Hi all,

So I sold my dinosaur (Sony PD-170). Great camera, used it well, but the thought of tape and SD makes me think of the 'good ole days' --- OK so thats a bit of a tongue in cheek :)

I'm a convert from the Ex1 - after having my heart set on that camera I ended up with the 7D. While harder to operate, what a value for what it can do in the right hands!

. I earn my living doing camera and it has amazed me how much I took for granted using video equipment (i.e. autopilot). Owning the 7D will make me a much better Cam Op because I have to learn everything to get the best image possible!

One aspect is lens speed. I bought the 7D kit with the 28mm-135mm lens. I'm looking for a wide angle companion; here's the two choice I've come up with after filtering through many different threads.

Canon EF-S 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 USM Autofocus Lens ($720)

Tokina 11-16mm f/2.8 AT-X 116 Pro DX Autofocus Lens ($599)

*prices are from B&H

It's a tough choice, and heres some pro/cons I can think of with my limited research:

Canon Pros: name brand, more zoomablity, low distortion
Cons:slower lens, according to lensrentals.com it's a 'High Risk lens' for failure rate

Tokina Pro: Faster, Cheaper
Heavier, smaller zoom

Now my primary shooting method is gorilla style. Mostly narrative and action. I need an exellent low light lens as most of my framing will be with practicals and available lighting. My first short I want to film will be inside a park, mostly at night. Now is 3.5 vs. 2.8 a noticeable difference ? Will I notice more light coming in ? Is focusing a nightmare at 2.8?

I believe with the kit lens and one from above I'll have a sufficient range for achieving a wide range of looks and feels.

With that I welcome all opinions and advice!

I am about to buy the 11-16 for my 7D. I have heard good things about it. Another lens that you can look at is the Tamron 17-50mm with Vibration Control. I have the earlier model and really like it. The lenses that I have found myself using the most with my 7D are the Canon 50mm 1.2 ,Canon 100mm Macro 2.8 and Tamron 17-50 2.8. The 50mm is closer to an 80mm and the 100mm is a 160mm on that camera, but the Tamron was meant for smaller sensor and is accurate.
If you are nervous about the lens failing on you, check to see what the warranty is and if you can purchase an extended plan. The biggest challenge that we had when we added the 5D and 7D into our workflow was the lens change. We are accustomed to pressing a button to go in/out and not having to think about which lens will work best in the next situation. I can also suggest purchasing some king of shoulder bag to carry a lens or two in. You can also toss some lens wipes in there as well. With all of the switching, you will get a finger print on the lens :(
Is focusing a nightmare at 2.8? That really depends on who you ask. When I started using my 5D with the 50mm 1.2, I kept it at 1.2/1.4 almost all of the time. It was used primarily for detail shots as well as the bride getting her hair/make-up done. After shooting at the aperture for a while, you start to get the hang of it. When it comes to moving shots (first dances), it can get very difficult. Since you will be shooting in a park at night, I don't think 3.5 is going to work without some additional light. Depending on how wide of a shot you are shooting, I really like the smaller LED Litepanels.
You should also check out the "How to set up your 7D/5D" links people have posted on here. There are a few different opinions and you might want to try them all. You should also do lots of tests to see what ISO settings work the best for you. I don't mind hitting 1600 on my 5D, but I try to avoid it on the 7D. That is just my opinion as well.

I hope any of this helped!

Andy,
Before I bought my 7d for video use, I had been also shooting photography with Nikon gear. One of my favorite lenses was my Tokina 12-24 f4. When I sold all my Nikon stuff after buying the 7d, one of the first things i bought was another Tokina lens, the 11-16 2.8. I raelly like this lens, although it doesn't hve the same beautifull color that i got with the 12-24 ( although that also might have been my nikon cameras).
The 11-16 is great for video because you can stay so wide that almost everything can be in focus. I also got the following lenses, which I'm real happy with:
Canon efs 50mm f 1.4
Canon efs 17-55 2.8 is ( great video lens)
Canon efs 70-200 2.8 is..What can i say? A phenominal lens.
I'd really like to get the Canon 24mm f1.4 but can't afford it now.
I also have a collection of older manual Nikon lenses, which i use with my Letus extreme. These lenses can be found inexpensively and can be used on the 7d with a nikon to Canon adadpter ring. You could , for example, pick up a 28mm o2.8 manual Nikon for $75 on ebay or craigs list, add a $30 adapter and you have another lens for the 7d.

Chad,
Which exact model litepanels are you talking about?
Bruce Yarock

Bruce,

The Litepanels Micro (Litepanels Micro Series (http://www.litepanels.com/lp/products/micro_series.html)) is what I have been using. I was thinking about upgrading to the MicroPro as it appears to be almost twice as bright without being twice as heavy. I have the Miniplus, but with two full size Sony batteries attached, it weighs as much as the camera and lens.

-chad

I have the Tokina 11-16. Indoors in normal house lighting the 2.8 vs 3.5 makes a difference in how much gain you need. No trouble focusing with the Tokina, I just set it to infinity when on the move. I have a sigma that covers the 18-50 2.8, that one is a bit tougher to keep in focus wide open. The Tokina appears deeper focus beyond a few inches from the lens. The one trouble with the Tokina, it was hard to find for Canon mount.

Go with the Tokina.

Great lens. "Saved my life" on my first "run N gun documentary" made with the 7d a week ago in Japan.
More info soon.


Thanks.

Johnnie

That 11-16 gets great reviews, I'd go for it too.
I also got the 28-135 kit lens, but it's so slow that I don't use it for anything but outdoor shooting. Most of my dayjob type shooting involves interiors. I just ordered the Tokina 16-50 because I need a wide fast zoom. I already had a Tamron full frame 17-35 that's 2.8 at the wide end, so initially I ordered a Canon 24-70 f2.8 L lens. Unfortunately, the one I got had a loose floppy focus ring. I sent it back and got another one--same problem. Apparently Canon has some quality control issues going on there. I decided I didn't want to try for a third one because I need a lens next week, so I sent it back for a refund and ordered the Tokina which is here awaiting pickup. This particular Tokina gets up and down reviews, but I thought I'd gamble on it, since I'm so experienced at sending lenses back now.

I'd like to get that 11-16 later on, although I really don't need anything wider than 16mm at present for most of what I do. The 28-135, by the way, looks pretty nice under good light, so it's become my long lens. I'm pretty happy with it, especially for the low kit price. It's just too slow for shooting at 100 ISO indoors.

The Tokina has a pretty strong consciences, impressive

Errrrhhhh, but I shouldn't get to excited about a lens that nobody has in stock!

Checked B&H, out; Amazon, same. Ebay prices are way above the $600 street price. Is this getting discontinued. I called up borrowlenses but they don't answer the phone. Any place local (to the Bay Area) that has competitive lenses for sale ? Called Gassers - they don't have the Tokina & Canon is out of stock.


I'm very interested in older lenses. How does this work - can I buy any older lens, get the appropriate adapter ring and it will work on the canon (sans AF & IS)? Is there a chart to look at? My parents have this old Canon from the 70's, tried putting that lens on but it doesn't work. I'd love to hear some recommendations on older wide variable zoom lenses.

As I said, you can use most of the older Nikon manual lenses, which are inexpensive. Just get a few adapter rings and you're in business. As a matter of fact I have an extra 135mm f 2.8 in pristine condition if you're interested.
I also bought a Tokina ATX 28-70 f2.8, Nikon mount, to use with my Letus. I've also used it a few times with an adapter ring on my 7d, because it gives a bit more zoom that the Canon 17-55.
I picked up all of my Nikon primes for $100 or under each.
24mm 2.8, 35mm 2.0, 50mm 1.4,105mm 1.8 (beautifull),135 2.8.
Bruce Yarock

For what it is worth I have owned my 10-22 since the day it came out, so like 3 years ago. I am a pro photographer. I have used it a ton. And by used I mean roughly. I just do not baby my gear.

It works great. I just got my 7D and the thing is awesome. I do not know anything about the Tokina lens but that company has never had a reputation for making quality stuff. But the 2.8 thing is important I would think.

Shawn, not sure about the build quality of Tokina since I've never owned one, but an image that stands out in my mind was from a negative someone brought into a lab I was managing several years ago. It was without doubt the sharpest image I've seen made with a 35mm camera, absolutely stunning. That lens could have been an outlier, who knows.

Some stills made from some of the lenses mentioned wouldn't hurt.

Another vote for the Tokina 11-16.

Heres a project I recently did with the 7D. All the wide shots are shot with the tokina. Including the underwater scene.

Bantayan Island By Ted Ramasola On ExposureRoom (http://exposureroom.com/bantayan)

Ted

I have been a photographer for many years before entering he videomarket. As a photojournalist I had the Tokina 12-24 f/4 on my 20D almost all of the time. It's just a well-built affordable lens with a great wideangle zoomrange on a 1.6x cropfactor DSLR. Though, I must say I have never used it for filmpurposes. Maybe an idea to have a look on this one for a try-out?

Gabor

Yet another vote for the Tokina 11-16mm. The Tokina is a constant aperture lens, the Canon 10-22mm is not.

No zooms in video with the Canon.

The Tokina is the only EFS lens I own - the rest are Canon EF.

I'm pretty sold on this lens. I should probably rent it for the weekend at the cost of ~$40, but I'm pretty sure I'm going to love it. With the crop factor this lens roughly 16mm which is perfect for what I need to do. Can look into fish-eye later on, but doubt I'll need to be that extreme. Constant, fast aperture is as important as how wide it gets.

Any ideas on why my 20 year old Canon glass didn't work? Is it because the film is FF and I have an aps (and thus just need an adapter?)

The Tokina 11-16mm is the bees knees.

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/mcgeedigital/landscape/UVA_Field_Widest.jpg

Wow - thats an amazing photo

Just to add to this thread.... as I've just bought a Canon 10-22mm wide angle for my 7D! Should have it in a few days assuming the delivery van can drive through the deep snow we've now got forecast! :-)

I read a ton of on-line reviews on what seems like every camera forum/site on Earth the last few days.... and it was not an easy choice but I thought I'd share why I went the direction I did. This might help others considering the Tokina 11-16mm versus Canon 10-22mm "dilemma", especially for the video-centric like us. Bear in mind I've not got the Canon lens yet - or handled the Tokina either. From what I've read, both are super lenses and which one is right for you depends on your own needs, but for me, in no particular order...

Tokina 11-16 Pros
(1) Constant F2.8 - no other super wide zoom lens for the 7D can match that!
(2) Sharp
(3) More solid build quality
(4) Bigger/wider focus ring

Tokina 11-16 Cons
(1) Very susceptible to lens flare - and I like to take lots of pictures with backlighting (often sun backlit) for effect, so this was an important issue for me. I've seen some flare issues/loss of shots with my otherwise excellent Canon 17-55 F2.8 IS AF USM EF-S and don't want any worse than what that gives for sure. This could be an issue with such a wide lens used for video where you're moving around (from what I've experienced with the 17-55, especially outside with a low sun).
(2) Very limited zoom range, really it's a prime with a very fine adjustment for framing! Sure, in video work I'm not going to do any zooming anyway (with the ergonomics of the 7D, except in post).
(3) In the UK at least, very, very similar in cost to the Canon (which I got with Hoya Pro filter and special Canon shade for £600, by the way). There seems to be a shortage of Tokina 11-16s at the moment... so those that have them...
(4) Very slightly slower/noisier AF - but it's super wide so I doubt this is really any issue - as very little won't be in focus/will need focus adjustment (and in video I only use AF before I hit record anyway). Or, if I want to throw away a second in edit and re-autofocus, whilst I'm still video recording, I just just press the AF On button on the back of the 7D (this works even during video recording). Mostly, I manual focus with video though for obvious reasons.
(5) Moderate, i.e. noticeable, chromatic aberration, possibly more than Canon from what I've read.

Canon 10-22 Pros
(1) Less barrel distortion - except perhaps at full wide, 10mm, but very consistent across the range for a wide angle. This is very important to me as I'm doing a lot of architectural/commercial design photography/videography on the wide end with my EX3 and that has quite noticeable barrel distortion (which has resulted in some shots being totally unusable in editing).
(2) More useful zoom range, meaning I won't have to take off/swap lenses so often, and a nice overlap with my next lens up.
(3) Little bit lighter in weight - minor point but I do like to keep my 7D kit as minimal in weight as possible as I walk a lot with it.
(4) I like the Canon "anytime manual" focus ring approach, where you can just give it a nudge if you don't like what AF gave you. With the Tokina you have to snap the focus ring into a different position to go full manual (much like on my EX3) - which may give a judder if you're hand holding whilst recording video and just want to tweak focus to catch a fleeting moment better.
(5) Closer minimum focus than the Tokina - allowing a bit more creative scope (and it goes a tad wider to 10mm too!). Note to self, better polish my shoes as they'll be in shot sometimes!!!

Canon 10-22 Cons
(1) Slower lens, F3.5 is as fast as it gets on the wide end and by the 20-22mm area it's F4.5, so really more an outdoor lens or I might need to light my subjects if indoor (which I often do anyway if it's paying work). Bit of a pain it's not constant aperture - for video when framing/setting up the shot. Anyway, I'm also planning to buy a super fast general lens very shortly for the 7D/indoor/low light work, so no worries.
(2) You have to buy the shade separately - come on Canon get real!
(3) That's another EF-S lens I've just bought - mind you I don't think the crop format is leaving our (or more importantly my) future anytime soon...

Like I wrote, both appear to be great lenses - but that's why I just spent £600 on the Canon offering (including the necessary extras).

nice one Andy..

Ive also been trailing through sites today with a view to getting a wide angle sometime soon.. It can get a bit confusing trying to weed out the pros and cons that are relevant for video guys.

Very good summary even if you haven't used either, I'm sure you made a good choice and from what I've read i have no doubt theyre both fantastic lenses.

Thanks for the thanks! Had the Canon 10-22mm a few weeks now - thrilled with it - no regrets at all. Super lens!

However, if anyone does decide on the Toki, I've just read on other threads etc. that the Tokina 11-16 seem to have become available again - and then sold out almost as fast, at least at B&H in the States! Not sure about our side of the pond regarding availability but a few weeks ago they were very hard to find, at least at a sensible price.

Next purchase for me is going to be a Canon 70-200mm F4 IS AF USM. I have the F2.8 IS version on loan for a month at present from a 5DMkII owning mate - great lens but I've begun to see that it's just too blumming big, way too heavy and definitely unnecessarily expensive for my needs - so I'd rather buy the F4 version which I'll do before I have to hand this big baby back!

+1 to the Tokina 11-16, and Andy is spot on with his assessment of it

Im currently debating between getting the Tokina 11-16 or the Canon 16-35..

Now of course they are a different focal range to each other, but as someone who plans on upgrading to a 5d2 when the firmware comes out.. is it a waste of money buying the tokina as it'll probably end up being too wide for a 5d2..

The tokina is half the price of the canon however.. tough decision.

I thought the Tokina only fits APC-C camera body. Does it even work with the 5d?

Good point, completely forgot about that.

Tokina it is.

Can sell it with the 7D body if i do upgrade in the end anyway.

I thought the Tokina only fits APC-C camera body. Does it even work with the 5d?


some folks use the lens on the 5d with a TC... works fine...

I'm pretty interested in the Tokina as well, but I just read this on the BHPhoto website: Only fits on the EOS Digital Rebel series or 50D, 40D, 30D & 20D SLR cameras

Do you need an adaptor to mount this lens on a 7d?

No adapter required for 7D... just order the Canon mount version... B&H just didn't list the
7D...

And if you need it to fit it on a 5D you use a TC for that camera body. Then the 5D has the
same reach as the 7D with that lens...

Go with the Canon EF-S 10-22, with 77mm filter threads. You will be thankful, for a number of reasons.

Wow, had no idea so many others shared the same question and uncertainty regarding wide angels.

Thanks to a lot of feedback and research, I ended up getting the Tokina and while the feel is different, I have really enjoyed it. Only in still mode, I have noticed some distortion while at 11mm.

Heres the Tokina in action:

"Water" by Tim Kay 60p & 24p --- Slo Mo & Reg. on Vimeo

My Tokina arrived. Love it. So theres another happy customer.

Anyone using it with a CP filter?

Ken Rockwell said in his review - "Avoid using a polarizer, because with lenses this wide you'll more likely get a dark band across your sky than a dark sky. This is because sky polarization differs as you look across the sky, and wide lenses see a huge swath of sky."

Tokina 11-16mm (http://www.kenrockwell.com/tokina/11-16mm.htm)

Has anyone come across this? coming from a video background using a Polar on a wide lens has always been pretty standard for me.

So not sure whether or not to purchase one for the Tokina..

So far not having this problem, but having another ...keeping my B&W filter clean. I probably spent 5 mins today spraying, wiping, respraying, rewiping, what a pain. Bought it off ebay so hope it's not a knock off. But even with this inconvenience my heart can't handle the stress of exposed shooting, Even if i'm inside! Thought I found a tiny scratch on the front glass and it sunk my heart!