Thanks Don.
I guess both Jenna and I should check out the Lenmar battery.

And yes, those ratings are as you describe it "best-conditions rating".
But that goes for all brands, not only Canon or Lenmar.

Note that the LIC941 is not a good fit in the Canon XH A1 (marginally too large so it does not slide in/out reliably) in case you are considering an upgrade in the near future. The Lenmar LIC950G is more like 5200 mAh and may be a better fit for the XH A1.

Yes, there are several threads in the XH-A1 forum about non-Canon batteries not fitting.

Lenmar rates it at 6000 mAh, no doubt a best-conditions rating.

I've never done a definitive comparison test, but subjectively it has lasts at least as long as the Canon BP945, if not longer, on a full charge. But I rarely shoot more than a tape's worth in a single session, and if I do change tape, I usually change to a fresh battery at the same time.

Don, I actually have done fairly thorough testing of Lenmars, and found that they in fact deliver what their sticker claims within +/- 5%; this can not be said of the Ebay bought generics. Getting typically 60%-70% of their sticker claim.
HTH

Thanks Alex. Good to hear from you.

have you done any testing on degradation of Li ion over time; e.g., something like "you can typically expect the available capacity to fall off by 8% per year" as the battery ages.

Don, I only am familiar with the numbers supplied by Sanyo. They have it about 10%/year if the battery is stored fully charged, 3%/year if it is stored at 40% charge. What I personally observed, is if the pack fails, it happens very quickly, in catastrophic manner. It is not normal aging, but some kind of hard failure in the electronics in it, or one of the cells pops.

So it's between a BP9**.. and a Lenmar?

I suppose the VL-3 sounds better to me, I don't want a light that is to bright, just a sort of fill light for anything I film within 7-10 feet of like you said, BUT, I am a bit worried about it eating my battery, so are there other lights on the market that will fit my canon gl2? I like the idea of the light running on it's own battery in a way, but could I possibly find a softer light that does run on it's own battery? Or is the battery that the VL-3 takes up, not that much, so it wouldn't cut down my filming time by to much?

Thanks for answering my question about the charger, I noticed on ebay it's ALOT more expensive to purchase a battery with a charger, than just the battery alone, and without knowing I would have boughten one with a charger.. so thanks :)

I suppose the VL-3 sounds better to me, I don't want a light that is to bright, just a sort of fill light for anything I film within 7-10 feet of like you said, BUT, I am a bit worried about it eating my battery, so are there other lights on the market that will fit my canon gl2? I like the idea of the light running on it's own battery in a way, but could I possibly find a softer light that does run on it's own battery? Or is the battery that the VL-3 takes up, not that much, so it wouldn't cut down my filming time by to much?


A fill light helps to reduce contrast and to illuminate shadowy parts of the shot. The VL3 will most certainly NOT do that. In fact, in my experience what it will do is illuminate a face at 4>6 feet and then it drops off after 6 feet - that's my experince. If anything, where it IS working it would create MORE contrast with the shadowy parts still being low or dark. So, in my mind, the VL3 is the opposite to a fill light. One of the "advantages" of the VL3 is that it can be set in AUTO mode so it reduces the i8n-use period to a minimum.

However, you are asking the question that hits all of us at one time or another - "What IS the most appropriate lighting option for my needs?". Now often this is modified by budget. Like with mics - there ain't NO mic for ALL occasions - likewise, lights and usage are also often thought as being capable of doing ALL jobs. They can do MOST jobs but when it comes down to being selective about your lighting to create less grain, more definition and more fill, then the wallet often gets a hit. But sometimes this can be mitigated against with judicious finds on eBay or the like.

After 5 years I found an eBAy 50 Paglight. I got it for almost half price ( I think? ). And this was AFTER buying a piece of Cr$%p of a 20 minute usage piece of nonsense AND a PAglight C6 system. I now have this PAG50w wire to a lead acid battery. It works. It's not even ugly. This is far far cheaper than a battery-belt system - but LithIon, it ain't!

The other thing I keep forgetting to mention is that a fill-light works from the side - mostly 90 degs. IF you are asking about ON-camera lights, then they work, by definition, from the front. I guess what you are asking for, nit unreasonably, is a light that FILLS the scene/frame in front of you. Well, you need watts to do this and THEN you need something that will diffuse those watts DOWN. So, more watts to illuminate/fill and then slap on something that will reduce the overall illumination. Kinda contradictory - huh? If you look at ENG operatives interviewing politicians etc, they have BIG light heads and then diffusing stuff. But the end result is that the FACE of the talent is layered away from the background. Would you call that a fill? But it is illuminating the face nicely. The OTHER must have is a reflector and then someone to hold it. And this you will also see on more leisurely interviews - "Here, at "Buckingham palace" "White House" "UN", where you see the . . . in the background . . " that kinda of thing will sometimes stretch to a bloke/woman holding a reflector.

So, to recap:

a] Research - you are here, good! See what OTHERS on the ENG circuits do too!

b] Pragmatic - know your budget and maybe wait for the "right" thing to come along. It will!

Are you going to make mistakes? - Nah!! Of COURSE you are! Why should you be any different to any of us here? But hopefully you can mitigate against them too. Go see the other lighting forum here on DVINFO and buy Vic Milts "Light It Right!" instead of the VL3.

Cheers,

Grazie

thanks for the input Graham. I did see some more expensive camera lights for the gl2 on ebay, but they seemed.. well.. somewhat large, and perhaps a bit to bright. I know that for the best lighting I can't rely on the on camera light, but for situations in which I otherwise couldn't set up lighting (not that i have a lighting set up yet anyways) I think it would be in my favor to at least have some illumination. Maybe I will put it off for a while until I come across something that seems right for me, i'd just have to be in a situation where I wish I had SOME additional lighting, but I suppose that will kind help me determine what kind of light i will need in the end..

thanks again

Don, I actually have done fairly thorough testing of Lenmars, and found that they in fact deliver what their sticker claims within +/- 5%; this can not be said of the Ebay bought generics. Getting typically 60%-70% of their sticker claim.I'm sure you're right, but since you can get 3 or 4 generics for the same money, you're still getting much more battery life at the same price point. :)

In other words, a battery with 60% capacity that costs 1/4 as much will still give you quite a bit more bang for your buck.

More bang if it meets the minimum requirement for runtime. Having to change batteries mid tape is not always possible for longer form events, or a higher sudden failure rate may not be an acceptable risk for some users.

You pays your money and takes your chances.

Agreed, Don. But I'll add that I've been using generic BP-945's for years, and have run into no more problems with them than I have had with Canon batteries. Also, I have shot numerous multi-hour events with these batteries without having to switch. Worst case, you buy two of them and switch to a fresh one when you switch to your third tape. I have one of these batteries that I have been using almost daily for several years and only very lately has it begun to show signs of holding less of a charge than it used to. I have never heard of anyone having any real issues with cheap batteries for these cameras.

Sure, you can spend more money if you're afraid of a catastrophic failure. You can get Anton Bauers if you want to get super-finicky. Spend the money if you want, but meanwhile I'll be getting the same images as you are and will only have spent a fraction of the money that you did in order to get them. :)

I'm not dissing anyone who wants the added peace of mind, I'm just sharing my experience for the benefit of those who would prefer to spend a little of their money on things other than camera parts every now and then. :)

In sum, everything I have experienced in connection with these cheap batteries suggests that your camera is just as likely (if not more so!) to crap out as the batteries are. Take that for what it's worth; as always, your mileage may vary.

hi all, I've looked to see if there is any reference to these batteries on here, and couldn't find one.

http://www.inov8-memory.co.uk/batteries.php

they seem to have the onboard chip, and everything the originals have -
and do a 945 for £21

http://www.digiprintuk.com

do these take the risk out of buying completerly generic batteries whilst still being cheap and offering decent quality - anyone used them?

guess no ones ever heard of them then - didn't risk the cheapies after I found a hahnel bp945 equivalent on amazon for £28, cant go wrong at that price

guess no ones ever heard of them then - didn't risk the cheapies after I found a hahnel bp945 equivalent on amazon for £28, cant go wrong at that price

When I first got my "Canon" BP945, £98, I looked around and ALSO found the HANEL option from Fotosense: http://www.fotosense.co.uk/

Something like 45 quid, then. When I received it and on closer inspection I noticed that BOTH the Fotosense battery AND the Canon BP945 (at £98!) are in a cover that BOTH have the "Hanel" word logo as part of the plastic-injection black cover! I've never forgotten that!

Can somebody confirm to me if Canon actually have a factory making these batteries? My feelings are that I maybe waiting a long time.

Grazie

I'm not 100% certain, but I believe Canon buys their batteries OEM. They might even buy them from a variety of makers.

In any case l I think the importance of whose name is on the battery largely boils down to where you go for warranty claims or who you sue if it explodes and burns your house down, or leaks prematurely and ruins your camera etc.

In such a case, I'd rather have "Canon" stamped on the battery!

But I don't usually spend the extra $$$ on Canon brand batteries because I don't think these are statistically likely events.

If I get a brand X battery and it seems to work OK for a reasonable period, I'll buy more of them. If not, I'll write it off to the cost of experience.

In such a case, I'd rather have "Canon" stamped on the battery!

This was sold to me by my Canon authorised dealer and service agent; it was in a Canon sealed blister-pack but it had this Hahnel logo on the case!

Grazie

2 yr warranty on the hahnel seems pretty good anyway,

I dont mind paying for quality, but when the same high spec gear is available for a lot less I dont want to pay for a more expensive 'logo' on something.

I'l see how long this battery lasts anyway - just bought a rode videomic so I'll get out and test the thing.

It's impossible anymore to know who actually makes what. Everybody buys from everybody else, particularly in the computer business. Dell sells tape drives, but they don't make any. Some models of IBM's high end disk arrays are IBM designed, others are pieced together from different suppliers. Sometimes IBM and HP buy the same stuff from brand X and change the front bezels and market the same thing under different names. Bug chunks of HP printers are made by a company you've never heard of - because they don't sell under their own brand name but manufacure only as OEM to other companies. Companies like IBM etc buy tape cartridges from companies like Fuji Film and Maxell, re-brand them, and sell them - sometimes for less than the original maker can sell them. It's really common for companies to by some of their products from their competitors and rebrand them. Everybody wants a full product line, but nobody wants the costs of developing a full product line.

The purchasing companies however do test the stuff they buy and audit the manufacturing processes at their suppliers and stand behind the stuff they sell.

I'm a little surprised that Canon wouldn't have a Canon imprint on the battery, but at the price point we're looking at, the cost of a unique mold for the plastic cover might be prohibitive. Molds are very expensive and it isn't uncommon to spend a half million dollars for one - although a mold for something as simple as a battery shell could be pretty cheap. Molds for front bezels for rack mount or even consumer equipment on the other hand are quite costly.

Anyhow if it came in a Canon pack then it's a Canon battery!

I previously used a Keene BP941H Li-ion 4350 mAh 7.2v on my old XM1 camera. This battery will not fit on the XM2. Any reason?

Martin

According the the "Keene Electronics Catalogue 2005" catalog the BP941H should fit the XM2.

I've got the large battery on my GL2,
charged it fully a few days ago but today it showed it was at 1/2 charge.. The unit has NOT been used and is in a controled enviroment and not subjected to cold or heat.
Is it normal for the camera to have a slight draw, even when shut down?

I think this is normal - although it seems quite a bit faster drop than I would expect. If I think of it I'll stick a fully charged battery on the GL2 and leave another fully charged battery alongside it for a week and see if there's much difference.

Generally there seems to be some "leakage" when batteries are mounted - they last longer when separated. Leakage rates vary according to charge state and battery technology.

Anton Bauer has a blurb on their web site that describes a bit about the decay rate for different technologies.

How old is the battery???

Batteries have a limited life span (a few years) and once they start going downhill they start losing their charge rapidly. A dead or shorted cell - which can happen to ANY battery - will also do this.

Rechargeables all self-drain to a certain extent. Nicads are the worst, but lithiums will slowly self-discharge too.

But it may be time for you to just buy another battery and dispose of that one...

I've got two of the large GL-2 batteries and sometimes leave them on the cam for a week with no battery level drop noticeable.

Sumpin ain't right with your battery. Disconnect the battery from the cam and let it sit for a couple days and see if it drops in capacity.

In addition to what has been said already:
I have used a BP-945 battery with my XM2 for 4 years now. Always leaving the battery on the camera. And I have never experienced any significant capacity- or charge drops the way you describe it, Randy.
A slight current draw from the battery when stored is normal and to be expected, but not half the charge in a few days or weeks.

Have you tried to attach the original battery to the camera to see if that one also lose much of it's charge in a few days? If so, it might be something wrong with the camera itself.

Same here, have not noticed any mentionable drain from the BP-945's I use on my GL, which are almost always mounted.

I have put one of our large batteries on the GL2 fully charged and it showed 1/2 right off. I flipped the camera over to Card for stills and it was full. Switched back and it was full on the vid selection. It has happened twice I believe since I have had teh camera. Maybe this will work for you.

Cheers.

I'll order online and don't want to get something which may well turn out to be more or less trash because I have never heard of that particular off brand (i.e. not offical Canon issue) before.

Need an BP-945 equivalent.

Any suggestions as to reliable sources/online e-tailers and "brands" that would qualify for a happy solution?

What do you personally use?

Thanks,
Bruce

I've had acceptable performance using LENMAR batteries. I;e used LIC941 (6000 mAhr rating) and LIC950 (5200 mAhr). But cannot state whether either would give 3-4 hours in a GL2. More important (to me) is getting to the point for a tape change.