I have not found any detailed spec on the PXW-Z100 but the information I posted early are from the Sony Consumer US site for the FDR-AX1. Sony 4K/60p Ultra HD Camcorder | 4K Camcorder Review | FDR-AX1 | Sony USA (http://store.sony.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=8198552921666597838#accessories)

Ron Evans

This sounds great, but I wonder how you'll focus it? Hopefully the EVF will be up to it. I've gone from feeling like there were no good options for me for upgrading from the EX1R to having two. Now I'll have to decide between this and the PMW-300.

Thanks Ron, couldn't locate anything like that for the Z100 specs. I'm assuming that the frame rates for it will be identical but at 4096×2160 sizes.

[QUOTE=Jack Zhang;1811526]Remember that those are the bitrates for XAVC-S, not XAVC intra. The intra bitrates are way higher than that.


Yes the XAVC bit rates are likely 4 times the XAVC-S bit rates, instead of a 150Mbps it would be 600 Mbps. Fill a 64G card in short order !!! That is why I am more interested in the FDR-AX1 !!

Ron Evans

600mbps is...a lot. But I think the Z100 will also get a long gop codec next year, correct?

edit - yes, the Z100 will get a free, less data intensive long gop codec in mid 2014. I'm assuming it's the same one on the AX1.

I hope you can select XAVC-S as one of the codecs. Need that flexibility in case i'm in a bind for space.

Yes XAVC-S will come as an update next year but won't be available at launch, it will be XAVC I frame.

This sounds great, but I wonder how you'll focus it? Hopefully the EVF will be up to it. I've gone from feeling like there were no good options for me for upgrading from the EX1R to having two. Now I'll have to decide between this and the PMW-300.

For me, the lack of full manual is making me lean towards the PMW-200 fixed lens replacement with XAVC 1080/50p/60p. That has to be coming down the pipes, so that's my next move. 4K broadcast acceptance is still another couple of years away.

It is a shame the SOny will make Z100 users wait until the middle of next year to get lower bit rate options, this is the major problem with the Z100 (assuming image is fine) that prevents it from being a universal workhorse.

A fairly random selection of factoids...

On frame rates:

This is a 'world camera', so supports 50/60Hz.

24fps is (according to FCPX) 23.976 ("23.98" in the menu).

In 25fps mode, you get 1/3, 1/6, 1/12, 1/25, 1/50, 1/60, 1/100, 1/120, 1/150, 1/215, 1/300, 1/425, 1/600, 1/1000, 1/1750, 1/2500, 1/3500 - is anyone reading this? - 1/6000 and 1/9000.

In 24fps mode, you get

In 60fps (89.94) fps mode, you get 1/4, 1/8, 1/15, 1/30, 1/60, 1/90, 1/100, 1/125, 1/180, 1/250, 1/350, 1/500, 1/725, 1/1000, 1/1500, 1/2000, 1/3000, 1/4000, 1/6000 and 1/9000.

There's 24/30/60 and 25/50 modes for DCI 4K, QuadHD 4K and 1080 resolutions - I don't *think* there's any odd gaps there - but please take note that my loaner is running a fairly old beta of the camera firmware, there may be some changes.

There's the usual numbers (very reminiscent of the FS100) for S&Q motion - yes, S&Q at 4K!

One should mention that the Z100 has a WIFI facility (borrowed from the F5/55?) and a camera control app that enables remote control of the camera via tablet. NOTE WELL: no, this is not going to provide a 'wifi EVF', but it does provide a sort of Camera Control Unit, so you can control recording (not just rec start/stop), camera settings (shutter, f-stop, focus, zoom, white balance) and other functions. However (and I haven't been able to confirm this yet) I don't think you can add 'essence markers' or mark shots. This may be a limitation of my early software, but I don't see these functions in the camera's menu structure.

On the body, yes - there's a separate AC in, so like the EX1, you run off AC with a 'backup battery' should someone pull the plug, you can change batteries whilst plugged in, and so on.

Matt,

Hope I didn't miss this earlier in the thread, but what is the extent of manual control, and what auto functions does the Z100 drop?

Great info Matt - Thanks! Yes we are reading it!!! - as I noticed you missed off the 24p shutter speeds by accident (in your list in the post above). I can easily guess them but I'm only really interested in 25p and 50p personally.

Really pleased to read that the AC input is not hidden inside the battery compartment like on some of the newer PMWs - silly move that was and I'm glad Sony have listened. Pity the handle is not able to swivel from what I can see.

This cam is very interesting, but I'm still wondering just how poor this thing will be in less than stellar lighting conditions...I am probably still leaning towards a PMW-300 as a replacement for my trust EX3 when my baby eventually dies - hopefully she'll still keep going strong for a while yet!

It's early days and when we see some decent real world footage from this cam it'll become clearer (at least in my mind) but Sony sure have been spitting out some interesting cams to cover off almost every niche this last 12 months!

The controls are very much like the NX5 - but in the 'fine print' (and having got used to this on the FS100/700) it's a little bit more twiddly to set a 'fixed' white balance - you have to dive into the 'Paint' mode and set it there. A bit like the EX1.

So, yes, the lens is a bit 'fly by wire' and there's a little bit of latency on the iris. I preferred the 'manual' zoom to the rocker - maybe all that time with the Canon 24-105 has paid off.

Although there's a sort of TLCS, it's not got the finesse of the EX1 (don't let the iris go beyond f8, don't go above 9dB gain and so on).

I've not checked the audio limiters yet - the Z1's audio was great and the limiter was unburstable. The EX1's were... not so great. Noisy, and a truculent limiter. Great advert for the joys of a Sound Guy.

Biggest gripe so far: no histogram. A couple of Zebra patterns, but no histogram. Certainly no WFM! You really will have to keep one set of Zebras for 100 (or 109 if you dare). I found it very easy to overexpose - but then this isn't a finished unit.

OIS feels more Z1-like than EX1-like, a good thing. There's push-auto for focus and iris (but note that there's no TCLS rubber sheet - though you will be nagged for ND at appropriate times).

ATW speed can be set, and there's 'shockless' switch between the presets that's really helpful if you're dashing around a large venue with daylight and fluoro.

There was one cheeky little feature of the Z1 which I can't quite see if I can do on the Z100 (if I can't have easily dialled in white balances) - assigning a couple of buttons for 'upping and downing' the preset WB by a reasonable 'notch'.

This is a CineTone camera, not a CineGamma camera. Bother. So, I bet there's going to be the same game of people cooking up recipes to help tame the highlight compression and open up the dynamic range. This time, instead of having one central pot of Picture Profiles, you get to save the WHOLE CAMERA STATE, and move between them. You can have up to 64 of them (in theory - it's greyed out on my unit). Better still, these are stored on the right hand SDHC card, separate from your media, so most of the time your camera will have that slot filled. Yes, updates can be installed via this slot, but most of the time it will be 'your camera settings'. Good to see that separated from the footage.

You can't record to two cards at the same time, but when the AVCHD recording for SDHC in the left hand SDHC slot comes on line, one could record 1080p for now and 4K for later, or record 2x HD at the same time albeit in two different formats.

Sorry, drifting off away from 'dropped auto features'. But hey, it's a Sony Handycam. All the usual videographer 'lifesavers' are there. If you tape over the 4K and ignore some of the finer points, it looks and feels and works like a Sony NX5.

I'm going to be in 'random stream of factoids' for the next 36 hours - apologies in advance.

I think the markets for the PMW300 and the Z100 are very different. Even the PMW200 has a more ruthless optimisation for the 'broadcast stringer/fly-on-wall-docco/reality-tv gigs. The Z100 gets you a camera that's easy to live and work with, plus some 'expansion' to the average videographer's portfolio.

And I think it's a big move away from 8 bit to 10 bit - that's important. 4K isn't just about resolution, it's about a wider colour range, a wider contrast range. Rec709 is a TWENTY YEAR OLD STANDARD, and 4K moves us on - BT.2020 will be bandied about, I'm sure.

BTW, 422 10 bit HD looks phab on 4K - so I think it's important for the industry to 'gee things up' on that front (quiet at the back, Canon).

It's early days and when we see some real world footage from this cam it'll become clearer (at least in my mind) but Sony sure have been spitting out some interesting cams to cover off almost every niche this last 12 months!

Sorry to keep banging on about it, but check out Malcolm Gladwell and his famous TED talk about spaghetti sauce. There is no one perfect camera. There is one perfect collection of cameraS. You can get a 20% share in one market with one product, but you can go for 50-70% share with a range of products that capture the ends of the bell curve too.

[quote=Ron Evans;1811559]

600mbps is...a lot. But I think the Z100 will also get a long gop codec next year, correct?

edit - yes, the Z100 will get a free, less data intensive long gop codec in mid 2014. I'm assuming it's the same one on the AX1.

Yes it seems like Sony will give the Z100 add the firmware in the AX1 and that would make it a very nice camera.Both cameras in one. Next year it would be the camera to get. But not sure I want to spend the extra money or wait until next year !!!

I am just going through Matt's latest post and one comment is my experience with the NX5U is not to let the iris go beyond F5.6 as the image gets soft and for my comparisons with the CX700 and NX30U I have becomes inferior. I expect it will be the same with a similar size sensor and lens. I keep my NX5U at F4 or more open. My normal range is F1.8 to F3.4 just like the data code says on the small camera in semi auto. Clearly the sweet spot !! I use negative gain and ND filters even in the theatre at times !!!

The NX5U has picture profiles that I assume are now in the paint menu. Will read Matt's posts again.

Ron Evans

Just read Matt's post again. As far as gain is concerned I keep my NX5U at less than 9db. Going to 12db means filtering with Neat filter. On the CX700 and NX30U with the newer sensor they are still very usable at over 21db so this may also be the case with these new 4K cameras too. The camera looks to have the same rubber plug for the LANC remote control. Does it have this port ? The assignable button next to it is assign to expanded focus on the NX5U is this the case too.

Ron Evans

I can't provide any comment on the Gain situation other than listing the numbers (-6, -3, 0, 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18 and 21) as I'm not able to really judge picture quality on my early beta version yet.

But what I can tell you is that, yes - there's a LANC socket and your existing controllers should work just fine. Assign 7 is also marked Focus Magnifier, which is exactly what it does, and it does it whilst recording. There is also an Iris Push Auto button where your pinkie finger 'could' be. I've not developed the muscle memory for this yet so it feels a bit awkward, but I'd rather ride the aperture ring rather than push a button. IMHO. :)

Matt. The Z100 and AX1 seem to have both a host and peripheral USB interface just like some of the Sony Handycams. Do Sony say anything about the use for these ports ? Considering the amount of data it would be nice to be able to connect up large SSD or hard drive for long form recording especially for 10bit 4:2:2 other wise one would be changing 64G cards every few minutes !!!

Ron Evans

Yes: there's a big 'Type A' USB socket and a small 'Type Mini-A' USB socket in the left hand rear panel.

The Mini plug definately allows you to connect to your computer, where the camera switches into 'USB Storage Device' mode and you can access the XQD cards directly. However, I think (!!!) this is USB2 not USB3 - so you're going to be buying a USB3 XQD adaptor pretty quickly. Good in emergencies though. I had it plumbed into my Mac, it all went smoothly, and the 4K rushes slipped into Final Cut Pro X like a bar of soap in a hot bath.

Now, here be dragons... I may get this subtly wrong... but...

The big Type A USB socket is interesting too - you can attach a USB storage device to it and the camera can copy the contents from its XQD cards to it. I haven't tried this, and the only info I have is a little bit of PowerPoint that points to it saying 'USB Host'. You could do something very similar with the FS100, and whilst it could power a USB dongle, it wouldn't power a USB spinning disk - also, at USB2, it could take 45 minutes per card.

This feature may (or may not) be absent from the first release of the camera, as a 'future upgrade'.

I did ask if it could be a streaming video output (could it look like a webcam to WireCast or other streaming services?) or a way to record to external media, but I think it's a no. Yes, I do keep asking about this - the Z1's firewire (given enough Gaffer Tape and exclusion zone round the hardware) straight to disk was brilliant. Yeah, fine, there's ninjas, but... Sigh. Happy days.

Data code for the CX700 and NX30U have shown a max of 28db I think so the range of settings is similar. Just like the NX5U they like putting in the negative gain to make 0 look more sensitive !!! At these max gain settings the CX700 and NX30U as still more usable than the NX5U at 12db so we will have to see how these perform at 4k in low light.

Ron Evans

Can you even guess, and I know images are embargoed, if the Z100 will give as versatile an image as the EX1/3 did. They even did features with them. Then same cams on docs and weddings. Even broadcast. The last Swiss Army Knife cam. Is this the same?

The similarity to the NX5U may be slightly more superficial - different sensor (!), different processor (!), and so on. Again, usual warning - I can't offer any judgement on picture quality, but I have "noticed" (<-- big air quotes) that it's about a stop darker than my EX1.

My method was to set up zebras at 60% on both, zoom onto flat area of tone, set shutter, gain the same, look at difference in aperture - hardly ASC style testing, but hey. Dining room table stuff.

Also, I don't see a dramatic difference between shooting 4K, Quad or HD - the EX1 gives you an extra stop for 720p.

It may well be doing a bit better than the NX5U to EX3 comparisons I have available then. Was a little more than a stop slower. With better noise performance it should be better than the NX5U then. AX1 looks like a very nice successor to the NX5U can't wait !!!!

The hard drive unit for the EX1/3 is very useful. Maybe we will see a similar unit for the XQD interface if the USB is not usable.

Ron Evans

Can you even guess, and I know images are embargoed, if the Z100 will give as versatile an image as the EX1/3 did.

Well here's the thing... EX1/3 has CineGamma, the Z100 has CineTone - immediately, one can predict all that tedious mucking around with knee and black levels and gamma and the rest. We need to get this camera's dynamic range pegged first.

My waters tell me that it will not be filmic, it will have a reality feel - not video-ish, but HD-ish. It will reward people who muck around with the paint controls and control the highlights, who can light nicely, and it will bring back pictures that look good without the need for 'grading'.

Just like the Z1's HDV made for great SD, I'm, erm, guessing that the 4K will make great HD that's full of detail and punching above its weight for a corporate/event image. It's not going to be anywhere near the F5 territory, but the 10 bit 4:2:2 I-frame recording is going to make a difference. The EX1/3 has a bit of (cough) 'texture' to it, which can waste a bit of datarate.

Sorry, talking in circles here. I can give you a 'definite maybe'. :)

Matt, you are right, "We need to get this cameras dynamic range pegged first."

Anybody care to speculate how many lines of resolution these two cameras would resolve?

Would 1500 lines be easy?

With Bayer and Nyquist issues calculated, would 2000 lines be out of the question at best aperture setting?

CT

Anybody care to speculate how many lines of resolution this two cameras would resolve?
Depends on the lens, but with good normal deBayering 80% of the sensor resolution is a decent first estimate: hence 80% of 2160 lpph - so 1728 (probably more realistically around 1700)

Note that's for luminance. Chrominance will be somewhat lower.
With Bayer and Nyquist issues calculated, would 2000 lines be out of the question?
I'd be amazed if anyone got that....... :-)

With due respect, if we're into counting the number of photons dancing on the head of a pin, don't forget that Sony do a very nice line in 4K Cine cameras - F5/55. I fear that the lens may be the limiting factor here.

Remember (oh sheesh, I'm going to sound old now) when the Z1 came out? HDV? I distinctly remember the moment: DSR570 shooting DVCAM, Z1 shooting HDV, downsampled to DV50, then pushed through a really early Colorista. The DSR was actually better, but in 80% of our shoots we couldn't afford a DSR, and with the Z1 i) the shoots would happen and ii) we could do Colour Correction on them. I could see the difference, I could argue for the DSR570, but would the client?

Fast Forward to the Z100. If you're shooting narrative on a microbudget, Black Magic's got you covered. But here's the beef: would you prefer the BMCC or the Z100 if I got you to cover the Notting Hill Carnival by yourself?

What will the camera resolve? Probably not as much as some cameras. But if you downsample its 4K to HD, a lot more than others! LOL

With due respect, if we're into counting the number of photons dancing on the head of a pin, don't forget that Sony do a very nice line in 4K Cine cameras - F5/55.
Forgive me if I misunderstand, but it sounds a little like you think the F5/55 should be superior in predicted resolution, at least in terms of the sensor alone?

If so, it's not true. Neither is it true for any Bayer 3840x2160 sensor - the best you're likely to get out of them in terms of luminance resolution is about 1700 lpph. This is inherent in the working of the Bayer sensor and the deBayering process. Figures vary, but comments like "halfway between true sensor resolution and 50% of it" and "about 80%" seem the norm and generally accepted. One things for sure - you WON'T get 2160 lpph out of such a sensor, be it an F5/55, an PXW-Z100, or one from anybody else of those dimensions.

What I'm NOT saying is that it must therefore follow that the an PXW-Z100 is therefore just as good as an F5/55. That would be to ignore lens issues, but most importantly all sorts of other factors such as diffraction limiting and dynamic range to name just two. What I would say is that because of the sensor dimensions, the MAXIMUM resolution EITHER camera could be expected to give is around 1700 lpph.

Practically, then I don't disagree with the practical points you make with reference to Z1 and DSRs. I was just replying to a straightforward "what resolution can we expect" question. And 1700lpph needs to be seen as a maximum figure for any 3840x2160 sensor - a camera may meet the figure in centre frame, but not at the edge, due to lens issues, for example. What it can never do is exceed (roughly) that figure - and that's as true for an F5/55 as for a PXW-Z100.

If it's using the normal Sony Cinematone gammas and 709 with knee it should be around 10 stops which is is pretty good from the approx 1 to 1.5 micron pixels (given the lenses focal length the active area of the sensor may be about 1/3").
The EX1/PMW200/PMW/300 pixels are roughly 3 microns, F5/F55/FS700 roughly 5.6 microns.
As there is a direct correlation between pixel size, dynamic range, sensitivity and signal to noise ratio, even though this is a back illuminated sensor (which will help make up for the light lost in the bayer filter) I think the numbers above will tell you where the Z100 and AX1 will sit. Noise reduction has improved in recent years so noise can be better masked although this comes at the expense of smear and some image softening. But noise reduction becomes less and less effective at higher gain levels.

Can't help but observe that the specs for the NX5 lens and Z100 lens appear identical: NX5U f = 4.1 to 82.0 mm (equivalent to f = 29.5 to 590 mm at 16:9 mode, f = 36.1 to 722 mm at 4.3 mode on 35 mm lens)
Z100 f = (equivalent to 29.5mm to 590mm)

But Sony are not publishing the actual focal length for the Z100. Is this because it would tell us the actual active area of the sensor????

I have never scaled down 4k video for delivery to HD before. Now, I know this is a complex question and I'm not quite sure how to word this;

When shooting in 4k, the image "noise" or "grit" or "dirt" should be very fine and detailed. Now, in theory, when it is scaled down to HD, the noise should become "smaller" and less noticeable?

Or....

Will the noise be a certain "size" based on the surface area of the entire sensor and not the resolution or density of it?

That's a strange way to put it but I'm trying to think of any advantages of deliberately shooting 4k for the purpose of HD delivery. (noise "perception" is reduced??)

Does that make any sense? lol

Overall, downsampling averages and throws away detail, be it desired (image data) or undesired (noise), for which the target image size doesn't have the resolution to represent.

It's impossible to do a perfect downsampling without any spacial artifacts. The sharpness advantage of 4K-downsampled-to-HD over native HD you may see is largely due to the optical anti-aliasing filter fixed to deal with the highest spatial sampling of 4K.

I did this cropping when I first got my FX1 HDV to SD. It worked very well and expect to do the same with hopefully the FDR-AX1 when I get one !! The noise will stay the same size relative to the pixels. If you just crop a HD sized image from the 4k image you will be taking roughly a 2k image( image and noise ) from the 8k source. In viewing terms the pixels will look 4 times bigger and so will the noise compared to the 4K image on a 4K TV. On a HD TV I don't think you will see the difference. The more you zoom in of course the more significant the effects noise may become as you will now be using a scaling function and how you do this will govern the output. When I did this with HDV to SD DV I fixed the scale as a crop and just panned around or choose a different position in an attempt to eliminate any scaling issues.

Ron Evans

It depends on how you do the down conversion.If you do a simple down scale then the noise will have a similar level but with larger effective grain size. A good quality anti aliased downscale should result in a very slight reduction in noise as adjacent 4k pixels will be averaged together so any random noise ends up getting reduced very slightly.

The sharpness or resolution of a good quality video camera is governed by the optical low pass filter. These filters are always a compromise as the cut-off is not instant. So an OLPF designed for an HD camera will start reducing contrast quite some way before 1080 and then still allow some detail beyond 1080 to leak through which manifests itself as a small amount of aliasing. As a result you will get a gradual fall off in contrast as you approach the cameras maximum resolution and this has a noticeable effect on the perceived sharpness of the image. If you start with a nice 4k Bayer sensor the you should have a resolution of around 3.2k which you can down convert digitally to HD. A digital low pass filter can be far sharper and more precise than an optical filter so you can get better contrast at the limits of the down converted resolution.

But all of this depends on just how well you do the down conversion and it may take a bit of work to find the optimum settings, plus some decent computing power to do the conversion quickly. Get the down conversion wrong and you will get aliasing artefacts that may spoil the image, possibly not obviously so at the first generation but something that may appear after subsequent encoding passes.

Can't help but observe that the specs for the NX5 lens and Z100 lens appear identical: NX5U f = 4.1 to 82.0 mm (equivalent to f = 29.5 to 590 mm at 16:9 mode, f = 36.1 to 722 mm at 4.3 mode on 35 mm lens)
Z100 f = (equivalent to 29.5mm to 590mm)

But Sony are not publishing the actual focal length for the Z100. Is this because it would tell us the actual active area of the sensor????

I've asked, but answer came there none. Hmmm.

So... I sort of did an unscientific test by comparing the EX1 and Z100 on top of each other and observing the difference in angle of view - the EX1 is a little bit wider. 6-8% or so?

If the EX1 lens 'sort of' starts at the equivalent of a FF35 32mm lens, we might say that the Z100 kinda looks like a 35mm lens? But my figures don't tally with yours probably because I forgot to factor in the 16:9-ness. I don't have an NX5 to compare with.

But I do feel many videographers should be factoring the cost of a 'Wangle adaptor' - I wonder if the NX5 kit (with wide lens shade and French flag) would suit?

As for the 709 thing - here we get into a whole new ball of wax. Please do correct me if I'm wrong, but one of the side benefits of 4K was a bigger colour gamut - bigger than Rec709, probably the DCI P3 thing, plus the shift to 10 bits per channel too. Hence, 422 10 bit HD looks very nice upsampled to HD, whereas 420 8 bit stuff doesn't, therefore a good idea to shift to 10 bit. I am clinging on to this info by my fingernails and liable to oversimplify!

PS - @David, no, I was just wanting to distribute the point that the Z100 wasn't going to be a 'cheap F5'. LOL

It remains to be found out the differences between PXW-Z100 and the FDR-AX1. This is the AX1 page on the Sony site Sony 4K/60p Ultra HD Camcorder | 4K Camcorder Review | FDR-AX1 | Sony USA (http://store.sony.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=8198552921666597838#specifications) Lens specs look identical to my NX5U. The FD-AX1 sensor looks just like my Cybershot HX30V, same size, same sensor count 18.9MP. The HX30VB takes stills at 4,896×2,752 and will do so while shooting video at 60i with OIS and Active EIS !! If you set it for 60P it cannot takes stills at the same time . Probably drain the battery and get too hot to hold !!! Does the PXW-Z100 have a different sensor to the FDR-AX1 ?

Ron Evans

Does the PXW-Z100 have a different sensor to the FDR-AX1 ?

Ron Evans

I'm betting the sensor is the same.

As far as the Z100 being a cheap F5, or even a cheap F55 - yes! For me and my budget, anyway. I can't justify getting an F5, much less an F55, but the Z100 should be within my reach - barely. Besides the no raw video option, doesn't the Z100 have the same XAVC codec as the F55?
For $6,500 I don't expect an F55. I'll settle for a 1/2.3" 4K camera.

And I'd pick the Z100 and AX1 over the cheaper BM4K, just because of the ease of use. No lenses, no rigs, no external battery source required. Just unpack, add a battery and media card, and off I go.

I think the sensor is the same too. Sony marketing giving differentiation for a year before installing the LongGOP firmware. If that was available at the introduction the PXW-Z100 would be my choice too. However for my theatre show stuff the FDR-AX1 is a nice replacement for my NX5U even at 1920x1080 doing 60P a nice match with my CX700 and NX30U with 4K as a bonus. May indicate that the HDMI output from the FDR-AX1 may be 10bit 4:2:2 at some point with the HDMI 2.0 firmware update !!!

Ron Evans

As it stands right now, I still consider this the Z1U of the 4K generation. Give it another 2 years and the imperfections like the minor CA and the bayer artifacting and interpolation will be greatly lessened in a newer model that would be the EX1 of the 4K generation. (which would include manual controls instead of servo)

I also wonder if we'll see the return of Letus adapters if the DSLRs don't catch up to 4K in time, which I wouldn't doubt within the next year.

I think its more appropriate to consider the PXW-Z100 the NX5U of the 4K generation and the FDR-AX1 the AX2000 of the 4K generation since they look to have used a lot of these models in the construction and retained AVCHD recording too. I don't think I will see much difference operating one of these cameras to my NX5U !!! Same batteries, Lanc controller, mic etc. The AX2000 had a smaller battery, no mic, less menu controls, no HD-SDi, timecode input and did not have the ability to use the FMU128 compared to the NX5U. Looks like the FDR-AX1 does not come with a mic, no HD-SDI .........

Ron Evans

I'm more referring to the image quality rather than the functionality. I personally want to stick to my BP-U workflow and semi-manual Fujinon lens. It would be very bad if the BP-U line of batteries is retired after the PMW-300. Only with the BP-U lineup can you get a 96Wh battery.

This Z100 looks pretty darn nice. But I think I'm going to wait for NAB 2014 and see the new "Z200" before I buy into single small sensor 4k right now.

I think the Z100 is the entry level "PMW-100-class" camera of today. The new "Z200" will have three 1/2 inch sensors that run behind that wonderfull PMW200/EX1 Fujinon lens that we all love so much today.

I have no idea that this is true, but I strongly suspect this camera is in the works as we speak.

"PXW-Z200" should I hold my breath? ;-)

CT

Another promo video for the PXW-Z100 this time not the FDR-AX1. PXW-Z100 (XDCAM 4K Handheld Camcorder) - YouTube

Ron Evans

I think to suggest that the AS1 or Z100 are a poor mans F5 or F55 is pushing things a bit. I would say the FS700 is closer to a poor mans F5 than the Z100, even though it can't do 4K without adding extra stuff.

I think the HD from and FS700 will look closer to the 4K from the F5/F55 than the 4K from a Z100 or AS1.

The only thing the Z100 has in common with an F5 is 4K XAVC. It will not have the same dynamic range, noise, sensitivity, DoF etc. Resolution is only a very small part of the whole image quality equation and the end viewer is more likely to notice all the other things before they notice whether its HD or 4K.

The Z100 is more a B camera to the F5/F55 etc.

One interesting consideration is that so far no one has launched a 4K ENG style camera with 2/3" sensors. It's interesting that we have plenty of large sensor cameras and a couple of small sensor 4K cameras (don't forget about the JVC) but nothing in the middle. I wonder if we will ever see one? Certainly shoulder mount cameras are not as ubiquitous as they used to be.

I think to suggest that the AS1 or Z100 are a poor mans F5 or F55 is pushing things a bit. I would say the FS700 is closer to a poor mans F5 than the Z100, even though it can't do 4K without adding extra stuff.

I think the HD from and FS700 will look closer to the 4K from the F5/F55 than the 4K from a Z100 or AS1.

The only thing the Z100 has in common with an F5 is 4K XAVC. It will not have the same dynamic range, noise, sensitivity, DoF etc. Resolution is only a very small part of the whole image quality equation and the end viewer is more likely to notice all the other things before they notice whether its HD or 4K.

The Z100 is more a B camera to the F5/F55 etc.

One interesting consideration is that so far no one has launched a 4K ENG style camera with 2/3" sensors. It's interesting that we have plenty of large sensor cameras and a couple of small sensor 4K cameras (don't forget about the JVC) but nothing in the middle. I wonder if we will ever see one? Certainly shoulder mount cameras are not as ubiquitous as they used to be.

Sure, the Z100 is no F55. No one here is suggesting such a thing, I'm pretty sure. Obviously, a 1/2.3" sensor will have plenty of drawbacks compared to an S35 sensor.

But as far as this "poor man," the Z100 is as close as I can get to an F55. And neither the FS700 nor the F5 can record 4K internally, without an expensive add-on recorder. At least the F55 and Z100 share this feature. They even share the same codec, minus raw video (I think). The Z100 does it for less than the price of an FS700 body. That's a bargain to this poor man.

And if the Z100 will make a good b-cam to the F55, then that's a huge, huge bonus. I'd settle for b-cam work to an F55 any day. I'd be ecstatic to get such shoots.

I finally got to see a 4K monitor in Best Buy (video shot on an F65, I think). I was floored! I'll take 4K resolution, even if dynamic range and sensitivity is lost on a 1/2.3" chip. For $6,500, you can't have it all.

As far as a 2/3" 4K sensor, let's not forget Panasonic has recently announced such a device. I won't be surprised if it shows up in a shoulder mount design in the near future.

All this talk of a 1/2.3" chip on this drool worthy cam, remember almost certainly it uses only a 1/3" portion since that is what the lens is designed for.

All this talk of a 1/2.3" chip on this drool worthy cam, remember almost certainly is uses only a 1/3" portion since that is what the leans is designed for.

OK. I'm good with that.

Another promo video for the PXW-Z100 this time not the FDR-AX1. PXW-Z100 (XDCAM 4K Handheld Camcorder) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiHTcwygZyg)

Ron Evans

Thanks, Ron! Nice video.

Another piece of information that is of interest as i am sure the early information on the FDR-AX1 showed it having LongGOP XAVCS 8bit 4:2:0 and AVCHD with the PXW-Z100 just XAVC 10bit 4:2:2. The current spec for the FDR-AX1 does not now show AVCHD and a note that says AVCHD will come in an upgrade in 2014 together with a USB and HDMI upgrade !! Seems like both will get the upgrade and the difference will then be just XAVCS 8bit 4:2:0 or XAVC 10 bit 4:2:2 with HD-SDI etc I will always need the LongGOP for the length of my shoots so as much as I like the idea of 10bit 4:2:2 unless it possible to connect up a 1T drive it won't work for me !!!

Ron Evans

I think the HD from and FS700 will look closer to the 4K from the F5/F55 than the 4K from a Z100 or AS1.

The only thing the Z100 has in common with an F5 is 4K XAVC. It will not have the same dynamic range, noise, sensitivity, DoF etc. Resolution is only a very small part of the whole image quality equation and the end viewer is more likely to notice all the other things before they notice whether its HD or 4K.

Especially if you are viewing on a monitor smaller than 65 inches or so. I'm really not excited about
this camera. To me it smells like Sony trying to push 4k....just like they tried to push 3D. I just don't see
the need for 4K for consumers. For pros, yeah when you are making a movie for a 60 foot screen it
makes sense. But for small one man video companies, the pipeline just doesn't seem to be there
to create, edit, and deliver in 4K for your clients....and this camera seems to be directly pointed at
those 'prosumers'. But hey, what do I know? Stills camera makers used th 'megapixel race' to keep
new cameras selling, so the video camera makers need to keep the 'resolution wars' going. I for one
am not buying into 4k until the tech is much more developed......and this is coming from a guy who
owns a FS700.

Looking at these two sister 4k cameras, it seems the AX1 has been given a VERY aggressive feature set. In fact, I'm surprised it was not branded a "4K NXCAM". If there is a new 4K NXCAM like this slated in the future,...how could it possibly sit above the Handycam version but below the XDCAM version? There is almost no marketing room for it in this type of camera.

This leads me to wonder,...for future 4K cameras, could Sony dissolve the NXCAM brand and simply place all "pro" and "semi pro" cameras in a wider market spanning XDCAM fleet?

In other words, could "XDCAM" now cover the market range that NXCAM used to cover and leave "Handycam" to pick up the "low end Pro"? (I started thinking about this when the PMW100 was released)

Look at the L battery now being used on the Z100. That's the first XDCAM camera to use the cheaper L battery over a traditional XDCAM BP battery.

I dunno, just it seems they are pushing XDCAM further down into NXCAM territory and moving "Handycam" further up into NXCAM turf. (NXCAM is getting squeezed from the top and the bottom!)

Could the new XAVC codec make NXCAM 4K simply no longer necessary?

Is that crazy talk?