dear friends,

i run a small video production house in our country.recently,we are planning to make a digital film.we are going to use panasonic hvx200 camera with letus ultimate 35m.m adapter.

I am not sure as to what lighting kit i should use to get better quality.So, i am planning to buy some for my company.my budget is around 70000$ us dollar.i am going to shoot indoor as well as outdoor and my option for buying these stuff is to buy from singapore.

It would be a great help for me if any of my learned friends from here give me some ideas and name of lighting products or kits in specific. i am looking forward to your proper guidance.

Jakaria habib

Could you clarify your dollar amount please? Because you have written $70000, which is Seventy Thousand dollars. Is this what you meant or do you mean some other amount?

For those curious about how much lighting gear $70k buys, I believe the answer is all of it!

Never forget you get what you pay for. If the sky is really the limit on your budget, I highly recommend you look at some quality flood/spot fresnels, as well as some fluorescent soft banks (great for fill light). As far as kits, there are so many... Personally, I'm a fan of Arris and Lowels, but others will say differently. I really believe you will be better off looking for the lights that will fit your specific needs and piecing together a kit of your own.

Also, imho, invest just as much research in grip and peripheral equipment as you invest in the lights. Having that cartellini clamp handy to put a light where you need it will save your bacon more than you think. Nothing ruins a shot like having a big light stand in frame... except maybe forgetting to turn the light on. =)

Well, it's really not THAT hard to spend $70k on lighting depending on what you're trying to light. Go price a few 20k HMI or Carbon Arcs and Max Mover then get back to me. But if you're lighting interiors, and maybe trying to get some supplemental outdoor lighting, then it's quite a helpful budget.

But even at that level of the game, without having SOME idea of what the needs are, it's hard to make any recommendations.

But I'd suggest we wait to hear what the true budget numbers are before speculating too much about what could be bought...

pssst...Perrone...20K's are tungsten, closest HMI's are 18K's...haven't seen a carbon arc in 20 years (but I'm sure someone's using them somewhere for the novelty factor)...MaxMovers are cool though!

I think anyone investing heavily in g/e right now should take a hard look at the current LED offerings. They are still in their infancy compared to where they are heading, but there's a lot of advantages. Been using the IS3 from Zylight and it's an amazing piece of gear, especially with the remote (dialing in intensity, color temperature and mired shift all from a tiny box on my hip; thus no gelling, no color shift on dimming).

pssst...Perrone...20K's are tungsten, closest HMI's are 18K's...haven't seen a carbon arc in 20 years (but I'm sure someone's using them somewhere for the novelty factor)...MaxMovers are cool though!


Wait a sec... I know ARRI has an HMI up in that range... lemme see...

Ahh yea, the 12/18 You're right.

Arri | Daylight 12KW/18KW HMI Fresnel Light Kit (190-250V) | B&H
Retail of $33k is gonna go through that budget pretty fast...

(Gee the Mole is only $29k... everyone loves to stretch their dollars... Arri | Daylight 12KW/18KW HMI Fresnel Light Kit (190-250V) | B&H)

In reference to the Carbon Arcs, I was thinking of the article on the recent Indiana Jones movie where the DP was having problems keeping the HMIs cool, and the director offered, "That why we used Carbon Arcs last time". Apparently they are more heat resistant, but given their rarity, I'd bet they'd be pretty pricey!

I love having you on this list Charles.. really. If you're ever in N. Florida, look me up. I'll set you up with beers all night just to pick your brain about a million questions I have!

Even without beers, Perrone, my brain holds far less than a million answers (less every year, of course)...but I'll take you up on your offer when and if my travels take me there! Which will hopefully NOT be during your hot season, I don't do well with the sticky...

Arcs had a great quality of light, but they were finicky and required specialized crew to operate and maintain. Ultimately they were phased out by HMI's which were much more efficient. There are still plenty of people who prefer the look of arcs, but the economics of the business are not favorable to their use (and many of the electricians who were qualified to operate them have retired in the meantime).

Arcs had a great quality of light, but they were finicky and required specialized crew to operate and maintain. Ultimately they were phased out by HMI's which were much more efficient. There are still plenty of people who prefer the look of arcs, but the economics of the business are not favorable to their use (and many of the electricians who were qualified to operate them have retired in the meantime).

I fear in 10 years we'll be saying much the same thing about film. I say that as someone who just bought a Nikon film body for a song...

10 years, probably true. Anyone want to buy a Nikon FE body from the early 80's...?

=
In reference to the Carbon Arcs, I was thinking of the article on the recent Indiana Jones movie where the DP was having problems keeping the HMIs cool, and the director offered, "That why we used Carbon Arcs last time". Apparently they are more heat resistant, but given their rarity, I'd bet they'd be pretty pricey!


The previous Indiana Jones was released in 1989, so brutes and crews would still be around then.

You'll also need to buy a silent generator If you're going to operate these big lights.

10 years, probably true. Anyone want to buy a Nikon FE body from the early 80's...?

I'd say yes, but I can get them on Ebay all day long, and you'd do better just keeping your for nostalgia's sake to be honest.

i am extremely sorry for writing 70k instead of 15000 $ .Actually i want to spend 15000$ for light.since i want to spend this money as an investment for my company so, i am looking forward to have some reply from our learned friends. i want to buy some lights that has good long life as well as portable.

thank you all for your valuable reply.

Jakira - help us out. "Digital Film" - means... what? You're shooting narrative features? Lots of locations? Do you have a small studio space you're trying to outfit?

With this kind of money you don't want to waste it, so why not get the people who will design the lighting for the projects to select the kit for you. The DoP would want the most appropriate kit for each project - so unless you can predict what you want, we can't really help.

I have lots of equipment I thought I would use often, and it often may sit for a year without being used, but during this time I'm buying or hiring other kit because what I have already isn't what I need for the current job.

well to be specific the film is going to be a romantic with a little touch of comedy.almost 35% of the scenes are going to be shot indoors and i need proper lights for this reason.the other 65% is going to be shot outdoors.50% of the outdoor shots are going to be night sequence and i am very worried about it.to be specific i need lights for indoor shooting and outdoor night sequence.

How much power can you draw on your electricity mains? People may make suggestions, only to discover that it's impractical in Bangladesh.

Are the "indoor" scenes during the day or at night?

Well, almost 60% of the indoor shot are night sequence.and i have a lot of location to shoot for.so, portability is important.

regarding taking help from dp, you will be surprised to hear that most of them in our country do not have educational background in this sector and they still prefer the old school technology.so, i want your help friends.

Arri | Daylight 12KW/18KW HMI Fresnel Light Kit (190-250V) | B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/192477-REG/Arri__Daylight_12KW_18KW_HMI_Fresnel.html)
Retail of $33k is gonna go through that budget pretty fast...



$2500 for the bulb. Gulp.

Let me start by saying that I'm really only a wannabe when it comes to lighting. I've spent a fair bit on crappy lighting in the past and last year i dropped $5k on cool-lights gear. I've used it a fair bit at the direction of experienced DPs and have learned quite a bit in the process. My goal was to be able to drive up and have "everything you need for an indy film" in my truck, and mostly i've achieved that goal. I know how to use my gear, but expect there to be a proper DP waiting to tell me what to do when I rock up. With that in mind, this is my perspective...


For $7k you can get a nice, versatile indoor kit. For outdoor stuff? You could be pushing it.

Here is what I bought:

=== 4x cool lights 150w cdm fresnels.
cons: The build quality of the metal casting and the mounting bar is kinda low. The output is slightly warmer than advertised. (Less like noon-sun and more like late afternoon going into golden hour... 5000k?). The light from the fresnel has a hot spot in it.

pros: So far they've held up to quite a bit of abuse, so the build is a non-issue. The light color is quite pleasing on faces when set to daylight, and I find mixes very well with sun and "true" hmi sources, so that con is also a pro. Very high lamp life. No Heat on talent. Insanely low power draw.

overall: I LOVE these fixtures. They are a great size, cool on the talent, somewhat focusable and the bulb life is such that I can do crazy things like run them for 9 days straight in an installation. They have enough punch to do a pretty kickin key, a powerful hair light or slitted down with the barn doors a light fill. They output something around the light of a redhead (a little less, but daylight... and way more than a redhead gelled for daylight), but draw only 150w. So they are *very* generator friendly. For the price they are a no-brainer. The versatility you get from 4 of these at $2k is well worth it. I'd buy again in a heartbeat. I pull them out on every indoor shoot.


=== A 4 bank cool lights non-dimming portable fluoro (similar to kino diva)

cons: i wish it acted more like a case light and snapped into its own case. My lollipop is kinda mangled. I think i read that there were some crappy ones - perhaps i got one of those.

pros: hell of a lot of light for the price. Up close its nice and soft, and you can pull it back far enough that its actually fairly hard from a distance. So far its been 100% reliable and I'm still on my first bulbs hundreds of hours later.

overall: Its a big enough fixture that I tend to only pull it out "as-needed" but she's been a workhorse and produces a fantastic amount of light that is also very pleasing. I'd buy again in a heartbeat.


=== 2 cool light LED 600 panels

cons: green spike out of box, and LED lights are kinda weird by the nature of having 600 tiny sources.

pros: very handy size, not much color shift when dimming and drink 55w of power! This means i can run them for a couple hours on a 7ah lead acid battery.

overall: I pull these out on every shoot. I cut some minusgreen filter that i permanently mounted to the barn doors and now my LEDs are a nice daylight source thats pleasing on faces. They are a super portable light and because I can run them off battery, they are first out when shooting in the unknown. They weigh very little and I use the battery as a "sandbag" so its a great commando solution. You can also have people carry them around on walking shots. They aren't going to do anything against sun, but i've found them a very versatile unit that myself and my DPs reach for again and again.


=== cool lights 575w "HMI" fresnel:

cons: i got an early beta model. Its ballast is insanely loud, the head squeals like a pig.

pros: its a lot of light - roughly that of a blonde but off 575w and daylight:

overall: First off, I'm aware that i got a beta and the new ones aren't noisy like mine. I mostly use it punched through windows, so the noise isnt an issue, so I don't *think* that has colored my opinion. However, my opinion overall is "meh". Where the 150s feel like a bargain, the 575 seems... i dunno. My reaction to this fixture isnt really rational, since its still super cheap compared to an arri equivalent. It just seems like the dollar per lumen should scale *down* and not up as you get brighter. That obviously flies in the face of reality and maybe even physics... but its my kneejerk. I guess I really want a CDM 575 and 1.2k for price/value/bulb life. When you need the punch, the 575 is nice. I mainly use it through a window or in a huge space, or as an outdoor fill when its a little overcast, so for me its more of a specialty fixture. When i need it, i'm really glad to have it, but buying again I'd have a long think about the cost to return its offering me. I'd probably end up buying it again because... there really isnt anything else with an equivalent daylight kick for a similar price.


So this is all a bit obtuse from your original question (especially once you cited $70,000 as the budget. hehe). But perhaps my experience may help.

For $5k you can get a lot of tungsten fixtures. Or you can get an assortment of cool lights daylight fixtures like mine. Or you can get a basic arri tungsten fresnel kit or 1 or 2 small arri hmi fixtures. Some people would absolutely opt for the arri as a more long term solution, and they could be right. I opted to maximize bang-for-buck and I think its worked out so far.

The reason i say $5k is you really need to spend quite a bit on support gear. You need stands. Good ones. superclamps, grip heads, flags/reflectors (can be foamcore), and craploads of decent extension cords. The support gear can eat up a shocking amount of the budget, but you need it. Lights without a way to rig them is useless. Outdoor scenes at night? You'll probably need to get the lights up high (or at least one big one), so make sure you have stand/rigging/creativity to pull it off safely.

The great thing about the 150/575 watt cdm/hmi is the power requirements are so low. You can run all my cool lights off a small honda 2000i generator (which perhaps you should budget for? heh. i LOVE This generator! its very quiet, weighs about the same as a old sewing machine and produces power cleaner than most wall outlets! Seriously, check out these gennies, they are fantastic.).

The low power usage also means that if i can find a single good a/c point in a house, i can load it up with most of my lights without worrying. I can also run spaghetti messes of daisy chained extension cords without any dramas. The same thing with redheads and blondes would be a huge hassle and usually require a proper gaffer be around to handle the power side.

If you are doing intimate scenes at night and shooting on something with good low light response, my kit can handle it. A porch with some people, no problem. A medium garden space? Yes, if its ok to be moody. If you are lighting up large spaces? I don't think you'll be happy. That said, a clever DP has made my gear do amazing things at night, but it requires skill and talent and that definitely isn't included in the purchase price.

There are a lot of indian companies selling clone grip and lighting gear. I'd certainly look at what they have to offer, as shipping overseas is really costly. I'm happy with my cool light purchase and given there is nothing like it at the price range, i'd buy it again. That may or may not be the most raving endorsement, but hey.

I dunno if that helps. I have a headache and I touch-type so I kinda am just rambling on the forum until the panadol kicks in. Sometimes i find that if i answer one of my long-winded responses it chums the water and other people chime in with great info, so ill risk the sharks and put this out there, fwiw!

I hear your pain regarding "trained" DPs. They are out there, and some even have born instincts for lighting. My advise is find one of those people, hire a transvestite hooker to lure them into a compromising photo and use that photo to keep the DP around and working with you. Of course, you could always just pay them well and treat them with respect... but this is the video industry, so nobody does that. We'll call the "dignity and pay" a "plan B" fallback if the industry-standard tranny-hooker-blackmail-photo doesn't pan out. hehe.

Cheers, and good luck!
-a

Dear Andrew,

Thanks a lot for your generous reply.It is really helpful.Now, i have got some idea as to what sort of lights needed in certain situation.thanks a lot

salam brother jakaria.... bought your lights yet??? maybe you could try buying frm china, the name's DYNACORE... it's quite reliable and it produces good batteries using sanyo cells could try it not bad i dare say..... you can check em at dynacore-china (http://www.dynacore-light.com).