hi there,

A QUESTION:

can i just use the CONNECT HD with premiere pro as a capture engine and as aVI CODEC??

i dont care about the realtime thing, or even the aspect hd extra tools as the color correction, etc.

i would like to use the VEGAS but im pretending to use the TWIXTOR that its only avaliable for premiere.

so i got to render everything with the codec to get the 24fps.

dont know about there, but here in brazil is not that hard to get a film transfer for free (as we dont have a film
production as the americans have..."they" need us to a lot!)

thanks

ciao

ah, by the way, WHAT is the config on the twixtor that i need to set to get only the 24 frames convertion?

Connect HD will work with Premiere Pro. Under Premiere you can set up a Video for Windows (VfW) editing mode that is 1280x720 @ 29.97 and then editing using CineForm AVI clips. The VfW edit mode of Premiere is no match for the Aspect HD editing mode, but if real-time is truly not of importance, you will do fine with Connect HD.

Twixtor does seem to be the way to go for 24p exports under Premiere and After Effects.

If youre saying that i can use it on premiere pro, it is used as a CODEC ? i can set the premiere to render my project with the connect hd codec?

and, can i capture directly from premiere to that codec?


thanks

ciao

Yes. Connect HD has an external tool that captures M2T data and converts it (automatically) to a system friendly HD AVI file. These AVIs contain the CFHD (CineForm HD) format data, which can be imported directly into Premiere, Vegas, After Effect etc.

Twixtor worked for me to go to 24p as an After effects plug-in. not premiere. Twixtor does something with premiere (i don't know what), but it didn't seem to be frame rate conversion.

And, as far as i know, Cineform doesn't export from After effects back to Cineform codec, yet. I exported the files as uncompressed AVI to get the best result.

The After Effects supporting codec is part of the release version of Connect HD and the Aspect HD upgrade -- both coming soon.

Im having two problems.

#1 where there is a vertical blue or negative line on the right side edge of the captured clip, its only on the converted by ConnectHD file. I guess its about 40 pixels wide and looks blueish.

#2...its also rendering all my 16:9 footage as 4:3 for some reason. I did setup Vegas properly in accordance with the ConnectHD manual. {1440x1080 / upper / 1.3333 & simulate aspect ratio}

( The .m2t file loads into vegas just fine- in 16:9, but if I load the .avi Connect file- it loads as 4:3!

Its not on the camera...and only happens upon conversion with ConnectHD

edited to add a screen capture of the .avi in Vegas.
http://aequantum.com/vegasclip.jpg

im running:
XP PRO w.SP2
DX9.0c
Vegas 5.0b
HD link 1.3 (trial)
HDR-FX1

Why is this happening? Is it because its a trial?

Thanks!

#1 sounds like a bug we had in one build of Aspect, but I never heard of it in Connect. Download the new Connect 1.5 and see if you still see that problem there.

#2 you need to look at the very last paragraph in the section of the connect manual about configuring. Once your project is configured, you still have work to do on your clips so they are imported correctly. This is a limitaion of Vegas, but I think they will fix it in Vegas 6. Here's the exerpt from the manual just for other readers who may not have it...

"Finally, when you import your clips into your Media Pool, they may still look like they are 4:3 rather than 16:9. Right click on one of the clips in the Media Pool, and select ‘Properties’. Change the ‘Field Order’ and ‘Pixel Aspect Ratio’ to match the clip you have imported, and then click the ‘Save’ button which is next to the ‘Stream’ field. From that point on, your clips should import correctly, and your project should play those clips correctly as well. The rest of the features you’ll use should work identically to the way you are used to editing DV in Vegas. Consult your Sony Vegas users guide for more information on Vegas editing features."

Thad H.
CineForm Support

excellent! Thank you Thad. That worked! ...but I still get the blue stripe intermittently, it depends on the clip I convert. I'll have to research some more about the cause.

Thanks!

Hello, this is for you cineform people :-)

First of all, I'd like to pick your brains on a few compositing questions.

1. The connect HD software for AVI applications ($199) How does that work? Would I be able to import the captured clips into premiere or after effects? I'm running after effects 6.0 professional, shooting with the HD10, and I'd like to do some compositing within after effects, green screen chroma key, etc.

2. The cineform website says it is for avi applications. Would it work well within premiere pro? I have 1.0 with the mainconcept mpeg pro codec, which supports hdv 1 and 2. I hear it is very sluggish, but how would it handle?

I'm more concerned with the compositing part right now.

Also, if I can import the hdv footage into after effects, would I be able to export it back as a clip in hdv resolution?

My questions are probably old and probably have come across your screens before, but I'm still trying to get my computer set up to do this stuff. Any feedback would be appreciated. Thank you again and sorry for the bother.

Carlos Rodriguez III

Hi Carlos,

I'm the local CineForm guy so I try answering your questions.

1. Connect HD converts incoming camera MPEG2TS streams to a more managable AVI file using CineForm's wavelet compression. This AVI will work in After Effects, Virtual Dub, Vegas, Premiere, anything that uses standard VfW codecs.

2. Connect HD does work with Premiere Pro 1.0, although is it not optimized for that purpose. For that there is Aspect HD ($499) and the 1.5.1 Premiere upgrade that CineForm developed with Adobe (free to 1.5 users.)

For compositing you will need either Connect or Aspect HD, as the free Premiere plug-in doesn't come with components to support After Effects. You can use Connect with 1.5.1 for a low cost solution. Aspect offers greater performance in Premiere, but doesn't accelerate AE.

That's what I really like about this forum! A fast knowledgeable answer. Thanks for the input.

So just to get this straight, premiere pro 1.5.1 will import the footage into after effects 6.0, but it would still be best to use Connect HD, right?

Thanks again David!

Carlos Rodriguez III

Not quite. Premiere 1.5.1 fully supports CineForm HD within Premiere, but not for outside applications like After Effects. Connect HD provides a license to use the CineForm HD format in any PC application (CHD also includes the HDV capture and conversion tool -- HDLink.)

Best is Aspect HD with Premiere 1.5.1 and After Effects.
Next is Premiere 1.5.1 and Connect HD for After Effects work.

You don't have to use Premiere 1.5.1 but it makes things much easier (particularly for Sony HDV which has a pixel aspect ratio not fully supported pre-1.5.1.) You can use Connect HD with Premiere Pro 1.0, but the performance is limited.

I hope this helps clarify. The trail versions for all CineForm software is available from the website.

-David

great, thanks! much appreciated!

I have been following your posts regarding Connect HD and Vegas hopefully closely enough to allow me to ask the following question.

I am really considering purchasing Connect HD for the abilities as mentioned in your post:
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=45329

I have a burning question I need answered. Connect HD creates a "intermediate" avi file to be used for editing. How does one swop out to the original HD for rendering to have quality carried through to the final product - or am I missing the boat here entirely with my philosophy.

At present, I have been using PIC video's mjpeg codec for intermediate work and then using Gearshift to swop out the intermediate with the original m2t in Vegas 6. I would much prefer using a less lossy codec. What is the quality of the intermediate like for output work - hell, in short here, I'm in a quandry and a bit confused as to what my workflow should be since everyone has so many different ideas. Your objective opinion would be appreciated.

I have downloaded the beta Connect HD 1.7 and find it to my needs, especially the scene detection from my FX1E.

ASs you probably have gathered, I am relatively new to HD and the video editing world so any constructive help here would be appreciated.

Regards

Jeremy

Jeremy,

Good questions. The confusion is over CineForm's use of the term "intermediate" which we derived from the film workflow "Digtial Intermediate" not from the concept of temporary "proxy." In film digital intermediates you don't go back to the source negative. The CineForm Intermediate is not a proxy for the M2T data, it completely replaces it. We are like an uncompressed workflow -- only much more convenient due to file size and speed. We adopted the branding of "CineForm Intermediate" during the post production of "Dust to Glory" where CineForm compression was used through out and was the final master format. So that is the philosophy. From these AVIs you create your master, to go to whatever output format you want : WMV9, AVC264, MPEG2, DVD, D5 or film.

Finally - a concise and honest answer! - thanks David

First, thanks for the quick reply - from what I can gather from the forums - a Cineform standard!

You have just gained another customer!

I will be doing some tests to satisfy my own curiosity but from a workflow point of view, you have certainly enlightened and satisfied me.

Many thanks

Jeremy

My initial experience with HDConnect 1.7 has been very good. I capture m2t wtih automatic conversion to CF Intermediate. That saves hard drive space and gives me very good quality for editing. So far I've output the final edit to two different formats, wmvHD for playback on a computer, and back to m2t (HDV) for printing to tape. I played the latter through a Christie LX 45 projector and was very pleased with the result.

When I first started using HD Connect, I thought the time delay awaiting completion of auto conversion would be a workflow problem. The delay is equal to about 50% of the total length of the clip. I've adjusted my documentary production workflow to capture shorter clips (e.g. not usually longer than 5 or 6 minutes, and often only 1-2 minutes) and while the auto conversion is happening, I review the next portion of tape and cue it to avoid capturing the interviewer's questions and fluffed answers. I find I waste very little time this way. This probably wouldn't work so well for long-form event productions but I don't do much of that anyway.

Hopefully Vegas will soon have this function built in.

Hopefully Vegas will soon have this function built in.

That would be nice... and it's something that many HDV newbies are mistakenly beguiled into believing exists. I don't think it's likely to happen unless the HDLink tool can be made to work somewhat like a 'plug-in' for Vegas, so the captures are made directly to the Media Pool/Timeline.

Any possibility of that?

As things stand at this point in time, anyone who has a HDV camera and a PC who isn't using a Cineform product, is not getting as good a final product as they could...

As things stand at this point in time, anyone who has a HDV camera and a PC who isn't using a Cineform product, is not getting as good a final product as they could...

Can we quote you. :)

Regarding the HDLink direct integration into Vegas, this would be nice. The Sony Vegas engineering team (hopefully) will be adding more of these features over time. Unfortunately I'm not aware on any plug-in API that would allow CineForm to do this itself.

Can we quote you. :)

Sure!!

I know there've been those who've questioned the need for Cineform products in dealing with HDV; but from my experience with editing HDV from my HD10u and FX-1e, ConnectHD has been an integral component of creating video - both SD and HD - that has truly lived up to the expectation and promise that HD carried with it when I decided to jump on the HD technology train...

Thanks for your efforts David, and your involvement with the HD community.

I'm a one-man operation using Vegas to edit--primarily on my desktop. I'd like to start using my laptop for some smaller projects. Vegas lets me have two installs. Does CineForm?

Yes and No. One purchase is only for one license. However we do recognize that the laptop to desktop work-flow can require a second install. Contact technical support to request a laptop activation.

David,

I've got Aspect HD on my main, can I get it for my laptop too? I got the laptop later and now use it more than the desktop.

Also, when I bought it, I asked for the disk to be sent when available, hard copy, but never did get it, is it ready yet?

Thanks david,

Mike

Some policy applies to Aspect HD.

If have forwarded you inquiry to sales regarding a physical copy to see what happened.

Thank you very much David. I can't express how much it means to have you as a major contributor to this forum. I wish there were more reps like you.

Mike

I'm very interested in the possibility to use Cineform codec for real time
capture and compression in combination with inexpensive card.
I know about expensive combination Prospect HD and AJA Xena card.
But i can live with 4:2:2 8bit use Connect HD or Aspect HD
for capturing 720p from cmos camera head and capture board
like this:http://www.epixinc.com/products/sv9m001.htm
Anybody tested Connect HD with differents capture boards?
Thank you in advance for any info,
Serge.

Connect HD is not currently setup for this as the camera source image is bayer formatted, not RGB 4:4:4 or YUV 4:2:2 which is expected by the CineForm codec. You will also need to gamma correct the linear data coming off the camera head. So there will be a lot of pre-processing required to compress of the fly -- so much pre-processing that you will spend for more on your PC than will will on any other gear to maintain real-time capture from a bayer sounce into Connect HD.

HOWEVER, we have been developing a new compression technology to directly compress bayer source without all the processing overhead. Unfortunately this market for frame grabbers is smaller than that of HDV, so a bayer compression tool can't be priced as inexpensively as Connect HD. This is currently undergoing a licensing discussion, so today I can't annouce details.

as the camera source image is bayer formatted, not RGB 4:4:4 or YUV 4:2:2
David, but if this cmos camera head inside have a dsp and can output filtered signal YUV 4:2:2 through GigE or 1394b, in this case is possible encode to PHD? Or only solution is camera with SMPTE 292M HDSDI output and Xena HS as capture card? And last question:Prospect HD able to resolve non-standart resolution 1280x1440p24 (combined two streams 1280x720 by over-under stereo3d)?

Prospect HD would be able to encode (in real-time) YUV 4:2:2 (10-bit) data coming from any source even 3D resolutions like 1280x1440p24. We can encode 1920x1080p30 on a dual Opteron 252, which is 62M pixels per second. 1280x1440x24 is only 44Mp/s so it will work well. The Premiere capture tools are of course only setup for HDSDI or HDV inputs, but the DirectShow encoding components are available to do much more if you create your own tools.

Thank you very much David. I can't express how much it means to have you as a major contributor to this forum. I wish there were more reps like you.

Mike

I agree David. Your input on this forum was a major consideration in my purchase of Aspect HD --- Although I hope to know more than you in a week or so... :)

I am considering getting an nVidia 7800 to speed up Magic Bullet effects rendering in Vegas 6. Would that new video card (versus my nVidia 5700) have any postive impact on HD Connect performance?

Compression and conversion is not impacted by the performance of the graphics card. None of CineForm products rely on the GPU to achieve its performance.

Is it technically possible for HD Connect to tap the GPU and could it significantly improve performance?

It would likely slow things download. Bouncing data two and from a GPU is overhead we don't need. CineForm products are heavily optimized to not need GPU acceleration.

Hello David. I downloaded the ConnectHD 15 day trial version yesterday, installed it, and got it running. Before using the software to capture any footage I thought I'd try converting an m2t clip I'd downloaded a while back. The clip is only about 100mb in size, and I had 3gb left on the drive I was using. I tried the conversion a number of times, but it just didn't work. I'd get a message after just a few seconds telling me the conversion was complete, but there'd be no completed file. Is this feature disabled in the 15 day trial version? My camera wasn't connected at the time aswell, if maybe that stops it from working?

Also, in the manual it's mentioned that a minimum 2.8ghz P4 with HT is required for decent performance. Now I'm running a 3.06ghz Dell notebook with HT, but I've disabled the Hyper Threading because when turned on, it lowers the overall performance of the computer dramatically. So much so that DV avi files can't even be played full screen at their full frame rate. So I'm just wondering if HT is really a necessity? I'd rather leave it turned off.

There is no reason I can think of that should prevent your trail version from working, it is a full version with no restictions. The only unknown is that M2T file. Try downloading one of these m2t clips (as I know they are good) -- http://www.hdvinfo.net/articles/jvcprohd/hd100mini35test5.php

As for Hyper Threading, it isn't required but it will improve performance for threaded applications like Connect HD which is multiple CPU aware. Older non-threaded tools can't directly benefit from HT.

Many thanks for the quick reply. Yes, I might try a different file. I have those ones from the JVC, but they're on another computer.

As for the Hyper Threading, if that is supported I may end up giving it a try. It's easy enough to turn on or off in the Bios.

Anyway, I thought it was about time I tried capturing some footage from my HC1. After reading the system requirements for ConnectHD, I realised the Windows SP2 update was required. So I downloaded that and installed it. Now the computer won't even recognise the camera or any other Firewire device! Of course SP2 adds a firewall to all network devices, so I disabled that for the 2x Firewire connections. Unfortunately I still can't get it to work. Hopefully I'll get it sorted out. There's a Microsoft fix file I've just downloaded. Maybe that will work.

Try uninstalling the Firewire driver, then search for new hardware devices. When it finds the FW the camera should be visible also.

Actually I'm now quite certain it's the Firewire socket on the camera that's blown as I've tried connecting it to 5 computers, and not one will work. Plus I've even tried connecting it to an old Canopus card. Very disapointing, especially considering I've only had it a week. The power switch is faulty aswell. As soon as I turn the camera on it switches off again, and then back on, off again and so on continuously. I can usually get that to stop. I thought it was a bad battery for a while there, but it happens with just the power supply connected also. Seriously, making the switch from a Canon XM2 to the HDV Sony HC1, I thought my biggest concern would be deinterlacing the footage. I honestly never expected anything like this.

Anyway, I look to trying your software once again David as soon as I get this camera repaired. Thanks for the replies.

i'm using connect 1.5 with XP SP 1 .. also using V6c ... ( windows media player will NOT play any clips using the cineform codec 2.0 but those clips will play in Vegas TL )

i see that connect 2.0 states use XP SP2 ... the problem with updating to service pack 2 is it cripples 1394B (s800) ..in fact in knocks it down to s100 ( 1394a =s400) ..yea microsoft has a fix but that just gets it back up to s400 and NOT s800 speeds .. 1394B difference = SP1 60MB/s reads & 45MB/s writes.. SP2 35MB/s reads & 24MB/s writes ... BIG difference...

soooooooooo is it connect 2 just will not work with sp1 or it just slower, locks up ?

Connect HD will work fine with SP1. We only (strongly) recommend SP2 as the setup is much easier because the camera drivers are ready to go in SP2 (so it is only a customer support issue.) As you are already running 1.5 under SP1 you should have no issues.

Has anyone else experienced an error like the following:

The capture log displays Error: m_deviceMK->BindToObject(0,0,IID_IBaseFilter,(void**)&device(0x8004005 - Unspecified Error) in (C:\Brisco\Apps\Capture\VideoCaptureDevice.cpp at 205)

This error shows up in the log has soon as I turn on my A1U. The error is pretty much printed in between every status message.

i.e.
It will say
Welcome
Version
Error
Camera not in playback mode
Error
Ready to Capture
Error
Capture
Error
Converting
Error
Ready to Capture


Etc, etc, etc....

It doesn't actually capture anything though. It correctly shows the timecode of the tape, and I can control the camera just fine. I just can't use the software at all.

I opened a support ticket, but haven't heard back from them yet. I was just curious if anyone else here has seen this.

There is a post about this in the Cineform Disscussion forums, but nobody seems to have resolved this problem yet.

No idea. You are running SP2? You will need to wait on support for this one, as I have never hard of it. That error means the camera device doesn't support MPEG2 transport streams. Maybe the camera is trying to output DV.

i've had connectHD 1.5 installed for sometime on my HP laptop.. in early dec i installed v2.? i did not enter serial # ... i also noticed that it did not uninstall 1.5 ... v2 expired while i was on the road last week ( did not have my serial # with me) and everytime i attempted to load in a avi. clip the expired - BUY- notice poped up.. so i uninstalled V2 but i still keep getting the BUY pop up notice repeatedly while i edit (vegas 6) ... is there a way to get rid of the pop up ???

Good question for tech support. That isn't supposed to happen, as the expired license is only to prevent encoding not decoding.

it was connect HD v2.0.1.10
the zip is labeled connecthd20dl050930

on the laptop under XP add/remove programs ..
cineform HD VFW codec ..is still listed
connect HD is still listed no version listed .. the cineform folder is still on C drive and i can pop up connect HD 1.5 program

in Vegas 5 .. when i go to render as HDV 1440x1080 60i there is not a cineform codec listed ..

in Vegas 6 when i render for HDV there is no cineform codec listed??

no cineform HDV clip will playback with picture in V6/5 or WMP = audio only ...


i see from my other Computer in Vegas 6c cineform 2.1 codec is available
( it does not have connectHD installed) so i assume 2.1 is from within V6..
but it has disappeared from V6 on the laptop ...

so would i assume when i uninstall connectHD v2 it took the cineform codec that comes with Vegas 6 with it ???

once i get rid of pop up - i assume re-install V6 will get the codec back ... and once i re-install connect HD 2.1 that will get it back into Vegas 5 ...

Sorry for the confusing version numbers : You want Connect HD v2.1, which contains the CineForm codec version 2.3. That should solve your issues.

I downloaded a trial version of Connect HD for Vegas 6d. Could someone point me in the direction of a tutorial for this? Workflow, conversion, rendering?

Thank you.