I'm trying to record movies direct from my Macbook Pro to a DVD Recorder using the firewire. Do any of you do this for basic SD DVD delivery to clients? If so, please tell me what set-up is working for you. I recently purchased a Sony DVD recorder from wally-world with firewire input, but when attached, it seemed to sap all system resources from FCP and I was unable to play out to it. I've heard that some are capable, not only of recording direct from the NLE but also work as a poor man's break-out box? Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Never been able to make that work, myself. Mostly with Panasonic recorders but also with a Toshiba - no luck.

Hope this helps...

I have read several posts recently about problems exporting to a DVD recorder. I got an early Sony DVD Recorder (RDR-GX7... or something like that?) and made DVD's for a number of years using a firewire connection to my G5 Power Mac. I also used it for monitoring DV by connecting an LCD monitor the the DVD recorder's component output jacks. It all worked great - used it as an uncontrollable device.

So something must have changed in FCP to prevent this from working. I still have the recorder at the office, and it seems to me I had a problem using it there. I use DVD Studio Pro now, so it's been awhile since I've tried.

All I can say is that this definitely did work for me with the old Sony DVD recorder up through FCP 5.0x.

THats exactly what I was hoping to do Boyd, so glad to hear it's possible. Maybe a setting in FCS2 I'm missing? I use DVDSP frequently, but sometimes it's not worth it to go through the painful compression times needed for long projects, for test or preview discs. Don't know if it's this recorder, limits of FCS. If you get a chance to try it, I'd love to hear how it works for you.

OK - Bought a new Sony GX257 recorder with FW input, a 19" flat panel TV, hooked everything up and every time I plug the FW into the DVD it crashes the FW800 external that I have all my footage on! I unplug the firewire from the DVD recorder and my drive returns. Something about the FW bus maybe? I just don't get it! I'm running a MBP 2.2GHz Intel Core 2 Duo with 4GB Ram and OSX 10.5.6. Any help?

That's something I haven't seen before! What happens if you try using the MBP internal drive? I will try to find a chance to hook up my old Sony recorder to my MBP in the office this week since now you've got me curious. But my recollection is that it didn't work the last time I tried. And the last working setup I used was a dual G5 with FCP 5.x. That machine died last year and isn't worth fixing.

Hey Boyd, I haven't tried moving anything over to my internal drive, which has pretty limited space. In fact, having to work off the internal drive would be such a PITA that it would pretty much defeat the purpose of making quicker & easier DVDs. There is clearly some conflict between the MBPro and the Sony recorder. May return this Sony unit and try one more recorder...
I was just trying to do a print to video on my camera, then playing out from my V1u through the A/V out to the DVD Recorder and that looks incredibly BAD on my screen. This is beginning to turn into rocket science with too many factors to consider. Beginning to think it's more trouble than it's worth. I'm pretty sure that if I threw enough $$ at a full editing system, these process would be easy, but my business just won't support a new editing suite complete with breakout boxes, etc. Frustrating.

I use a Phillips DVDR3460H 250 GB hard drive DVD recorder and its firewire functionality is limited to accepting dv streams from compatible camcorders:
Helpful Hints:
– The DV IN socket does not support a
connection to a Personal Computer.
– It is not possible to record from the
recorder to your camcorder via the DV IN
socket on your recorder.

However, a Firestore FS-4HDPRO 60Gb HDD manages to fool the Phillips it into thinking it's connected to a camcorder. The Firestore is the only other device I have got to work with a DVD recorder, and I've tried a few different makes. The only other workaround for me is to print to tape from the mac and then play it back but that's 2x real time (and a bit for rewinding) of course.

[QUOTE=– The DV IN socket does not support a
connection to a Personal Computer.[/QUOTE]
Now if they put that little note on all the recorder's specs, it would save some headaches. It sounds like Boyd and others were able to do this at one time with some version of FCP and some DVD Recorders. I've now been testing or troubleshooting this for 15+ hours with no luck. It does look like I can Print to Video and then take the feed from camera/tape to the Sony DVD recorder, but as you mentioned, that's 2X+ realtime. Might be worth it for longer projects though. Interesting that it works with the Firestore, makes it even more appealing.
Seems like someone should be able to come up with a hack for this so that the a Mac firewire would be recognized as a camera. My DVD-recorder does have a USB port, that I would think could be used to upload a piece of code. Anyone on here a programmer?

Well of course it will look terrible to take a/v out (composite) video from your camera to the DVD recorder! It should work with firewire though (well, mine does anyway). I only suggested using your internal MBP drive for testing purposes (with a short clip). That would take the second firewire device (disk) out of the equation.

I don't understand why the DVD recorder would care if it was connected to a camera vs computer. I had to use mine as a non-controllable device, but that was no problem.

Thanks Boyd, guess I was too frustrated to make that connection. Will try it from the local drive tomorrow without additional firewire attached and see if it makes any difference. I guessed some type of bus problem since it shuts down my external firewire drive whether FCP is open or not so it doesn't appear to be solely and issue with FCP.
I also don't see why it would make a difference whether it's attached to camera vs. recorder. In my mind, a line out is a line out. The terrible AV out performance was when using the camera as a pass through to the monitor. Not so bad direct from camera AV to recorder. I'll try to find a dv-dv (4pin-4pin) firewire cable tomorrow here in podunk, OH and see if that improves the picture. Still would prefer the realtime of coming straight from the NLE. Thanks for all your patience. I'll let you know if I get this resolved.

Research indicates that mine is a common problem with DVD recorders after about 2007. For some reason (probably copyright concerns) none of the newer DVD recorders seem to be able to record direct from FCP's timeline. Other forums indicate a few older recorders that were able to do this including Boyd's Sony RDR-GX7. So, Boyd, if you get a chance to test this with your current FCP version, it would be greatly appreciated. If it works, I will start searching for one on the used market. Thanks, JLee

Boyd, did some searching on the GX7 and found a lot of users begging for a firmware upgrade as they were having trouble with <8x discs. Might that have been the problem you had? http://forum.rpc1.org/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=39788

Why don't you want to use the standard method of exporting via Compressor as an MPEG-2 and muxing it to a dvd using either DVDSP, iDVD, or Toast? Granted its a 2 steps instead of 1 but its not a deal breaker.

Why don't you want to use the standard method of exporting via Compressor as an MPEG-2 and muxing it to a dvd using either DVDSP, iDVD, or Toast?
The biggest issue with that is it's a major time killer on my machine. I recently had a client that wanted 9 hour long presentations burned to DVDs for duplication. You could say I substantially underestimated the time it would take to 1)Export Full Quicktime 2)Compress it to SD MPEG-2 using compressor 3)Mux with DVDSP & 4)Burn with Toast = @ 6-8 hrs. per disc.
I did a 5 min. webbie last week that the client requested a DVD for as well and that 5 min. piece took almost 2.5 hours to complete a disc! Gotta streamline this workflow.

The biggest issue with that is it's a major time killer on my machine. I recently had a client that wanted 9 hour long presentations burned to DVDs for duplication. You could say I substantially underestimated the time it would take to 1)Export Full Quicktime 2)Compress it to SD MPEG-2 using compressor 3)Mux with DVDSP & 4)Burn with Toast = @ 6-8 hrs. per disc.
I did a 5 min. webbie last week that the client requested a DVD for as well and that 5 min. piece took almost 2.5 hours to complete a disc! Gotta streamline this workflow.
Even if you could export it from FCP directly to DVD you would still need to encode it as a MPEG2 and Mux it. That's what takes so long. Btw Compressor encodes faster than FCP because it can utilize multiple cores. You could also export it analog to VHS but that works at real time meaning 9 hrs of footage would take 9 hrs to record.

Your best option is to export as a quicktime to an external hard drive for them to view on a laptop. I don't know what your doing but I can't imagine any client reviewing 9 hrs of footage. Encoding to DVD is not a practical process for lots of footage in a short time. Clients often ask for things that aren't realistic because they don't understand whats involved to create it.

Clients often ask for thinks that aren't realistic because they don't understand whats involved to create it.
There's no doubt about that! I'd be happy to deliver a hard drive any day over making DVDs. The client that wanted 9 hrs of raw footage was duplicating and delivering DVDs of speakers at a conference. But, most of my clients (product demonstrations, web videos, videojournalism & tv commercials) DO request a
DVD to play on standalone players. My last week's webbie plans to show a DVD of the product at a trade show looping in on his TV/DVD combo. My understanding is that it might be possible to get near real time SD recording to DVD through firewire, and since the customer normally wants a DVD and is "always right" that method certainly seems preferable to the Compression/DVDSP dance I've been doing.
But, maybe my workflow does need work. I'm shooting/editing 1080i HDV/ProRes Render-outputting a standalone Quicktime>dropping the full .mov into Compressor for resize & compression, then off to DVDSP where needed. Is there a faster workflow I should be aware of? 2.5 hours to produce a 5 min. DVD sure seems like a lot of time that I have difficulty charging a full rate for. If there's a faster process than the one I listed above, I'd greatly appreciate it and give up on this firewire to recorder idea.

There's no doubt about that! I'd be happy to deliver a hard drive any day over making DVDs. The client that wanted 9 hrs of raw footage was duplicating and delivering DVDs of speakers at a conference. But, most of my clients (product demonstrations, web videos, videojournalism & tv commercials) DO request a
DVD to play on standalone players. My last week's webbie plans to show a DVD of the product at a trade show looping in on his TV/DVD combo. My understanding is that it might be possible to get near real time SD recording to DVD through firewire, and since the customer normally wants a DVD and is "always right" that method certainly seems preferable to the Compression/DVDSP dance I've been doing.
But, maybe my workflow does need work. I'm shooting/editing 1080i HDV/ProRes Render-outputting a standalone Quicktime>dropping the full .mov into Compressor for resize & compression, then off to DVDSP where needed. Is there a faster workflow I should be aware of? 2.5 hours to produce a 5 min. DVD sure seems like a lot of time that I have difficulty charging a full rate for. If there's a faster process than the one I listed above, I'd greatly appreciate it and give up on this firewire to recorder idea.
Its ok for the client to ask for a dvd to review, what you aren't doing right is giving yourself enough time to turn it around and maybe not charging the client enough for a dvd proof. The biggest time eater in your process is down converting HD to SD for DVDs, followed by encoding it. So you have the following options:

1. don't shoot in HD especially if the final output is going to be in SD.

2 if you or the client insists it be shot and edited in HD then you have charge accordingly and spend all that extra time because there is no way around it besides spending thousands on the fastest equipment available which has its limits too. I suggest you call a reputable professional video company that offers HD services and ask them how much to produce a video in HD and dvd proofs with quick turn a rounds.

Some good points Pete. Most of my clients first priority is a 1280X720 H.264 file for HD web sharing, but when they want a DVD, I haven't tried dropping the edit in a SD timeline and coming out of that to compressor. In my mind, I was just keeping the highest quality I could up until final output. I guess I never realized that the bulk of my Compressor time was downsizing to SD.
Unfortunately, I think I'm charging as much as my market will bear for shooting/editing but if I charged a full hourly rate for the time it takes to make these DVDs, my clients would freak! On the other hand, maybe then I could avoid having to make so many DVDs. I did a print to tape (SD) tonight and then out to a DVD standalone recorder and the process was a little under 2.5X realtime including finalization. Sounds like about as good as I can expect to get.
Thanks for your input.

You really need to come up with a better way to package your editing/proofing services. For example if you look at people who do weddings, they are going to have package where they edit the video but that means the client isn't involved in the process. I sometimes have clients who want to make the editing decisions but that is a separate service. They can schedule an appointment at my studio and for $30/hr... You could also bring it to them on laptop. For those requiring a dvd proof I start it going before I go to bed but I don't do HD for the reason you are saying it takes too long for the money they are willing to pay. The encoding process for HD and H264 is so time consuming its difficult produce low budget projects and make it worth your while.

I never had a DVD recorder that was able to take the video directly out of FCP so I always make client copies of the rough footage by running the tape directly into the DVD recorder from the camera or a VTR via the S-Video analog output. The quality is excellent for the purpose. I would also turn on the on-screen timecode for the client's reference and to prevent the client from running off and editing with the DVDs. This is the most efficient use of your time.

You should look into the Elgato Turbo H.264 USB accessory. For $150 it really speeds up the H.264 process and it does an excellent job. Some don't like the fine color quality but I find it great for most jobs.

Thanks William, that sounds like a great workflow for me. I did not know about the Elgato Turbo, but just put it on my shopping list. I'd be interested to know how much faster it encodes 720 H.264 than Compressor and if it delivers a QT .mov file or an .mpeg4?

I never had a DVD recorder that was able to take the video directly out of FCP so I always make client copies of the rough footage by running the tape directly into the DVD recorder from the camera or a VTR via the S-Video analog output. The quality is excellent for the purpose. I would also turn on the on-screen timecode for the client's reference and to prevent the client from running off and editing with the DVDs. This is the most efficient use of your time.
I like your dvd method

OK, maybe I can shed a little light on this.

Hooked up the Sony RDR-GX7 DVD recorder to my Dual 2.4ghz MacBook Pro running MacOSX 10.5.7 and Final Cut Pro 6.0.6. Works like a charm. I did not do any "in depth" testing, but I can play back the FCP timeline and monitor it with an LCD monitor connected to the component output of the DVD recorder. Audio plays back properly from the stereo output of the DVD recorder as well.

It's connected to the MBP via a 6-pin to 4-pin firewire 400 cable. The FCP files are on a 1 TB iomega Ultramax firewire 800 drive connected to the FW 800 outlet on my MPB. No crashes.

So it sounds like the problems you guys are experiencing are probably related to the DVD recorders and not FCP or the computer. I can't make any generalizations beyond this, but can tell you that it all works just the same as it used to on my old G5 with the same recorder and FCP 5.

Thanks for testing that for me Boyd. That confirms what I suspected. It seems few (if any) of the new DVD Recorders allow direct firewire input from computers. Better hold on to the one you've got. In the mean time, I'm going with William's suggestion. Testing that now..

I paid $742 for that baby in 2003! My company ended up buying it from me at that price since it was used almost exclusively for work. So I can still use it at work if needed, but that's not likely. The main reason for its existence these days is dubbing old analog Hi-8 tapes to DVD.

OK, maybe I can shed a little light on this.

Hooked up the Sony RDR-GX7 DVD recorder to my Dual 2.4ghz MacBook Pro running MacOSX 10.5.7 and Final Cut Pro 6.0.6. Works like a charm. I did not do any "in depth" testing, but I can play back the FCP timeline and monitor it with an LCD monitor connected to the component output of the DVD recorder. Audio plays back properly from the stereo output of the DVD recorder as well.

It's connected to the MBP via a 6-pin to 4-pin firewire 400 cable. The FCP files are on a 1 TB iomega Ultramax firewire 800 drive connected to the FW 800 outlet on my MPB. No crashes.

So it sounds like the problems you guys are experiencing are probably related to the DVD recorders and not FCP or the computer. I can't make any generalizations beyond this, but can tell you that it all works just the same as it used to on my old G5 with the same recorder and FCP 5.

Indeed. It has to do with how the FireWire chip in the DVD recorder is programmed. It must put out an identifier code for FCP to recognize it as a recording device. No DVD recorder from Panasonic or JVC have ever put out this identifier (except maybe that $3000 DVD authoring recorder JVC made years ago). I have owned Panasonic DVD recorders from the first model they put out (still works great) to the most recent version. JVC recorders for the past 5 years as well. Apparently Sony programmed their DVD recorders as VTRs for a while but the only Sony DVD recorder I ever owned (broke after a year) didn't. Most DVD recorders are passive input devices except the JVCs that can control DV decks (poorly) by FireWire. Finally, I have no clue about the intricacies of FireWire programming except once as a beta tester for a video capture program I found out that JVC didn't properly write the firmware for the HD100 camera's FireWire chip. It worked but there was no device identifier for the program to know what camera it was hooked up to. Minor issue.

Thanks William, that sounds like a great workflow for me. I did not know about the Elgato Turbo, but just put it on my shopping list. I'd be interested to know how much faster it encodes 720 H.264 than Compressor and if it delivers a QT .mov file or an .mpeg4?

.mp4 that seems to be friendly to most video players, PC or Mac. The device is very fast, real time or faster with HD files! You have to have an Intel Mac although.