Hi All

I get the occasional bride who would like to see her wedding in full HD but hasn't got a BD player.... apart from adding a player into my packages, what other options would be practical.

HD Media Player and a USB drive ????? BD players are not that popular at the moment and still pricey ..I was wondering if a Mediaplayer with the wedding video preloaded might be a nice touch as an optional extra... could I also get away with a format that doesn't require me to add a BD burner to my computer ?????

Any suggestions ??? Portable would also be good so she can take it to Grandma's house and just pop the HDMI cable in the big TV cos sure as nuts she won't have a BD player or PS3!!!!

Chris

I don't shoot weddings, but I shoot a lot of business events. I have the exact same challenge. Virtually no business has a Blu-ray player, yet they want to display HD video in their lobby, trade show booth, etc.

The HD Media Players have been a godsend. Best Buy was closing out the Western Digital HDTV players a few months ago and I bought several for about $50 each. I put the video on a USB thumb drive and either loan a player to the client (if it's a video for a specific event) or I simply include one on the invoice.

Thanks Chris

I also liked the WD Players!! Just for interest, what format did you use on the thumb drive...I was just wondering the most "economical" format to use that will fit on a drive!!

I know that Bruce Foreman swears by the HD WMV files!!

Chris

To be perfectly honest Chris, if a bride wants to watch her wedding in HD then she should just purchase a BluRay player. You shouldn't have to start including them in your packages.

I actually just dealt with this with one of our brides. They selected our BluRay upgrade and now several months later as we're about to deliver the discs she was wondering if the BluRay discs would play in a regular DVD player. I simply explained that they would not and let her know that you can purchase a BluRay player pretty cheap these days. She was cool with that.

My opinion is that it's our job to delivery an amazing video product, not video equipment. d;-)

Not sure about there Chris, but I think Netflix, Tivo etc is killing BluRay over here. With that being said, I do think delivering an HD data file is more future proof than a BluRay disc will be. I'm just not sure how you are going to print your typical beautiful DVD artwork and fit it on the case of that thumbdrive? :-)

Interesting.... HD files on a small drive would be awesome to do as a package.

I still believe Blu-Ray is a niche market. Growing, but still niche. Many people still are loving their DVD players fine and if you're not a hardcore movie consumer with a large monitor and sound system, generally people seem to just stick to what they got and watch DVD because t's cheaper and they think they can't see a difference.

I think that's a great idea to be able to offer HD files with your package so that it could be viewed via a media player or other device. That enables it to be more future proof in this digital age of rapidly changing technologies.

I love the wdtv media boxes, got 3 of them.

Also love bluray, i think maybe bluray has taken off here in the UK than in the US?

Still, only about 20% of my 2010 brides ordered a bluray, thats up from about 12% on 09, and 5% in 08

I use the wdtvs at home, but they are great for wedding shows.

In terms of formats, i did ALOT of testing for the wdtvs, i found that h264 files (the same specs that i use for vimeo, both 720 and 1080) were the best, and those same files play on xbox, ps3 and mac/pc/laptop (as long as the machine isnt too old)

Its the same specs that vimeo recommend for exporting, 5mbps for 720p files, 12mbps for 1080p (athough i found that if you use profile 3.1 insead of 4 that the files play on the ipads native video player)

James

Hi All

I get the occasional bride who would like to see her wedding in full HD but hasn't got a BD player.... apart from adding a player into my packages, what other options would be practical.


Remind them that a Bluray player is just $69.

I agree with the opinion to remind the client how inexpensive bluray players have become. WDHD with a thumb drive sounds great until they lose the thumb drive or accidentally erase it. You could pay for video hosting service on the internet but that would really only be good for 10 minute montage. Its funny how clients can be so dam cheap about things like this.

Remind them that a Bluray player is just $69.

Not entirely true. A good one with bd live network features and faster load times are more expensive. The lowest end ones with basic function and slower load times... Sure you can get one at big lots for 60 bucks (well during the holidays).

My ps3 performs far faster than that other cheap player that sits in the spare room, but all depends what you want out of a player. Fine for basic needs. :)

This entire HD transition has been nothing short of a nightmare because consumers just don't know better. A lot of them even think that the awful SD picture they watch on their new TV is in fact HD. It's really sad when you think about it...people will purchase a new 40"-50" HDTV for a few grand but they won't spend $70-100 for a blu-ray player nor will they upgrade their cable TV programming to an HD package...so they go on watching SD on their new TV, which IMO, looks like garbage. On top of that, they prefer to stream Netflix OnDemand thru their XBOX which is actually lower res than DVD quality.

I simply provide my clients with a DVD/Blu-ray combo pack. It really doesn't take that much longer to encode both formats from the timeline using Adobe CS5 and this way, they have both forms of media to choose from depending on which player they have.

This is an interesting discussion. We still deliver solely on dvd even though we use HD cameras. Haven't had a single request for blue ray yet. I'm hoping I can skip the whole bluRay thing and start delivering files on thumb drive. I think netflicks and movie streaming will kill the bluRay market.

I just wish there was a better way to make a thumb drive look fancy.

A couple pays the photographer around $2000 and in return, they get a great looking deluxe leather bound photo album.

A couple pays the videographer around $2000 and in return, they get a 2 inch plastic thumb drive.

Now I realize, I'm being a little sarcastic because in return, they actually get a wonderful movie of their big day, but I just can't imagine trying to glam up a thumb drive. Believe me, I'm with ya. I wish I could skip the entire Blu-ray thing as well but unfortunately, I just can't come up with a good way to make a fancy package for a thumb drive compared to optical media or the photographers deluxe leather album for that matter.

Hi Adam

Me too!! I have yet to get an enquiry for BluRay and most brides only find out about HD from hubby anyway.

Michael, you could of course supply them with a WD Live Player and add a 300GB external drive...surely that would be as impressive as an album??? Also it's harder to lose than a thumb drive....BD has not been popular here at all (the only people that I know that have them are ones that bought a Sony TV and a BD player was thrown in for free)

I'm figuring that you can take your Media Player over to your bridesmaids and just plug into their TV and you can all re-live the moment The player's secondary features also might make hubby like the idea too!!

It's an all-in one arrangement especially if you get the players with space inside for an HDD...!!!!

I was thinking more of a HDD inside as they are cheaper by far than a 64GB thumb drive...here those are way over $100 and a 500GB 3.5" HDD is half that!!! Maybe the USA is different but people seem to like little "gifts" in their video package ..."buy this package and we will give you XXXX free!!!"


Chris

Having had this discussion recently with a bunch of women I can tell you that the average bride will not be at all impressed by a WD player and a hard drive; the groom maybe, but the bride no. It's just not comparable to a beautiful album. I'm not trying to burst anyone's bubble, just relating what I've discovered.

No doubt, product delivery for our industry is a bit of an achilles heel versus the photography industry. We currently use custom-made image-wrapped cases and they look amazing, but the technology is definitely going toward digital delivery and streaming. Not really sure how we're going to handle delivery in those mediums yet.

Do what Disney now does on most of their titles - DVD/BR/Digital copy all in one package, for a little premium over just the DVD or just the BR...

Now you've delivered in a format that is almost universal (DVD), BR, for those that have it available, AND a digital copy on a disk that an be downloaded to their computer or whatever device with a screen they have available...

The only "flaw" I see in this is that you might have to render out several different resolutions of digital copy, and choose formats very carefully for compatibility, but it certainly would follow a marketing pattern that works for one of the biggest "media" providers on the planet.

BTW, 8G thumb drive, $12 at Frys... 16G, $20... depending on how you render, those would hold a LOT of "content".

I agree DVD encasement holding both DVD and a BR is the best solution. I think what ppl are missing about a physical disc is they can mail them to a relative or take it over to their house and watch it.

For (the few) couples that order a digital copy from me, is use these.

Metal USB Tin Engraved Presentation Flash Drive - Presentation Flash Drive / Cases (http://www.warehouse-video.co.uk/presentation-flash-drive-/-cases/metal-usb-tin-engraved-presentation-flash-drive/prod_264.html)


Definitely better on the eye than a standard usb

Haven't had a single request for blue ray yet.

180 degree opposite opinion:

1. Lots of demand for Bluray.
2. The majority of people that meet with us have a Bluray player.
3. Bluray is promoted on website and demonstrated during consultations.
4. It is offered in our middle and higher tier packages and the result has been more sales of upper tier packages.

You won't sell what you don't promote.

It's just not comparable to a beautiful album ... We currently use custom-made image-wrapped cases and they look amazing, but the technology is definitely going toward digital delivery and streaming. Not really sure how we're going to handle delivery in those mediums yet.I long ago left the wedding industry, but I understand Travis' point especially from the bride's point of view.

Has anyone started promoting/selling digital delivery to savvy couples yet? I imagine a USB thumb drive in a nice elegant case would be good way to make it more presentable. Or for the very high end customers a full iPad package with a nice case? Just wondering since it seems to be heading in that direction. For a less expensive solution, what about a nice digital photo frame that also plays video, delivered of course, in an elegant case. Seems like an interesting opportunity to sell to brides.

180 degree opposite opinion:

1. Lots of demand for Bluray.
2. The majority of people that meet with us have a Bluray player.
3. Bluray is promoted on website and demonstrated during consultations.
4. It is offered in our middle and higher tier packages and the result has been more sales of upper tier packages.

You won't sell what you don't promote.

I agree, Craig. When I first went to HD, I was figuring the blu-ray thing might not really take off and I'd just kind of bide my time and wait for thumb-drive or similar delivery.

And I am delivering on Blu-ray to 80% of my wedding clients (in addition to DVD of course).

We too deliver Blu-ray on all weddings in addition to four DVDs.

Our local Blockbuster tells me that they now carry almost as many Blu-ray copies of new releases as they do DVDs. That's probably as good a guide as any of the penetration of BD.

If the BBC or ITV bring out a Blu-ray of the recent Royal Wedding that will add impetus too.

Hi Philip

Nice to see you back here!!

Hmmm maybe supplying a BD disk with the DVD's might just spur the couple into buying a player...trouble is here BD players are still more expensive by a long shot than DVD players.

Just for interest do you use the same software to create your BD menu as well as the DVD ??

Chris

I have heard good reviews about these Sumvision Cyclone Micro Media Players - they are for sale on amazon and ebay for about 20 quid.

You can attach an external harddrive or a thumbdrive or a number of different memory cards and away you go. Seemingly they play HD 1080p in a number of formats.

Anyone here used them?

Hi Philip

Nice to see you back here!!

Hmmm maybe supplying a BD disk with the DVD's might just spur the couple into buying a player...trouble is here BD players are still more expensive by a long shot than DVD players.

Just for interest do you use the same software to create your BD menu as well as the DVD ??

Chris
Chris, thanks for your comments - as long as I'm not told again by the self-publicists here that because I choose not to show my work I'm not entitled to comment, I'll remain to play my small part.

Because I'm not a Premiere user but I do require a sophisticated authoring system I've switched from DVD-Lab (which has serious flaws quite apart from the owners still not accepting that BD is a system worth supporting) I've moved to TMPGEnc's Authoring Works 4.

For anyone considering the same move may I add that it's as individual as DVD-Lab and familiarity with one is little or no help in moving to the other. However, once the move is made, the experience is excellent BUT and it's a big BUT there is a remaining problem.

The big drawback in TAW4 is that to author the same programme in BD and DVD requires a completely separate process.

Of course, the authoring possibilities for BD are more sophisticated, but people constantly remind me that Premiere has overcome that difficulty. If I was better disposed towards Adobe I might take more interest - my guess is that the "common" authoring in Premiere means that one's BD menus are no more sophisticated than the equivalent DVD menu. That would not be good enough for me so for now I'm sticking with the slight inconvenience of TAW4.

Just for interest do you use the same software to create your BD menu as well as the DVD ??

Chris

Adobe Encore is a great solution for the dual-burn DVD/Blu-Ray. Still haven't found the HD-->SD conversion suitable within Encore, so I make the DVD mpeg separately.

Tim's message prompts me to add that I've referred to Premiere as the dual-authoring software, whereas I think I should have written Encore.

However, his mention of the conversion also reminds me to add that depending on your editing program, once you've prepared the "core" MPEG-2 DVD or BD file, TAW4 is remarkably fast compared to DVD-Lab which for me needed a lot of time spent with TMPGEnc Express.

A couple of days ago I authored and burned to DVD a 10 minute fashion event programme for Debenhams, a UK clothing chain store, in just a few minutes because TAW4 uses my native 8mb/s MPEG-2 produced by Avid without any re-encoding. I'm not familiar enough with other NLEs to know if similar economies are available generally but for me TAW4's need to encode only the menus etc is a huge advantage.

No doubt it is the BD-DVD file conversion within Encore/Premiere which is the clever bit in producing authoring in either flavour from the same "core" file and equally it's the lack of this cleverness within TAW4 which is its disadvantage.

Another delivery method I've used for a few business clients is to provide a widescreen SD version on DVD with an HD version in WMV format as extra content on the disk. The DVD includes an autoplay.inf file, so when the DVD is inserted in a Windows PC, it plays the HD version. When inserted in a DVD player, it of course plays the DVD version.

I guess if I were delivering wedding video, I'd probably deliver a two-disk package with a DVD version and a Blu-ray version. Even if they don't have a Blu-ray player today, the odds are good that someday they'll have some sort of device that will play that Blu-ray disk.

I just wish there was a better way to make a thumb drive look fancy.

A couple pays the photographer around $2000 and in return, they get a great looking deluxe leather bound photo album.

A couple pays the videographer around $2000 and in return, they get a 2 inch plastic thumb drive.

Now I realize, I'm being a little sarcastic because in return, they actually get a wonderful movie of their big day, but I just can't imagine trying to glam up a thumb drive. Believe me, I'm with ya. I wish I could skip the entire Blu-ray thing as well but unfortunately, I just can't come up with a good way to make a fancy package for a thumb drive compared to optical media or the photographers deluxe leather album for that matter.

Haha! So True.

Maybe we need a solution like the cases for the older "pro" DV tapes or these days some high-end SDHC cards that are exactly the same size/dimensions as regular media but have an impractically large case.

I do agree about skipping Blu-ray though - as long as I can work out what will come after it!

It's anyone's guess as to what the next technology to follow blu-ray will be and when it will come along. Many seem to think it will be some sort of streaming but I wouldn't bank on it anytime soon. Netflix streaming for example, isn't even DVD quality. Then there are the cable companies who are testing metered usage or placing caps on bandwidth. Finally, brides in general will want something more substantial than a thumb drive or WD player to playback their special day. As long as Hollywood keeps releasing their movies on optical media (DVD / blu-ray), it's my opinion that this is what brides are going to expect. I've given up trying to find creative solutions on how to deliver media other than on optical. A few years ago, I decided to follow the movie studios lead, and offer DVD/Blu-ray combo packs. Fast forward to today...I include the combo packs with every package. Like a few others have mentioned on this thread, I use it as a selling point and it works quite well when presented in the right manner. Brides wont ask for it if they dont know about it or you dont advertise it. Very few of my competitors offer Blu-ray and I can't begin to tell you how many brides opted to go with me because it's included with every one of my packages. Many of these brides don't even have the Blu-ray player yet but believe that their wedding will be future proofed with BD. Just my 2 cents.

I know a lot of HD tv's have usb ports. Do these usually play video (vimeo) files? Or just for pictures? We deliver dvd+bluray and then have a smugmug account for streaming and downloading of hd content. Maybe it would be worth upgrading a vimeo account for HD delivery and download?

We then deliver dvd cases inside of boxes. Might be interesting to throw a usb drive into the box.

Dvd Cases | Loktah (http://www.loktah.com/catalog/dvd-cases)