I finally found a moment to upload a couple of snaps from NAB at the BlackMagic booth.

Shots of the camera with both types of mounts. A shot which illustrates the location of the audio jacks. A shot of a 128gb media card.

I have shots of the menus - I'll post them if you like but they aren't very good - I don't like to post very soft pictures, but I'll do it if someone would find it of value. All I had at NAB was a Flip cam, and it doesn't close focus at all.

I'm not really in the market for new cameras right now, but I love companies, like BlackMagic, who put their best foot forward in every endeavor, so this project has my attention, for that reason.

one more - the display at NAB - just so you can feel as if you were there!

any one else concerned that 470gb or what ever it is only gets you 5 hours! i guess that's the price you pay for 2k

470gb only gets you five hours with ProRes/DNxHD. For the full 2.5k raw you're only looking at about an hour in the same space!

120gb SSDs are available right now at newegg for $99, that gets you nearly 80 minutes of prores - per minute that's about the same as you get with sandisk CF cards for a DSLR.

470gb only gets you five hours with ProRes/DNxHD. For the full 2.5k raw you're only looking at about an hour in the same space!

120gb SSDs are available right now at newegg for $99, that gets you nearly 80 minutes of prores - per minute that's about the same as you get with sandisk CF cards for a DSLR.


Ahhh! And now the real discussion begins! I was curious about the space requirements for raw. I saw the 5hr spec for pro res which is just fine for my needs.
1 hour taking 470gb is a different animal altogether!!
Gonna need my own personal "cloud" of storage for that stuff!

BH is taking pre orders BTW!!

I'm not sure because i wasn't around when 1080 came around but Im sure it was the same deal as far as storage. As technology moves forward Im sure it will become more practical and it will be a non issue.

Storage Rates 5 MB/frame in RAW 2.5K fits about 30 minutes of 24p video on a 256 GB solid state disk. Compressed HD formats fit more than 5 times the amount of RAW video.

Chris - is it too soon to have a separate forum for this baby?

So I just found out about this camera and it sounds amazing for the price. However, is there any footage shot from the camera anywhere? Doing a google search hasn't turned up much. I would love to see some raw footage.

Blackmagic Cinema Camera - John Brawley (http://vimeopro.com/johnbrawleytests/blackmagic-cinema-camera/video/40381671)

I am not sure this is RAW footage. I saw the BMD at NAB. They had three hooked up to monitors
pointed at a Tiki hut with models hovering around. The hut had a yellow hue to it.
The viewfinder looked like it had a yellow cast. That could have been all the yellow in the scene.
The broadcast monitor looked better and more balanced. BUT, remember, this shoots RAW and
comes with Resolve to grade the 12bit RAW stream it records on board, so I would estimate that
the color could be pulled all over the place if necessary.

This was the deal of NAB 2012 imho. Despite it's plastic like shell and lack of places to hang externals,
there promises to be a LONG wait list.

Not too soon, no, but there's not gonna be a lot of hands-on to talk about... for awhile, anyway.

BUT, remember, this shoots RAW and
comes with Resolve to grade the 12bit RAW stream it records on board, so I would estimate that
the color could be pulled all over the place if necessary.

This was the deal of NAB 2012 imho..

This is going to be the interesting question - how flexible is the image? Even between RED cameras, the EPIC image is much more flexible than the RED ONE, even with the same color science. You can push the EPIC all over the place in the grade. RED ONE is a bit more limited (though still one of the most flexible images available).

It will be interesting to see how flexible the BMD image is - certainly with their experience with Resolve, the outlook is promising. But even all RAW images are not created equally.

And delivering this camera with both Ultrascope and Resolve makes it almost too cheap to pass on...it's an insane value. It's great to see what another company, with no trickleware model to protect, can do.

And very nice to meet you and get a chance to hang out at NAB last week, Jacques - good luck with the Superior shoot - hopefully you can put one of these BMD cameras to work!

Despite its... lack of places to hang externals...

C'mon, Jacques -- it has three 1/4-20 sockets in a row right across the top!

Not to mention places to hang, externally (via the neckstrap bales).

Pic attached... see?

It would be fun to get a hold of some RAW sample files of this camera and then push them around in Resolve to see what they do.

C'mon, Jacques -- it has three 1/4-20 sockets in a row right across the top!

Not to mention places to hang, externally (via the neckstrap bales).

Pic attached... see?

These are fine for a microphone or a wireless - but you can't build a true cinema rig with them. The rigging options are limited for sure. Plus, 3 holes doesn't equate to three items - it just shows you where you can put them, but the width of objects like a secondary monitor for your focus puller or a wireless video signal - all that stuff won't fit on the top of the camera. No doubt 3rd party options will be forthcoming...or a cage system - does make it awkward though.

At 2.5K RAW, it's cinema grade, for sure, but the ergonomics have some limitations which will require a bit of tinkering.

For documentary shooting, it looks fantastic.

Agreed. Just messing with Jacques a bit; he and I go waaaay back.

The camera looks great value but the optional Blackmagic Cinema Camera Handles at $195 while not in Zacuto territory seems very expensive for a piece of bent metal & a couple of bicycle handlebar grips. Blackmagic Design: Blackmagic Cinema Camera Models (http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/blackmagiccinemacamera/models/)

Expect an Ebay version for $30.00 a month after release.

Probably I'm pointing the obvious, but the quoted 2.3X crop is somehow misleading. The crop factor of the BMD sensor compared to S35 (24X13.5 HD aspect) which is the motion picture standard is only 1.5X which is not bad at all. Certainly much better than the 2.2X of the 2/3inch ENG.
You can get a 2.8 DOF equivelant with 1.8 lenses. Since many L primes and Zeiss lenses are 1.4 or better, for me the sensor size is not an issue, apart from the lack of choise in the wide end. On the other hand we must not forget the benefit of working with the center of these wide coverage lenses.

seems very expensive for a piece of bent metal & a couple of bicycle handlebar grips

I found it funny though that by adding a simple lcd hood or a handle they have got 3 "incredible versatile" versions. I think accesoires companies will have a blast developing add ons for this thing.

Probably I'm pointing the obvious, but the quoted 2.3X crop is somehow misleading. The crop factor of the BMD sensor compared to S35 (24X13.5 HD aspect) which is the motion picture standard is only 1.5X which is not bad at all. Certainly much better than the 2.2X of the 2/3inch ENG.
You can get a 2.8 DOF equivelant with 1.8 lenses. Since many L primes and Zeiss lenses are 1.4 or better, for me the sensor size is not an issue, apart from the lack of choise in the wide end. On the other hand we must not forget the benefit of working with the center of these wide coverage lenses.

And compared to M4/3 like the GH2 it is only 1.2x.

I think the reason why so many are calling it a 2.3x crop is due to the use of EF lenses which typically people think of using with a FF camera on the high end. You are right however that in terms of S35 it isn't all that bad. Now if it would have supported PL lenses I think people would question it as much

Wow, I didn't notice those 1/4x20 holes in the top. Thanks Hurd. Caught me again :-)

The bottom line is, love it or hate it or even if you don't give a care about it, BlackMagic's cine cam has rocked the camera world, and they will sell thousands. Other manufacturers can continue to charge super high prices at their own risk, because as has also been stated, if BMD can deliver this at $3K with Resolve, what might they do in six more months or by NAB 2013? They could put a larger sensor (pick a favorite) into a metal chassis, up the bit rate to 16 and easily get $6K (Ssh, don't let them know some would pay even more!).

Exciting times with a cam like this, software like Smoke coming down to $3500 and thunderbolt all over the place.

Here's an interview about the Blackmagic camera:

Blackmagic Cinema Camera 2012 NAB interview on Vimeo

All makes perfect sense now as far as the sensor size used. As the guy from Blackmagic said in the interview, 2.5k was the biggest picture they could record in raw to the ssd. Maybe for those who would like to see an S35 or FF35 sensor from Black magic, they may be waiting until they come up with a raid array of ssd's.

Or figure out a compression scheme like RED - but there is a heck of a lot more to this than one might guess.

All makes perfect sense now as far as the sensor size used. As the guy from Blackmagic said in the interview, 2.5k was the biggest picture they could record in raw to the ssd. Maybe for those who would like to see an S35 or FF35 sensor from Black magic, they may be waiting until they come up with a raid array of ssd's.

CineformRAW is better choice. SI2K at $3K will be better:)

Do anyone know how the Iris is controled? I see an Iris button at the top left corner, is it then changed with the left/right arrow at the bottom or just by touch on screen?

On the blackmagic site it says about the iris controll function: "Iris button automatically adjusts the lens iris settings so no pixel is clipped"
Not sure what that means, can't be that the camera decides what the best Iris value is?

All makes perfect sense now as far as the sensor size used. As the guy from Blackmagic said in the interview, 2.5k was the biggest picture they could record in raw to the ssd. Maybe for those who would like to see an S35 or FF35 sensor from Black magic, they may be waiting until they come up with a raid array of ssd's.

2.5k off a S35mm sensor should be no different from 2.5k off any other sized sensor, so I imagine it has more to do with the sheer cost of manufacturing a larger sensor.

Ahem,
Yes of course you are right Mark! I have no idea what i was thinking when i wrote that post!!

Adam Wilt has done a 2nd report on the Blackmagic camera:

ProVideo Coalition.com: Camera Log by Adam Wilt | Founder | Pro Cameras, HDV Camera, HD Camera, Sony, Panasonic, JVC, RED, Video Camera Reviews (http://provideocoalition.com/index.php/awilt/story/nab_2012_is_bmd_the_new_red_part_2/)

To reply to my own question above...

Quote from the above linked article:
"• The camera uses a Canon-compatible EF mount. EOS lens apertures can be adjusted using the FWD/REV transport buttons on the camera’s back panel (at present, though, there’s no iris readout on the camera; that would be another nice thing to see in the release firmware)."

The camera might just slot in into the niche created by dslrs and just wipe them clean. A lot of people though are comparing the Blackmagic Digital cinema camera with cameras which are more than triple it's price. I think that's unfair. This camera will only capitalize on the dslrs. Whether or not it will surpass it's hype remains to be seen.

Oh by the way, I wrote up an article of this on my blog, if anyone is interested in reading further. Please leave a comment or feedback. I need more information to quench this thirst of mine.

Fadly.M.H.Wychowvski: My take on the Black Magic Design's Digital Cinema Camera (http://fadlywychowvski.blogspot.com/2012/04/5-things-to-note-about-black-magic.html)

The camera might just slot in into the niche created by dslrs and just wipe them clean

I honestly don't believe that, eventhough the blackmagic is a mainly a real "filmmakers" tool while the dslr is trying to be, the only reason why one should buy a blackmagic is it's ability to shoot raw and I read here it can record only 30 min to a 256gb ssd drive in that format. While a dslr is a bear to operate in real time the blackmagic seems virtually impossible to handle in realtime situations so I see it as a tool specifically aimed at corporate, commercial or filmmakers market where you have the time to set up and operate. For filmmakers on a budget that are using a dslr now they probably will continue to use dslr's, a canon 550d f.i. has still one of the cheapest workflows (taking it's purchase price into account) to emulate that filmlook. Also for wedding videographers where dslr's are very popular they will continue to use it as a blackmagic has no benefit here. Many are tempted by it's low price point but taking its difficult workflow into account and it's big cropfactor (and you still need to invest in expensive ssd drives and external batteries) I'd say that some people will be very happy with it but it won't clean out the dslr's niche yet.

Not true at all. No camera offers native ProRes422 or DnxHD shooting right out of the box like this camera does. Sure this isn't raw which is the main focus of the camera but I know a lot of people who are just as excited to be able to have a DSLR form factor camera without the annoying compression artifacts. Raw converted to ProRes422 in the camera is going to look pretty darn good. There are a lot of people out there trying very hard to piggy back an external recorder to the HDMI port on DSLR's just to be able to get 4:2:2 color. With the Blackmagic camera shooting directly to ProRes will give you this right out of the box.

As a Panasonic GH1 user who enjoys hacking my camera there are six areas we wish we could get to with our hacks.

1. As low of compression as possible.
2. 4:2:2 color.
3. Decent audio ports with actual audio control.
4. As little of in camera sharpening as possible or at least have control over it
5. Elimination of moire and aliasing.
6. 10bit or higher color recording

The Blackmagic camera solves all of those problems with ProRes recording basically giving DSLR users what they have always wanted. I'm not 100% sure on #4 but if I had to take a guess it should look cleaner then most video cameras out of the box since it is designed to have a raw look.

Of course this doesn't mean being able to fit an hour of video on a single SDHC card but it does mean 5x the recording space compared to raw. As silly as it may seem right now I bet a lot of people wouldn't mind this at all considering what they will get out of it.

I know a lot of GH2 users who would gladly move to a GH3 if it just solved one of those areas.

Excellent summary of this camera's advantages over existing DSLR's, Thomas.

I think those points do a great job of cutting through the hype surrounding the camera and point to some specific features this unit will bring to the market that haven't been available at this price point.

Allan Barnwell
Omega Broadcast Group - Professional Video Sales, Rental & Services (http://www.omegabroadcast.com)

Thomas nailed many of the thoughts that I tried to put into words earlier in this thread but was not able to articulate as clearly. I paid $1500 for the ability to record ProRes to SSD with the Samurai. This basically has that built in!

I know the sensor size is odd, but once you get a few lenses and you acclimated, i think it will be a fine tool for the anyones toolkit.

IT truly makes sense to have a M4/3 adapter with this camera, having better choice of lenses:
Nokton 25mm, 17.5mm F 0.95, Olympus 12mm, 45mm, Panasonic 17mm, 45mm IS.
Optically mentioned lenses are better than Canon L lenses, IMO and made for sensor that is similar in size.

There are other cameras that record in ProRes the most notable being the Arri Alexa which also has the option to record in RAW although from what I read the vast majority of users shoot ProRes with the Alexa.

Does anyone know if this camera can be set to record single frames? We are looking into using it for a film printer.

It's been about a month since this camera was announced. I know it doesn't ship until July....but has anyone seen or heard anything new regarding it? I was hoping there would be some new clips posted or some new information released by now to keep our appetites peaked.

Today is the BMD show in Burbank I expect any news to be launched from there, If there is I will post as soon as I return from the show,

Today is the BMD show in Burbank I expect any news to be launched from there, If there is I will post as soon as I return from the show,

You're headed to the show from Denver? Nice! I guess I asked this question on the right day I see!

Please post any news that you hear. I am particularly interested to confirm that the OIS on EOS lenses will work. I suspect it should....but this is a big thing for me since I will be shooting a decent amount of handheld clips.

Thanks!

Actually headed from Ohio.

Actually headed from Ohio.

Philip,

What brings you to Ohio? Or is your profile location wrong? Also.....are you going strictly for the BMD event or do you have other business out there? Just asking as it seems like a large trip for a single manufacturer. I know I'd like to be there.

MArty

In Columbus taking care of family matters for an indefinite stay, commuting to LA.

Was at BMD show. Mixed feelings. Cam is very filmic, but the LCD is a joke and is far far from an accurate picture, must have external monitor. Only 45 minutes RAW on 500GB SSD. Team is really nice and well meaning guys but clearly they do not know image capture. Lots of strange decisions like omitting compressed 60p becuase they could not do it with RAW. Seem to think this is a RAW cam when most people will shoot log compressed. Jello but they say it will be better in production version. NO Image Stabilization at ship, maybe latter. Still July ship from factory but may not arrive at dealers till later, Cannot emphasize enough how awful the LCD is. Only three ISO settings, 400, 800, 1600. Only three WB settings. This is a very crippled camera.

Everyone wants RAW and sees only that, ignoring the usability of the camera and the extreme workflow and post production equipment requirements. They estimate 4-5000 preorders, and up to two month backlog at ship. I predict lots of them will go to people who ignore the real workflow and design issues and let their cameras sit on the shelf. But for those who understand what a cine camera is, and need that specialized instrument the camera will be great.

Wow. That is disappointing. I am still very interested but it seems like a lot of features are missing. I was hoping the LCD would be decent....is it not even as good as LCD on other cameras like af-100 or fs-100? I don't necessarily expect it to be 100% accurate to a field monitor but it should be at least good enough to focus and frame your scenes.

I too will be shooting primarily in a ProRes with Raw as an option when needed. WHat were your impressions of the crop factor? What lens did you see on it and how did it feel? Did it feel extremely cropped?

I am getting this camera for my narrative style work and hanging onto my XLh1 kit for more event oriented work. I considered selling my H1 and buying an af-100 or fs100, but thought BMD cam would allow me to keep the H1 and have a 2nd more "cine" style camera. Obviously these shallow DOF cameras aren't ideal for run and gun ENG type of shooting....so different tools for different jobs.

Any other thoughts? Can you elaborate on the filmic look?

The LCD is good only for framing. It was hard to see clearly indoors, outside would match my feeling about the LCD - pathetic. It was tellng tha mearly everyone turned to the tabletop external monitor when they played with focus. It will probably be good for focus, but do not forget that it is a touch screen that hides the controls so you loose image when you need to change settings.

On the external monitor the cam produced nice creamy images that look pretty good (hard to tell without a LUT being applied).

Forget the AF100, the GH2 hacked is much better and cheaper if you want m4/3..

They had a canon 24-105 on the camera, at f4 not the best choice for indoor demo of a cam limited to 1600ISO

Can't find anything about using legacy lenses on this cam..? Is this basically like the GH2 where you can use any lens with the right adapter?

Are there any cold shoes or 1/4" threads anywhere to attach things?

Can't find anything about using legacy lenses on this cam..? Is this basically like the GH2 where you can use any lens with the right adapter?
No. You can't use m4/3 or c-mount lenses (even with a 2x adapter).