GY-HMQ10U JVC Professional Features page (http://pro.jvc.com/prof/attributes/features.jsp?model_id=MDL102132)

Here's the press release..: http://pro.jvc.com/pro/pr/2012/releases/gyhmq10.html

Steve
Bethlehem, Pa.

Man, I so want this! Affordable 4K video capture. I have no idea what I'd do with the video, but I still want one!!!

Pan and zoom a FullHD window through a Quad HD frame.

I've tested this using iMovie's KenBurns FX. Just like working with a huge photo. Very sweet!

Zooming works in Media Composer.

FCP, MC, iM all import QDHD ProRes.

Missing info on utility that reads 4 streams sequentially and converts to 1 stream of QDHD ProRes.

It seems camera will down-convert to HD. Output via HDMI -- YES. Output a file -- don't know yet. Worse case -- perhaps files on one card are down converted to an HD file on a second card.

PS: Wait for the screams about not being able to get a shallow DOF. :( This is not strictly true since it seems the chip is 1/2-inch and the max F-stop is 2.8.

Steve, I agree on the DoF. This is basically a single chip EX1 that can shoot in 4K - and for a cheaper price. What's not to love?
The thought of holding a camera in my hands that can shoot 4K video, for less than $5,000, is simply mind-boggling. I was expecting it to be in the $6-8,000 price range.

I had heard it was going to be $6000 and was very depressed. I simply can't spend that much!

Good point about it being a single chip EX1!

This is great news.I just hope this means that JVC will be coming out with a shoulder mount version, and if it is $10,000.00 or less with 1/2" chips I would take two right away and a third by the end of the year.I pushed back my camera upgrade until this year and It looks like I maybe glad I waited

I am beginning to think the shoulder mount crowd has just been forgotten.

I disagree with that. I think JVC will always have a flagship camera for studios and news crews. this is what the HD250 was and what the HM790 is. these are the type of camera's that I would be interested in, where I use in the studio and in the field.
I can't imagine that JVC would increase the quality in it's prosumer cameras and not increase the quality in it's professional cameras.It has to many TV stations and small production houses that use their equipment to not address that market. If I am wrong there is always Sony or Panasonic. I hope not I have use JVC cameras sense KY29 days

JVC has a good business in news. But these customers don't need 4K. And won't for years.

For the Indie crowd, JVC is showing a 1.?" sensor 4K camera with a Nikon mount.

This could become a shoulder-mount.

It's a 1.25" 8.3 megapixel sensor, with a Nikon F-mount.

CES 2012 JVC 4K2K with Interchangeable lens - YouTube

4K resolution for 5K US... that's close enough to being what I was hoping for with the Red Scarlet. It's a shame it "only" does 60p at 4K, as I'd love to have the proposed Red's 120fps, but 50/60p means smooth half speed replays, and that quarter speed replays still look ok. Looks like JVC have managed to make what could be the camera to replace my HM700.

Zooming works in Media Composer.


Hey Steve,

Could you explain this? I thought MC was unable to zoom into footage without quality loss, cause it resizes (or crops) footage on import.

Thanks!

JVC has a history of coming up with innovative ideas and systems. Yet they always fall behind in market perception at the end.

Hey Steve,

Could you explain this? I thought MC was unable to zoom into footage without quality loss, cause it resizes (or crops) footage on import.

Thanks!

Good catch! The Pan_Scan function cannot zoom. But since it can pan & scan within 4K2K -- it doesn't crop AMA ProRes imports.

PS: I've heard that the Pan_Scan_Zoom function, which was limited to photos, now works with video. It's on my list of things to check when I get back.

OT Puzzle: where in the world is Steve reading the "First Impressions" story and wondering about the needed utility?

I'm hoping that since JVC released ProHD utilities for the Mac and PC they will simply modify them to bring data, via USB, from 4 cards in the camcorder into one's computer. Although there is a spec for 4K2K H.264 (Level 5.1 and 5.2) they only reach 30p.

I'm assuming there will be a utility supports transcoding to ProRes on the Mac.

What works like ProRes on the PC? CineForm? Will it work at 4K2K?

PS: so much for a using a front-camera iPhone shot!

I should know more about the JVC utility in a few weeks. It is planned for both PC and Mac.

As you might guess -- your PC or Mac must have a codec that can handle up to 2160p60. ProRes works fine on the Mac. On the PC one can play, but not encode ProRes.

Perhaps JVC can OEM a ProRes encoder from Apple.

Will the utility have a 4K2K player? A way of cropping down to FullHD?

As I think about it -- there are lots of open questions about the JVC utility!

it would be nice to edit the 4K video without waiting for some new editing system. I have to believe JVC thought this through...right?

Under OS X, it's EZ. Convert to 2160p ProRes and edit with iMovie, FCP X, FCP 6/7, or Media Composer using AMA.

On the PC -- good luck. Other than uncompressed, I don't know of a general codec. EDIUS likely can use its own codec. But after seeing iMac 27" in India and Manila -- I'm thinking I'll not worry about anything Windows. If Asia is going Mac, then it seems the price is no longer as high as it was.

I believe the JVC makes its 4K image from four HD images, and also outputs to 4 SD cards. The 4K image is then later recreated in the NLE with the captured 4 HD images. The same goes for the HDMI clean feed, I guess.

A new codec might not be required since it can be edited native - if one has enough horsepower to handle four HD AVCHD streams at the same time. Suicide!

I have a feeling that editing in 4K will be somewhat of a kluge at first. At this point it appears that you have to run the JVC "combiner" application for the four "quad" HD segments and convert into a usable 2160p file , ProRes or (hopefully) DNXHD. format.Then you import or link into Avid, FCP 7, or FCPX. One big question is how fast is the combining process going to take. I must say I haven't been impressed with JVC's past software utilities.

I think early on, most people will be shooting 1080/60p AVCHD with this camera.

Look forward to seeing what this camera can do, David

"... usable 2160p file , ProRes or (hopefully) DNXHD."

Because MC will not now allow a 4K2K timeline -- I simply use AMA's ability to work with ProRes.

Of course, that won't work in the Windows world.

I believe EDIUS will support 4K2K with their HQ codec. But, does EDIUS 6 support 4K2K?

This is from JVC's web site (US) on the "combiner" software:

"A Mac-compatible software utility is provided to simplify the process of ingesting and converting the files recorded with the GY-HMQ10. A single USB cable is all that's necessary to connect the camera to the Macintosh computer. The utility will recognize the 4 memory cards in the camera and generate a single thumbnail for each scene. Right-clicking on the thumbnail begins the conversion to a single 4K Prores file suitable for editing on Final Cut Pro X. If camera thumbnails are dragged to the HDD, all of the associated files are automatically copied to the destination. Installation of Final Cut Pro X is necessary for this utility to operate."

They say it will take 3X to 10X real time to convert (not to combine).

Windows users?

"Installation of Final Cut Pro X is necessary for this utility to operate."
Oh no!
And whatabout FCP7 ?

You need the ProRes codec from FCP 6/7 or FCP X.

Given the AVCHD source, I would use ProRes LT. However, I believe LT is not supplied with FCP X.

Interestingly, FCP 6/7 IS supported, but performance is lower.

I've used iMovie with 2160p ProRes LT files. VERY sluggish!

Windows users ARE out of luck.

PS: EDIUS 6 does support 4K2K timelines.

I said "I've used iMovie with 2160p ProRes LT files. VERY sluggish!"

OMG! FCP X plays full screen at about half-speed and fairly smoothly.

The file is JVC 1080p60 scaled-up to 3840x2160p60 as we might get from JVC's utility. Codec is ProRes LT.

Since it's my first day with FCP X I don't know of behind my back FCP has converted to ProRes Proxy (whatever this is ???) but it looks great in terms of detail.

And it skims well too.

PS: Actually since the Generate Proxy button is showing, I think this is the original.

SAMPLES AVAILABLE FROM JVC U.K.

You can get a short sample -- 4 files -- from JVC:

JVC Professional Europe - GY-HMQ10E 4K2K HD Camcorder - JVC Professional catalogue : product details (http://www.jvcpro.co.uk/jpe/en/global/product.3533.140.html)

I've imported into FCP into 4 tracks and used the motion filter to move into place in a 3240x2160 ProRes 422 sequence.

See the attached.

I put a circle wipe in so I could be sure the aspect-ratio remains true. Looks fine in FCP, but in QT 7 it's a bit "tall."

Playing on my late 2010 iMac, I can get jerky play at about 15fps.

But, it's MUCH better in FCP X.

Note how a QFHD video looks on a monitor. Even HALF doesn't show fully!

PS: In this experiment I bumped saturation by 15% cause I like the look for my home town.


More later.

Windows users ARE out of luck.

Not necessarily.
I downloaded the clips, loaded them onto a Vegas Pro 10 timeline (properties set to 3840 x 2160), used a separate track for each clip and used Track Motion to position them properly.
Getting it to play smoothly (Dell Precision quad core with XP Pro SP3) was another matter :(

I downloaded the testfiles.
1. They play fine individually, however none of them has audio, even when MediaInfo shows Audio present. All have a constant audio level at -45dB.
Do the files play audio in your cases?
2. I AMA-imported them into Media Composer, works fine. Only problem with MC is, that I cannot set-up a 4K-project, maximum is 1920x1080.
Joachim

By out of luck I meant the utility that stitches the four h.264 file to one file is only for the Mac. JVC also assumes the file will be ProRe 422 -- which is OS X only.

Of course if one had a lot of time one could use four tracks -- to which one would need to add for filters and four transitions during editing.

PS: no audio on mine. And, yes ProRes 422 works fine in MC using AMA.

New 4K2K Sony -- the NEX-FS700. Supposedly $9000.

Sony : NEX-FS700E (NEXFS700E) : Product Overview : Other (http://www.pro.sony.eu/biz/lang/en/eu/product/nxcamcorders/nex-fs700e/overview)

The camera will be available in June no Price yet

In the basic version, only 2K via SDI port.

3G SDI Out of the Sony FS700, a 10-bit (likely S-log) 4:2:2 signal is present, which is output progressively. Internally, the Sony should NEX-FS700 according AVCHD only 8 bits 4:2:0 record.

Preliminary Information
This is preliminary information. All features and specifications are subject to change without notice.

MemoryStick or SDXC Cards or on external HXR-FMU128 recorder

4K-ready
The first 4K-ready Super35mm camcorder in its class – providing an assured upgrade path to 4K acquisition and delivery -- with full HD 1080p for today.The camcorder will also have the capability to produce 4K RAW 3G-SDI output via a future upgrade.

Super slow motion at 10x at full HD or 40x at lower resolutions
Incredible super slow motion capability of up to 10x slow motion at full HD resolution.

E-mount interchangeable lenses offer a wide choice of lenses

Additional A-mount lenses available
The Sony LA-EA2 A-mount lens adaptor allows you to use the wide range of high quality alpha lenses and take advantage of the auto focus function for quicker, more convenient operation.

Built-in HD filters HALLELUJA!!
Internal ND filters (clear, 1/4, 1/16 and 1/64)

3G-SDI interface and HDMI
A 3G-SDI output enables easy integration with highest quality recording formats.

Switchable 50 Hz and 60 Hz shooting
The NEX-FS700E is switchable between 50 Hz and 60Hz to allow 24p shooting in PAL areas and no PAL/NTSC limitations.

The new improved Grip has a Zoom ring! e-Mount Servo Zoomes to come!!
Selectable magnification and positioning of expanded focus

Expanded focus improvement allowing 4x and 8x magnification and a moveable area of expansion for easy focusing with shallow depth of field.

Given JVC's 4K2K camcorder, I would not be surprised if Sony introduces a VG30 that shoots 4K. But still crippled to keep the pressure off of more expensive Sonys AND to keep avoid hurting JVC too much. (So what will Pana announce?)

I noticed the new JVC now says AVCHD on the camera -- yet that was not in the announcement. Could this be 36Mbps AVCHD?

Will this force JVC to keep the price under $5000?

Where do you see 10-bit in the FS700 specs? Everywhere else says it's an 8-bit output.

Also, the JVC cam IS under $5,000. It lists at $4,995 at B&H. It records 4 channels of 36mbps AVCHD to make 4K. It can also record regular HD at 1080/60P at 27mbps. Isn't that AVCHD 2.0?

I don't see a Sony spec for the 3G HD-SDI output. The German is Google translated as "IF."

They also don't say S-log.

The F65 RAW is 10-bit S-log from 16bits off the sensor.

Sony may well define 8-bit RAW for the FS700. It might or might not be S-log. If S-log, it's about equal to 10-bit non-log data.

Also, the JVC cam IS under $5,000. It lists at $4,995 at B&H. It records 4 channels of 36mbps AVCHD to make 4K. It can also record regular HD at 1080/60P at 27mbps. Isn't that AVCHD 2.0?

By under, I'm not talking about LIST at $4995, but a "street price" at B&H closer to $4495. Typically, JVC allows a significant discount. Unless, the MSRP is much higher and B&H uses LIST to mean "their" price.

It does not record AVCHD when in 4K mode. It uses 36Mbps H.264.

By under, I'm not talking about LIST at $4995, but a "street price" at B&H closer to $4495. Typically, JVC allows a significant discount. Unless, the MSRP is much higher and B&H uses LIST to mean "their" price.

It does not record AVCHD when in 4K mode. It uses 36Mbps H.264.

B&H lists the price at $4,995.
JVC GY-HMQ10 4K Compact Handheld Camcorder GY-HMQ10U B&H Photo


Ah, gotcha on the 4K. It is H.264/ MPEG4. This is the same codec for their smaller PX10, which also uses the Falconbrid engine. Is it better than AVCHD?

AVCHD is a "brand" of H.264. Likely, JVC could not get AVCHD 2.0 upgraded to 3.0 and include 36Mbps. Or, more likely, they didn't want to, thereby giving them an advantage in bit-rate.

I need to check if 36Mbps uses the same encoding "tools" as does 28Mbps. I would expect it does.

PS: Interesting that 1080p60 edited in FCP X and Shared to BD automatically keeps the frame rate but changes the frame size to 720. Smart. However, export via Compressor and you can create a 1080i30 BD.

I keep being blown away by the PX10 clarity. I expect a 4K version, which would be far more affordable. (JVC showed the PX in case with the HMQ10 at several shows.)

I keep being blown away by the PX10 clarity. I expect a 4K version, which would be far more affordable. (JVC showed the PX in case with the HMQ10 at several shows.)

Do you have a PX10? I'm interested in getting one. JVC is coming out with the GX1, which has the same size chip as the HMQ10 and PX10, but records in AVCHD 2.0. I like the 300fps record speed, even if it is in SD.

The PX10 is $900. Although I have no real reason for 4K I'd be pi**ed off if I later learn JVC released a 4K version for about $1500.

I only think this might happen is because I saw the PX in the glass case with the HMQ10 at NAB 2011.

But, it must have 4 SD card slots and 4 HDMI's. I not sure I see how these will fit on the PX. So maybe I'm wrong.

But, I have no need to make any decision before NAB.

PS: I note that the PX10 is NOT sold at the JVC store.

The PX10 is $900. Although I have no real reason for 4K I'd be pi**ed off if I later learn JVC released a 4K version for about $1500.

I only think this might happen is because I saw the PX in the glass case with the HMQ10 at NAB 2011.

But, it must have 4 SD card slots and 4 HDMI's. I not sure I see how these will fit on the PX. So maybe I'm wrong.

But, I have no need to make any decision before NAB.

PS: I note that the PX10 is NOT sold at the JVC store.

HD Memory Camera - GC-PX10 - Introduction (http://camcorder.jvc.com/product.jsp?pathId=8)

It's listed under "HD Memory Cameras," not "Camcorders." JVC considers it a hybrid DSLR-camcorder.
I think it's placed with the HMQ10 under glass because both use the Falconbrid engine.

Did you actually try to buy one from the shop? When I try, it sends to a list of on-line dealers.

Oh no. If i do buy one, it will be from one of our SITE SPONSORS!

I mean did you follow the link? It only leads to a list of on-line sellers. No JVC Cart. It's not IN the JVC store.

JVC has posted the HMQ10's utility. Alas, not a single sample. And, I can't ger the UL sample to work because it doesn't -- I think -- have the right folder structure with thumbnail.

OT -- I've been watching many 16mm/Super8 transfers to HD -- while thinking at going back to film with a cheap film camera. You can buy fantastic film cameras -- cheap.

Oddly, my reaction is that -- except for Tri-X with it's wonderful grain -- the old days weren't so great. Yes, the cameras were totally manually which I long for. But, there is NO detail unless one chooses certain Super8 camcorders and film stock. Switching to 16mm helps -- as expected -- but gets expensive.

Perhaps because I used to shoot Tri-X for photos and movies -- I'm tempted to say there are conceptually two "modes" -- non-realism (shoot Super8 film and xfer to HD) or realism (shoot 1080p60 with a PX10 or 2160p60).

Buying a film grain package is an option. :)

A short sample from JVC HMQ10E (record 1080/50i), 3:50 min.

http://www.videoproduce.cz/images/JVC_HMQ10E_HD1080i_test_50i.m2t (640MB)

(normal gamma, gain 0/6/12dB and some color correction)

New version of the JVC HMQ10E's footages with color levels ITU 709 on youtube.

test 4K kamery JVC HMQ10E (record 1080/50i), úrovn? barev pro TV (ITU 709) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVfbe2lDI2w&feature=youtu.be)

You could have had even better result shooting in Quad-1080/50p (4k) mode. Still the best looking interlaced clip I've seen on YouTube. Excellent camera for the money.

I have small problem with aliasing (resize from 4K to HD in camcorder) on TV, a better result can be from the blurred quad HD at postproduction (you need an JVC utility, it is only for MAC OS now). No ND filters, a lens is wide 43mm, F2,8 to F5,6 only, buttons are not friendly, EVF is 300k pixels only, it is not easy to make focus on LCD.

But picture is stunning with very nice and rich colors (I was testing this 50i record for using at broadcast).

I have small problem with aliasing (resize from 4K to HD in camcorder) on TV, a better result can be from the blurred quad HD at postproduction (you need an JVC utility, it is only for MAC OS now). No ND filters, a lens is wide 43mm, F2,8 to F5,6 only, buttons are not friendly, EVF is 300k pixels only, it is not easy to make focus on LCD.

You can easily do without the JVC utility (at least in Premiere) by just dropping the individual quadrants onto a 4K timeline and adjusting their offsets to form a complete, seamless image. I've grabbed some samples and tried it. And... it takes FOREVER to render! But that really wasn't a surprise. :)

I'm really tempted by this JVC 4K option. However, I am confused by the size of the sensor. Isn't it very small? If the sensor in a camera remains so small, but the resolution of the image increases so much, isn't that just software and spec? Is it really better resolution or just using more pixels?

Like I say, I'm really tempted by this JVC 4K option - but confused by the size of the sensor. Surely it's very small? If the sensor in a camera remains so small, but the resolution of the image increases so much, isn't that just software and spec? Is it really better resolution or just using more pixels? Or am I misunderstanding. Is each quandrant individually grabbed from the full sensor? Or am I correct in thinking that tiny sensor is giving a quarter of its size to each of the four streams? HELP!

You know what they say, "if it sounds too good to be true..."
This does not mean that the camera is bad, merely that you get what you pay for and not a penny more (I am suspicious that you may, in fact, get quite a few pennies less).

They can cram so many pixels on a tiny sensor and achieve higher resolution but suffer from low light sensitivity. They can use spacial offsetting, which I don't really understand well, to double up the pixel duty and tease a higher resolution out via software task-management, and suffer potentially from some kind of artifacting, aliasing, or lack of sharpness/practical resolution.

If I were to test this camera, I would look very carefully at the noise levels in the shadows and color detail, particularly in areas of complex detail or fine color differences. But probably I would buy a camera that shoots 1080p at a similar price and know that I was getting the top end of 1080 instead of the bottom end of 4k.