road map in the future for Tokina. Cinematics had a booth at NAB. I stopped to talk to them. They are re-housing lenses. They are an option. It depends what your threshold for pain is in terms of having a DVinfo sponsor to buy it from and reps to support the product. This forum is one place to share experiences and opinions to crowd source input on products.

Gary - let me know it you want to swing by and try the Tokina lenses.

We have all these in stock:

Tokino TC-116C: TOKINA 11-16MM T3.0 CINEMA FOR CANON
Tokina TC-116M43: TOKINA 11-16MM T3.0 CINEMA FOR MICRO 4/3
Tokina TC-168C: TOKINA 16-28MM T3.0 CINEMA FOR CANON

The Zeiss CP primes use the glass from the stills lenses, but the mechanics are more than the still lens barrel having a cine conversion.

Zeiss Eye Candy by Adam Wilt (http://provideocoalition.com/awilt/story/zeiss_eye_candy)

The Zeiss CP primes use the glass from the stills lenses, but the mechanics are more than the still lens barrel having a cine conversion.

Exactly right. More blades in the iris (14 vs 9), and 300 degree focus throw instead of the 90-270 degrees depending on the lens. Plus, the CPs all have manual aperture control, which is only the ZFs for the stills (and they turn the way Nikon's focus, unlike the CPs).

Frankly, I never use the Tokina in AF so I prefer not having the sliding ring, and I want manual aperture control for mounting on the GH4. That makes it a good deal at $1900.

You are implying that it gives you more throw. Do you know what focus throw is? It does not give you more throw.

Setting up a straw argument then attacking it does not help your position. I will make one last attempt to help you understand.

If you have a fixed small diameter drive gear meshed to a larger diameter drive gear, the small one will have to turn more than one revolution to make the much larger gear make one revolution. Are you still with me here? The greater the disparity between the smaller drive gear and the larger slave or driven gear, the more movement the smaller gear must make relative to the other. If you can't comprehend that, then here is a picture how it works:

File:Gears animation.gif - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gears_animation.gif)

Well these Tokina Cine lenses are very nice. I know because I've handled all of the versions just released. I've also shot with the original version glass and the newer version glass in both stills housings. Ive also used the Duclos REHOUSED version. and I've played with this cosmetic attachment that is bolted onto the stills version of the stills lens.

If you want the 11-16 in PL you pay almost 4k for the Duclos version. It is very good. If you want EF or M4/3 then you should just get the Tokina version ( newer glass ) and two year warranty. at just over $1,800 it is the best wide super 35mm variable prime you can get.

Gary, Dave, as much as I got a chuckle out of the rhetoric, let's turn it down to simmer. :)

I've had one major dealing dealings with Cinematics and after that would never give them another dollar of my money. Long story short, but almost a complete failure off every item I ordered, and that was most of their catalogue. However, I did look at their "rehoused" lenses closely at NAB this year and they look quite good... for a mostly cosmetic alteration. While they do give a few advantages over stock lenses, built in gears, matching front ring sizes, markings, and I think they will de-click your lenses as well... nothing internally is changed (save declicking) so many wouldn't consider them actual rehoused lenses. More like, cloaked lenses. For some people, this is plenty, for others, it isn't.

Personally, for the $600ea and my past dealings with them, I'd spend $50 on front ring size adapters, a good gear ring and a screw driver to declick my own lenses and have them just look like boring old lenses.

I'd spend $50 on front ring size adapters, a good gear ring and a screw driver to declick my own lenses and have them just look like boring old lenses.

That's exactly what I do with mine, though I am looking at the Tokina Cine and the GL Optics Sigma 18-35 for the conversion that gives manual aperture control.

It may have been put to bed (hint: never ignore a warning from D. Couper or the second one will come in the form of a beer bottle/hockey stick to the side of the head) but I'll add a footnote to the focus throw "discussion" above.

That was something of a disagreement on semantics--probably the most accurate phrase to use would be "effective focus throw" when an external solution is required. In other words, as far as the focus puller is concerned, the throw is effectively increased with an oversized idler gear, even though the lens remains unmodified. One additional way to achieve this is with a remote focus control, which are slowly making their way into the lower-budget production world. Whether a given lens has a 50 degree or 300 degree throw on the barrel, on the remote handset it will remap to the full rotation of the knob. This is obviously very handy with still lenses. I have a set of ZE's that, from the AC's perspective, were transformed into CP2's (obviously there are a few other differences as detailed above) because I always use them with in conjunction with my Preston FIZ system. An added bonus of that particular controller is that it can be programmed to learn the marks on each lens for later recall, which means that you can use one marked ring with every lens in your set--6 feet will always be at the same place on the knob, which makes it much easier for the AC.

Another great feature is that you can simply expand the scale as desired, mapping the physical ends of the knob to any two points on the lens. This is very helpful if you are shooting a macro closeup or something similarly delicate and have to pull in minute increments, say, 9" of range spread out across 300 degrees of knob rotation.

The FIZ system is out of reach for most but there are low cost alternatives out there and the feature sets continue to evolve. If lens throw is a big concern, a $4K investment in a tool that can erase that regardless of the lens in use (as well as allowing for focus control with remote, Steadicam or jib mounted cameras) may be a worthwhile investment.

Although I would add when stretching the scale on a remote or with a gear on a follow focus, this can involve making your own focusing scale for each lens. Less of problem if you've got a set of discs marked in advance, but it takes a bit longer if you have to recalibrate the markings after each lens change.

Indeed, Brian. In this day and age, the usual MO with AC's when stretching a scale is for focus so critical that they will generally be pulling off the monitor anyway, so they don't bother remarking the lens for that. And to be very honest, only a tiny percentage of the AC's I know (including "bigshots"!) ever even think of or remember to expand the scale.

Getting "back to normal" depends on the system--on the simple one you would need to recalibrate the lens, on the FIZ it's just a cancel button to get back to standard scale.

There will NOT be a 11-16 PL cinema lens from Tokina. It is NOT in the road map. Speaking of number of blades, remember the SLR MAGIC MFT lens? I think they had 4 blades and the ended up in sort of a rectangle and if you closed down too hard they would hit together and flex / bow. About Cinematics, they rehouse YOUR lens so they don't have to maintain inventory and worry about prices of lenses falling.

That was something of a disagreement on semantics--probably the most accurate phrase to use would be "effective focus throw" when an external solution is required. In other words, as far as the focus puller is concerned, the throw is effectively increased with an oversized idler gear, even though the lens remains unmodified.

I just checked this out for myself, a Redrock Micro Lens gear versus a Wide Open Camera gear that basically sits flush with the lens, and the throw was definitely improved with the Redrock gear on the follow focus, so good to know!

We now have all these lenses in stock now:

Tokina Cinema ATX 11-16mm T3.0 EF Mount (http://www.omegabroadcast.com/product-p/tok-tc116c-90-4782.htm)
Tokina Cinema ATX 11-16mm T3.0 Micro 4/3 Mount (http://www.omegabroadcast.com/product-p/tok-tc116m43-90-4783.htm)
Tokina Cinema AT-X 16-28mm T3.0 for EF Mount (http://www.omegabroadcast.com/product-p/tok-tc168c-90-4780.htm)

We are waiting for this one:

Tokina Cinema AT-X 16-28mm T3.0 for PL Mount (http://www.omegabroadcast.com/product-p/tok-tc168p-90-4781.htm)

That's exactly what I do with mine, though I am looking at the Tokina Cine and the GL Optics Sigma 18-35 for the conversion that gives manual aperture control.

The Cinematics rehouse of the Nikon version of the Sigma 18-35 provides manual aperture control and it sells for $1900. ( the GL Optics rehouse of the same lens is $3500. ).

I believe that the Nikon version of the Sigma 18-35 has focus end stop. And the focus turns the "right way", the same way that Canon / Fujinon / Zeiss glass turns.

About the only difference I see between the GL Optics rehouse of the Sigma and the Cinematics rehouse of the Sigma is that the iris throw appears to be shorter on the Cinematics, more like that on the unmodified lens.

The Tokina 11-16 Cine EF is interesting because it gives you the Tokina 11-16 with an iris on the lens. I am considering using this lens with a simple EF to e-mount adapter on the Fs7. That would give me a wide zoom with manual iris control on the lens, thus avoiding the control of iris via an adapter or electronics.

The two lenses- Tokina 11-16 EF CINE and Cinematics 18-35 ( Nikon version ) would give me two wide zooms with manual iris control on the lens, covering 11mm-35mm or a comparable 35mm equivalent of roughly 15mm to 48mm. ( I would just leave an EF adapter on the Tokina and a Nikon adapter on the Cinematics. Both only needing a simple mechanical adapter with no iris control or electronics. I don't need the f-stop displayed in the viewfinder. )

The upcoming Sony FE 28-135 ( also with iris ring on the lens ) would complete the package. Package range being a 35mm comparable equivalent of 15mm to 187mm, all with manual control of iris via iris ring on the glass.

Anyone see any reason to go with the $3500 GL Optics rehouse of the Sigma 18-35 over the Cinematics $1900 rehouse of the Sigma 18-35? Both are Chinese companies. Both rehouses are metal and not plastic.

Have you previously owned any Cinematics products?

I have not owned or used any of the rehoused lenses, Cinematics or otherwise.

I am so wanting mechanical iris control, with an iris ring on the lens itself, that I am considering taking a chance on the Cinematics. I don't see any reason why Cinematics products would be more suspect than G.L. Optics. Both are Chinese companies that rehouse photo glass to make it more usable for video. I trust Duclos over both Cinematics and G.L. Optics, but the Duclos mods are far more pricey. Duclos may perform a mod on the Sigma 18-35 but such a mod isn't listed on their website. Only the Tokina 11-16 mod is listed.

My interest in the Cinematics lens is obtaining a Sigma 18-35 with an iris ring. This is the cheapest way to obtain one. The $800 Sigma 18-35 for Nikon ( unmodified ) does NOT have an iris ring.

A criticism of Cinematics rehousings is that the witness marks do not line up correctly. But I could care less about that because I will be focusing by eye "run & gun" style. The greater focus travel as a result of the rehouse would be lagniappe. It doesn't hurt that the Cinematics rehouse makes the Sigma 18-35 appear far more professional, more "filmic" and less prosumer. I am only looking for a short term zoom lens solution until I make the leap to a Angenieux DP Rouge or the Canon Cine-Servo 17-120mm. Although there will always be a need for a small, lightweight wide zoom. Either because of confined space ( shooting in a car ) or needing to be more discreet than having a huge cine zoom on the camera. Or, simply not wanting to lug around 4-6lbs of zoom lens on the camera.

It sounds like there's only one way to find out...

I have not owned or used any of the rehoused lenses, Cinematics or otherwise.

I am so wanting mechanical iris control, with an iris ring on the lens itself, that I am considering taking a chance on the Cinematics. David, let us know if you purchase the Cinematics lens. I'm seriously considering the Cinematics too!

Troy- Do you see any reason to go for the G.L. Optics over the Cinematics?

Reading the descriptions from each company I just don't see much difference. It looks as if the iris on the "Gloptics" has more throw than does the iris on the CMatics. FYI- the G.L. Optics pages are a bit misleading. The lens pictured most, the rehouse of the Sigma that has the nice fat barrel like the Cinematics is the G.L. Optics rehouse with the extended, 300 degree focus. That lens costs an additional $850. So, for the lens you see pictured most in reviews and in the GL Optics video the total before shipping would be $4350. The $3500 rehouse of the Sigma 18-35 looks like this:

http://www.cinemaglass.com/assets/images/products/1/gl_optics_18-35_f18_super_speed_zoom_pl_version_3.png

Do you know if the Sigma or the Sigma rehouses have focus end stop?

Are you also considering the rehoused Nikon over the rehoused Canon version in order to gain iris control on the lens?

You see any issues with using the re-housed Sigma via a simple Nikon G to E-mount adapter? It seems a bit redundant to use one of the more expensive adapters that has iris control since the lens will have iris control on the barrel.

Ok. Back to buying Tokina Cinema lenses from Omega Broadcast folks.

We have them for rental as well...