I'm a beginner, shooting videos to promote adoptable dogs for a rescue org (dogs that are in a foster home, so home settings).

I know dogs well, but know lighting not at all! For my own animals I just wait til i can shoot outdoors in the sun.

I'm looking for an inexpensive improvement (a professional-level solution is out of my budget range) to allow me to shoot indoor shots of a 'generic' dog (could be black coat, could be light), who's position I can't 'direct,' and also possibly some generic person holding or playing with the dog in the room.

Most important is to capture the dog's personality, how they move, what interests them, are they active or mellow, etc. But I'd *sure* love to reduce the grain I'm sure to get if relying only on overhead light or window light. (And, hopefully without creating truly ghastly shadows.) Also hopefully for it to be safe around a moving animal (I'm nervous about attempting a hot 'home depot' light that might get knocked over.)

I imagine I'll be turning on all available houselights, opening all window coverings, then positioning one or two stands in 'safe' locations just to boost the light in the room.

I realize I'm asking for everything in a challenging set of scenarios. The good news is I'm not needing a perfect professional solution!

Before I started reading this forum, I was hoping I might pick something up for $50. Now I'm really hoping for under $200, $250 tops

I would LOVE advice. What makes the most sense to (cheaply) bring the light up in a room to reduce grain? I'm guessing I'd be able to identify the 2-3 most likely places a dog and it's foster people might be, but not one, and certainly no backdrop. Softbox? Umbrella? [I have checked "Light Science & Magic" out of the library to learn a little more, but don't think they're focussing on crazy animals that can rip around!] :)

Currently I'm just shooting with my Canon Powershot camera in video mode, but am looking at a vixia HF-S10. I realize low light will continue to be an issue.

Advice is welcome. Hope I've provided enough info. (I now realize even a monopod will go a long way to improve camera shake. I'm looking for something similarly basic to improve lighting side of things.)

For a sample of what I'm talking about, please check out 0:34 mark at this video
Zack - Adoptable! on Vimeo

thanks kindly!

Hi Karen:

I would seriously consider shooting the dogs outdoors. They can run around more, you may get to see more of their personality. As an example, The Dog Whisperer shoots in similar scenarios that you are describing and they are often trying to get the same sort of footage, people and dogs interacting. They use three cameras and a decent amount of grip and lighting gear honestly, it barely gets the job done, Dog Whisperer is a great show but not a show with amazing lighting or photography.

If you can shoot the dogs outdoors, especially in a shaded area, it will look better than anything you can do indoor without a grip and lighting crew and a budget of many thousands. You are fighting a bad lighting situation by trying to shoot without enough light, why not take them outdoor? If you can shoot in the mornings or late afternoon, you stand a chance of getting some pretty nice looking footage. Avoid 10:00 AM to about 4:00 PM if possible, the first two hours and the last two hours of the day are pretty decent light.

IMHO, there is nothing in your budget and situation that will make a noticeable improvement indoors because you are shooting dogs running all over the place, probably don't have enough crew or enough time. Use what is available. For you, that would be the sun and shade. For $50.00, buy a FlexFill and have a friend light using the sun, it works amazingly well once you learn what you are doing.

Dan

Something like this may work:

Lowel | ID-Light 100W Focus Flood Light, 4-Pin XLR | ID-02 | B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/185678-REG/Lowel_ID_02_ID_Light_100W_Focus_Flood.html)

It's a 100w on camera light. It's not something I'd usually recommend, but it has no stands to worry about and it's portable.

The problem is that it's going to bust you budget by a bit because it needs a battery source. There may be some cheaper options out there, but you're filming in daylight and you're going to really need some punch.

There's just not much in the budget you've given to work with. Anything that is going to need to be plugged in is not going to be portable enough, or would require another person to hold and move with the animal. Alternately, you could light up the entire room some, but then you're into a 1k or 2k light to make much difference and that is going to fall outside your budget as well.

I tell you what might work and would be DIRT cheap. If you can find an assistant, buy a silver worklamp, and the brightest fluorescent lamp you can stick in it. I can give you some links for that. If you can get your assistant to stand right behind you and keep it pointed at the dog, and you can stay rather close to the dog, it might give just enough fill to work. Maybe. But it would only set you back maybe $50.

hi karen,

being a gaffer i would just bash 2 redheads in to the ceiling from the corners to bring up the ambient levels.

this is probably not so easy for you as you dont have the lights.

any strong source you can get hold of to do this will help.

shoot outside....plenty of light but hard to control and follow dogs
shoot inside... low light but easy to control and film dogs.

ah decisions decisions.....

hope this helps.

ian

And right now she's asking.... what's a gaffer? What's a redhead, what's a strong source?

Come on man, she's clearly never bought a movie light in her life. At least define the terms.

Karen, basically everyone is saying to do one of two things:

1. Shoot outside
2. Shoot inside and buy a very powerful light to raise the ambient levels.
3. I offered another option of putting a light on the camera but it will cost more money.

If you want to go with a stand and light, there are some fairly inexpensive options.

Something like the Lowel Tota: Lowel | Tota-Light Tungsten Flood Light, Bulb | T1-101 | B&H (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/285942-REG/Lowel_T1_101_Tota_Light_Tungsten_Flood_Light_.html)

This light is nearly unbreakable and throws a strong swath of light. It's not very controllable, but in your case, that's probably ok. You'll need to add a beefy stand so as not to worry about it getting tipped over. Say something like this: Matthews | Maxi Kit Steel Stand | 387485 | B&H Photo Video (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/99162-REG/Matthews_387485_Maxi_Kit_Steel_Stand.html#specifications)

Or if you need to save a few bucks, something like this: Matthews | Black Kit Stand | 387402 | B&H Photo Video (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/337344-REG/Matthews_387402_Black_Kit_Stand.html)

Those stands should last 20 years. The light probably the same.

hi perrone,

if you dont know what a gaffer is or a redhead or a hard source

maybe you should be doing something else.

i just offered up the quickest and cheap way to do something
and it doesnt get more basic.

cheers,

ian

ps a couple of shot bags will keep your lights upright.

shot bags= small bags full of shot or sand and weighing from

5 to 25 kilos

Ian, I've been a gaffer... but she's a newbie trying to take video of dogs. She doesn't know what all that stuff is...

Yes, pushing a couple of fresnels up on the ceiling would be quick and easy. If they were in the budget. She's barely got budget for more than 2 good stands, so get real.



hi perrone,

if you dont know what a gaffer is or a redhead or a hard source

maybe you should be doing something else.

i just offered up the quickest and cheap way to do something
and it doesnt get more basic.

cheers,

ian

hi mate,
yes you are right, i have been doing this so long i just assumed
she would know what i was talking about.

i should know by now when the eyes start glazing over i have lost them.

karen if you can beg borrow or hire a couple of lights it would
be of great help to you. if you were in melbourne australia i would
lend you some.

cheers
ian

First and foremost, I truly appreciate everyone's suggestions and ideas. Thank you for responding and helping me out. They help me see what I'm up against.

I definitely am having reinforced: outdoors is the way to go if at *all* possible, and aim for certain times of the day. Thanks, the feedback helps, really! As a noob, I have ideas but don't know if I'm just being nuts or what there is to learn. Being outdoors seems like it should be my priority #1 based on the responses. Happily, that *is* a possibility most months of the year and with most foster homes. I'll highlight that importance with the foster parents.

Also getting a sense of other options for the winter-time weeks or months where indoors is more ideal...thank you, I'll look into all the ideas you've each offered. (I doubt I'd ever have an assistant, and appreciate you each being clear where that's a critical component to the option presented.)

I'm thinking about fashioning a silver work lamp solidly to an old exterior-frame kelty backpack frame, and maybe becoming my own assistant! (hah. ok, that's a joke and would probably freak the poor traumatized dogs out, but it does keep me thinking creatively.) But seriously, the details really help me understand where to focus and where to not.

I appreciate you taking the time to respond and give links/ideas. It saves me from wasting money on what I *wish* would work out. It is challenging for me to know what are good options, being new to this. The specific ideas really do help, Thanks, all, from the newbie.

-Karen
(who knows what gaffers tape is but the 'redhead' thing...) :)

hi karen

dont ever apologise for not knowing everything, the only way to
learn is to ask.

you will always remember something if you asked and are given an answer.

red heads are an open faced 800 watt (aus) 1000 watt (usa)
tungsten light used to be the backbone of the industry, not very controlable but lots of light.
they are called red heads because they are red (go figure)

cheers
ian

oh by the way gaffers are the backbone of movie making and they also do all the work..........the rest of the crew just stand around trying to look good.

cheers,
ian

oh by the way gaffers are the backbone of movie making and they also do all the work..........the rest of the crew just stand around trying to look good.

cheers,
ian

I'd pay money to see you tell a DP or producer that... Or the key grip.

hi mate,

funny really i have never said that (aloud) on set so not
sure what the reaction would be...... ok ok i do know what the reaction would be....

doesnt mean its not true.

cheers

you all are funny! thank you for your help and humor.

I think your video is perfectly fine give your production goals. It does exactly what it needs to do--give a prospective owner an idea of what the dog is like. Your audience is not that sophisticated. They are not expecting a pet video to be Avatar. Sure, noisy video and changing white balance don't look good but nobody is going to reject the dog because of it.

This is way outside your budget but is another way of thinking about the problem: get a camera that is better able to use existing light levels. The still reigning king of this is the Sony PD170/VX2000. Its a standard definition camera with very good low light performance.

You don't need HD for this and HD cameras, all things being equal (which they never are), do not do as well at low light.

Downsides? Cost--I wouldn't pay more than $1000 for a good used cam. Tape--I'm totally sold on the tapeless environment.

But back on the lighting side, I was in Home Depot the other day and saw they are making 150 watt (equivalent) fluorescent bulbs. One of these in a work light in each corner of the room--probably aimed at the ceiling--might do the trick.

Take a look at this Husky tripod worklight:

Husky 84-Watt Portable Tripod Fluorescent Work Light - Review | Tool Snob - ToolSnob.com (http://www.toolsnob.com/archives/2007/10/husky_84watt_portable_tripod_f_1.php)

I haven't shot with one but was at a friend's house and it light up the backyard like a beacon. Maybe some homegrown reflector could help direct the light to a part of the room. They are less than $100, IIRC

Maybe that plus one or two LED Lightpanels knockoffs from China? They've got over 100 little LED bulbs and can mount on camera. You can get them for $60 bucks or so.
Pro 126-LED Video Light for DV Camcorder Lighting with filter (http://www.linkdelight.com/index.php/Continuous-Lights/Pro-126-LED-Video-Light-for-DV-Camcorder-Lighting-with-filter/Detailed-product-flyer.html)

Put the Husky in the middle of the room and throw the camera and LED lights on a Halo Rig (Halo Rig HD Stabilizers for Digital Video Cameras (http://halorig.com/)) and you're good to go.

The Husky is warm white. I'm not sure about the lightpanels, so you may have some issues with white balance. I'll defer to the more experienced folks here as to whether this solution might work, but I thought that I'd throw in some cheap alternatives...

Hi Karen,

For around $115 you can get a Lowell Tota and there's a place in San Mateo (a little bit of a drive from Santa Cruz but not too far) that has decent light stands for about $30 each. I'd recommend going that way instead of the work lights. One Tota would help to bring up the ambient light and for what you're thinking of you probably just want to get it so there is enough light to keep your camera from introducing a lot of noise. Two Tota's would probably be enough for most of your situations.

If you get lucky you can find use Tota's for around $65 to $75 on Craigslist.

Just my one pennies worth of opinion.

-Garrett

oh by the way gaffers are the backbone of movie making and they also do all the work..........the rest of the crew just stand around trying to look good.

cheers,
ian

I think the boom op on my last shoot who had to position himself uncomfortably under a dinning table for 4 hours would disagree with you on that one.. ;). Or the PA's that had to lug the 1000 lbs of gear down slippery narrow stairways because the location had no other way in. Great house but horrible access.

-Garrett

Andy, John and Garrett!

Thanks for your additions to the thread, all helpful.

Garrett, I'll watch craigslist religiously for any local Lowell Totas that appear, thank you. I'd love to learn about the San Mateo store with $30 stands, feel free to post of PM me to share here, if you would. Thanks! (The grave danger: a drive to San Mateo sends me near an REI store.)

Ok, I'm off to begin learning about white balance now!

And everyone, thanks for making me feel welcome, even with my noob questions/expectations in tow.

Hi Karen,

I'll have to look back to see if I find the info on the place. What type of camera are you shooting with? Most cameras can white balance pretty easily.

-Garrett

Hi Garrett,
Just before starting this thread, I ordered a Canon HF-S10 cause it dropped in price for a short time on Amazon. It's en route, but if all goes well, that'll be the one!

Karen,

Nice camera. You'll most likely want to have a decent amount of light so that gain won't be added which translates into noise in your videos (noise in videos looks like grain). White balance is pretty easy. If you do use lights like the Lowells you could set the white balance to tungsten or you better you can just set the custom white balance by taking a white piece of paper and placing it just in front of your subject. Then zoom in on the paper so it fills the entire screne. Then there will be a button to allow the camera to take a reading and set it.

Pretty easy to do. Once I find the name of the place that has the stands I'll email you the info.

Good luck.
-Garrett

That is a MARVELOUS choice of camera. I recommended the same model for a friend of mine last summer. I had a chance to shoot with it over the summer and thought it was stellar for a consumer cam. I let him play with my EX1 while I enjoyed having a camera that weighed next to nothing for a while! :)

What will you be using to edit your videos? I realize this is a lighting thread, and we may need to break this discussion off a bit, but just wanted to be sure as a new shooter, you avoid some of the common pitfalls.

Wow, I was already feeling like I got a good deal given I was ready to make the leap and buy something, now I'm ecstatic! Great feedback, thanks.

Garrett, re white balance: my subject likely won't be standing still and lit in the same way over any given minute (well, if indoors at least)...but I look forward to playing around with it and will try out the various features. Thanks!

Perrone. Ok, software. I was hoping to not have to admit this publicly! :) For my little videos so far, I've been using iMovie 08, what came with my computer, since my needs have been so minimal: bring the audio to zero (as I put a song over it all anyway), trim clips, crop clips, basic titles and transitions, fast! That said, I do also have the earlier version (iMovie HD) which has some more features but I haven't needed to go there (I did at one time, but it's been years). I will soon have iMovie 09 (cause I believe it might be better than '08 for Canon's .mts files?). I was going to play with that and see if I hit snags. If I did I was planning to fork out for Final Cut Express -- from what I read, it and iMovie 09 can convert the mts files. I believe this means there's a quality loss (?) but at least they're files I can work with. That was my seat-of-the-pants plan.

I'd certainly love to avoid software/conversion pitfalls! I wanted to 'trouble shoot' the mts issue in advance, but I couldn't find a store in this town that actually has a Canon camera to demo, where I could pop in an SD card and take home some samples. So all of this is based on what I've gleaned online. I am hoping my computer has the processing power to handle this new level that HD will require (hence the "if all goes well" part of my commenct below).

Hardware wise, I have an iMac w/ an 2.4 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo processor. I think/hope I'll be ok there. And 4 GB of RAM (the max).

Thanks all!

I do something similar to what you're doing. I shoot Adopt A Pet segments for our local Humane Society's Web site. I shoot the dogs outdoors and the cats indoors, mostly for the comfort of the animals. I shoot in HD with a Panasonic HMC-40 then downconvert the footage to SD for editing in Premiere Pro CS4.

When I first started shooting the videos about three years ago, I was using a small Sony hand-held camera and came across many of the limitations you are experiencing. But, I agree with Andy - you don't have to win an Academy Award with these videos. As long as the shots aren't horribly jerky, out of focus or really dark, people will watch them. And they don't really care about the production quality, they're focusing on the pet. If anything, I put more of an emphasis on the audio quality, since I interview shelter workers holding and interacting with the animals. (But I like your idea of action shots set to music.) So I use a Rode Videomic instead of the camera's built-in mike.

If you really need an external light, my suggestion is the Comer 900. I bought it through L.A. Color Shop | Online Photo/Video Gear Shop (http://lacolorshop.com/), which is one of this site's sponsors. I use it on my Sony hand-held cameras (though you need an adapter for the hotshoe) and it even has a cold shoe on the top if you want to mount a mike or another accessory. It's not dirt cheap but it does the job well.

I'd be happy to weigh in if you have any other questions. Keep us posted on your progress!

Hi there Sherri,

Thanks for your input on lights and more.

I'd love to take a look at your HS videos (I'll PM you), and take a look at how you incorporate interviews/sound. The one time I tried that the ambient din was indeed inhibitive. (I do like to shoot my dog out in the wild, and have the rode videomic on my wish-list of items. either before or after a fig rig! hah)

Thanks, Sherri

Hi Karen -

I'm also in Santa Cruz. I have two Totas + stands, etc. If you'd like to try a test drive before making a decision on what you need, give me a PM.

Does anyone else foresee a problem with the combination of light stands and dogs?

How about something like a portable halogen worklight. Home Depot has one for $49. 1000 Watt 160 Wide Angle Wall To Wall Portable Worklight - L-5203 at The Home Depot (http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xr5/R-100664508/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053)

Point it towards a corner to illuminate the entire room.

It's not a pro solution but it fits the budget.

It's not a pro solution but it fits the budget.

They are WOEFULLY unstable. I'd never risk one on a set with an uncontrolled animal.

Hi everyone!

I've settled on (1) being outdoors if possible, then (2) going w/ a Lowell Tota and quality stand (and indeed never use if the dog is a spaz), but Tsu, I'd LOVE to check one out first to see: will one get enough light to make the purchase worth it. Thanks, I'll be PMing you.

Thank you all for your input and ideas,

Karen