Sony is back in the game... announces 1080p60 and 1080p24 camcorder.

Model Highlights: 1920 x 1080 Full HD 60p/24p recording, 12MP still images, wide angle G lens, "Exmor R" CMOS sensor, enhanced manual controls, CinemaTone presets, advanced controls, GPS receiver

HDR-CX700V | Full HD 96GB Flash Memory Camcorder | Sony | Sony Style USA (http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=8198552921666294237)

What I like:
- The 3.0” (16:9) Xtra Fine LCD™ screen (921K) (it's only 3" but has a better resolution than the new Panasonic camcorders)
- Video Format : HD: MPEG4-AVC/ H.264 AVCHD format compatible (1080/60p: original format); STD: MPEG2-PS
- Video Mode : HD PS: Approx. 28Mbps/ FX: Approx. 24Mbps/ FH: Approx. 17Mbps/ HQ: Approx. 9Mbps/ LP: Approx. 5Mbps; STD HQ: 9Mbps (so 24p mode is 24Mbps (Panasonic's is only 17Mbps). And Sony joins Panasonic with an 'original' AVCHD 28Mbps 60p mode... hope they make it officially supported by the consortium soon.)
- Focal length in Movie Mode: 26.3mm - 263mm (16:9), great wide-angle!
- The HDR-CX700V provides advanced capture and control features that are often considered the domain of professional cameras including expanded focus for precise manual focus control, zebra and peaking for precision focus and exposure adjustments.
- Get the most out of your camcorder with enhanced manual controls. The assignable dial allows for control of focus, exposure, white balance, iris, and shutter speed.
- Assignable Dial : Yes (Focus / Exposure / Iris / Shutter Speed / AE Shift / WB Shift Set)
- The built-in 96GB1 embedded Flash memory can record and store up to 40 hours of high definition video footage (HD LP mode).
- Tracking Focus works as an extension of Face Detection to allow you to select an object with a touch of the LCD and have the focus follow the selected object.
- A built-in GPS receiver7 makes the HDR-CX700V an ideal choice for travelers. The receiver gives you the ability to view your current location on the LCD map display, as well as "tag" your shooting locations. Tagged videos and still images can be reviewed and played back using the Map Index function on the camcorder or once downloaded to your PC using the supplied PMB (Picture Motion Browser) software9. Additionally, the receiver automatically adjusts your camcorder's clock to the proper time zone.
- MSRP $1299

If Sony hasn't crippled modes (like omitting stuff from the manual mode) this is an awesome camcorder for the price. Looking forward to seeing some test footage.

Think I just found the successor to my ageing Sony SR-1.

How are these camcorders's predecessors in terms of image quality and color reproduction? I see that it is a 1-chip sensor.

I'm still skeptical about the single-chip stuff. The upcoming TM900 has a 3.5'' LCD touch screen and could be cheaper than this Sony and have 3 CMOS sensors to boot. (even though each sensor is 1/4.1'', in bright light, the quality in my opinion is better than the single chip Sonys (not too oversharpened, not too undersharpened). They also mention that the TM900 has a better DAC for the sensors than the TM700.)

I think it's really interesting that Sony have also introduced a camcorder with a 1080p60 frame rate at 28Mbps (and 1080p50 for us over here in PAL land). Hopefully, it's implementation is very similar/identical to the much acclaimed Panasonic TM700/SD700 and HS700 versions - and the slightly improved new versions of Panasonic camcorders just announced - and will become adopted as some kind of AVCHD codec consortium "extension" standard as Floris mentions.

If more manufacturer's (e.g. Canon, JVC etc.?) jump on this format soon then hopefully we'll see more compatibility with the better NLEs in the near future too.

This is a great time to be considering a small, highly portable yet highly capable camcorder! I wonder if Sony will soon upgrade the HXR-MC50E as it's already looking outdated/overpriced regarding frame rate options (unless you really need XLR on a small camera).

Choice is a great thing!

How are these camcorders's predecessors in terms of image quality and color reproduction? I see that it is a 1-chip sensor.

Looks like it will be a "feature updated" CX550V with a SMALLER 3" screen... should be a fairly decent camera, but makes me want to figure out how to hack the firmware for the "old" models... I knew the feature capabilities were there, just not enabled... GRRRR.

Probably not a compelling upgrade if you've already got XR/CX 500 series and later, but carries on that tradition.

If more manufacturer's (e.g. Canon, JVC etc.?) jump on this format soon then hopefully we'll see more compatibility with the better NLEs in the near future too.
Choice is a great thing!

Hopefully this means Sony Vegas will offer full support for 1080p60/50, and the other NLE's will follow suit. Perhaps it will not be that long before the standard for shooting for slow-motion no longer requires dropping the resolution to 720p!

Vegas already supports 1080p60 through the MainConcept decoder. FCP, Avid, Edius, and etc are the odd people out when it comes to editing 1080p60. (Unless they use CineForm)

One other thing that I don't think anyone has mentioned yet.

The new Sony's that will offer 1080p50/60 appear(from viewing pictures on the Sony website) to not have a cooling fan, i.e. like the Panasonic TM700 family and Panny's new upgrades, unless I missed a fan grill somewhere?

Whilst the potential lack of one source of low level camera noise is welcome, I hope that does not mean we might get overheating problems if shooting for any length of time - like on some of the DSLR's when shooting HD video (luckily something my Canon 7D has only ever done once!)

It doesn't need fans, its such a COOL camera.... LOL

But seriously, I think the addition of this new level of AVCHD, level 4.2 for the 1080p60, in the consumer market is promising for the new 35mm pro model thats avchd. After all...they usually test out in the consumer market before hitting the pro market.

And another thing about this cam. I notice the CX700V has an unsually wide lens for a Sony camcorder - but I read a comment from Dave Blackhurst on here somewhere that the older CX550V (which was less wide than this new upstart) was on the verge of barrel distortion when on it's wide end.

So I'm wondering how "useful" (i.e. lacking in distortion) this extra wide aspect might be on these updated cams - I guess we won't know until the first tests get done, hopefully in the next month or so, assuming they meet that mid-March shipping date.

If I go for the CX700V, since it's a 37mm thread, I could screw on my trusty Sony VCL-HG0737Y Wide Lens Adapter (with Cavison Hood) and really "go for it" - a lovely bit of glass when I've used it on my HDR-HC1 - heavy through!

edius 6.0 does edit 60p. not sure where you heard it didnt,on the 700, not having the 3 1/2 inch screen is a factor for me. why did they go smaller. overall quality and performance, im leaning to the 550 in that the 700 will be identical in this area. no real reason to spend another 300.00.
the zebras/enhanced focus/ audio meters not a big deal here.

And another thing about this cam. I notice the CX700V has an unsually wide lens for a Sony camcorder - but I read a comment from Dave Blackhurst on here somewhere that the older CX550V (which was less wide than this new upstart) was on the verge of barrel distortion when on it's wide end.

So I'm wondering how "useful" (i.e. lacking in distortion) this extra wide aspect might be on these updated cams - I guess we won't know until the first tests get done, hopefully in the next month or so, assuming they meet that mid-March shipping date.

If I go for the CX700V, since it's a 37mm thread, I could screw on my trusty Sony VCL-HG0737Y Wide Lens Adapter (with Cavison Hood) and really "go for it" - a lovely bit of glass when I've used it on my HDR-HC1 - heavy through!

Wellllll... even the CX550V will show the edges of every 37mm WA adapter I've fitted, although I picked up an older HG0737 that isn't bad, heavy like the "Y" (a fine piece of glass!), but it's silver, and earlier vintage. The built in lens of the CX550 is so wide that it's tough to find hoods and WA adapters that won't show in the corners. I'd expect the CX700V to be even more susceptable.

Thanks Dave. Very useful information. I'm currently looking for differentiators between the new Panasonic TM900 and new Sony CX700.

It sounds like I should not consider the fact that I already have the excellent aforementioned Sony wide angle adapter as a compelling reason to stick with Sony, but make my decision on other factors.

You can use your WA, just plan on zooming in maybe 5%, maybe a tad more if you do - I find I leave my WA HG glass in the bag or ox more often than not now... but I've still got it just in case, and now my cheaper VCL .6's are close to fisheyes (with some vignetting at full wide of course)! The really nifty thing is if you mount an adapter or hood, you can actually watch the active IS at work, as the framing shifts slightly and smoothly!

The Pro market almost got 1080p60 with AVC-Ultra. (which is now vaporware)

Gee... it sure would be nice if my $1500 MC-50 had peaking, expanded focus and zebras. Especially considering this is in the Sony Pro Line.

Marc -
That and the CX550!! I have to wonder if Sony could produce a firmware upgrade - I'd bet the hardware is CAPABLE, just not enabled. Really would be a great customer relations move to "upgrade" some of these "basic" features for the "older camera" - might even make me MORE of a buyer of Sonys "stuff" if they did such a thing....

In fact it did just influence a BR player purchase - and it was easy to update the thing!! Now it supposedly does 3D... not that I even plan on a 3DTV, but hmmmm... since the capability is there...

Companies could build a lot of "brand loyalty" by simple and easy firmware updates, IMO!

Dave,

I completely agree. Even my SR-11 has Zebra stripes! How could a camera like the MC-50 not? Unfortunately Sony will probably try and sell an MC-60 that has all the additional features. But who knows perhaps they will do the right thing considering the MC-50 is a newly released camera and the 550 is basically the same model. One can hope.

I'm looking for a NEX-VG20 that has:
1. The E-mount and lens options that go with it.
2. An updated sensor that supports the new frame rates.
3. The brains & features of this new HDR camcorder. My HDR-HC9 has peaking & zebras also...

And while your at it Sony, leave the LCD and VF on when the user hooks something up to the HDMI.
I happen to like my control surfaces active at the same time as my larger external monitor.

Don't forget that 28mbps is still too compressed for 1080p60. 48-50mbps or more is better, but then again, it's still 4:2:0...

When a decent bitrate and 4:2:2 are in the mix, that's when the pros start noticing 1080p60 become a new standard for acquisition formats.

Once again, I will re-iterate that AVC-Ultra when it was announced 2 years ago was going to be that "magic codec" that had the tech specs to back up quality 1080p60 acquisition. But then it vanished and no products came out of it... Hopefully this year's NAB will see the revival of the codec since consumer 1080p60 cameras making the market.

When did Sony stop using LANC on their consumer cameras?

I think LANC is still on all Sony camcorders. It now appears on the A/V connector. LANC isn't just the 1/8" plug its the protocol that has been available even on the 5pin DIN plug on SVHS decks. Adapters are available to convert from the A/V 10pin plug to the 1/8" jack. VariZoom Mini Audio/Video to LANC Converter Cable VZ-AV/LANC B&H

Ron Evans

Thanks Ron great input.

HI Paul -
The Sony Sport Packs which you're familiar with, use the LANC protocol via the A/V "D" shaped plug. They also have released a couple other LANC/remotes for that plug - the functionality has been there since around the HC3, but for a couple years no one at Sony seemed to know anything about it.

I figured it out from the service manuals and reverse engineering the Sport packs and figured out how to hack the plug - you can adapt the "old" 2.5mm plug LANCs to use the A/V port, and "most" of the functions work exactly as expected, depending on the implementation in the camera and the controller. Just mainly an interface issue - Sony decided to "hide" the functions under a layer of new and different portt configurations (I'm about 99% sure there's another interface point in the AiShoe, Canon also used that!).

This is one of those reasons I am about 99% sure that Sony COULD release a firmware update that would "unlock" some of the "new features" if they would realize that it would make SOME customers happy, increase brand loyalty, and increase the ongoing value of their products in the marketplace!

I wish I were a bit more knowledgeable in the software/firmware department, but I'm more "hardware" oriented - I should think that a magic lantern or GH13 sort of firmware hack would not be out of the realm of possibilty - I guess no one out there is that interested in "hacking" Sony gear, unfortunately! And my experience has been that (at least Sony US) they don't even know what the "official" features offer - I made multiple contacts about the LANC when I was first contemplating the A/V jack hack, and not one C/S person had any idea about it!

LANC is the maintenance interface for the Sony camcorders so they are unlikely to explain things to you Dave. There were various controllers that work to do things like mask dead pixels etc and enable disable features. This was of more interest in Europe as the ability to record was disabled in lots of camcorders because this would have resulted in them being taxed/tariff at a different rate. The hacks allowed them to be turned on afterward even though this would have voided the warranty. For a while the maintenance remote was available and I missed the opportunity to get one.It is the RM95 Picture & Link: RM-95 : Sony Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review (http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1009&message=1711078). However you also need the code book!!!

Ron Evans

They pop up on eBay once in a while (RM95's), but I have to wonder how much use they will be on the "newer" cameras - and what level of "hacks" would actually be available.

If I understand current designs, the LANC interface would be limited to the "basics" (existing manual controls), where I think most of us want to access "chip level" commands - allowing access to features that are there on "new" cameras, but were likely left unactivated on the "old" models, even thought the potential capability may well have been there! That's more firmware tweaking.

I know Sony has issues firware updates on rare occaisions for various cameras, usually user installable via a downloaded file copied to a memory stick, so in theory it could be done if in fact the features are there and the firmware code was available to be hacked, or updates were released by Sony directly.

Heck, just got a Sony BR player (finally decided it was time to join the party...), and once network connected, it updated two firmware revisions, and now can do 3D (even if I'm not ready for THAT party just yet!)... of course that WAS an "advertised" feature, but obviously when the player was RTM, the code wasn't up to snuff, so they released the player without 3D, to be "added" via firmware updates later in the product life cycle.

My point being that devices now are routinely run by advanced highly integrated chips, and MARKETING or engineering deadlines decide which features do or do not make the "final cut", then "next year" the features, using either identical or nearly identical hardware suddenly become "available".

I have a really hard time believing that my CX550V's, which I'm quite happy with (like the 3.5" screen, and NOT really wanting to go "backwards"!), are incapable of having peaking, zebras, and 24 and 60p... I MIGHT consider upgrading a CX500 to a CX600... maybe... but that camera too is quite adequate for what I ask of it, just would be nice to have the features, or the capability to add them via a firmware update. Feels like driving a Ferrari with a speedometer limiter on it - an arbitrary limitation of the capabilites of the machine!

Unless Sony have changed to using the USB interface on the camera for maintenance ( which would make a lot of sense) then I expect the LANC interface is still usable. They are just ways to get into the microprocessor that controls the camera. In both cases though the maintenance access code is needed before anything can be accessed. Otherwise its just the camera control interface just like the IR remote or tripod controller.

Ron Evans

The specs on Sony Style say that it has "remote commander" interface. Isn't that what Sony calls their LANC controllers?

No, that's what they call their wireless IR remotes.

Found this on YouTube.

YouTube - Sony HDR-CX700: First HD Test Video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Obu8R4DTON8)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this THE FIRST consumer camera from Sony to shoot 24p?

In any case, I've always preferred Sony's color reproduction to Canon's, particularly in the blue/green range. So I'm hoping this will be the first of many to compete with the Canon Vixia line. I thoroughly enjoyed the HC7, but got rid of it when I committed to 24p, then later sold the V1U since the colors were so different from the HV20's.

I assume pulldown removal is required ie the progressive frames are recorded amongst 60i.

The wide angle looks great.

What's the point of 96GB of memory? I'd prefer dual slots and no built-in memory. Ah, it says there is one Memory Stick Duo and one SD slot. Wonder if they record simultaneously, or Relay style. I'd vote for keeping your memory, Sony, and dropping the price to $775 (wink).

Anybody know what "Golf Shot" is?

"Golf shot" uses high speed shutter to record a series of images of a golf swing or other sport. Here is a you tube video that sort of demonstrates it: YouTube - Sony Handycam Golf Shot Overview (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1EBdN7Wsbo)

As with the CX550, there is only one memory card slot, near as I can tell. You can use either SD or Memory Stick, but not it all goes to one slot.

The point of 96 gb is longer times between having to download video to free up internal memory. My guess is that this is aimed at folks on the go who might not have time or location to conveniently offload to SD cards/memory sticks or computers during a day or a week of travel. Also aimed at folks who need really long recording times for day long meetings, scoping sessions, and the like.

Sorry if this has been posted already but...
WHY DID SONY REDUCE THE SIZE OF THE LCD ? !!!

As an owner of a Sony MC50U I can honestly say that the 3.5 LCD is a glorious feature on such a small camera. It was one of the deciding factors which helped me choose between the sony and the Pan TM700

One step forward, one step backward.

The new Panasonic TM900 has a 3.5 inch screen (up from 3 inches) and it's now double the resolution of the TM700...unfortunately that's still half the resolution of many top end camcorders like your Sony - but "good enough" (bearing in mind the other features and cost of the Panasonic compared to it's likely alternatives) to have made me push the button on a TM900. At least it has peaking, zebras etc. Mine will arrive on Tuesday 15th Feb.

Scott said 'Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this THE FIRST consumer camera from Sony to shoot 24p?'

Well, my four year old standard definition Sony HC96E handycam (PAL) has the option to shoot 25p (progressive segmented frame) and it looks pretty good. I believe the NTSC version can shoot 24p but not 100% sure.

I'm also looking at the CX700 as a possible camcorder, that or the Canon XA10 (I decided can't afford the xf100 as things stand at present). I need IR for night shooting and the CX700 has 'Nightshot'. Nice to have 60p but fair to say it's not widely used as an end product - not yet at least (correct me if I'm wrong) as it's not broadcastable and can't be put on blu-ray or DVD. I guess ypou can keep it for future use and just drop every second frame for editing and current delivery.

I was about to place an order for the CX700, when by chance whilst in Germany this weekend I noticed in a couple of German Camcorder magazines, a CX690 version which seems to be same spec but no flash memory just SD card only, for 200 euros less than the Cx700.
Can't find any mention in the original CES press releases, but it does exist in Germany at least.

Any one else looking at this model?

Thanks

I guess ypou can keep it for future use and just drop every second frame for editing and current delivery.

Exposure rate is the same for progressive and interlace, no need to drop frames. For interlace only a field is recorded but for progressive the whole frame is recorded. So 60P ( or 50P) should work just fine in an interlace project setting for an NLE . The NLE will just take a field from the full frame( odd or even field is half vertical resolution). The standard is confusing as interlace cameras take exposures at the full rate of 50 or 60 frames a sec. For interlace they just record a field each time and for progressive the whole frame. Since two fields make a frame the standard says 50i is 25fps and 60i is 30fps ( for drop frame time code in NTSC that is 29.97). The temporal rate though is the same for progressive and interlace. This is of course NOT true for 24P, 25P or 30P which will have a slower temporal motion. Full rate progressives will include twice the detail, need more in camera processing power and storage but will have much more detail for stills from a video frame or for slow motion.

Ron Evans

Ron, that's interesting. I may not have fully understood but does this mean that 1080/50p (or 60p) progressive footage would be treated as interlaced and in effect automatically interlaced when rendered from a 50i (or 60i) timeline?

Paul, thanks for mentioning the CX690. I didn't know about that and I have checked the Sony UK website. It's not showing so it could be a version restricted to some EU countries. I hope it does become available in the UK though as it might save a bit of money.

Depends on the NLE you will have to check yours but I think most of the current NLE's would take the file with whatever else is on the timeline and render to the project export settings. Edius and Vegas will do this not sure of others.

Ron

...CX690 version which seems to be same spec but no flash memory just SD card only, for 200 euros less than the Cx700...it does exist in Germany at least...Any one else looking at this model?...
Yes, I might be interested in this model as well and I look forward to the first tests. Unfortunately it´s not absolutely clear at the moment what the differences between the CX700 and the CX690 are. Even the Sony homepage is a bit inconsistent. The CX690 definitely has no GPS receiver and very likely no flash memory (although the website lists 96GB built-in memory for both). And maybe both camcorders use different types of stabilizers (CX690: SteadyShot, CX700: SteadyShot Active). But to be sure, I guess we will have to wait till it is available: The CX690 is expected to follow one month after the CX700, so in April we should know everything about it.

Let's say a consumer buys a shiny new CX700 for a big vacation across Europe for which they've paid $5000. On day 12, they've got 90GB of outstanding footage and still shots...all their memories of the fantastic trip.

How much is that camera worth on Day 13?

For my money, cameras are for acquisition, memory is for transfer, and hard drives or the cloud are for storage. After getting robbed of everything in Costa Rica last year, the last thing I'd want is footage in the camera.

Give me the CX690, especially if it has the Sony equivalent of Relay Recording.

Well all the latest Sony camcorders have card slots for SDHC or Memory stick whether or not they have internal memory. They also will transfer to USB hard disk without a computer . So if one doesn't want to record to the internal memory just record to the card slot. or at the end of every day backup to hard drive like a Passport USB drive. The CX690 doesn't seem to be available on any of the NA sites so far anyway. The CX560 looks like a CX700 with less memory and no viewfinder.

Ron Evans

Thanks, Ron, I had not made that connection.

I'm still waiting for the model with zero memory, to compete with the HF-S200 I just bought. :)

I just noticed the B&H description lists a "built-in USB cable." Funky. Sounds like a recipe for frustration.

It looks to me like the CX560V is as close to a "card only" configuration as they are offering - haven't heard anything about a "690" - any links? The 560 will drop the VF, and has 64G memory built in, plus of course the card slot for external card in MS Pro Duo or SDHC flavor.

The USB cable is in the strap so is out of the way and if you have a laptop with you means there is no need to bring a cable just connect and backup to laptop.
Ron Evans

Well all the latest Sony camcorders have card slots for SDHC or Memory stick whether or not they have internal memory. They also will transfer to USB hard disk without a computer . So if one doesn't want to record to the internal memory just record to the card slot. or at the end of every day backup to hard drive like a Passport USB drive. The CX690 doesn't seem to be available on any of the NA sites so far anyway. The CX560 looks like a CX700 with less memory and no viewfinder.

Ron Evans

I didn't know it was possible to transfer video files from the camcorder direct to an external hard drive. I thought you always had to go via a computer. That's good news. So I take it if you recorded onto the built-in camcorder drive (not SDHC card) you could then drag files, or whatever you do with them, onto something like the Passport USB drive or whatever external portable hard drive you have as long as it has the appropriate USB port. That could save a lot of money because if you were shooting say 12 hours of video you wouldn't have to buy loads of SDHC cards. I shockproof portable hard drive doesn't cost very much these days. Just one worry, how do you tell that all your video clips have transferred successfully?

Ron, you are right. Just checked specs for both CX700 and CX560 and both offer the option to transfer to external hard drive:

'Direct Copy - Transfer video footage direct to an external hard disk drive without PC: playback with fun camcorder features'

and:

'Also featured on all HD and SD models, the Direct Copy feature lets you copy footage directly from Handycam camcorders to any brand of external hard disk drive (USB2.0; under2TB, FAT32) via a USB cable (VMC-UAM1; sold separately), when connected to AC power, for PC-free back-up and archiving. Video stored on the external HDD can be played back through the camcorder for viewing on a compatible HD television.'

Looks like you have to be plugged into mains AC to do this. I was hoping this could be done when outdoors with no access to a power socket.

I think this is because some of the USB drive take power from the USB connector and in this case the camcorder would have to supply power. May not be enough power in batteries in this mode to power the external hard drive too. Also better to have mains supply rather than corrupt data if battery shuts down during transfer.

Ron Evans

Anyone have on order? When will the first one be in someones hand?

I have mixed thoughts on the USB cable being on the unit. If it breaks, you are dead meat since I assume there is no other way to get the data out. Too bad firewire is not on these units.

Weird the 550 has the viewfinder, but the 560 does not. Guess they understand how to get the max dollar from the consumer.

There is only so much power you can take from the camcorder. Most external USB drives of any size would need external power. Now, if the USB was small, then maybe, but no way I would want to transfer files via battery power.

Still trying to understand if the 60P is that much better than the 60i. I only buy these things like once every 5 years, so really want to capture the best material for any future needs. So, if I make a BR from 60P or 60i material, will I see any difference? If not, what is the value of 60P?