Many brides tell me that they do not want a video because they were at their friends wedding and the videographer stood 2 feet away from the bride and groom during the vows/ring exchange, blocking everyone's view. Please, if that is you, stand further back. You are hurting our industry. Use your zoom/telephoto lens. Thanks!

One of my selling points is my highly unobtrusive style. Brides really dig it.

I agree. IMO there is no reason to be that close and frankly in my area most churcues won't let you get up there. Even the photogs I work with can't get that close. That's why they have zooms on cameras. Back up, get out of the way, it's not about you...

The video industry is changing but some people are still in the old game. Our marketing is simply Same Day Edits and being invisible on the shoot day. And there are people who love that stuff. There are those who are uneducated and just want to show off on the day of and get not such a great product.

Remember you don't have to show off your company or skills by the size of your equipment but your sheer talent

Exactly the same could and should be said of photographers who insist on walking backwards down the aisle during the recessional completely ruining the image for both the guests and for the video.

We now cite the recent Royal wedding as an example of the "ideal" - no means of media production in sight at all unless you count two miniature microphones on the corners of the officiants' robes. ie we're getting the clients to demand better performance from the photographers..

+1... Phillip

Many brides tell me that they do not want a video because they were at their friends wedding and the videographer stood 2 feet away from the bride and groom during the vows/ring exchange, blocking everyone's view.

I'm willing to bet these are DSLR shooters, not true video guys....am I right?

I'm willing to bet these are DSLR shooters, not true video guys....am I right?

Is that supposed to imply...that all DSLR shooters aren't professional?

What a ridiculous statement, lol.

I'm willing to bet these are DSLR shooters, not true video guys....am I right?

Not necessarily . . . I've seen videographers will full-sized video cameras do the same thing.

Thats a dumb statement, I am a video guy switching to dslr because of its amazing quality.

Hi Guys

No need to jump up in defence!! I'm sure that Warren MEANT that DSLR videographers have smaller and less obtrusive gear so they could get in closer. He didn't mean any disrespect to our DSLR users at all!!

I have big shoulder mounts so I can't get too close...like Philip my main concern has always been over enthusiastic photographers crawling around the couple like ants with the lens almost touching the rings at one wedding!!!

I think we need to be close enough to get decent shots without having dozens of people in the way when the guests stand up but also be as unobtrusive as we can!! During the vows I will often crouch down on the floor so I match the guests who are sitting and don't stick out like a sore thumb!!

Chris

I think depending on amount of cinematographers you have it depends. We always discuss with photographers in advance and most are very accommodating while some aren't. It becomes a little easy when you have multiple sources of cameras and crew. I mean 2 or 3 or 4. That way if they do come in your way in one shot, you can cut away to another.

Just how we deal with things.


Jawad

hey Everyone. My point wasn't to include the photographers in this thread because brides will always hire a photographer. Many brides don't hire a videographer at all because they've been to weddings where the videographer is in the way. So if you are one of those videographers that stand 2 feet away, please back up. As for DSLR, i'm DSLR and i use 135 2.0 and a 70-200mm so there is no need for me to be 2 feet away. There are videographers with 18X zoom lenses that stand 2 feet away.

I'm sure that Warren MEANT that DSLR videographers have smaller and less obtrusive gear so they could get in closer. He didn't mean any disrespect to our DSLR users at all!!


Guys, I saw it with my own eyes last week. 3 videographers were shooting DSLRs for a wedding. 2 were cross shooting the bride and groom with 70-200s on tripods, the third was on a monopod in the aisle. Right before the vows began, the guy in the aisle went up to the front, and set himself up in the middle of everyone. It looked like he had a 16-35mm lens. Because he was shooting video, once he was set, he couldn't move. And because he was shooting wide, he had to go in close. The 2 still photographers were trying to work around him, frantically ducking left and right of him, trying to fight for a good angle. It was horrible. The main event was watching the photographers trying to get their shots rather than the couple saying their vows!

I'm not disrespecting DSLR users, as I'm one of them myself. (I use DSLR only for B roll and beauty shots) But the propensity for this kind of stuff to happen is much higher with DSLRs because it's easier to shoot wide because of less shake, and it looks cool and "fresh."

Warren, I believe the propensity of this happening is more because of the uneducated vendors operating DSLR/video equipment.. not the DSLR itself.

With DSLR being cheaper and affordable, more people are jumping into the industry without much experience and only a couple L lenses. They focus more on the quality they get and did not consider the respect they need to give to other vendors, clients and audiences.

I personally have stopped getting that close angle for a ring shot (I put my hands up guilty in the first wedding I did, I was standing rather close). I realized that the closeup shot, although nice, it doesn't tell much of a story. I prefer more on getting the bride and groom expressions when putting in the ring, rather than the ring going in itself. So far, no couple have complained to me and none have requested me that detailed shot anyway.

While I understand many vid people regardless of the gear they use (real vid cams or DSLRs) want to be creative and produce award winning footage, we are all, in the truest sense, documentarians. We are there to document the day and during the edit, we take all of that great footage and put it together to prduce our wonderful movie trailers, highlights or whatever we call them today. Granted there are certain shots that would be and are very nice to have in those highlights, trailer or whatever but most of those shots can be recreated after the actual event be it the placing of the rings on fingers, lighting a candle and getting the couple to stand so they don't block the candle, even the kiss. For the most part it can recreated and no one will really know the difference.
To me it doesn't matter what gear you're using, if you're a schmuck with a video camera you're still one with a DSLR. Move your ass out of the way, be a professional and quit making the day about you. "Hey look everyone, I've got this cool camera with this cool lens. I haven't got a clue as to what I'm doing but don't I look cool blocking out the photogs and the guests"
The point is it ain't the gear, it's the person using it and I agree, with the lower cost of much of the gear out today there are more and more people getting into the industry that have less common sense than my soon to be 13 year old grandson. Why him and not the younger grandkids? Think back to when you were 13! Less common sense than an 8 year old. It's that word! TEENAGER!!!!!!! Anyway while they have the gear they have no respect for other vendors or the guests or even the B&G because if they did, they wouldn't stand there. I've had a handfull of photogs over the years that did the backwards walk down the aisle for the recessional. Trust me, they don't anymore...at least not when they work with me. I'm not bashing photogs but as a vid guy that's who I work with. I can imagine the photogs can get a bit angry with us as well when someone stands 2 feet from the couple as they do their vows. If I were the officiant I would stop and tell that person to either back off at least 50 feet or leave but do it now. IOW I would call that person out and embarress him/her, but I'm just that way.
Don't misunderstand my post here. We all want to create the best most creative product we can but there are limitations and we all need to live with in them and if need be recreate. Like I said before, it ain't about us!

I think the biggest thing in my market is NOT seeing a videographer. If they are not common, then the brides don't feel like they're necessary. Everyone gets a photographer of one sort or another, but video is pretty rare. I think that's a bigger problem than obtrusiveness (which everybody says they're unobtrusive btw) That's the new 3Chip camera statement... You'd be run out of town if you didn't stay in the back of churches in our area at least...
Bill

This post is not about DSLR shooters as brides have complained to me about other videographers standing 2 feet away for the past 19 years. My point is, the video guy standing 2 feet away is hurting our industry and he's been doing it with "proper" video camera's for a very long time.

I'm always amazed somebody hasn't put together a video kit with small remote cameras on discrete tall poles. Hardly able to be noticed and remote controlled from somewhere out of the way. Two or three monitors, joysticks and you'd be away.

I shot my sister's wedding a month ago and her photographer did this same thing for most of the ceremony. I tried to get his attention with no success. He ruined most of the master shot. Thank goodness I had two other cameras flanking the sides to get the ceremony.

I think out of the approx. 15 minute ceremony I have about 3 minutes of useable footage from my master shot. It just pissed me off because this was my little sister's wedding and the video was a gift for her and her man.

My wife was planning on doing the photos, but she was asked to be the Matron of Honor so she ended up in the wedding. Throughout the editing process I wished that she was the photographer instead.

I'm always amazed somebody hasn't put together a video kit with small remote cameras on discrete tall poles. Hardly able to be noticed and remote controlled from somewhere out of the way. Two or three monitors, joysticks and you'd be away.

I think you'll find that Philip Howells does just that, at least with one.

The one that always killed me was the first dance. The videographer goes in for the 360 degree shot with a full stabilizer vest with on camera lighting, 2' from the couple. Really kills the moment.

The one that always killed me was the first dance. The videographer goes in for the 360 degree shot with a full stabilizer vest with on camera lighting, 2' from the couple. Really kills the moment.

The 'full stabilizer' is a hideous circus attraction for a wedding, when all that's needed is a DSLR and a glidecam.

I can't imagine doing this - even standing in the aisle (normally about 2/3rds from the front of the crowd, so my distance from the front of the church is dictated by how many pews are filled with people) I feel self-conscious as though I am distracting people.

I understand that occasionally it's tough to find a spot with a good angle without blocking somebody's view, but to knowingly and willingly block off the couple because your think your shot is the most important part of the day is disrespectful to everyone in attendance.

I'm always amazed somebody hasn't put together a video kit with small remote cameras on discrete tall poles. Hardly able to be noticed and remote controlled from somewhere out of the way. Two or three monitors, joysticks and you'd be away.

I actually tried this some years ago with a Grizzly pro remote system, as well as a live switcher with 3 cameras. My thinking was to make shooting and editing much easier and quick. However, after actually doing it, I found major problems which made me sell the switcher...
1. It's impossible to control 3 cameras simultaneously. If the action moves from one area of the room to another, you can't compose quickly enough. This forces you to shoot a lot wider than usual, which tends to lose impact and emotion of the shot. A live operator does a much better job. I tried to follow the bride down the aisle remotely, but failed. Doing it with the remote was too jerky for my taste, and my only usable shot was a wide stationary.
2. High poles sway. If you have a panning camera on top of a pole, it will sway every time you pan. I used a heavy duty speaker stand, as well as a light stand. You would think that these are rock solid, but they're not. The picture will sway enough to ruin the shot if you're in tight. Tripods are the best camera support.
3. Unless you're in the room where the action is taking place, shooting by watching monitors is like shooting with blinders on. There are many times when you need to see what is taking place outside the field of view of the cameras, but won't be able to.
4. It's hard, and sometimes impossible, to control focus and iris remotely. The Grizzy system used lanc to control the camera. Many cameras today, however, don't have lanc.

Conversely, the best use for remote cameras is if everything is locked down. However, as I said earlier, you'll generally be forced to shoot wider than usual, in which case your shots will lose impact. The alternate remedy for this is to shoot at a higher resolution than you'll need, then zoom in in post.

you can definitely control as many camera as you want.
the trick is to use a computer that can translate movement of one camera for the other camera.
once done , if you move a camera, all others will follow the same framing (if possible)
it is easy to write and build with cheap remote controlled servo.
if you modify a tripod to be the master one, all others camera will aim exactly were you want.
but the fact is , it is always simpler to put a guy behind each camera or to set it wide and let it unnattended.

And that is why when you shoot a live action TV show, like NASCAR (which I have done running remote cams) there are a whole lot of associate directors who are in the directors ear telling hin what they have for shots on the monitors they are responsible for. there is no way 1 person can watch all the monitors and call the shot, not when there are upwards of 80 live cameras including the in car cams, hard cams on the roof of the scoring tower and on built platforms and somewhere in the area of 8 to 10 remote cameras not counting the handheld cams running around. Plus even for the rmote cams the tripods we used for the camera control units were big big heavy heavy duty Cartonis that could probably hold up a car and all we had on them was a control unit that I guess didn't weigh more than 6 or 7 pounds.
Yep, remote multicam by yourself is a supremely tough job.