Levan, you are right. RealStream is a good think for video people. But the output is just what the input produced. And the input is the sensor from a video camera. It is a very small ccd sensor without film like dof but with video like motion blur. The ARRI D20 and DRAKE is made with cmos sensors from the same manufacter. And both cameras are made for film people with funktion like film cameras. Maybe this is the trick why both make filmlook pictures.

@Juan. The new panavision genesis use a 12,5MP cdd, but with high dynamic range like cmos. I saw a article with this: The first genesis pixelrow use a different gain like the second, and so on... So the first row see the low and the second row the high lights. All together, this trick make a high dynamic range picture, like a cmos sensor.

Maybe the Drake people do it like the Kinetta people. I had a call, 4-5 weeks ago and they told me, they shoot two movies at the same time. One with a 8Bit Drake, the other with a 12Bit Drake. So it must be min. two Drake´s. And they told me, they made tests with altasens and they worked also on a full 35mm dim. cmos version.

35mm film frame size is 22mm x 18.5mm I think somewhere around that and It depends on if it is regular 35mm or super35.

24x18mm aperature for full frame with no soundtrack inframe, if i recall. frame height is 19mm for 4 perf (16frames per foot). 4 perf with soundtrack can vary, but 22x16 and 21x16 are common i believe.

(this is all completely out of my head, and i don't shoot film, so if i'm wrong, it's not my fault ;)

Yes, and also, if you go to www.purposelabs.com you can download some clips, that are also shot with CMOS sensor. Actually, as a whole I don't like footage on this site, but it still has a better look than CCD cameras.

And another arguement is that why would ARRI choose CMOS on their D20, it definately is not because of the price, they chose what is best, I guess.

@Frank, I don't know about DRAKE, what they were planning 4-5 weeks ago, but I wanted to buy a camera and I don't have one. I also think that the DRAKE team has plit up, I don't want to specify why I think so, but this is not my imagination, it is not my business also. They never told me if they were experimenting with 35mm sensors. Well, now that you mention it I recall that they have shown me some footage with CCD sensors on their camera, and again I didn't like it at all, but I have to be honest, it had a wider dynamic range. 8bit version of DRAKE is just not good enough, believe me, I tested it, and It doesn't have enough colors to the picture. Even 12 bit, couldn't capture color as sharp as they were in real, but I liked it anyways because I like the look.

4:4:4 has each colour given its own whole channel in RGB normally while 4:2:2 is YUV and the U and V channel or only half the width of the Y channel.

Rolling shutter is something to be avoided, so if it has global that is better and you really don't need to even think any more about rolling.

On a note about IBIS5, if you check the CFA wavelegthn response you see some bad overlap on green and blue which will cause some difficult colour response.

CMOS and CCD look almost the same.Forget about saying CMOS is more "organic".
The infamous "video look" has nothing to be with that.It is related to the after sensor image processing (border enhancements and some other several things)
A key factor for "film like" quality is called "dynamic range".
Has anyone looked at the images from DVX100 "CCD" miniDV camera from Reel-Stream?
Hm. I've seen various images from the Reel stream and while they look better than images from the normal camera they still have that video sheen to them and not as good as the CMOS chip footage. The main problem is latitude of the 1/3 inch ccd compared to the 2/3 inch CMOS (or even the 1/3 inch in the HC1).

As you said, there are many factors involved, even the fact that Ibis has 100% sensor fill factor compared to normal ccd. Apart from the well capacity, SNR and QE, one of the best bets would be to compare the response curves of the different colours in film to the sensors. This determines much of the look.

I imagine that Obin is going to be using that sanfor?? CCD sensor that what's his name posted to the technical thread a few months ago. The one with industry leading statistics (escapes me at the moment but you would know Juan). Though Ibis also has another large sensor capable of 1080p in it's lupa range.

@Frank, I don't know about DRAKE, what they were planning 4-5 weeks ago, but I wanted to buy a camera and I don't have one. I also think that the DRAKE team has plit up, I don't want to specify why I think so, but this is not my imagination, it is not my business also. They never told me if they were experimenting with 35mm sensors. Well, now that you mention it I recall that they have shown me some footage with CCD sensors on their camera, and again I didn't like it at all, but I have to be honest, it had a wider dynamic range. 8bit version of DRAKE is just not good enough, believe me, I tested it, and It doesn't have enough colors to the picture. Even 12 bit, couldn't capture color as sharp as they were in real, but I liked it anyways because I like the look.
I am curious about this as well, I discuss different things (new cameras) then everything, everywhere, went quiet all of a sudden. Let's hope the calm before the storm. I don't think they have much need to come here, as people here, in general, are looking for below $10K cameras rather than $18K camera.


Keith:

About the colour overlap, I did a post somewhere about it, how a little bit of overlap could be used to register edges/and detail in Bayer footage, and filtered out during saturation enhancement. This would be particularly useful for monochromatic, and complementary, coloured surfaces and low light, and I guess that might have been their intention.

How's your project going?

Also that woman's face looks like hardened clay.

dammit.. so inappropriate.. yet so funny.

Wayne:

I'm sorry to say that I'm under obligations not to reveal details of what I am currently working on or the current status of my project only that things are happening and they are getting really interesting now.


Also never really though about using the colour overlap to any use, always though of it as a hinderance.

I went to Moscow and saw the camera. It is working, and has great picture, and most importantly very good color information. It is 1920X1080 10 bit 4:2:2 with 1" CMOS sensor. You can use any standard film camera lenses on this camera, the configuration I saw in Moscow had some Arri lense on it. It has great DOF. As the developer explained it is true 10bit, he compared his camera to D20, and he said that D20 has higher resolution and 14bit, but he said that it is not true 14bit, it is some mathematical calcuation of 14bit, he said that in future he will also have 14bit. As a recording medium the camera uses flash recorders. Each recorder at this moment is capable of recording 3 minutes of video. This flash recorders are detachable and you can own several of them so that this way you get as many recording minumutes as you want, it is just that the cost of each recorder is 2000. He is also writing some looseless codec and it two month the same recorders will be capable of recording of up to 20 minutes. He said that upgrade will be free, with no additional costs. The standard camera can record all know standard formats, like 24p, 25p, 30i, 60i or whatevere. The maximum speed of the camera in HD is 50fps progressive. The standard cost 18000USD. I decided to purchase the camera and I will have it by the 18th of October, but I customised it, my version will also be able to work in SD and record up to 1000 FPS progressive.

On october the october the 17th, if I remeber it correctly, there will a tennis championship in Moscow, Cup of Kreml, it will be on satellite on air and this camera will be shooting the championshi, specifically some slow motion effects you going to see there.

I liked the DRAKE functions, but the picture quality of the russian one is much, much better.

When I shoot first matterial with this camera I will post the links to the matterial so that you can watch.

btw, any news about DRAKE ?

i m still waiting a official news about avaibility to purchase it...

That is great news Levan! Please keep us updated on how everything goes and definately try to post some pictures of the camera as well as some clips for it. A couple of questions....will it output 4.4.4 RGB? Also what do you think that0 you will be able to edit that kind of footage on? Dual core mac G5 maybe?

..........

@Omar

No, standard version of the camera can not record 4:4:4, but as I was explained the stream is 4:4:4 and if I wanted I could order the special recorder or use any standard recorders with dual link. But at this moment I go with 4:2:2.

About editing, I have G5 dual 2,7, with 4GB ram, Deckling HD pro and Huge Raid. But to tell you the truth, I have problems with editing HD material in real time in Final Cut Pro. I don't understand, why apple keeps advertising that FCP can edit uncompressed 8 or 10 bit 4:2:2 in real time, it is not true, at least not in my case, I am so disapointed. I might have some setting wrong, but I don't know, I think I tried everything and it doesn't do real time.

I will keep you updated about the camera and post pictures.

@Jeremie

Why are you waiting for DRAKE to be on sale? Last news from them was that the camera is not working. Do you know anything else? As I know the team is splited up. I recieved e-mail from them that Marc Oliver is not a part of the team any more, but on the other hand if you go to their web page, the contact info is still on him, and their site has not changed a long time, and they have not replied to so many post in this forum. I don't think that DRAKE is reality any more, unfortunatelly.

I think the sad truth is, that when operations like this get this involved and spend the amount of time and money on it that they have, all else becomes an after thought. Then there is the problems associated with this sort of business, and personal things that happen. Pity I liked these fellas.

I know they were looking at alternative sensors and customisations that cost money, maybe this is the hiccup stopping/holding up the new version of Drake.

But the problem is they are going for the upmarket sector (well down market compared to normal film production) but so many companies are also going for the same market, where it is very expensive to offer the absolute best, to compete with the big guys. The real market is something similarly priced to HDV cameras but greatly out performing them with full film and video feature sets. I feel the cinema emphasis in the forum is "cooking" a lot of projects, in marketing terms. But now the problem is that a HC1 with 35mm lens adaptor and analogue component recording, offers a viable alternative in the low end. So that market is becoming very competitive also.

http://www.ctt.ru/files/images/HD_Optronica_demoframe001.bmp
http://www.ctt.ru/files/images/HD_Optronica_demoframe002.bmp
http://www.ctt.ru/files/images/HD_Optronica_demoframe003.bmp

These are the frames from russian camera, they have uploaded them on their web page. I was there when they did the shots, it was in a office room, without any lighting, just the room light.

What do you think?

Ok, lets presume that Drake is dead ( too bad ), well what are the other alternatives ?
The russian one ?
and ?

for under 20 000 $

Sumix for under $3K (hopefully) which is playing dead from what I can tell, everytime I prod them I get no response.

Wayne, I can't agree about the market. I don't see too many competetion in the market. If you only mean the price range, yes, there are many cameras under $20000, but they are no close to the quality of either DRAKE had or the Russian camera has. Well, at least I don't know of any, even for $50000. Yes, you can say that Drake had less quality in some aspects, but it was very filmlike, and if you are an artist, and you shoot something that must look beautyfull, the HD studio cameras are not going to do any good for you. I don't even see Cinealta or Varicam being an alternative. Maybe only Viper is good, but still, even Viper has video like look. I now am sure that only CMOS and only Single chip is capable of achieving the film look, and it will deveope in future rather than 3CCD. Because the prizm is ruining the picture, I don't know why. So at this moment, the only camera I know that is alternative to DRAKE is this russian one. And Sumix or SI cameras, are not complete systems.

Yeh, but russian camera on the other hand is not so cheap. The camera is 18K and you need flash recorder, with 5 minute capture time it costs 3K, and you need at least 2 of them. Plust to that it uses film lenses, not c-mount, which are more expensive, but I found good lenses, ELITE, they are of a very good quality, I would say one of the best, and they primes cost 5K, so the camera itself is 24K and you need lenses, more expensive ones than drake would use.

Theres always those of us pursuing our own projects. DIY HD <$2000? Maybe.

Theres always those of us pursuing our own projects. DIY HD <$2000? Maybe.

So tell em about those, I am "most" interested.

Wayne, I can't agree about the market. I don't see too many competetion in the market. If you only mean the price range, yes, there are many cameras under $20000, but they are no close to the quality of either DRAKE had or the Russian camera has.

There is a new cheap Viper, there maybe upto 5 different sub $20K and $10K camera projects I have heard of. Quality, I expect most will FF, Micron ,or Altasens quality, which many will like. Incomplete or complete, to a certain extent it doesn't matter if you know what you are doing. Some high speed ones also dropped by in the threads. The problem is we don't see much of them, but they are out there attempting to break through.

Micron have released new models with increased quality and reduced costs, even there new mobile phone versions are probably good enough. They maybe worth a look at, particularly for the low end.

wayne,
I'll go into more detail if have some success. Most people dont seem that interested in the cheaper options like I am, and people havent been very interested in my project when i posted in the past. So I will wait to give details when/if I have more to show. I'm still only in the dump-money-i-dont-have-into-camera-parts and try-to-start-coding-an-interface-without-all-the-equipment-yet phases. You know how it goes.

It's kind of sad how much the DIY HD talk has died down in these forums. I could sure go for some more.

It's kind of sad how much the DIY HD talk has died down in these forums. I could sure go for some more.

I think part of the reason for that, is the new affordable HD cameras coming to market.

I got some new infos about DRAKE and also the russian camera.

The russian camera ist not was Levan said. The sensor is not a 35mm size sensor and not a 1" size, it is just a 2/3". In fact it is the same sensor size like DRAKE use. Yes, it is possible to use cine lenses, but then there is only a "zoom effect" and not the same dof or fov. High speed works only in very low resolution. 14bit in the future is only when the manufactor will produced those sensor. All together, it seems they use the altasens sensor.

I had also a long call with the DRAKE team. They have 3 working cameras. A 720p 8Bit, a 720p 12Bit booth with 2/3" IBIS and, thats new, a 1080p 12Bit with 2/3" altasens. There is one big movie finish, shoot with the 8Bit drake and works on a second big movie, shoot with the 720p 12Bit, gos on. They can also mount all cine lenses (with adapters), but they said there is no reason, because they got mutch more dof and fov with high speed cmount lenses.

But they will sell this cameras only after received all patend rights.

But yes, it also looks like the team split off.

Yes, it is possible to use cine lenses, but then there is only a "zoom effect" and not the same dof or fov.

Actually the DOF will be the same, but, as you say, not the FOV due to the zoom effect. The zoom just means you are taking the image and cropping out portion from the center of it. Same image, same DOF, just cropped as if it were zoomed in. It is not a real zoom.

wayne,
I'll go into more detail if have some success. Most people dont seem that interested in the cheaper options like I am, and people havent been very interested in my project when i posted in the past. So I will wait to give details when/if I have more to show. I'm still only in the dump-money-i-dont-have-into-camera-parts and try-to-start-coding-an-interface-without-all-the-equipment-yet phases. You know how it goes.

It's kind of sad how much the DIY HD talk has died down in these forums. I could sure go for some more.

Well I'm interested. The reason I think people are uninterested is because things have gone on for so long without product (except for the separate commercial Drake product that, unfortunately, people can't buy yet, and patents can take so long to finalise, what are they doing, the US allows production with patent pending). Also certain people have taken the initative but been unable to deliver, unfortunately, and they have been commercial initiatives and the focus then concentrated on them, leaving people like you with no interest or support.

I asked some time ago about the cheapest camera for IBIS, Micron (I mean there must be something out there this side of $500) but nobody seemed interested, and the cheapest project option just seems to go up.

I have seen security cameras for a cheap price (with less than 0.1 lux) that might be an option pixel shifted on a 3 chip prism to make 720p (look at the Imperex thread, Nick Hockings is looking at making his own HD three chip and has found a source for prisms). I actually saw a camera and monitor for sale at around $76 US, and I was surprised at the quality of the monitor, but I am sure the camera was doing pretty good to, it makes me wonder, exactly how expensive do you have to go when cheap SD product that can be pixel shifted for HD, is this good. Quiet frankly, all Panasonic has to do is make a 4:4:4 gs-120 with a new pixel-shifted Mini-DV HD mode (I've done the calculations, quiet reasonable compression). I have thought of making a prism in times pass using liquid optical grade oil or water in the prism. I have also considered firewire cameras (the normal ones you use on your PC),programming digital cameras to do it, and lately a guy started up a new thread claiming to have discovered Mini DV cameras with still modes that output the current image displayed between snaps. But realistically I have more stuff than most people could shake a stick at mounting up here, and am unlikely to get to do it. If you want to communicate with me directly about it your welcome to, just let me know.

If you want cheap there was an article I posted on the home made cinema camera technical thread that mentions cheap cmos images with complete DSP circuits and USB output (and Micron has just released advanced version of theirs).

But yes, it also looks like the team split off.
I am sorry for the separate reply Frank, but who split off, I have been unable to raise Rai for quiet a while?

Thanks

Wayne.

@FRANK

Where is that info about russian camera from? It is definetely no 2/3, it is 1inch, and I never said it was 35mm. And it uses cine lenses, actually I myself saw Arri lense on the camera, and pictures that I posted linkes to are taken with the ARRI lense. It has great DOF, and yes it does crop, because the sensor is not enough, actually what it does is that you have to recount the lense size, like for example when you what 50mm lense, you need to use 40mm lense and it will be like 50mm on 35mm film. High speed version, is not standard option, and they make one for me, I pay additional 40K for high speed option, but the standard HD camera cost 18K.

Now about DRAKE, it is great if drake is still alive, but I don't know why they don't respond. It is for sure that they split off. Whom did you contact? I really want to contact them.

@Levan, what do you mean? 1inch ? Is this the optical sensor area size? I have a russian friend, he have more details, so i am shure it is the chip size. And there are no information on the web size regarding the exact optical area size in mm x mm. But this is a very importend detail. Also the exact bayer pixels size and resolution. And what will be the real resolution at what high speed ? All in progressiv mode. If you have details, please let us know.
But the pictures i saw shows no great dof and i can see debayer colors errors. All this show me, it must be a sensor like the altasens 356x.

In two weeks i will meet the Drake team. Than i hope, i see Drake and i will know more details.

wayne

I'm not totally sure think 3chip is the direction to go in for homemade cameras, but for those trying it, im impressed. I mean pixel shifting low res sensors leaves you at about the same color information as bayer only now you have it split into 3 channels that have to be reconstructed (granted bayer is no walk in the park either but i think most camera APIs or software packages will handle it without you having to do too much work) and you're limited to lenses f1.6 or more (occasionally f1.4) intended for prisms. f1.0 and faster lenses help out when it comes to low light and shallow dof, the drake guys had a good point with that. I tend avoid having to work on the sensor/optics level, positioning prisms/sensors and building precision housings and building camera interfaces from scratch are things i wouldnt try on my own. the gs series 3chip cameras tend to have quite a bit of chromatic abberation in high-res pixel shifted still photo mode, so imagine how hard it must be to avoid such abberations when pixel shifting on your own.

I'm glad there are still some people working on projects, although i admit im a little amazed anyone who has the money for $20,000 cameras would go with a "homemade" product, but then i dont necessarily think i have a great understanding of the high-end camcorder market. Not that Drake looked that homemade... the new russian camera though...


michael

yeah that may be true, but im not sure id call them affordable. maybe "more affordable than previous way-overpriced HD camcorders" is a better term. how affordable is $6000+ if you can make a more flexible version for half the price? There is still hope for DIY HD. Who wants to shoot on $250/gb media when there is $0.50/gb media? and i cant imagine aquisition with 20x GOP compression on an old codec is for everyone either.

Noah, I think one of the Pana GS models uses 1/3 rd pixel shift to get it's highest native resolution, which is extreme (upscaled modes above this would be worse and the 4:1:1, 4:2:0 colour not so good) but I see with the right software routine you should be able to nearly completely correct chroma/resolution much better than Bayer per file size, due to the predictability of images. But trying to correct chroma abbreviations from cheap prisms might be tougher. I think pixel shift is great for really cheap cameras, for when Foveon X3 ever becomes available in the segment (no prism, F1.0). Most of the work in doing the 3 chip prism is figuring out a cheap procedure to do it in the first place after wards it should be much easier for others to copy. I have my own ideas for a cheap alternative to prisms to. With a security feed I would look at collecting 3 video feeds into a security capture card and recording uncompressed or low compression (this is the hard part, I imagine there isn't a card that can do this and an expensive card would need to be sued instead).

@Frank

camera is CMOS 21mm diagonal sensor, 4/5" (technology limitations...)
So, it have some 20% zoom effect with 35 mm lens, and about 30% on HD1920x1080 picture. next chip will be real 35mm. I don't know what sensor it is, they told me it is the same sensor as in D20, but smaller one.

Please let me know when you meet with DRAKE team.

Here is the link you can download a shot with russian camera. It is in fast mode, in SD ucompressed raw image, no color correction. Tomorrow I will do some color correction to it and upload one with color correction and in normal speed also.

Waiting for your comment.

www.ctt.ru/files/demo/fast_dog.rar

Thanks for the upload Levan. It looks good. Did you get a chance to do any color correction yet? What is the frame rate on this shot? Can't wait to see what hd looks like on this. Any chance that you can post a 720p image? Is it the altsens chip in this camera?

I think it is 250fps. I don't know what chip it uses, but I don't thinks it is altasens, since this camera has 1' chip and I don't know if altasens has 1' sensor at all. on 24th of this month I will have this camera (I purchased one) and I will shoot 3 TV ads. Untill now I am shooting usually on 35mm and I hope to get results very close to 35mm. I will post finished TV commercials in HD format 1080p when I am finished, I will also post some shots I will make with it.

Unfotunatelly I couldn't do any color correction, since I am sitting with high fever at home :*(, but tomorrow I will go to studio and do some grading on Final Touch, and hope to achieve some nice results.

normally I never do this,
posting a link in different threats
but I guess it could kill cameralink
Imaging a camerahead some FGPA with embedded Linux
up to 4 firewire voila
http://heroinewarrior.com/firehose.php3

Well Kinetta is mostly working on His camera for his need, it is Altasens and a fine piece of art. Drake there are no news, they are in a price league where they need real marketing forces , chanels and skills, wondering if they have them, being technically top is another cup of tea, sadly.

The russian camera is in a price range... same story.
Sumix no news ever sadly.
Realstream not bad and with a mini 35 look a like even better, I do guess.

A lot off HD consumer cams are arriving, all with shortcommings, recording media, imager size, compression only to name few plus low light short commings, optics etc.

What do we need.

All we know worked with 35 mm and S16 we do not need all the menues, and buttons to be found today, a variable speedrange like Kinetta is not bad and has been on 35mm and 16 as well. Standart Optics and for the dammed Film look, either some mini 35 or to accept that a total different technique has it's own look.

How can we make Sumix speak ??
And it has to be to disk, as disk-array, like kineta is doing, is cheap
and can be a mechanical take away cartridge, no download time with a laptop running some editing package, instant picture!!

Could be the digital S16 for a lot of people and if it does 1080i ok!!

Levan, I can't wait to see the HD clips. You are editing on a dual g5 right? Have you found a way to optimize it to handle 1080p raw footage? How good does it handle editing HD? Hope your comercial shoots go well. Get well.

Ronald, firehose sounds interesting....is this a software solution that allows you to tie together multiple connections to transfer the different parts of the same information? Would one set it up with multiple firewire conections coming off the same camera say? Sorry for the ignorance, I am still learning the intracasies of the type of specialized computer knowledge we need to make projects like these happen.

thanks,
Omar

Omar,

Yes I am on dual G5 2,7, with XT800 and deckling HD pro, and HUGE system raid capable of speed 210+. And you know what? Final Cut is not good at all with uncompressed 10 bit 4:2:2 1080p. Not at all. It need render all the time, and I am so unhappy with that. Well, Final Cut itself is a great tool, but they advertise everywhere that it is capable of Real Time uncompressed HD, but it is NOT. So I am working with it anyways, because all my jobs are on film and most of them are finally trasfered back to film, so I have no other option, I have to wait to render, it doesn't take a long time to render either, but it is that why the hell they advertise like that. And when I call them they tell me it should. That is funny.

Since you asked, do you have similar problem?

@Levan
Actually I do not have my set up yet. I have been doing a lot of reading and was on the verge of buying a dual g5 2.7ghz system, however after some research it seem that the amd dual opteron pc is maybe the better way to go. You can drop twice the ram (16gb) and in a head to head test with the dual g5 2.7 running aftereffects for various types or rendering it came out ahead or equal in almost every task. I am bummed out. I have been a long time pc user and have always run into problems over the years with them. My cousin is an audio engineer and has sold me on the idea of using a mac for my next project, as they are never seem to have the same problems and errors, viruses, etc. that pc does....but now with what I have read and with you have said I am not so sure about mac. I wonder what others have experienced with them on this board? Anyhow good luck with the commercial shoots and I cant wait to see some of the 1080p footage!

@ Frank
have you met with the Drake team yet? How did it go, do they have a working 1080p camera yet....ready to sell?

I would beg you to wait until Wednesday 19 October. I'm not saying you should buy mac, but when quad G5 is released, perhaps the math changes.

I'm not saying they will be released, I just read the news and know there's a big press conference "to unveil Apple's latest pro innovations" coming wednesday at the PhotoPlus Expo in NYC.

Ok. I admit! I am still very happy with my dual 2.5... There. Now you now it.

How can we make Sumix speak ??

Does anybody have their direct number to the group inside Sumix (Hungary I think) to ring. I don't normally don't do this, I prefer to leave them alone to get on with the work, but I think this is just too ridiculous. Something is wrong, it doesn't normally take that long to get a basic system out. Even if they are waiting for the Altasens to reach full production they could have used the system with the IBIS/Micron cameras in the meantime.

That Opteron motherboard looks nice, Multiple Gige, PCI-E and Express card (for future DX10 GPU processing cards). Now all it needs is, MacOSX, and firewire B or C.

Finally, cheap progressive HD alternative to HD1!

I have just found this link to the next hard drive based JVC Everio HD camera in the news section. The quick and the dead, how do these sort of releases effect peoples decisions on the cameras here, presuming it comes with uncompressed component out? Maybe we can expect more cameras from other manufacturers soon.

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.avmagazine.it%2Fnews%2Fvideocamere%2F430.html&langpair=it%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=%2Flanguage_tools

http://www.linuxdevices.com/articles/AT3888835064.html

and 1280 x 1024 @ 30fps
could be cheap pumps out on Ethernet

Yes, sure.Problem is Filippov doesn't want to give support to this kind of project.
I asked him many times, but his replies were short.He even says it is not possible to shoot using his cameras...

I'll pay that Ronald.

Good price. Originally I was skeptical about the camera, but I mistook which codec it had. I'd still prefer Gige for obvious reasons.

So what can you tell us about video editing, capture, quality (culling detail etc) any bayer mode, or 4:2:2, 4:4:4? Any IBIS/Altasens planned. He was planning on doing something suitable here.


Juan,

I'm interest in what you said. Why did Filippov say that it wasn't suitable, does the low bit rate codec cull too much detail, or is capture software a problem?


Have another observation, sometime ago I posted and article about an new integrated Mpixel camera chip with DSP, compression and USB output on the technical thread. Something like this would be a cheap option to build a camera around.

i am really really looking forward to the Russian camera, I have been shooting with the CineSpeedCAM the last few days, it shoots 1000fps, and it's inch format cmos has GREAT DOF!

Now, this is 1080p, it is shot thru widnow, I asked them to do so, because I wanted to evaluate how the motion in real speed (not high speed) looked like. See for yourself.

www.ctt.ru/files/demo/monorels.rar

and please your opions :*)

For last two days I was busy shooting with Photron high speed camera, I shot the commercial, it also had 1' sensor, and it did such a great job, when I finalize the post production and the camera is I will post a link to it. Some shots I was shooting with 4000fps, it is amazing what you get, I would love to have camera like that, but I had to hire it from London and it was expensive to rent.

But, after all this I can say for sure now, that CMOS technology is much film like than CCD, I have no idea why, I don't know the logics behind, and I am not a technicaian to know how it works, but I am judging from the end result. CMOS with the cine lenses are so artistic looking, and it carries all the emotion and feeling, and it is the same with all the CMOS cameras I know.

thanks for the info, I am downloading now your file. What is the status of the RUssian camera?