Anyone shooting video with long lenses?

I see lots of great advice to use ND filters and understand why. I have polarizers and ND filters for smaller lenses (EF100-400 and smaller) but not for the EF500 f4 and wonder if there's a workaround?

The 500 f4 with the 1.6 multiplier gives a standard 800 mm on the 7D. Can still add a X2 and X1.4, so that should be enough to shoot the knee cap on an ant. Been using a Wimberly head to shoot birds in flight, which is coming in useful for shooting video.

Spent several hours on a canoe with a tripod yesterday, shooting with 17-40, 28-135 & 8mm fisheye. Got some nice footage of a kayaker splashing a small basking gator with his paddle, grrr. A great learning experience but after several hours in the sun a flashing red light came on, so stopped for lunch to let the camera cool down. Took about 4 hours to download 14 Gigs from a 16 Gig card. Not sure if a faster hard drive would solve this.

Is it possible to shoot video through the viewfinder? Trying to track a moving object on the LCD screen in the sun is more than a bit lame. Looks like I can't auto focus while shooting video, but that's just part of the learning curve.

Absolutely love this new camera. I was shooting out to sea from the beach recently with the 500 f4 and heard the sound of a very low flying plane to my left. Spun the lens 90 degrees and shot four perfectly focussed shots from point blank range. Amazed that it could focus that quickly. No way could my 10D or 5D have done that.

Nowhere near sorting the workflow out yet. Bought NeoScene and Premeire 8, so a big learning curve ahead. Quite a big jump for this stills photog and loving it.

Hi Doug,

I have a 32GB card that I've never filled it completely but I routinely go above 20GBs and although I never really pay attention to it while copying the files to my hard drive it generally takes about 20 minutes to transfer, nowhere near 4 hours.

Somethings doesn't sound right there unless your encoding to whatever codec your using with Premiere, then 4 hours might not be too long. I just encoded about 10GBs to ProRes for FCP in less than an hour, I think. I grabbed some breakfast and it was done when I got back...

Sorry, can't help you with your lens question, wish I could, but I have not been fortunate enough to use that type of lens.

You are probably using USB 1, USB 2 will speed up the transfer by 4x or more.

I routinely do wildlife video with a 7D for stock footage, though I am not fully set up to process and produce anything with it at the moment. I've been sending it out to an editor/producer friend of mine for that.
Anyways, I really do enjoy using this body for work. I wish I had a longer lens though, as for right now I am using a 200mm Nikkor with a 1.4x Tele. giving me about 450mm FOV.

Most of the time, outdoor conditions allow me to shoot under ISO800 so noise is never an issue. I'm still working with profile settings to get a sweet spot.

The only issues I've ever had involved rolling shutter effects on fast movement. I was following a group of whitetail deer running, and upon reviewing the footage I could see the background doing its "Jello" dance. Live and learn. I wouldn't put my life on this camera for shooting the next planet earth series, but it never leaves my side either. Once you know its limitations, it's very useful and provides beautiful footage surpassing the other gear available to me.

I think the jello thing would be the main problem. Wildlife is usually moving!
It's why "the next Planet Earth series" is using Varicams, because they have CCDs and so no rolling shutter issues.
In terms of lens power too, you'd be better off using something with a 1/2" or 1/3" chip as your 500mm lens would then equate to a 2500mm or 3500mm respectively!
Tried it very briefly with my Nikond D300s in the back garden, stuck on a 400 2.8 and boy was it useless!
Steve

Is it possible to shoot video through the viewfinder? Trying to track a moving object on the LCD screen in the sun is more than a bit lame. Looks like I can't auto focus while shooting video, but that's just part of the learning curve.

You'll need some form of loupe/hood to be able to focus effectively in Live View Mode. Check out the Zacuto Z Finder, Hoodman HoodLoupe and others. I don't have one yet (hoping to get one at NAB next week) but I find that I cannot nail focus handheld by relying on the LCD screen.

If you're locked down on a tripod, your other option is a small monitor like a Marshall, SmallHD or the like. You focus and compose off the monitor rather than the camera's LCD.

Cheers,
Bob

You are probably using USB 1, USB 2 will speed up the transfer by 4x or more.Hopefully 40X faster as USB 1.x is 12 Mbit/s & USB 2.0 is 480 Mbit/s.

I use one of these Lexar - Flash memory card readers - Pro FW800 CF Reader (http://www.lexar.com/readers/pro_udma_reader.html) which is much faster than than any USB 2.0 CF reader that I have used.

I use the 100-400L for outdoor nature shots a lot. A downfall of that lens is the lack of smooth manual focus - at least with my copy. And as you noticed, no auto focus / tracking focus with the 7D (or any other HDSLR). But - with high enough aperture most will be in focus so you can track outdoors. I filmed body boarders at a local shore break the other day and after an hour of practice I finally got a smooth motion to track boarders moving in the barrel. But then you look back at the footage and the rolling shutter becomes an issue.

Tried it very briefly with my Nikond D300s in the back garden, stuck on a 400 2.8 and boy was it useless!
Steve

I don't quite understand that remark, Steve?

On another note, most of my distance wild photography and filming with DSLRs is with telephoto lenses in the 300mm - 600mm range. They may not provide the extreme magnification provided by fitting the same lenses to a Canon XL camcorder, but they do tend to provide the very best quality stills and footage. It just means that you need to get a lot closer to the wildlife...or wait a lot longer, although the results tend to be well worth the effort.
However, there are of course times when you'd like the same extreme magnification when filming with a DSLR as a camcorder + SLR telephoto lens, especially for example to obtain tightly framed crisp footage of the moon and craters etc.

One option for DSLRs may be the Fieldscopes. Most of the fieldscopes of the past did not provide good enough enough quality when a camera was attached, but one of the latest reviews in Outdoor Photography magazine has made me closer at that option.

The review was of the Nikon EDG Fieldscope 85 attached to a DSLR via a Nikon FSA-L2. This turns the scope into a 500mm-1750 f/5.9-F/21 zoom lens. Yes, it may be lacking in the available light compartment, but it does seem to deliver sharpness and colour contrast equal to a lot of pro-grade DSLR zoom lenses. I prefer to use fast telephoto lenses, but to have the possibility of using a 500mm-1750 zoom for video with a DSLR is a good option to have when you need it...especially considering the quality of the images it is capable of.

These figures are with the full frame camera like the D3/D3s/D3x/D700 (or on a Canon 5D Mark II + adapter). Attached to the Canon 7D or D300s the Nikon EDG 85 would turn into a DX lens covering 750-2625mm.

Obviously it would need a good tripod and correct technique to obtain the best footage, but the same can be said about using extreme telephoto lenses on camcorders.

It's quite straightforward Tony, pan with anything moving (as wildlife often does) and it skews like crazy. The codecs are dreadful too of course.
And what use is 24P for wildlife? You want to slow things down rather than having to speed it up to 25P in post.
I do agree with you re lens power, people do rely on it too much these days. In Super 16 days we always used to think of 600mm as being the longest you'd generally like to use (like most others I'd use Canon 300 2.8 2x or Canon 150-600), but now on the Varicams our standards are HJ40 and HJ18x28, both of which will go to 1000mm or more, and yet 2/3" already gives slightly more magnification than Super 16!
Steve

Oh, sorry, I thought your were talking about the actual quality and use of a 400mm f/2.8 on a D300s, not what it was like for panning. For locked shooting it should be OK, although the crop factor obviously increases the jello affect compared to on the D3s, especially when you begin moving that tripod head from side to side...

Yes, I'm with you on the crappy 30P & 24P for filming. It's been so nice to use the 5D with 25P! I think the next Nikon is inline for 25P though.

The 7D seems to be very slightly better than the D300s in regard to 'wobbly' jello, but of course those increased telephoto affects don't help matters.

In fact if you pan very slowly with a full frame camera such as the 5D the jello is almost non-existant and definitely not a big problem with most nature subjects. I try not to follow or pan much with wildlife anyway.

Probably the worse case scenario would be following a cheetah at full pace during a hunt... :)

We must shoot very differently Tony because I'm always panning when I film wildlife.
I know one thing for sure, next time the NHU book me for a shoot if I suggest using a 7D or 5D for it they'll think I've gone insane. I don't know what the future holds for DSLR movies, but they're not even close to being chosen for broadcast wildlife except for special circumstances - just finished on a series on which underwater stuff was on a 5D. Topside was all HDCam, Varicam and PDW700 - don't even like EX cams etc., due to CMOS issues, let alone DSLRs.
Steve

Yeah, horses for courses, Steve, and why we don't have the same wife and probably would prefer our steaks cooked entirely differently. :)

It's just nice to know that we all have so many choices provided to meet our own requirements, goals and desires.

Yes, choice is good. But I just can see very few situations where DSLRs would be a preferred choice for wildlife shooting. Very limited budget? Maybe, though you'll get better results with a Canon XL-H1 and standard lens for the same cost. Portability? Maybe, but if you need big magnifications and so are using 400 2.8, 600 f4 etc, you lose that advantae immediately. The only thing in its favour I think is if you need to put it in a small housing, or hidden somewhere maybe as a remote.
Steve

Hi Everyone,
Thanks for all the great replies, you're very kind.

I shot boats running at high speed out of the inlet today using an EF100-400 lens. The weather was bright and sunny with some rough water caused by wind and tide. As the boats were coming towards me I had the sun to my back, panned and then shot almost straight into the early morning sun. I was using a low end ball head.

Even with small apertures F5/F8 the boats stayed in focus, and as I turned into the sun I cranked the aperture down. I left ISO at 100. Overall not bad and see that practice is helping. Shooting with 1080 and 30P, tried shutter speed of 60 and 125 which didn't seem to make any difference.

I do see what looks like each frame playing when playing back in Zoombrowser. My card is not UDMA, could that be the cause? There's no buffering delay. After running it through Neoscene it smooths out and is worth watching without feeling sea sick. Overall amazed at the clarity and sharpness of the video, playing it back on a 24" monitor.

If I understand correctly "Jello Effect" is the stuttering background when panning or is that called rolling?

Another 4 hour download. I'm shooting with a Kingston 16G 133X card and downloading with an old card reader from 10D days to an external drive. Great tips on getting a faster card reader, special thanks for that.

Hook the camera right to the computer and you'll be fine.

Hi everyone,
Been shooting solidly for about 2 months and getting used to some of the quirks of the 7D.

Shooting 1080 30P:
My standard settings are shutter speed of 1/125 (1/250 creates a background shudder when panning, I think it's called rolling).

ISO of 800 -1250 even in good light. Noise doesn't seem to be a problem and I've shot at ISO 2500 with a small amount of noise. Above 2500 definitely is a problem.

The reason for the high ISO is that I want a reasonable depth of field. I was shooting a Racoon recently at around F8 which is my standard still setting. A larger Racoon appeared in the background and was just an out of focus blur, ruining what should have been an excellent clip. From then on I started using F16 and smaller apertures, sometimes down to F32.

I compose and focus through the viewfinder, adjusting the exposure by turning the wagon wheel on the back of the camera. Of course the camera mode is manual. I've found that the correct exposure for a still shot is correct for video. Then I flip the video switch and press the remote.

Starting and stopping the video created a shudder at the start and stop. Went online and found that the Canon RC1 will operate the 7D video. I have one from my 10D and it works great. The 5D remote does not work for 7D video, at least mine doesn't. Now no shudders so no need to fix that later. There are some camera settings to set to get this working, such as live mode enabled and 2 sec timer on. Remote RC1 needs to be on setting # 2. Big improvement and this is a must have for me.

I've tried 3 kinds of tripod and head combo:
The first was a Manfrotto carbon fiber tripod with low end ball head. Sort of OK for panning but not great.
The second was my Wimberly head on the Manfrotto. Not great, but I'll try it again with the up/down locked and see how it pans. This would be for the 500 lens maybe with 1X4. Maybe I won't be able to pan with this magnification.
The third is a not very high end video head on a fairly solid but cheap aluminum tripod. Seems best for panning. Of course it's best for panning, that's what it's designed for. Duh!

Just found out how to switch from video to still and back instantly. I lost some Swallow Tail Kite shots this morning because I was shooting video and it took 2 sec to trip the shutter when I switched back to still. By that time the action was long past. Use the C1 and C2 setting on the Mode dial and set presets.

I never zoom, the 100-400 is hopeless for this. The other lens I use is an EF28-135mm F3.5/5,0 IS which is great for more general shots of sunrise with birds twittering etc.

IS is always on, even on the tripod.

Have a Rode Videomic which seems to work OK. Turned micro switch down 10db. The high pass filter doesn't seem to make any difference for traffic noise. Picks up any nearby talking, even from the side or back, so I just stop videoing and shoot stills when people gather.

Get some funny questions such as "what's kind of mic is that?" "Lady, you are being recorded" "I don't care if I'm being recorded" and she walks away, offended that I won't stop my shoot to talk. "What's that furry thing on the end of your mic?" "Ma'am, I'm busy recording, your voice is on the video" "No it's not, the camera's pointing the other way". Yeah right! I do try hard to me nice though, it's an honor to be using this amazing technology and I want to share nature's beauty, I'm hooked.

Learned how to make turkeys gobble, which is fun and adds a lot to the clip. Yesterday I was shooting a lone turkey and suddenly heard a bunch of gobbles to my side and behind me. I turned around and there were about 6 of them watching me. When I turned the camera on them they hustled way...spoilsports.

Switching to USB2 made a major difference to download time. 10 Gigs seems about 10 minutes which is wonderful, thanks again for the previous help.

The PC side of this is another saga, Win 7 64 bit computer, CS5 on the way etc. Don't forget to factor that cost into the camera purchase. I gave up on Premiere Elements and my older XP photographic computer with CS2 couldn't handle it.

Trying to add video clips to our web site now, this is hard work for this non geek couple.

Hope these notes help someone out there, I'm loving it.

Happy shooting and thanks to all the posters whose discussions have helped so much,
Doug.

Home (http://www.BaileyNatureGallery.com)

Hi Doug,

Using a high shutter speed with 30p gives the stuttering (strobe) effect, some refer to it as the "Saving Private Ryan" effect, as that film went for that effect. Ideally your shutter speed should be twice the frame rate, so 30 fps is 1/60th shutter, 60fps you go for 1/125 shutter.

The jello effect is when you pan, verticals in the frame lean over, so if you imagine a classic jello from an old time jello mold, when you shake it the jello flops side to side, that's what we see with the cmos sensor cameras when fast moving objects rush through the frame or we pan quickly.

Hi Norman,
Thanks for the clear explanations. We read these terms, but often have no idea what it really looks like. Also sincerely appreciate your excellent blog, I've been reading it since day one of the 7D and it really helped get me going.

Regards,
Doug.

Thanks Doug