It will work but now I have to manually start playback on the camera then hit start in CF.


That approach seems to be the easiest way of preventing HDLink from crashing under Vista during Firewire capture. I also noticed another way, which for the life of me, I don't understand. If I choose to resize, but pick 1440 X 1080 (in essence, no resizing from HDV. Note: This is a licensed version of Neo HDV), then HDLink works fine for capturing with my Canon HV-20 with no workaround like manually starting the camcorder. Why inserting the CF resize filter into the media graph makes a difference, I have no idea. Maybe it's just a coincidence.

Also, does HDLink ignore OS filter merit or does it use whatever MPEG2 decoder has the highest merit? I know that on my system the Nero decoder has a higher merit than the CF Elecard decoder.

I'm more curious than worried about this issue, since most of the time I can capture without a problem without having to use the "manually start playback" trick. I've also noticed that manually starting playback before starting HDLink also works, but that takes a bit of planning to get the capture start location correctly.

HDLink crashed when I try to convert some Cineform .mov files to .avi. When I select the files and click Start, I get "An unkown error occured while accessing...". I am using the latest build.

Any suggestions? Thanks.

Edgar

First guess: do you have Quicktime installed?
Please submit a trouble ticket, www.cineform.com/support

Ditto here, David.

AVI to MOV is no prob, but we did get some crashes doing it the other direction. We tried converting some 1920x1080p MOV's from DigitalJuice (JumpBacks) and they crashed HDLink. Since they aren't CF compressed material, I didn't pay a lot of attention at the time.

When I tried converting CF'ed AVI > MOV rewraps back again ot AVI's, it was no prob, but the MOV> AVI "conversions" from DJ certainly were.

I'll try it again if I get a chance, to verify those results.

BTW, we have QT Pro installed.

I submitted a support ticket. Thanks David.

I do have quicktime installed and I got the same error on multiple computers.

Edgar

Stephen,

Converting non-CineForm MOV files it a little tricker, you needs components suitable playing those MOV files in Window Media Player (i.e. they must be playable in DirectShow.)

Stephen,

Converting non-CineForm MOV files it a little tricker, you needs components suitable playing those MOV files in Window Media Player (i.e. they must be playable in DirectShow.)

I figured there must be something there that requires a plugin recognized by Media Player. It really is not an issue for us, but I did want to hear what you had to say on it.

The impressive part to me, is that you've managed to work the CF codec and supporting software tools into having the cross-platform compatibility they do have! You've not only leveraged a great idea into something very useful, you've actually helped change the face of video production and even made possible new and BETTER hardware possibilities by doing that.

Hi,
I have a new problem. not sure what I did but for my hg10 if I put a canon software imported .m2ts file thru hdlink it stops after a few mb and sits forever. The same is happening if I just drag the file from the cameras hd to my hd in explorer and run it (.MTS).
It was working? not sure what's up. maybe something I installed afterwards? I uninstalled/installed my aspecthd 5.2.2 101 and the coreavc pro (1.65)that were playing nice together before. I think it might have happened after playing a overlay vid monitor full (nvidia fx3000)?? I disabled it but no change.

BTW when I take one of the files (either type) and place it in graphedit (before hdlink). it shows "nero dvd decoder" for the video and "ac3filter" for the audio going off to "default directsound device" (with a little clock icon in that filter box) when hdlink is running , the haali splitter icon is in the tray

thanks,
jack

HDLink will only convert media that will play in DirectShow, so the failure is upstream somewhere. Look into any new tool that has introduced a different demux or AVC decoder.

I'm just wondering what people's experience has been running HDLink under Vista SP1? With Vista x64 and my HV20, HDLink has not crashed at all for me, during capture under SP1, although I didn't have a lot problems with it previously.

no difference..crash..frustrated,,

Hi,

Hoping that someone can help me with this ... got my brand new XH-A1 yesterday, downloaded the trial of AspectHD (5.2.5.110a) and I can capture and edit successfully in PPro2.0 using the appropriate Cineform preset.

But ....

When I try to re-wrap a Cineform AVI to a MOV I receive the attached error (see jpg of log file).

I've also attached the prefs window in case that is helpful.

The error occurs with any Cineform AVI whether it's the original file I captured using PPro 2.0 or the file I export from Premiere after I've finished editing.

I'm just wanting to export a Cineform AVI from Premiere, re-wrap it as an MOV so I can use Sorenson Squeeze 4.5 to convert it to other formats.

Thanks,

Matthew.

Two things.

1) Sorenson Squeeze 5.0 is now AVI compatible.

2) You need Quicktime installed to rewrap an AVI to MOV.

Two things.

1) Sorenson Squeeze 5.0 is now AVI compatible.

2) You need Quicktime installed to rewrap an AVI to MOV.


Hi David,

Thanks for your super-fast reply!

Quicktime is definitely installed.

I did read on another thread that Sorenson Squeeze 5.0 is now AVI compatible - but I was hoping to avoid shelling out for it just yet as version 4.5 is getting me by at the moment.

Plus, I'd hate to buy the upgrade to v5.0 and have it still not work :(

Any other ideas with my current setup?

Thanks again!

Matthew.

That error is what happens when the MOV MUX can't find a suitable version of QuickTime installed. What version is installed?

That error is what happens when the MOV MUX can't find a suitable version of QuickTime installed. What version is installed?

Hi David,

I've got Quicktime 7.4.5 installed on my system. I might see if there's a new version available or uninstall and re-install Quicktime.

I'm also installing a trial of Sorenson Squeeze 5.0 and will let you know how that goes with the AVI files.

Thanks again,

Matthew.

Haven't tried 7.4.5, but 7.3.1 and 7.4 work.

Haven't tried 7.4.5, but 7.3.1 and 7.4 work.

Hi David,

I'm having success using the trial version of Sorenson Squeeze 5.0 to convert the Cineform AVIs into other formats.

No luck yet with re-installing Quicktime etc ...

Looks like I'll be ugrading to Squeeze 5.0 in the near future ;)

Thanks heaps for your help - really impressed with how quickly you responded.

Cheers,

Matthew.

I'm trying to convert some Sony AVCHD footage (.m2ts). Hdlink only works if picking resize to 1440 option, but refuses to stop encoding, duplicating the same file over and over. Also original file of say 60Mb ends up 326Mb in cineform format - what gives?

some bug surely?

Using Version 3.3 yet? It can help with AVCHD files.

re: size. AVCHD is compressed to a inch of its life, 2 or 3 times more than HDV, and we are 3 to 4 time bigger than HDV. So expect files at least 5 times bigger than AVCHD -- and you want that. Data size increase has to happen when you unroll all that very long GOP motion estimation nonsense.

Hi David, yes it's v3.3.

It does the job, but has mentioned bugs, looping / STOP button not working / hanging unless you select resize option....

Sounds like the beta not the release code. You should be running Build 164 not 163.

I have been using HDLink for about 2 years now and I just ran into this issue. I typically have hdlink split my 24f HDV clips as it captures them and it creates cineform avi files, based on the start and stop of my camera recording. In the past, when it would encounter a glitch/dropped packet, whatever, it would split the file and create a new avi at that point and I would typically lose a second or two of the video. Not ideal, but what are you going to do....it was a glitch in the recording.

Recently however, it has been skipping right over the glitch and continuing to capture the clip. What tends to happen is the video shifts in relation to the audio and the remainder of the clip has audio sync issues. In this case the audio was ahead of the video by 6 frames. I was able to perform a shift in Premiere and compensate for this but I am wondering why this is happening.

To be fair I don't have many dropouts and I don't usually shoot long takes, but in this case it was a live concert and the audio was obviously out of sync for the reamining 45 minutes after this glitch.

Should cineform see this gltich and start a new clip? In the past this is what it did but the last 2 times it encountered this situation it didn't.

I should point out that I am not using the absolute latest build....I don't think I have updated since January or so. I am of the mindset that if it is working....don't fix it.

THanks.

Hi Marty,

It's hard to tell exactly what's happening during this "glitch" compared to others.
Generally if we see an improperly terminated/structured MPEG stream packet, we may interpret that as a scene break. If there's just invalid MPEG stream data but it's properly structured, we may continue processing it.

There haven't been any changes (to my knowledge) in the section of code regarding M2T decoding and conversion for quite some time, so my guess is that it's a different type of "glitch" that's occurring in the camera.

It may be time to clean your video heads or get some different tapes; hopefully that will prevent the problem in the first place.

If you have the problematic M2T saved, and it's small enough, send it over www.yousendit.com to tbucklin@cineform.com and I'll take a look at it and see if there's anything I can find.

Thanks. I did just clean the heads hours before the recording and these were brand new tapes. In all fairness I have not rechecked the tape to see if this occurs at the same spot everytime. I use an XL-H1 to record and a Canon HV20 to capture. Both decks had just been cleaned prior to this event.

I have notice on occassion the HV20 will drop a frame (or 15!) one time through, and then I can rewind and play the same part again and it is no longer there. I assume that is not a permanent problem with the tape in that case. However I have not been able to test this in this case.

David, the HDLink with the new 4K upgrade is not capturing from any of our HDV cams.

In CS3, the capture works just fine.

HDLInk recognizes the cams, but is giving a "missiing video header" error and terminating.

If it helps, I can screen capture the log (hardcopy logs would be a nice feature to add to HDLink...)


Suggestions?

Contact support as it working here. Are you running 3.3.1.167A, there was a small patch to the installer a few days ago.

Contact support as it working here. Are you running 3.3.1.167A, there was a small patch to the installer a few days ago.

No, just the original release version. I can download the new patched ver. and see if there's any dif.

Or just install this small patch
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=123287

Or just install this small patch
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=123287

The patch "healed" it. Tnx!

i was watching someone capturing and editing with cineform / cs3 today, and noticed they were capturing with hdlink. now i know i can download a trial version, etc., but i've searched around for answers here and on the sony site without too much success vis a vie using hdlink to capture with vegas.

what i would like to know before i waste / invest any time / money is....

a. does hdlink work happily with vegas (ie the captured / converted files), and if so, does it capture and convert on the fly reliably (e6600, 3gb ram, dedicated sata drive)?

b. is the 'high' quality in hdlink noticeable better than that supplied with vegas cf?

c. will it print back to a sony 15 vtr more reliably than vegas's ptt?

d. is it worth my while considering i rarely do compositing to any degree, most of my work is doco, so is pretty much cut to cut, a bit of minor cc'ing, titles, etc., and so far, editing m2t's hasn't caused me any serious grief?

e. ah, most importantly, does it capture the original tc, and is there anyway of batch capturing with it (neo)?

thanks for you time,

leslie

a. Files captured with HD Link work perfectly fine with Vegas

b. Yes. CineForm's software has updated components compated to those shipped with Vegas. Plus you get the myriad of pre-processing features (telecine removal, etc) unavailable otherwise with Vegas.

c. no idea.

d. your call. CineForm offers improved visual fidelity compared to editing m2t files. We have quality analyses posted on our website you can review. But we also tell people that for simple edits that don't push your images in post, and if you're only doing one level of render, that you might get by with native m2t editing. Personally I would never do this, but not everybody is image critical.

c. HD Link does not batch capture, nor does it retain source HDV timecode. Those are features that are on the list but not yet implemented.

many thanks david for you reply, precisely what i was looking for....

other than i'm still not sure i need cf for the work i do (i can certainly see it's benefits when it comes to more serious post production). of course, it's a question only i can answer - having used the built in version on a couple of ocassions i can't really see the need for it, but then again, if i decide to start using magic bullet looks and the like, it could be a whole different story....

ptt is a temporary step since i don't have bluray at the moment, so it's a minor point.

the major, and it is MAJOR, is the lack of batch capture with hdv at this level. once cf does have it, it's certainly on my shopping list!!!

again, thanks for your time

leslie

I have only a few days left of a trial of Prospect Cineform and am seriously thinking of purchasing the software, especially after seeing the results on a large screen at my local multiplex (the colours looked wonderfully vibrant).

However I have had a couple of glitches that have made me think twice The most recent was a 24p-25p conversion of a 15 minute HD2 (720p) avi file. Initially I was impressed -it converted it in good time, the 4% audio increase was fine (compared to the same conversion using Adobe Audition) and most interestingly the file size went from 40GB to less than 5GB! But then I discovered the last three minutes of audio was missing... This was the second time to attempt such a conversion and the same issue occured both times (fortunately I could replace the missing audio).

I would be interested to know if anyone has any ideas on this. I am using CS3 software on a QuadCore with 3GB RAM running VISTA, and double checked all Cineform Pref settings. The only two other issues I have encountered are Export to Tape failure and MultiCamera editing failure. The other features will likely outweigh these issues, but any help appreciated.

Sincerely
Dan

720p24/25 CineForm AVI should be around 6-7 MB/s, so your 15-minute film should be between 5-6GB. So the file size is correct. I gather 40GB source was uncompressed YUV. I haven't heard any reports of the missing audio. How did you generate the source file? If we can repeat the situation here the audio can be checked out.

For tape to tape we recommend using HDlink's export over Premiere in built feature -- use Export Movie and select CineForm M2T (we think the quality is better.) Multi-cam is not accelerated.

Thanks for the reply David.

Yes, the original file was an uncompressed avi. file It was edited on a Matrox system -but not a 'Matrox' avi file as far as I know.

I will try the HDlink export method again, as it was not working a few days ago, while the export out of premiere worked fine.

Regards
Dan

hi david,
I am very new to this forum. I saw your replies over the frame rate conversions and really impressed with your answers.I am having a big problem here. I shot the footage using Sony's HVR S270 E hdv camera at 25p.Now I need to convert it to 24p. Is there anyway that I can convert my footage to 24p without losing much of the quality? Please do help me.
Thank you.

Yes, 25p to 24p is the easiest of the conversions (no quality issues.) But it is a question for a new thread. In that thread you should explain your production needs so user can help (not just me) guide you.

Thanks David. I used cineform prospect HD to capture the footage at 25p and edited on Premiere Pro CS3 and the final project was exported as cineform AVI file.Now I need to convert it to 24p to give a film look and for the film transfer.Can you help me out.
Thank You.

It is a question for another thread. Note: you can filmout from 25p.

I am trying to determine the minimum motherboard and cpu requirement when capturing hd-sdi or component video using the aja lhe to hdlink. I do not plan to use the machine for any editing, but the machine will need to be able to capture and compress video without any dropped frames. The storage device will be a raid of about 4-6 hard drives.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Richard,

The minimum specs are located here: http://www.cineform.com/products/Aspect-Prospect.htm#Sys_Requirements. There are a lot of variables that influence the exact CPU required on any sequence of frames, but in our earlier testing the E6700 seemed to work well as a minimum. I'm not sure you can still buy it anymore, and if not you should get one that is somewhat equivalent and maybe a bit faster.

Thanks, that was the information I was seeking.

I'm trying to get a precise workflow for progressing from HDV footage captured by a Cannon HV20 to either a wide screen DVD or a BluRay DVD.

At present, I'm using , 1. Automatically convert to Cineform Intermediate 2. Quality -High, with Progressive checked 3. Resize - None. for the HDLink.
Then I use a Cineform 30P Premiere Pro project to edit.
I export out of that using File-export- movie with the Cineform HD export and Fields -None (under keyframe and renedering).
I've been setting the resolution under video to either 720x480 or 1440x1080 depending whether I want the final DVD to be SD or BluRay.
Then I import the AVI into Encore and set that to automatic.

I think this works ok, but I noticed in reading this forum, that some authors were resizing to square pixels on capture. Since I only have ASpectHD and not Prospect, I would have to capture at 1280x720 for square pixels, and I was just wondering, if I should do that instead of not changing the resolution on capture as I am presently doing.

Secondly, I noticed that Procoder was being used to encode the AVI from Premiere, to import into Encore for the DVD, and I was wondering, if I should consider this option, or with my camera being limited to HDV it would make a significant difference.
Finally, any recomendations to my work flow would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance.
John Rich

John
I switched to Prospect and a 1920 sq pix workflow to accommodate the Sony EX1. I noticed that from the sq pix avi I was able to get cleaner imagery when transcoding directly to DVD, BR, Flash, iTunes. Previously, using HDV 1440 1.33par, I always had to downscale the avi to 480 1.2 par to get the best DVD. That gave me the idea that maybe all the "pixel shifting" between 1.33 and 1.2 plus transcoding was making life difficult for those pixels. I tried importing HDV as CFHD 1920 sq pix and compressing directly to DVD and it worked well- just like the EX1 footage, but of course the HDV images are inherently not as good as the EX1 for a variety of reasons. The HDV sourced DVD imagery from 1920 sq pix may be a bit better than the HDV 1440 1.33 on DVD using my old workflow, but not jaw dropping. Mostly, it's just a simpler workflow.
I would be leery of dropping the HDV down to 720 sq pix avi. I never tried it, but I suspect a price will be paid for the downconversion, plus you would be adding one more step to the process.

Help! I'm seeing weird errors coming from DirectShow when using HDLink. I have a trouble ticket open with Cineform but it's not going anywhere so far. Has anybody seen anything like this? Hoping another user can point me where to look for troubleshooting, at least.

I've installed the Neo HDV trial version, using it to convert AVCHD files from my Canon HF100 into intermediate files so I can edit on Vegas Pro 8. I like the results so far, and I'm thinking about buying the program -- if I can get my head past the fact it's downsizing my 1920 clips to 1440. Cineform says it doesn't matter. I'm taking their word for it so far.

But I'm having a technical issue: I can't convert more than one or two clips at a time. If I select one clip, no matter what it is, it always works. If I select multiple clips it will successfully convert one or two, but when it starts the 3rd (or maybe 4th, or sometimes the 2nd) it crashes. The log contains stuff like this:

...
Bulding conversion graph.
Using Super-Threaded Conversion
Error: m_mediaControl->Run() (0x8007000e - Not enough storage is available to complete this operation.) in (DirectShowGraph.cpp at 218)
Error: m_convertGraph.StartGraph() (0x8007000e - Not enough storage is available to complete this operation.) in (CFCaptureDlg.cpp at 2271)
Error: ConvertClip(next) (0x8007000e - Not enough storage is available to complete this operation.) in (CFCaptureDlg.cpp at 2328)


I have to close the program at that point. I can restart it, select the file that crashed, and convert it with no problems.

I've dealt with Windows XP enough to know that the "not enough storage" error is caused by an out of memory condition more often than an out of disk space condition, and caused by a DLL or registration conflict (or some other configuration problem) more often than both of the first two combined. In any case I know my nearly empty 750 GB hard disk and 2 GB of RAM should not be running out of room.

Per CineForm's tech notes, I've installed CoreAVC Pro and the Haali splitter that came with it. The version of the splitter seems to be the same that's available for download on the Haali splitter website. I know the CoreAVC codec is working because I can play the original AVCHD clips in Windows Media Player.

I'm not familiar enough with DirectShow and how it works to be able to chase this down. If anybody has experienced this and knows how to fix it, they will be my new best friend!

Yikes! Cineform does not retain camera-original timecode from HDV files? I was on the verge of buying Neo HDV, but this could be a complete non-starter for me.

Until I can afford an LTO-3 tape drive, recapturing from original DV/HDV tapes is the only way I have of archiving long-form documentary projects with hundreds of hours of footage. If that's not possible with Cineform, I may have to rethink my workflow. Please, please address this in the next version of Cineform!

Still no word from CineForm in the support ticket, but in case anyone is reading this, I at least was able to find out that it's crashing because of a memory leak. Private Bytes doubles after every converted file. It isn't letting go of something when a file is finished. I have to close the program and rerun it. Don't know if this is because of the HDLink program itself or if it's a problem with something along the DirectShow chain.

Anybody know a way to verify exactly which DirectShow components a program is using? Is there a "debug mode" for HDLink that might dump more info to the log?

Still no word from CineForm in the support ticket, but in case anyone is reading this, I at least was able to find out that it's crashing because of a memory leak. Private Bytes doubles after every converted file. It isn't letting go of something when a file is finished. I have to close the program and rerun it. Don't know if this is because of the HDLink program itself or if it's a problem with something along the DirectShow chain.

Anybody know a way to verify exactly which DirectShow components a program is using? Is there a "debug mode" for HDLink that might dump more info to the log?

Hi Rich,

We've spent parts of the last couple of days trying to get to the bottom of your problem.
We were able to reproduce the problem on *one* of our machines here, yet not on any of the others, so we're in the process of hunting down the potential culprit.

What seems to be happening is that the Haali splitter and AVCHD decoder are negotiating for a subtype of "avc1", which the decoder's having a hard time decoding properly. When it's linked up to our components, it's telling them that the frame size is 0x0 instead of 1440x1080, so it's not allocating the appropriately-sized buffer(s).

The real kicker is that with the exact same source file, Haali splitter, AVCHD decoder, and CineForm components in the DirectShow graph on two different machines is producing different results. We've tried toying around with the Haali settings, but those both match.

Jake should be getting back to you tomorrow morning with a couple things to try and a version of HD Link with some debug output enabled.

You've definitely come up with an odd one, but luckily one of our machines is equally as unhappy as yours.

Sorry... well, at least I was able to provide some intellectual challenge.


The real kicker is that with the exact same source file, Haali splitter, AVCHD decoder, and CineForm components in the DirectShow graph on two different machines is producing different results.


This is starting to sound eerily like my day job.