Mike how lightweight a tripod do you mean? I have a tripod from Gorilla which is quite nice for tiny little thing. Actually a smooth pan! But I do have others.

GorillaPod Video - Video tripod system for personal handheld cameras (http://joby.com/gorillapod/video/)

Hi

My first post on here for quite a while.

I've purchased a TM900 after coming from a Canon XHA1. As I wasn't shooting much video (I'm mainly a still photographer) I decided to sell. Well, a couple of years later I decided I wanted to get back into shooting video so thought (after reading a lot about it) I'd go for the Panasonic. So far I'm really pleased. The IQ is superb (a match for my old Canon) but I'm a little confused on a couple of areas......

For starters, I've had to move over to Premiere Pro as my Sony Vegas Pro isn't supported by my new Mac platform. Shooting in 1080/50P is also a new thing for me. My vids are for PC/Mac playback and I always saved to wmv. It now seems that H.264 is the way to go unless I purchase a wmv codec thingy for the Mac.

My first question (stick with me).....

The footage is shot in 50P so I take it there should be no field order or deinterlacing. When I save the video I find I get smoother footage when I set the field order to 'lower' at 50fps (in the H.264 codec settings). Now, if I right click on the timeline video and change the Field Options from 'None' to 'Always Deinterlace' then save the video but with 60fps and progressive I get smoother footage and a sharper picture. Can anyone explain this to me?

I still have a few other questions regarding Camera settings but wanted to clear this one up first.

Cheers,

Mark

If you are viewing on a computer monitor you will not get completely smooth video because typically your monitor is running at 60Hz and not 50Hz, so there are extra frames added/duplicated and this gives rise to some judder depending on the scene. On a HDMI TV this wouldn't be an issue as it would run at 50Hz to match the source. Also you computer may not be able to decode 1080/50p without some problems giving rise to even more stutters and judder.

Changing interlace settings is probably invoking the de-interlacer and more field-interpolation so smoothing things out better for 60Hz.

Regards

Phil

I am thinking of using two L-shaped profiles side by side to form rails for the dolly's narrow wheels:

V=====V

This would prevent the dolly from rolling of the contraption. I'll post any future developments.

Just did some experimenting - the lightstands I wanted to use for support are out. They are too wobbly.
It looks like microphone stands will be used instead.

Why not just two inexpensive tripods?

I bought my materials yesterday and will hopefully put it together in the next week or so. I'm going with a laminated shelf with 1 x 2" on the edges to create an I-Beam of sorts, and inlaying 1/4 x 20 inserts on each end for mounting on two tripods. I may add adjustable feet on the corners for floor use. All in all, about $20 total.

Why not just two inexpensive tripods?

I bought my materials yesterday and will hopefully put it together in the next week or so. I'm going with a laminated shelf with 1 x 2" on the edges to create an I-Beam of sorts, and inlaying 1/4 x 20 inserts on each end for mounting on two tripods. I may add adjustable feet on the corners for floor use. All in all, about $20 total.

I just happen to have a couple of mic stands, that's all. At the beginning I was concerned with the total weight of the device that's why aluminum light stands came to mind. Mic stands are heavier but that will add to the stability of the device.

Mike how lightweight a tripod do you mean? I have a tripod from Gorilla which is quite nice for tiny little thing. Actually a smooth pan! But I do have others.

GorillaPod Video - Video tripod system for personal handheld cameras (http://joby.com/gorillapod/video/)

Thanks for the reply, Al. that looks like something as porable as you can get. Would be nice to have that in the bag. However, I was looking for something I could use for fast deployment for use at eye level. My set up will have a seperate micicrophone and video light when needed.

I was looking for something I could use for fast deployment for use at eye level. My set up will have a seperate micicrophone and video light when needed.

Mike, have you consider a monopod? They have some limitations comparing to tripods but in some situations a monopod can do a good job.

Mike, have you consider a monopod? They have some limitations comparing to tripods but in some situations a monopod can do a good job.


Thanks for the suggestion, Adrian. I have used monopods for regular camera work. I would like to incorporate shooting stills from a point and shoot while running the video camera on the tripod for different points of view. .

Thanks for the suggestion, Adrian. I have used monopods for regular camera work. I would like to incorporate shooting stills from a point and shoot while running the video camera on the tripod for different points of view. .

Here is my super light "travel" tripod:

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/members/adrian-lepki-albums-my-toolbox-picture663-myfrotto-manfrotto-718shb-701rc2-video-fluid-head.jpg

I put it together some time ago for the specific purpose of travelling light. It consists of legs from Manfrotto 718SHB tripod and 701RC2 head. Also the center post was replaced with a longer one from one of Manfrotto's monopods. This tripod is 18" long or 54" fully extended.

Here is my super light "travel" tripod:

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/members/adrian-lepki-albums-my-toolbox-picture663-myfrotto-manfrotto-718shb-701rc2-video-fluid-head.jpg

I put it together some time ago for the specific purpose of travelling light. It consists of legs from Manfrotto 718SHB tripod and 701RC2 head. Also the center post was replaced with a longer one from one of Manfrotto's monopods. This tripod is 18" long or 54" fully extended.

Thanks Adrian. Nice looking setup, but a tad over my budget.

Dolly on rails cont.

Here are a couple of pictures of work in progress.

Rails on the floor:

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/members/adrian-lepki-albums-my-toolbox-picture664-table-top-dolly-diy-rails.jpg

Close-up:

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/members/adrian-lepki-albums-my-toolbox-picture665-table-top-dolly-diy-rails.jpg

Looks nice. I hope it works and you'll share the outcome with us. I'm going a little more "blue collar" on mine - the Jethro effect!

Thanks Roger, it will take few more days to get rid of rough edges and spray paint black the whole thing.

Some details: the overll length is 46.5" so it fits in the bag with the stands and some other stuff (the bag is 48"). The hole in the middle is for mounting the camera sideways.

In general this contraption can be used in 4 configurations:

1. directly on the ground, where the dolly by itself can't move, ie. sand
2. supported on table mic stands for low angles
3. supported on floor mic stands
4. as "the plank cam" as seen in this video at 0:30sec

Zero Budget Filmmaking: The Plank Cam - YouTube

I hope to post some results in coming weeks.

Cont. > Table dolly on rails - first trials.

Table dolly test 2 on Vimeo

It is quite difficult to keep this dolly moving at a steady speed. Especially at slower speeds. Hopefully with practice my technique will improve.

Here's a change of speed with the TM900: a sports video. Specifically, American baseball. This was a game that went from bright sunlight past sundown. Shows the OIS at work (all handheld), the great colors and smooth zoom.

108060p, 1/60th shutter. Manual iris and sometimes manual focus.

Panasonic TM900 Test Video: Spring College Baseball in HD on Vimeo

Alright guys, I just uploaded my first edited work with the TM900. Here it is:

Quality Demo on Vimeo

Would really appreciate any feedback, since I am a beginner at this and have a lot to improve.

I have noticed a few things regarding the TM900 while filming for this.

1. Notice how in the blue labyrinth scene the camera is shaking while I was adjusting focus - this happens all the time when I want to adjust focus on a tripod. Maybe I'm using too cheap of a tripod? No idea. The slightest touch and the camera produces a shaky image (stabilizer off when on tripod).

2. The time lapses don't look clean if you look closely. Seems like compression problems to me.

3. The sun isn't the clear-rounded sphere I was hoping it to be - I'm guessing I need a polarizer filter for that?

Roger, I followed your advice and exported from Premiere as 1920x1080 @ 25 fps (original footage was 50p) at 10 mbps. For some reason, Vimeo sees it as 720p footage, because when "Scaling is off", the video in fullscreen mode occupies half my monitor. Your canyon video fills the entire screen, so does Mark Rosenzweig's baseball video (good work with that, Mark :-) ). Any ideas why this happens? This video will be shown to potential customers, so I need it to be at its absolute best.

Thanks guys.

EDIT: Think I found out why Vimeo refuses to show it as 1080p: I need to be a Plus user.

Luc,

Nice footage. An inexpensive tripod does show its flaws when adjusting the camera, as I know all too well!

Are you a Vimeo Pro/Plus member? There are some limits to non-members and 1080 and/or file size may impact your ability to upload certain files. 720-30P @ 5Mbps is a good setting for Vimeo and I'm not sure the 1080 is better for most users when streaming. 1080 is nice when allowing others to download the source file for local playback.

Yes, apparently that's the problem, me not being a Plus user. Well at least we know it's not a technical problem. I uploaded the same vid to youtube and the quality is better. I can choose the 1080p option there too.

Answers as I see them Luc.

1) Undoubtedly a tripod that's not up to the job. You're at full tele on the TM900 right? That's the equivalent of 420 mm telephoto. Could be you had the 20x zoom option engaged - in which case you're talking of a 700mm lens. Those sort of focal lengths need tripods made of concrete if you're going to fiddle with the lens.

Try the same shot with the OIS turned on and see what you think. You're only told to turn off OIS when on a tripod because they expect you to pan or tilt. You're doing neither in this shot.

2) Don't look clean? You mean they have video noise? What gain settings were you using for the night time-lapse? And look at the crude iris blade flare from point light sources. A known problem with this camera.

3) A polariser will only help because of it's ND filtration properties - looking directly into the sun like that has grossly over-exposed the chips, and the resulting flare has spread much further than the sun's circumference. Take the same shot with very high shutter speeds (use the still camera facility if you like) so that zebras are not covering the sun and note that it is indeed (allowing for atmospheric haze) a true circle.

tom.

I appreciate the feedback Tom.

1. Yes, I think I was using the iZoom function. Will use the OIS next time then, see if that helps. You know what disappoints me though? The fact that it has a remote control, but you can't adjust the focus with it. It would have made a great difference...

2. Not video noise (was careful not to exceed 6dB gain), more like compression artifacts. Garbled video here and there, then it clears up, then it garbles some more. It's just not nearly as constant in clarity as the 50p mode, or even regular AVCHD.

3. Doesn't very high shutter speeds mean underexposure? Yes, the sun will be a clean circle but I fear everything else will be just... black. Hm, have to try this evening.

Thank you again sir!

Oh yes, exposing for the sun will mean massive under-exposure of the rest of the scene - I thought you were just checking out the sun's roundness. We all have to accept the sun as a grossly over-exposed blob if it's going to be in frame.

Hm, think I was a bit too late today, the sun was not as bright. So yes, now it looks much better :)

sunset snapshot from movie (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/836/vlcsnap2012031920h38m00.png/)

Pop Video using SD900
This is my first post but I have been following the information on this site about using the Panasonic HDC 900 series for some time. This persuaded me to buy an SD900 just before Xmas. I must say I have not been disappointed. I have uploaded a pop video made entirely on this camera to YouTube and would welcome any constructive comments.

Its Not Over.mp4 - YouTube (http://youtu.be/pFO6o5H79sM)

I used the camera in the manual mode, leaving it in auto focus and auto shutter speed. As the camera was on a jib-arm, I was unable to monitor the aperture 'zebras' so I used Adobe On Location to monitor the luma waveform.

I found only one slight problem with the camera: as you zoom in the camera appears to stop down. This effect is well known even on the cheaper professional cameras and easily fixed in post. The real problems are physically controlling the camera at the end of the jib - but that is another thread.

I have uploaded a pop video made entirely on this camera to YouTube and would welcome any constructive comments.

Its Not Over.mp4 - YouTube (http://youtu.be/pFO6o5H79sM)




Nice video. The editing rhythm and pace of the whole are good, so are the choices of camera angles. (Noticed one shot repetition of a drummer). One thing I'd change though, is the second shot in this video. The video starts with a very dynamic and tight shot of a drummer and then it cuts to a static wide shot of a whole band. The dynamic beginning is thus lost in this second shot IMHO.

Tried it in the rough cut without the second shot but it needed the wide shot to give 'geography' to all the players. I guess I needed a a more dynamic geography shot to make it work better.

Guy, the camera can't be in manual if the shutter speed's allowed to roam. You must lock the iris (and the associated gain) as well as the shutter speed to lock the exposure.

And the camera doesn't stop down as you zoom - you can shoot at f/2.8 using max wide, then zoom all the way to 20x telephoto and it will continue shooting at f/2.8. What you've seen is lens ramping, and it's very common. You can shoot at f/1.5 if you stick to max wide, but f/2.8 is the max aperture at full tele.

tom.

Thanks Tom. Are you saying that if the camera is in manual mode and I set the iris, then the shutter is also locked at the speed that it was set at when I switched out of auto?

That is correct Guy. That's because they were too cheap to incorporate an aperture-priority function on these cameras, so that when you lock down the aperture, the shutter value isn't left floating but is also locked down.

The 900's auto/manual exposure switching is not easy to grasp. In iA the camera controls the shutter speed, the iris and (by default) the gain. If you push the little chrome button iA disappears and MNL appears on screen.

The camera is still in auto exposure mode (I know, daft). If you now touch iris, it puts a yellow rectangle around the word and locks the exposure, if you touch it again to remove the yellow, it's still locked.

In iA the camera will choose any shutter speed from 1/25th up to 1/8000th, in MNL mode touching SHTR will lock in the reading iA had chosen as you suggest.

So, you're presented with a scene you want to manually expose, but have no idea as the the settings you should choose.

1) Ask the camera - call up iA, then press it again for MNL
2) Push SHTR to make sure it's 1/50th (the default - unless it's incredibly dark or light)
3) Push IRIS to lock in that iris/gain setting.

Strangely, if you go from iA to MNL and then push IRIS you'll lock the exposure ok, but then hitting SHTR makes the iris return to auto! Why, Panasonic? So make sure you follow the 1, 2, 3 sequence above to really lock that exposure down.

tom.

Thanks Tom. Are you saying that if the camera is in manual mode and I set the iris, then the shutter is also locked at the speed that it was set at when I switched out of auto?
Guy. Thats a good clear explanation from Tom. One other thing to watch out for when switching between iA to manual. The white balance will reset to AWB, you need to change it to your desired preset. The manual white balance settings remain in memory, even though the set idicator will be flashing

Teresa Wintermyr and Dan Sinbimuaythai Fight in Ranong on the Thai/Burma Border - YouTube

Heres a look inside of a country style Thai Boxing event that most people would never get to see... All shot using the tm900. Feedback would be appreciated!

Many thanks Guys for the lucid explanations of the subtleties of the auto functions.

Teresa Wintermyr and Dan Sinbimuaythai Fight in Ranong on the Thai/Burma Border - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qn-PVEm1RMM)

Heres a look inside of a country style Thai Boxing event that most people would never get to see... All shot using the tm900. Feedback would be appreciated!

Hi David,

I'd like to give you some feedback but first I need to know what was your intended goal and audience for this piece.

Adrian

Guys, anyone here know what Digital Cinema Colour is, exactly (under RECORD SETUP)? It says it records video with brilliant and wide range of colours, but that it requires a x.v.Colour-ready device.

With that setting, the camera records in x.v. color; naturally to see the benefits you need a monitor/TV with x.v. color capability and set to x.v. color. (Wikipedia: "xvYCC or Extended-gamut YCC (also x.v.Color) is a color space that can be used in the video electronics of television sets to support a gamut 1.8 times as large as that of the sRGB color space.")

Thank you Mark. Honestly sounds like something to avoid.

Yes, definitely avoid that setting!

Been busy with work so have not had much chance to get up to date with this thread. When things settle down a bit I'll try and do another quick summary of what's been covered over the last few weeks since the last one. Blummin heck, nearly 90,000 views! If someone else would like to do this summary, please do.

Just filmed my first live stage performance (school performance of kids singing) with two tm-900's, and an HV-30. Until now I have always shot with 3 Sony PD-170's. I shot in 1080p on the TM-900's in spite of the fact that I was going to export eventually to NTSC DVD. I shot in 1080i on the HV-30. My other settings on the TM-900 were: Manual white balance, intelligent auto on, anti-shake off (I was using nice tripods), manual audio at -21dB using VideoMic Pro, AGC audio on the other cam, 14x zoom maximum, autofocus, face-framing all, everything else at defaults. Here is what I liked/disliked:
Good:
1) Intelligent auto worked great for exposing faces properly whether the kids were under the spotlights or in shadow. Kids with very dark complexions were exposed properly when side by side with kids with very light complexions. This was far superior to the PD-170 and to the HV-30.
2) Great sharpness/resolution. The TM-900 was far sharper than the HV-30 and even more so in comparison with the standard resolution PD-170.
3) Turning anti-shake on and off with the button rather than via an embedded menu item

Bad:
1) "Face framing all" was a mistake on my part. I wanted to know what the camera was focused on, and this was an easy way to do so. But when panning across with 30 faces in each frame the little boxes drive you crazy. I will turn this off or maybe try "face framing primary" on my next project.
2) Manual white balance of the two TM-900's didn't result in them being quite as identical as it does with my PD-170's. I think the next time I might pick a preset that is close to perfect on both cams and not bother with manual white balance. I was also afraid that the camera might forget the manual white balance setting when turning the camera on and off. It blinks at you when you are in manual WB when you turn the camera back on and you wonder...
3) Colors were over-saturated. The kids had very bright red shirts on and they were almost fluorescent in the raw video. I had to dial them back in post which slowed down my editing process.
4) Matching the HV-30 well was pretty much impossible, even though the HV-30 was manually white balanced as well. I tried using the HV-30 in cinema mode because it is a lot less contrasty in that setting. But the resulting video was impossible to get to look like the TM-900 video from both a color and sharpness perspective.
5) Zooming at the desired speed is possible but much more difficult than the PD-170. I had times when I tried to zoom slowly but didn't apply enough pressure so nothing happened. I had other times when I tried to zoom at a moderate speed and ended up zooming way too fast. I did not try to use the zoom ring at all because it has seemed very clumsy to me to do so when I've tried it.
6) Trying to remember what the camera remembers when you turn it on and off or when you go to intelligent auto and back. This is probably the most annoying issue with the camera when trying to use it for this purpose. I was deathly afraid that I might accidently hit the intelligent auto button after I got the camera all set up and then lose all my settings. Or that when I turned the camera off after getting it properly set up that it wouldn't return to the same state when I turned it back on. I'm not sure if there is any difference in behavior if you just shut the LCD screen vs turning it off in this regard. I'm also not sure how quickly it runs down the battery if you just shut the screen and otherwise leave it on. These things aren't documented anywhere and it would take a lot of experimentation to figure it out.
7) The audio through the VMP was not good. It clipped some when folks clapped. It was still "boomy" in parts in spite of the fact that I was running in the low-cut position on the mike. I'm now wondering if the mike is more optimized for interviews than with musical productions. Fortunately I had several PD-170's running during the show on fixed tripods and I was able to use their audio. I'm not sure what I'll try next time as I really want to get away from the PD's and tape in general.
8) The additional editing time associated with using the high resolution video. I'm using CS5.5 Premiere on a very fast editing system. In spite of the fact that the video played back smoothly even with effects and multiple timelines, you can't quickly scroll through the clips. The final render times with color correction were also several hours rather than 15 minutes. This isn't too big a problem unless you discover an issue and have to go back and do it again (which I did twice).
9) Using the camera on a big tripod is not as nice as using a bigger camera. It's hard to be as smooth as the camera doesn't weigh anything. I used the eyepiece as I've always filmed that way. It's hard to get close enough to the camera as it barely extends out past the tripod plate on a big tripod. You end up leaning forward more than you have to with a camera that extends back further from the center of the tripod. The big battery also gets in the way a bit, both in getting your eye up to the eyepiece and also if you have to change the diopter adjustment.

In general the overall production was a success. I have proven that I can do projects with the TM-900's. I will be able to provide Blu-ray versions on future projects to go along with regular DVD's. The cameras aren't as convenient to use for this sort of thing because they aren't optimized for shooting in manual modes. (My guess is that they have intentionally made this so to prevent the cameras from impacting their professional lines). But they can be used, and at the price are hard to beat. I got my 2nd one for $699 at B&H a while back and am considering a third. The biggest issue is audio. I need to figure out a better solution in this area.

Alan

The problems with HV30 in cinema mode are:

- Lower resolution
- Different hue. Red gets wrong.

You can't change resolution in post. Hue is easier to change, try that when you color correct (CC) and try to match the two camcorders. I once used a XH-A1 and a HV20 in cinema mode and succeeded CC by changing hue.


Regards,

/Bo

Did you have a left hand on the pan bar and right hand on the zoom controller?
I think i'd opt for the ring control to try to get smooth zooms . . . some sort of support would probably be needed to rest/steady the hand, though.

Lack of a LANC port on this thing is a real shame.

Shooting the audio for a stage show with a mic on the camera is always going to be problematic. I've always slung a couple of mics over the stage and run them back to the camera. The sound is very 'open' but the audience clapping level is in the same ball park as the performance level. A better solution would be to have 3 or 4 mics on short stands along the front of the stage going to a manually operated mixer whose output goes to the camcorder.

I must agree with Mark: the lack of LANC makes smooth zoom operation very tricky. Is is possible to devise a simple mechanical linkage to operate the top control or the front ring?

Shooting the audio for a stage show with a mic on the camera is always going to be problematic.

RODE is soon coming out with an interesting solution for independent/limited crew producers:

The World's First Digital Recorder Video Microphone - RDE VideoMic HD (http://www.rodemic.com/vmhd)

I just hope the price won't be prohibitive.

Alan

The problems with HV30 in cinema mode are:

- Lower resolution
- Different hue. Red gets wrong.

You can't change resolution in post. Hue is easier to change, try that when you color correct (CC) and try to match the two camcorders. I once used a XH-A1 and a HV20 in cinema mode and succeeded CC by changing hue.


Regards,

/Bo

Have you (or anyone else) had any success creating an XHA1 CP file to match the TM900 ??

[Table dolly]

Here is my latest setup for tracking shots with TM900:

Hague table dolly on homemade rails. on Vimeo

Camera cage allows for better control when tracking with panning (or tilting) compared to the previous setup with a single tripod handle.

[Lighting]

Hi, I've started a thread on lighting tips and techniques here:

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/documentary-techniques/506767-lighting-tips-stuff.html

Please share your lighting for TM900 tips there. Thanks

This is cool. I just found this thread. I have had two Canon HV cameras and at the end of last year started a small business with someone using a Canon T2i and 60D. So far the results are stellar.

Having said that, I have been waning to go tapeless with my "video" cameras. So I go into Fry's Electronics and pow there is a little floor model HDC-TM900 for $380. SOLD! It was in great shape and had all the accessories except for the battery (that just got here today).

I am amazed at the work folks are getting from these cameras. It looks like I have lots to catch up on in this thread. :-)

Here is my second short movie made entirely with the TM900. The one thing that surprised me was the shallow DOF I managed to get on some of the close shots, really nice :) what I didn't like, however, was the low light performance. Even though I had multiple lights turned on, the camera struggled. Most of the footage had to be taken at +6dB iris and even then it was a bit dark. Everything you see in the movie has been lighted up a bit in Premiere - a process which brought out even more noise.

As a sidenote, I filmed at 1/50 shutter, even though you guys recommended filming at 1/100 if you know you'll want to slow it down at 50% speed. Even though most of the clip is at 50% speed, I'm quite pleased with how it turned out. Maybe I could have gotten away with using 1/25 shutter and therefore solve the +6db problem too? :)

Anyway, hope you enjoy the clip, any feedback is greatly appreciated. Thank you!



Pancake Day - YouTube

Nicely done. I wonder if softer lighing (i.e. china lantern) would help some shots.
This piece made me hungry :)

Haha Adrian, then my mission is accomplished :)

Nothing elaberate, but I use my TM900 a lot while storm chasing. Here is a video I shot a couple weeks ago.

Tornado and Cows, April 14 2012, southwest of Salina near Langley KS. - YouTube