The techs at Band Pro and Abel in L.A. are hinting that Convergent will launch this unit at NAB, priced point around $6K. So with Sony's SRW-1 recorder announced priced at $58K at Abel's, anybody taking sides?

So with Sony's SRW-1 recorder announced priced at $58K at Abel's, anybody taking sides?

Not yet. We still don't know the price on the Sony SR-R1 (do I have that name right?), nor do we know what AJA might up their sleeve, etc etc.

I think it's likely there will be a lot of options on the way after NAB.

Brian is referring to the deck for the F35 and F23 camera heads.

Sony reps have intimated a couple of times the SR-R1 deck is to be a bit less than the cost of the F3 body, so people are figuring around 10 grand without memory cards. Sony may surprise us even further. 4 weeks and counting to NAB.

Brian is referring to the deck for the F35 and F23 camera heads.
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Yeah, I know. But I don't think anybody would be using it with the F3 unless they just happen to have one around...so...

Not yet. We still don't know the price on the Sony SR-R1 (do I have that name right?), nor do we know what AJA might up their sleeve, etc etc.

I think it's likely there will be a lot of options on the way after NAB.

AJA does not at all seem interested in portable 4:4:4 recording. It can't be that big of a market really. The number of 4:4:4 capable cameras, that can't natively record 4:4:4 on-board is really pretty small.

I hope it's not Prores. Make's life difficult for we poor people on PCs :)

From what I've heard in the rumour mill the SR1 is supposed to be shipping with a 256Gb cards, so IF the price is around that of the F3 body, with an included card, it's a good proposition. Cards are rumoured to cost the same per Gb as SxS, so with a 32Gb SxS costing $850 approx, a 256 Gb card should be $6,800 which is pretty steep for 2 hours of storage.

If it's a 2 to 3 grand less than the price of the F3 body it is a good proposition in light of the existing recorder and the ones to be in the coming months.

It's good to hear that Sony may be including a 256 GB stick with it. I was thinking they would do that to make a turnkey price on the unit.

Sure is going to be an interesting April.

Actually, it's going to get very interesting by March 23rd.

Looks like Convergent Design may have found a new use for the XDR that was discontinued. Makes perfect sense!

It's much more than that, but I'm under NDA and can't say more. You're going to love it.

Dean, it's likely that the new convergent designs recorder has nothing to do with the discontinued XDR. They left that recorder to die at the roadside and that's where it'll stay. They never completed a number of features that were promised in the XDR, I know because I have one. With the rumor of the new recorder coming, I don't expect they'll ever complete those promised features.

Here's just a few reasons why the XDR can't be a part of any new 4:4:4 recorder

- XDR SDI input circuitry is single link 422 only, I recall that 3G/s is simply not possible with this hardware
- Codec is MPEG2, which is 8 bit 422 only
- Records to CF card only, which is not practical for 4:4:4 recording (which is why no 4:4:4 CF recorders exist. Any new recorder would likely record to SSD)

I'd love to hear about some kind of affordable upgrade path to 4:4:4 recording for us XDR owners. However, I'm pretty sure the upgrade path with be eBay the XDR on eBay and scrape together the difference to buy the new recorder.

:) It IS going to be awesome......

Just wait a few days.

Just seen this...
Apologies if anyone else posted it.
:)


2011 NAB Show: Convergent Design, Inc.: Profile (http://expo.nabshow.com/mynabshow2011/public/Booth.aspx?BoothID=112751&FromPage=nz_ALExhibitorSearch.aspx&IndexInList=9)

I almost missed the sunlight viewable monitor in the specs. Goodness gracious.

Will the F3 support 1080p60 through the 3G ports without the firmware upgrade?

That's very nice! Just what the doctor ordered!

Will the F3 support 1080p60 through the 3G ports without the firmware upgrade?

I had read in another thread that the F3 without the upgrade already supports 1080p60 via dual link output, but of course requires an outboard recoder to record 1080p60.

Dean, it's likely that the new convergent designs recorder has nothing to do with the discontinued XDR. They left that recorder to die at the roadside and that's where it'll stay. They never completed a number of features that were promised in the XDR, I know because I have one. With the rumor of the new recorder coming, I don't expect they'll ever complete those promised features.

Here's just a few reasons why the XDR can't be a part of any new 4:4:4 recorder

- XDR SDI input circuitry is single link 422 only, I recall that 3G/s is simply not possible with this hardware
- Codec is MPEG2, which is 8 bit 422 only
- Records to CF card only, which is not practical for 4:4:4 recording (which is why no 4:4:4 CF recorders exist. Any new recorder would likely record to SSD)

I'd love to hear about some kind of affordable upgrade path to 4:4:4 recording for us XDR owners. However, I'm pretty sure the upgrade path with be eBay the XDR on eBay and scrape together the difference to buy the new recorder.

Aaron ... I agree ... you bought into the XDR at the beginning and I think you should talk to the people at Convergent Design about some sort of upgrade path ... perhaps a substantial upgrade path. On another note, I bought the original DVX100, with its quirks, and watched as the DVX100 A came out with better qualities within a year ... so, I understand your regrets!

Will the F3 support 1080p60 through the 3G ports without the firmware upgrade?

The F3 outputs 1080p/60 over dual link SDI, out of the box. The firmware upgrade is not needed for this. I've tested it quite a bit, recording to the Cinedeck.

The F3 outputs 1080p/60 over dual link SDI, out of the box. The firmware upgrade is not needed for this. I've tested it quite a bit, recording to the Cinedeck.

What camera setting do you need for this to work? ive been meaning to try it out, but ican t figure out how to engage 1080 - 60p

What camera setting do you need for this to work? ive been meaning to try it out, but ican t figure out how to engage 1080 - 60p

Others > System > Format > HQ 1920/59.94i
VIDEO SET > Dual Link & Gamma Select > 1.5G YPbPr422 & Video

Neve rmind that the setting is 59.94i. The dual link output is indeed progressive, as the sensor is progressive. Works very nicely. So glad this is possible without firmware upgrade. Also note that there is no TC on the dual link SDI out when operating in this mode.

Thanks Aaron & Dave for your response on the 1080p60 out the dual-link SDI question.

Wouldn't matter for most that there isn't timecode on the 1080p60 signal as most would be using it for slomo footage. Timecode can also be striped after the fact if necessary.

I wasn't actually using the TC in my SDI for it's TC worthiness, since the footage is being overcranked in post the TC is useless. It's being used to trigger my external recorder. Since the TC isn't there, the recorder doesn't get triggered. That's why I brought it up.

Good point Aaron. That would apply to many of us in future.

fantastic thank you!

Watch our blog on Monday. Exciting stuff.

Andy

So the Gemini seems to be everything promised. Too bad Dan Keaton at Convergent Design says they won't be shipping till July and no demos are available.

Others > System > Format > HQ 1920/59.94i
VIDEO SET > Dual Link & Gamma Select > 1.5G YPbPr422 & Video

When I tried this at 50i all I got is single link 50i out of SDi 1 as well as the SDi monitor out. Nothing on SDi 2

Frankly I wish Convergent had also worked on getting 10bit 4:2:2 into something small like the Nanoflash. For a lot of people who don't need 4:4:4 the Gemini sounds like a hassle to me.
KiPro mini sounds nice but the Nano was so small. Interested in whetehr Ninja comes out with an SDI version at NAB. Any word on this?

"Interested in whether Ninja comes out with an SDI version at NAB. Any word on this?"

The Atomos Samurai comes out in July / August - essentially a Ninja with SDI In. I'm not sold on Prores though, and I believe the Ninja has problems accepting progressive frame rates or something???

When I tried this at 50i all I got is single link 50i out of SDi 1 as well as the SDi monitor out. Nothing on SDi 2

My results also. KiPro mini reads 29.97, no dual link apparent.

I'm not sold on Prores though,

you might be if you ever shot on an Alexa. Alexa picture quality, even just as it's lowest denominator (Rec709/ProRes HQ) is the bees knees for color correction and processing.

I even like it better than Redcode, and I know a A-list colorist here in Los Angeles who based on his comments i think would say the same. It's REALLY flexible material.

Nate, Also love the Alexa's knee and am trying to tweak the F3's gamma to come close. Trying some of Alister's suggestion, but noticed 4:2:0's weakness when grading a skin texture test yesterday - saw a very slight flickering amongst uneven coloration within a face. Have you ever seen this 'flickering' on F3 footage through DaVinci? Do you think recording 4:2:2 on Nano will rid it?

Nate, Also love the Alexa's knee and am trying to tweak the F3's gamma to come close. Trying some of Alister's suggestion, but noticed 4:2:0's weakness when grading a skin texture test yesterday - saw a very slight flickering amongst uneven coloration within a face. Have you ever seen this 'flickering' on F3 footage through DaVinci? Do you think recording 4:2:2 on Nano will rid it?

Never seen anything like you describe. I saw your other post about transcoding the native files in After Effects, and after hearing that, I have to suspect something went wonky in your conversion.

Flickering skin tones would never be a side effect of 4:2:0. 4:2:0 causes blockiness (aliasing) on the edges of saturated color, and you usually need to blow up the video to see it. So I have no idea what you're seeing.

Thanks for clarifying 4:2:0 . The flickering I noticed was a very slight color fringing on an ECU of a face, and the post house I'm working with have imported XDCAM browser so conversion shouldn't be the problem. BTW, do you like the Nucoda FilmMaster for grading vs. DaVinci?

Thanks for clarifying 4:2:0 . The flickering I noticed was a very slight color fringing on an ECU of a face, and the post house I'm working with have imported XDCAM browser so conversion shouldn't be the problem. BTW, do you like the Nucoda FilmMaster for grading vs. DaVinci?

I think you'd have to post a still or a movie, because you say both flickering AND fringing, and I can't really tell what you're talking about.

My color correction experience goes from Apple Color to Davinci, with a little bit of Scratch along the way, so I can't comment on FilmMaster other than I know it's well regarded, if a little rare.

Also note that there is no TC on the dual link SDI out when operating in this mode.

There most certainly is timecode on Dual-Link A. It triggers my Nano perfectly.

There most certainly is timecode on Dual-Link A. It triggers my Nano perfectly.

You have timecode when outputting 60fps on dual link? The nano can't record 60fps 1080p so I'm not sure what your camera is set to.

I didn't say I was RECORDING dual link. I said that my F3 outputs SDI with embedded timecode on connector A when it is configured for Dual Link. I can record "singe" link from connector A and it has timecode.
Dual-link does have timecode and it is easy to detect even without having a dual-link recorder.