Hello.

My XL2 came today, she's a beauty. I think I'll call it Mika. Lighter than I was expecting too.

Anyways with my excitement over (until I begin playing with it) I was hoping you could all recommend me stuff to get next for it. I've seen the top five essentials so they're noted.

I want to look at best tapes to use for it, most popular (yawn I know its been discussed to death) and also some lense protection/filters. Is the battery supplied really good etc?

Actually I think it would be a great idea for someone to start a sticky thread with all this stuff listed, so repeated threads don't occur and annoy everyone.

Thanks for the help so far.

Kev

As for my Top Five list that you've read, strike the VL-3 light and replace with the TA-100 tripod adapter. In fact make that the number-one priority on your list! It's a "must have" in my book.

actually i need a tripod, a good one but cheap. i really cannot afford a pricey one. this adaptor is just for easy dismounting right? a light would still be useful - top 6? no make a top 10 :D

Well you've bought a $5,000 camera and as I've recommended elsewhere on this board, you really should have a $1,500 tripod underneath it. You really don't want to compromise this. Maybe put it on the credit card, heh. But with a "cheap" tripod you're really cheating yourself and it's really going to work against you in a big way. In my opinion you should forget about the top five accessories or top ten or whatever, and instead throw those dollars towards the best tripod you can afford, and the TA-100 tripod adapter. The adapter is a neccessity in my opinion, not so much for ease of use but primarily for stability and safety. You don't want a $5,000 camera hanging from a single little quarter-twenty thread socket. The XL2 is way too heavy for that. In my opinion (geez I'm full of opions huh) Canon should have included that TA-100 adapter with every camera they make, even if it meant bumping the price up another $100.

Sorry about dollars vs. pounds there Kevin, you'll have to do the conversions -- as a Texan I know very little about currency of any sort. Our currency around here is measured in heads (of cattle) and bales (of hay).

It cost me £3,400. I have 9 months to pay the rest. I will think about the tripod. how much is the TA adaptor?

<<<-- Originally posted by Kevin Gilvear : It cost me £3,400. I have 9 months to pay the rest. I will think about the tripod. how much is the TA adaptor? -->>>

I got the ta-100 adapter for $149 at BH photo. I thought it was overpriced until I got it. Holy Shnikeys!!! It is a serious bugger! Heavy and solid steel construction. I don't regret it for a second!

Plus if you leave it on tthe bottom of the XL2 it really balances out the weight....but it blocks the shoulder pad so it's a trade off.

I cannot reccomend it enough.

Having had a little play with the camcorder tonight (sans tape) I did notice it becoming considerably heavy. I shall definetly look into purchasing the adaptor and tripod. Might be best if I purchase extra items overseas, they seem to be cheaper unless I'm wrong.

Can anyone recommend me a nice tripod then for this thing?

So being in the UK I need good tapes. Canon do their own right. recommended? Shorter length the better?

<<<-- Originally posted by Kevin Gilvear : Having had a little play with the camcorder tonight (sans tape) I did notice it becoming considerably heavy. I shall definetly look into purchasing the adaptor and tripod. Might be best if I purchase extra items overseas, they seem to be cheaper unless I'm wrong.

Can anyone recommend me a nice tripod then for this thing?

So being in the UK I need good tapes. Canon do their own right. recommended? Shorter length the better? -->>>

I don't think Canon manufacturers any tapes. I have great luck with Panasonic MQ or PQ tapes. I steer away from the 83 minutes because of cost and because of rumors that the thinner tape used in them can cause more dropouts or tape eatage. Haven't experienced it myself but have heard of it.

I avoid Sony tapes like the plague. Had horrible dropouts and issues with them in my XL1 and haven't touched one in over 4 years now.

Thanks Marty. I'll try panasonic tapes for my first test then.

sorry if this has been gone over already but why do you need an adaptor? i have one of those bogen tripods there are already a few different sized bolts on it.

<<<-- Originally posted by Chris Hurd : Well you've bought a $5,000 camera and as I've recommended elsewhere on this board, you really should have a $1,500 tripod underneath it.-->>>

Well I agree in essence, but not with those figures. I have a very nice heavy duty 3036 Bogen Manfrotto tripod with a 3038 ball head that I got a while back for $250 on eBay (although it was used, so might want to double that amount for a new one).

Both are rated for a max load of 26lbs and they are quite stable. The ball head has an all metal quick-release plate with a double lock system and I swear I could probably hang myself with this thing without it braking or getting loose.

But yes, a proper tripod is a must indeed, one that can sustain heavy loads.

Does this look like a good tape?

63 min Panasonic AY-DVM63 Professional Mini-DV Tape

http://www.apdigitalshop.co.uk/acatalog/Mini_DV___DVCAM.html

I can't find MQ ones. Is there a large difference between the two?

I think the MQs are supposed to be Panasonic's top of the line, just above the PQs. I bought 10 of them based on high recommendations from various sellers, including Brian at Zotz digital, but I couldn't say why choose the MQs over the PQs really. I figure they might have a smaller amount of drop-outs. But why? Beats me... PQs and MQs don't use oil-based lubricants though, which is a good thing, I know that much.

Thanks. Does anyone know of a good online UK retailer that sells Panasonic MQ tapes? I'm having no luck. I've tried ebay too

Don't the standard everyday Panasonic tapes use a dry tape as well? Or did I hear incorrectly?

ok i found the tapes and need to know something, sorry for the hassle.

what does it mean when it says cassettes chipped or not chipped?

also what is the difference between the panasonic DVM60 and panasonic DVM63? just three minutes?

<<<-- Originally posted by Kevin Gilvear : ok i found the tapes and need to know something, sorry for the hassle.

what does it mean when it says cassettes chipped or not chipped?

also what is the difference between the panasonic DVM60 and panasonic DVM63? just three minutes? -->>>

traditionally chipped meant there was a small IC chip inside the cassette that recorded information on it pertaining to start/stop and other info on the tape. I have personally only ever seen this on Sony tapes and not for 5+ years now. I guess if you have the right equipment it might be usefull but I have never used it.

The other question I can't answer. I have never seen or heard of a Panasonic PQ or MQ tape other than 63 and 83 minutes. That doesn't mean they don't exist but I'd make sure before you buy them.

PQs are totally fine, I've never had a problem with them and we've used them for a few years now for broadcast when we go DV.

As for tripod, I've just got a Vinten Vision 3 system for the XL2 and couldn't recommend it enough - I'd say it's the least you should go for. Bit steep at a grand (£!) but it'll probably outlast the camera to be honest.

I'll second that Gary
I bought a 2nd hand vinten vision 3 off ebay (yes a little risky, but I went for the plunge!)
It's in great condition, and it's a great tripod!
I have used the sachtler dv 4 and the vinten pro 5, and it wipes the floor with both of these, seriously!
The head is very smooth, like butter (melted butter, mixed with the nicest smoothie you can find!)

www.creativevideo.co.uk do a good (ish) deal on a new vinten vision 3. I'd definately get the 2 stage legs, as it gives you lower and higher height extremes.

Tapes, panasinic MQ series, I do beleive this is one of the cheapest you will find in the UK

http://www.kvjfairdeal.com/

go to Camcorder -> DVM -> Panasonic in the menu to find them. I have only bought form this company form their shop in Aldgate East, London, but their online prices are slightly cheaper. You will not find cheaper than that price really for that tape!

Hope this helps
Lawrence

that's great everyone, thanks.

From fairdeal site:

DVM 60 EK Mini DV 60min

or

DVM 63 Pro Professional DV

?

the latter is twice as much, still a good price so I'm assuming it is better?

The tripod I'll have to save for for a little while.
I need a carry case too but the aluminium one is too expensive really. Any other good bags?

The 63 minute panasonic one is the tape

It is also the one that everyone refers to as the Master series tape

I know it is a bit more than the cheapest, I just had that problem too.

The company I shoot with my camera for the most uses these tapes, so I now have to start using them as my general camera tapes (don't want to mix tapes in my new XL2!)

I used to have to only spend around £18 on 10 tapes, I just bought 10 Pana MQ tapes today, and it cost me £34.50!

Arrghhhhhh, it's like buying an expensive car and thinking it will be cheap to run!

Lawrence

thanks Lawrence. Why should you never mix tapes then?

I will buy a few of the DVM 63 then.

LOL
Checkout the LONG BLACK LINE Forum topic, and you will find endless discussions about this exact topic.

If you mix tapes you run the risk of fluid from different tapes dirtying your heads. Continous cleaning of heads is abrasive and can permanently damage them!

Read more form the dedicated forum!

Lawrence

thanks, just had a good read. I'll stick with the panasonic ones I plan on getting and hope they work fine.

After paying so much money for such a fantastic machine I decided to immediatley get a Manfrotto tripod with the 516 head, the EF Adapter witch will allow me to connect any EF lens to the camcorder, the ZR-1000 remote control which connects to the handle of the tripod and last, but not least, the 3x XL wide angle lens which is fantastic indoors and also for landscapes, etc.

I mean - why did you spend so much money if you do not want to utilise the camcorder to it's full potential.

Whenever my bank manager agrees I am going to get the TA-100 tripod adapter, the FU-1000 monochrome Viewfinder and the MA-300 microphone adapter.

Great machine!!

If ya got the money then by all means :)

I asked about these monitors not too long ago. I still think I want to go with the top one, nothing fancy but just good enough to get the job done. It is pretty cool I can stick it on a tripod once I get one, but would it also be easy to use away from the tripod?

http://www.b-hague.co.uk/Monitors%20&%20Btackets.htm

I'm really not looking at anything else above this price range for monitors - that is not an option at this point. I don't want to max out any cards if it can be helped, instead get everythign I can just afford that will produce good results. I currently have my xl2 ona 9 month interest free payment scheme so I have to bear in mind I have to pay that off withing said time.

Now, I am looking for a tripod and carry case and found this. First of all should I get this? The price is good but how is the tripod quality? Are those legs adjustable? It also has filters and cleaning kit which I'll need too. These would all work with a PAL camera I presume so is it worth it?

http://focuscamera.com/prods/964594358.asp

Any alternative suggestions would be great. Yes I have read the importance of buying an expensive tripod but I'm just not sure if I'll be able to.

Noooooo!

Don't get it

Read this

DON'T GET IT

You can see this tripod is no good! It has a flimsy tiny head

If you can't spend too much, buy one thing at a time, and wait until you can afford something else!

You will kick yourself otherwise!

My philosophy is buy the best, and if you can't afford it without selling your soul, wait until you can. Then you have the best, and it will be the best for some time and you will never regret it. Also the best stuff has a better resale value!

If I had bought a cheap tripod ($300) then it would have got me going, but it would have annoyed me and I would forever have been thinking I wish I had got the better tripod. Now I have the Vinten Vision 3 tripod, and I don't need any other tripod! In 5 years when the XL4 comes out, it will still work with this tripod. It will work with whatever MiniDV camera comes out and it will work well. Any camera that we will use that comes out will not be too heavy for this tripod!

Invest, and you will reap the rewards!!!

Don't handicap yourself before you even start the race!

It is THE second most important thing to invest in after a good camera. With these 2 things at least you can go out and shoot stuff without the need for anything else (from a bare minimum point of view). If you don't have a filter, alter the colour in post, if you don't have a wide angle lens, walk the camera backwards, if you don't have a microphone, you can just about get away with onboard sound. If you don't have a smooth pan/tilt from a good tripod how are you ever, EVER going to fix it?

Lawrence

Also

I just bought the pro jib arm from B-Hague

It is great, they are great.

I also bought the Monitor mount to attach it to the jib arm. It's one solid (heavy) lump of metal that is well engineered.

I will eventually buy the tripod mount too, but I have had a bit of a spending frenzy in the last 2 months, and I need to calm down, otherwise I'll have to sell my body!

I'm getting sweaty just thinking how much less money I have in my bank. I need to sell my old xl1s kit urgently!

Lawrence

Alright thanks. Looks like a tripod will be last minute buy though, see how the saving goes.

As for filters you are right, i was gonna do all the colour stuff in post anyway. But what about something to protect my lense during shoots?

How about a bag then? Any good places to get a reasonably priced one?

As for wide angle lense etc. I wont be buying any other lenses. Just gonna stick with what I have, it'll shoot 16x9 which is great and i shouldnt have any problems there with shots I'd imagine.

Oh and should I get a cover for the eye piece? I hear you get a bit sweaty using them.

Sorry for all the questions but this has all been really helpful

THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT

Immediately you get a video camera, immediately get the filter thread size and immediately put on a UV filter. Period. Immediately. It doesn't colour your picture, and it protects the lens. NEVER TAKE IT OFF

A $40/£30 filter on the end of the lens is cheaper to replace than a scratched lens, which costs over $1000/£800!!!!

THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT

I don't agree with that. I never used a clear filter in my life when using much more expensive cine lenses. Be aware that any filter can degrade the image (ie. loss of sharpness) and increases the chances to get light distortion (flares).

If you're using the sunshade or a matte box, there's no reason to scratch a lens. It's not that easy to scratch. You really have to abuse it.

I myself only use filters when they're absolutely necessary (like a special effect or when doing run and gun stuff in an uncontrolled environment with dust and lots of hazards). Otherwise, the front of my lens remains bare naked. It has a cap for transport.

There's two way to look at it. You can figure a $50 filter is a cheap way to protect a $2000 lens, or you can figure a cheap $50 filter is a way to potentially degrade the nice image of your $2000 lens. I choose the latter. Unless you're extremely clumsy, I don't think a clear filter is necessary. Nothing more than a marketing gimmick (those photo stores must be doing a lot of profit on those filters).

On the whole I follow the same guidelines as David. The circumstances under which I would use a clear filter for digital would be the same as with film production, which is when there is potential hazard to the front surface of the lens in a given shot. This would include: water or other liquids being splashed around (cover camera with plastic as well as use clear filter), things being thrown at or near the camera, etc. Common sense dictates a lot of this. I have on several occasions destroyed clear filters that were being used for these sorts of safety reasons; would hate to see what would have happened to the front element if they weren't in use.

Having had a bad experience with a UV filter that reflected the lens back upon itself if the light was right I tend to steer away from them. I was filming a RB singer walking down the city sidewalk. He was walking at the camera as I walked backwards with a cheapo steadicam clone. The shot seemed ok. However upon review in the studio later it turns out that at certain moments the sunlight would sneak in past the hood and illuminate the actual last element of the lens. The UV filter reflected it back into itself and the shot was ruined.

I assumed this was just a cheap UV filter. So what would I buy to replace this? A good qulaity unit that will not reflect upon itself?

Thanks

Based on the last couple of posts, I bet you could predict what David and I would recommend; just lose the filter!! Also, using an eyebrow or french flag is important in backlit situations (lens hoods don't do much for this sort of thing) to keep the sun from flaring.

Thanks fellas that is really helpful. I was only going to shoot in dry conditions, there will be sunny days and I was going to stick the lense hood that comes supplied on the end but the shots will be very controlled so I'll be avoiding any direct sunlight shots for example. maybe i can use a cover or something too, like suggested.

In the event of unavoidable lens flare where the standard lens hood cannot perform as desired, you can always get yourself some black cinefoil, or black foam core to ACT as a french flag or matte box. Very low cost, and very efficient.

how do you apply the cinefoil to cam?

Is the HC-3200 system case the only one available for the XL2? Its the only one I can find and a really pricey one at that. Surely there are cheaper ones that can protect the cam?

<<<-- Originally posted by Kevin Gilvear : Is the HC-3200 system case the only one available for the XL2? Its the only one I can find and a really pricey one at that. Surely there are cheaper ones that can protect the cam? -->>>

I can't comment on hard cases but as far as bags I really like the Tamrac one (2249). I tried the Kata CCC-10 but hated it. The camera barely fit and I had to close the viewfinder every time. And there was no room for accessories. Plus the strap was really short! Just my opinion but when I sling it over my shoulder I don't like the camera bag in my armpit!

The tamrac works great. I highly reccomend it. Unless you need a hard shell case. Then I have no info.
Sorry!

thanks. That bag seems like you need to pack the cam with all bits attatched. is that right? Is there room to put the lense, viewfinder and accessories elsewhere?

Kevin, You can find hard cases ranging from $50 to $500. It depends what you want to put in your case aside from the XL2 and one lens.

I myself bought a nice and big all aluminum and lockable Zero Halliburton 129c. It's not cheap at about $350 US but since I'll be carrying close to $9000 in equipment with that case, I figured it was worth it. It's a really big 29"x20"x10" case which will allow me to fit My XL2, the 20x lens, the 14x lens, a WA adapter, the 2x CRT viewfinder magnifier, 4 batteries, the LCD viewfinder, the CRT viewfinder, a home made matte box, the 2 lens hoods for both lenses, a director's viewfinder, the remote control and the charger.

If you need the size but can't afford an Halliburton, I recommend the Pelican 1650, which will cost around $150, can be locked with a locker and has waterproof anti-shock sidinds with foams inside.

If you do not plan to carry that much equipment in one case, any hard case will do, have a look on eBay, with Vanguard cases starting at $60 to smaller Halliburton's at around $200.

No matter what you choose, I recommend doing a little planing first. Measure all your gear precisely and try different fitting combinaisons either in Photoshop or on a sheet of paper to see if it will all fit in. You wouldn't want to shell $200 on a case only to find out there's not quite enough room in it for all your gear.

thanks david. I'll have a look around. Really it'll be for the cam, cables, viewfinder. the stuff that comes as standard with th eoriginal box. i can always buy a smaller bag for other items i guess

http://www.worldtraveler.com/servlets/store?S_=WorldTraveler__1096238293807&Page=shop/large_product.html&prodid=1691&viewnum=2&ref=brandresults

how do you fit the xl2 etc in that? did you make your own insides?

The cases comes with a big cuttable foam inside. You just lay your gear on top, might want to trace around with a pen, and custom cut the foam to your various accessories' shapes. They then fit snuggly into place and will not move during transport.

I see :)

Does this size sound good for a vanguard case i'm looking at on ebay?

460(L)x330(W)x155(H)mm

18(L)x13(W)x6(H)in

Hmmm, might be a bit too tight. I have in fact that very same case that I use for all my audio gear, but I'm not sure the XL2 could fit in there.

It might fit by removing the viewfinder and putting it aside, as well as the lens, but it's a little on the tight side, and you will not be able to put anything else in it.

Ideally you'd want nothing less than 7" deep inside measurments for maximum protection. This XL2 is pretty big...

As a reference, use those measurments:

20x lens: 8" x 4" x 4" with sunshade on
XL2 body : 8" x 11" x 6"
viewfinder: 7" x 8" x 3"
on-cam mic: 8" x 2" x 2"

If you have enough room for all that, it should work.

thanks , i'll keep looking then

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=227388&is=REG

would that be ok for an xl2 also?

Kevin,

You will find over time, that no matter what size case you get, it will gradually become stuffed with loads of goodies.

Add about 8" to your needed size, now.

Don't worry about "form fitted" inserts. Buy some foam stuffing from a furniture store/hardware store, and make your own inserts.

suitable you reckon?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=64330&item=3847352749&rd=1&ssPageName=WD2V