After reading through these posts something struck me as an outsider to the wedding game, but with one (cheaply) paid wedding under my belt.

The reason photogs make more seems simple. People care about their pictures more than the video. The video doesn't sit on the mantle for the life of the marriage (a concession there to the divorce stats), the picture does. The grandparents don't have the video on their mantle either. The affluent couple I shot for had the best photographer in the area, but the video was added as an afterthought. I talked with the photog about video and he figured going in that direction for him (as a pro) was just crazy...and I agreed. So for that mantle shot, folks are willing to pay a lot more. I'm not convinced that any level of education or marketing would change the hallowed status of the wedding poster print.

So in a sense, you're stuck. The product that takes more time, hardware, and sweat, is valued less...and may always be. I wouldn't suggest that this is always the case, just my observation.

Be gentle :-)

Thanks Dan~! I really hope that you're telling us the true story. :)

Young,

Amedio Wedding - Free
Auman Wedding - $1700
Lane Wedding - $2200

I have no reason to puff or artificially inflate anything.

Case in point guys. Some of you all can't even believe that kind of fee is possible for a newbie let alone for yourself. Y'all got to change the way you think.

Get 'um Peter!

PS I shoot with 2 PD170's and 1 GL2 with all Sennheiser evolution wireless and I-river's with GS mic's

I am worth every penny.

Sorry; this post is fairly long and covers quite a few topics, I wouldn't be offended if you skip it. I wrote it fairly late so I appologize for the stream of conciousness, but this has been on my mind for quite some time.

I think one of the greatest problems that prevails in all of these debates is the lack of understanding between parties, Over the many threads on this topic I have seen people living and working on Manhattan island debate people living in modest largely blue collar rural regions as to why their prices are wrong. I have seen seasoned industry professionals tell beginners why their modest documentary style one camera shoot is undercutting their 3-5 camera highly polished Hollywood FX style video.

Many people are in different positions and offering different things, yet for some reason these discussions are approached as if we are comparing apples to apples. Some people seem to worry that if anyone is cheaper than them (possibly considerably cheaper) they are “stealing” their clientel, that new people with a camcorder and no knowledge of presentation artistic shooting and editing or feel for the job are taking their clients.

The problem, if you can call it that, is with the cost of equipment every family probably has access to an uncle bob who shoots all the kids basketball games and authors DVDs for the parents of the team, probably does a pretty good job as well. Most extended families probably have access to a techno-geek nephew and aspiring indie-filmmaker who has excellent equipment. But if you really view that as a problem and you really think that an inexperienced person with little knowledge of wedding videography is easily and reliably taking your clientel then obviously the problem lies squarely with you, Uncle bob will never go away, the number of indie-filmmaker cousins are only going to multiply as costs plummet, so the cost to a bride for an unprofessional video can always be near free if they really want to sacrifice quality, Its your job not to price fix the service, because you simply cant; its your job to sell your services, to have the demo, and prove to them why you can command such a price; If they really see inexperience and poor video as being worth the savings you didn't sufficiently prove to them why they needed you and why you are worth it.

Though it does go the other way, Some people seem to get hung up providing an extra polish they go the extra mile (Some I would say run a whole extra marathon) and pull all the stops, they do a ton of work and expect just compensation for their work and thusly very high prices. The problem is; and I'm sure we all have experienced it, as videographers we look at video from a completely different perspective. Half the stuff we do is completely transparent or actually of no consequence to a laymen, When we look at other videographer's work we greatly admire and respect these beautifully crafted wedding videos, but I think there are some things we need to face, the fade timing with a slow blur and delayed audio fade out that you spent 5 minutes on, Might as well been the premier default; The minor audio glitch you took 2 minutes smoothing out; probably wouldn't have been noticed by your clients, but we fix this stuff, and in the end they never notice half of what we do. (Yes, I realize our goal is transparency) The real problem is when you go above and beyond and provide near perfection; While there is certainly some market for “The Best Wedding Video Ever”TM The average bride has only a certain level of perfection that they expect, a certain budget they must stay in, and also only a certain level of perfection that they are capable of seeing; I would venture a guess that most everyone here produces videos at a much greater quality than any of the recently popular bridal reality TV shows on today; and the brides would never notice a difference. While we hear poor audio, they hear “fine” while we see too tight of a zoom, they see “Fine” while we see poor cutting, they see “fine” Any work we do above and beyond that threshold is deffinately going to experience diminishing returns.

I'm in no way saying we should aspire to mediocrity, infact I suffer from this perfectionism pretty badly and time management is something I'm working on. Though I assure you I in no way produce videos near some of the crap local individuals produce involving a VHC Camcorder stuck in the back of the church, and I greatly admire the regional big shots that produce those videos other videographers envy. But really, this isn't an auction, this is a job interview. Its up to us to prove why we deserve our prices, and also provide our services economically and within the budgets of our clients, not why other people's prices are wrong.

If they really see inexperience and poor video as being worth the savings you didn't sufficiently prove to them why they needed you and why you are worth it.
....
But really, this isn't an auction, this is a job interview. Its up to us to prove why we deserve our prices, and also provide our services economically and within the budgets of our clients, not why other people's prices are wrong.

You are right on the point. If we cannot drive the market, we better flow with the market (as you pointed out, more precisely, the local market).

Josh, you hit the nail in the head mate, even though i still feel that hobbyists shouldnt undercharge, this is simply coz theyre selling themsleves, and their peers short.
Specifically the comment about brides having a certain level of "acceptance" where you and i might think a cut or a shot could have been tighter, or cleaner, they WONT see what we see.. they DONT see the technicalities behind what we do, which is why education is key..
Once they understand how much work is involved, then yes.. you can not only justify the cost, but you can also justify delivery time frames and anything else pertaining to your business.. which is what this is.. irrespective of your gear, or workstation.. if ur making a buck out of this, youre in business..

The thing that seems to keep getting overlooked in all this is that it's ultimately up to consumers what they expect and are willing to pay for from a wedding video. No matter what standards we set for each other and what price we think should be paid to get that level of quality, you'll never stop potential customers from shopping around and picking what they think makes the most sense based on their budget. If we agree a proper wedding video should cost at least $2-3K to produce but most couples are only prepared to pay half that amount, that either means a lot of people won't get any video or some of them will opt to accept what they can get for what they're willing to spend.

You don't have to like how this affects the industry, but it's simply inevitable unless you either engage in widespread price-fixing or pass some law which makes it difficult to produce inexpensive videos. Since neither of those is likely, these discussions are pointless in a free market economy because the market is working as it should right now. If people buying discount videos like what they get and people buying expensive videos like them even more than everyone's happy; if not the situation will eventually correct itself one way or another. Again, you don't have to like what this means, but you can't stop it. I'd say the current situation is fine.

P.S. I can see how setting some standards for membership in a professional association could be a good thing, but that wouldn't ultimately change market forces any. If passing those tests weeded out videographers who happen to charge less than some certain amount, then customers unwilling to spend that amount of money will simply hire people who don't belong to the association. No matter what you do from our end, what happens in the market is ultimately in the hands of the consumers.

hmm..

okies, we al repeat ourselves using different phrases and the like to get our points across...

i just came from a bridal forum where the brides were more than happy to fork out anythign between 3grand and 5 grand for decent photos..
this is AUD, so your looking at 2 to 4 grand US...

okies.. well what makes THEM so special??
Is it the picture on the mantle?? strange you might ask that, considering ive given pictures to clients from DV and stills weve taken with an MX500 (no shit), which the client has put up on the wall, as oppsed to what their photographer has provided... so does that mean i can charge 3grand now?
I wish....

Let's see...
Go ahead, stay in the basement. Keep the industry in the toilet.

I'm sorry, but I cannot respect anyone who doesn't respect themselves enough to strive for more, not less.

I like this guy... very well done I'm just about starting up, and his advice helps a lot.

We want to raise the bar, but when you start out you have to look at the market value of the product you are selling. When your new you don't have the experience to justify the new higher rate that a veteran would be asking for. You need to look at you own work, and the work of others that are making a comparable product, and set the rates according to that.

Brides aren't stupid and they aren't going to pay one and a half times the going rate for the same product that another company can deliver. And they definitely won't do it for someone starting out.

Start at the market rate, develop your skill set, and then raise the level. There will always be people at the lower end because people need to start somewhere, but once you get the first few done you can adjust for the correct pricing that you really want.

When you start out it's a long term investment that doesn't see a direct return on your initial hours.

Ben

Wow well said. I do see that a bride wont pay full price for me to practice on her. However if I've done a few weddings and I have my software and content downpack prices can defintely go up.