Who can tell me about DCR-VX9000 PAL camcorder?
I planing to buy used one. What should be I aware of?
I do not know if there is different betwen "Full Size DV Tape" and DVCAM tape.
Do I realy need tape with memory chip?
I need this camcorder to use in Europe.

Do you really want a PAL camera? Do you have the PAL support equipment?

This camcorder is intended to use in Slovakia/Europe where is PAL system.
As post processing will use P4 computer wit DV Storm2 hardware and Adobe Premier.
Is there any recomendation?

Isn't the VX-9000 the full size cousin of the VX-1000 (as the PD-250 would be to the VX-2000)? If so you would be getting somewhat older technology.

I'm not shure, but I like the size and shoulder type of VX9000.
I do have VX2000, but i do not like it, because is to small.
I planing to sale VX2000 NTSC which I purchased last month.

The VX9000 will definitely be a step backwards from the VX2000 with regard to image quality and feature set. The VX9000 is indeed the shoulder-mount version of the older, now outdated VX1000.

Consider instead the DSR250, which is the shoulder-mount version of the VX2000. Same great image quality, low-light performance, etc. but takes the larger full-size DV or DVCAM cassettes and has a pro black and white CRT viewfinder as well as a flip-out color LCD screen. It's a superb camcorder.

You don't need the memory-chip tapes, by the way. Hope this helps,

I think that was the PAL version of the DSR200, which was the DVCAM version of the VX1000 in the U.S. However, I believe the VX9000 shoots DV and not DVCAM, and that it uses either mini or full size DV tapes. Because it's a PAL camera it would be better quality than the old VX1000/DSR200. It may not be quite as good as a PAL DSR250 but it would be a nice camera if you find one in good condition for a good price.

Thanks all of you who did replay to my post.
I understand, that this camcorder is older version, but I like to purchace this camcorder for my brother who is wedding photographer in Slovakia. Until now he is using full size S-VHS camcorder Panasonic ( I think some as AG 9500).
My filling is, that this VX9000 will be big step up for him.
I can not oversee the price of DSR250 and VX9000. The difference is big. Sony VX9000 PAL I can get for $2000 in very good condition.

Please advise me if I am correct in my thinking.

Also please explain me difference betwen "Full Size DV tape" and DVCAM tape. Are they transparent compatible or are they different of each other? In other words, can I use DVCAM tapes in VX9000?
Thanks

DV tapes come in two different size cassettes. The miniDV are the small ones that record 60 minutes. Full size ones can hold up to about 4 hours. DVCAM tapes are basically the same thing and also come in mini and full size. Sony cameras that use full size cassettes also can use the mini's. You can also use DVCAM tape in the camera. It will record DV onto the DVCAM tape. Most Sony cameras will play DV or DVCAM. Some will record only DV, some both and some DVCAM only. The tapes are basically the same and are interchangeable.

Thanks Bill Pryor for your clear explanation of tapes.

I you or anybody can explain me if there is reason to use DVCAM tapes in camcorder recording DV format only. In this case Am I gona receive better quality of recording or not.

Also i still do not understand why sony uses memory chip inside tape. I know is recording same information on it, but do I need it if I will post process tape on PC with DV Storm2 ?

Thanks again.

Using DVCAM tape will not give you any better quality. The DVCAM tape stock may be a little better, but it would not affect quality of the recording. There is no reason to use the memory chip stock unless you have a Sony editing system that can use the feature. I use Sony DVCAM tape but not the memory chip tapes. In your case it's probably best to use a good quality DV tape stock. Pick one brand and stick with it because switching brands can sometimes cause head clog in some cameras.

Thanks so much to Bill Pryor for excellent explanation.

You saved me a lot of money on tapes, becouse when I asked Sony Representative, they recommendet the moust expensive one and of course with chip.

Do you hawe any recommendation for brand and supplier of this tapes?

Also do you know have many times I can record and rerecord one tape. What should I loking for to see that tape is getting old.

Thanks

I'm wondering how available full size DV tapes are in Slovakia? What is the cost of full size vs. mini DV in Slovakia?

I have no idea, because i living in California and this camcorder is for my brother. I will call him today and check.
I should have answer in 24 hours.
Look for my post.

If you record too many times on a tape, eventually you will see dropouts that will appear on screen. If you take care of the tapes they last longer. Don't leave them laying around outside their cases, always rewind to the head after editing with them, don't let them get too hot or too cold, don't change tapes in dirty environments, etc.

Any of the sales weasels always want to sell you the most expensive tape stock. I use top quality stock, but the memory chip is a waste of money. Sony is good and Fuji is equal to it in my opinion. Those are the only two I've ever used. You might be better off to shoot the miniDV tapes even though the camera can use big ones, because any DV tape deck will use the mini tapes, but some will not accept the big ones.

Thanks for advise.
As I understand VX9000 camcorder will accept only full size DV tape. Because my brother do not have any DV deck, I do not see any problem with it. He will use camcorder as his player (deck).

I have a VX9000 and yes it will accept the Full DVCAM tapes, provided it is recorded in DV. It will also take the blank tapes but it will record footage in DV. Nice Camera, great backup to my VX2000. Though it doesn't have the low light capabilities of the VX2000, it is much like the VX1000. I think you should shop around because two grand seems a bit much for it.

also vx9000 has only DVOUT but a gizmo can be obtained to allow DVIN

According speciffication for VX9000 PAL there is DV in and out.

a friend in the UK has a vx9000e and it is definately DVOUT only , he requires a widget to make it DVIN

maybe its different elsewhere

http://www.shoppersworld.co.uk/templated/midlands/prestons/product.asp?s=80&d=208&p=11831&c=9&s1=68&s2=0&s3=0

The DV in is disabled to prevent copying tapes. This is an internal software setting in a hidden menu (in most cases). It is usually only disabled in cameras intended for the European markets. If there is a krack, or hidden menu, you can usually find it on the net, if you search a little.

Hi Peter

I have the VX 9000 for the last 5 years.
It is a great camera (has the same ccd block as the vx1000),and many of the things i did with it believe it or not were broadcast even on the BBC.

The great advantage of using a DVCAM cassette is that a 3 hours DVCAM will become a 4.5 hours DV tape. (because of the different speed of DV and DVCAM).
Any way the cassette is the same just that a DVCAM will come in a better stronger case.

My camera is for sale (2000$) and it doe's have an original DV in/out (it's original market was not Europe where a DV in camera had a higher tax).
This feature is a must for him if he would like to edit his footage in digital and save some money in the beginning not buying a DV deck.

I live in Vienna so the camera can be delivered easy to your brother in Slovakia.
In any case i will be more then happy to send your brother DV or DVCAM cassettes in-case he will find it hard to get them.

Thanks
Johnnie

Thanks Johnnie Behiri for very good news. Please check your e-mail.
Peter

manual here

http://194.7.100.75/manuals/3858185231.pdf

Thanks John Jay for link to manual, but I do not speak German.
Do anyboby have link to English version of VX9000E manual?
Thanks in advance.

sorry try this

http://194.7.100.75/manuals/3858185131.pdf

Joihn do you have a manual for the NTSC English version?

sorry......

This is the English and French manuals inPDF (http://194.7.100.75/manuals/3858185131.pdf) and this is the manual inGerman PDF. (http://194.7.100.75/manuals/3858185231.pdf)

Jeff these are for the VX9000E which is the european PAL version, looking for the NTSC English version VX9000

I am hoping someone can put my mind at rest following an incident that occurred when I used my Sony DSR250P for the first time.

As I do not have a DV Cam video recorder I set the DSR250 up to record DV SP mode. However, rather than use dv tape, I have always used full size DV Cam tape in my VX9000 DV video camera. Naturally, I assumed I could use the full size DV Cam tapes to record on DV SP mode on the 250, given that the tape is the same as DV, albeit, supposedly better quality.

Unfortunately, this does not appear to be the case, as when I switched on the camera, in VCR mode, and inserted the tape and closed the compartment, I heard what I thought was the tape going through its loading process, albeit, I did think, a rather long process.

However, after a period of time I heard a few bleeps, which I assumed were an error code. I looked into the viewfinder and noted the error code, C-------- and the eject symbol. I then opened the tape cover and the tape self ejected.

I assume that what I thought was a long loading process was the tape attempting to eject, reload, eject etc? I tried loading another tape, however, this time I did not fully close the compartment lid, after another long loading type process the tape self ejected. No error message this time, I assume because the compartment lid was open.

After this I thought it may be related to the machine being set to record in DV SP mode, and that it wanted a DV Tape. Consequently I set the DSR 250 to DV Cam mode and reinserted a DV Cam tape. It loaded fine. So it would seem that the 250 will only work in DV SP mode if you use a DV Tape, strange, and NOT apparently mentioned in the hand book.

My real concern, it has really upset me, is that during the repeated loading type process which resulted in the error messag, I may have damaged my new camera. What do you think?

Thanks for any advice.

There are not, to my knowledge, any cassette coding devices which would tell the camera what type of tape is loaded. Other than mini vs full-sized.

I have run miniDVCam tape in my PD150 without problem but that does not necessarily extrapolate to full-size tapes in my DSR-300.

I have read postings on other forums where people use the full-sized DV tapes in DVCam recorders. Certainly my DSR-20 or DSR-300 have no warnings about this.

Furthermore, the camera/tape manufacturers are usually quite careful to mechanically disallow the loading of a harmful tape into a transport.

I doubt that you have damaged anything.

Call Sony's hot line support at Sony Business Solutions & Systems Technical Emergency After Hours Support (ERS)

For Emergency technical assistance for Broadcast Products after hours, on weekends and Sony holidays, call the Emergency Response System

Phone: (408) 435-8910 if you want after-hours support. Otherwise wait until Monday and call

Sony Business Solutions & Systems Technical Assistance Network (TAN)

Telephone support for technical / repair of Sony Business Solutions & Systems Products.
Hours of Operation: 8:30am - 8:00pm Eastern Standard Time
Phone: NEW TOLL FREE NUMBER (866) 766-9272

Note: When contacting your local service center select "service" at the auto-attendant prompt.

Then select option " 1" for TAN.

Listen for the Product category descriptions then make the appropriate selection relative to the product being serviced.

Your call will be routed to the next available Service Engineer specifically trained for that Model.


All of this can be found on Sony's Business and Professional Products Web site.
http://bssc.sel.sony.com/Professional/startpage.html

This is another advantage of having a pro product vs a consumer product from Sony.

Hi Allan,

On a couple of occasions I have had my 250 eject tapes after failing to load properly. In every case I have had the top cover open and looking down it was apparent that the tape was not sliding fully 'home' i.e. down then inwards towards the capstans.

I found when I inserted a tape that if I pressed the tape case down closer to the battery end it seemed to load ok everytime. Pressing at the centre or lens/front end occasionaly caused it to misload, almost like it was catching on something internally in the mechanism.

The above was with PDV184 DVCAM tapes. Never had the problem with miniDV tapes.

Mine is relatively new as well so if it plays up its going for back for servicing!

Thanks to all that replied.

I get missloads every once in a while with my DSR250. I get them in the DSR200 and DSR300 as well. But after several hundred threads in each of these cameras, they all still work fine.

I think the problem is usually when the tape reels go from mini-DV to full size. But sometimes not.

Unless you force the tape in without letting the transport feed it, damage is unlikely.

Any information out yet on the new SONY DSR-270?

I haven't heard anything but then I had no clue about anything else new from Sony and look what they did without telling me. WOW! I'm mad ;-)
Don

I was checking out this site, which someone said makes the best turnkey edit suites. While I was there I started poking around to see what else they were about. I came to a page where they're selling DSR250s. Here's what they say: "VIDEO IMAGE QUALITY of the DSR-250 is substantially better than the PD-150 or XL1s! In comparing the specifications between all of these cameras one would deduce that the PD-150 and DSR-250 have the identical optics and CCDs. Hence the image quality should be identical.
HOWEVER, using both of these units side by side reveals this is not the case at all. The DSR-250 produces video that is much closer to that of the DSR-300. Its Video has substantially greater detail, edge sharpness, color richness, and dynamic range over
video acquired from a PD-150 ... "
No way, right? And then they go on to say that the "AUDIO QUALITY on the DSR-250... far surpass[es]" that of the PD150 because "the mic pre-amps and AGC controls incorporated into the DSR-250 are much higher quality than those found in the [PD-150]".
Not true, right? And then they finish up with: "When you show up for a shoot packing this unit people know you mean business.
The 'impression' you make with a shoulder mount Sony gets you
instant respect and attracts a lot of attention."
I guess that last one's debatable. (Maybe should take it to a singles bar ;)
Anyone used both these cams?

http://www.saferseas.com/vsd/eye/eye2.html

The VX2000, PD150 and DSR250 have the same "engine." Perhaps the electonics is different with the DSR250, but from what I've read over the years the video quality is the same. The DSR300 is where everything changes. Perhaps BillKC will jump in and cut away some fat---by writing a nice long essay with some hidden but humorous meaning lodged ironically in-between a sentence or two. :)

Sounds like I might have to point my PD150 and DSR-250 at the same scene with exactly the same settings and do a screen grab and see what the diff actually is(if any).

One thing I will say for the 250 is that it is much easier to shoot with re the control layout i.e. dont have to get lost in menus to adjust the audio, gain up, iris etc etc. Much better CPSI (controls per square inch).

Jon,
Have you found that the 250 gives you "instant respect and attracts attention"? Actually, I *was* curious if you have noticed
any difference in the way you are regarded? (There was a thread recently on a Video University forum entitled "Big Camera ... Small Camera" and another one awhile back entitled "The Pro Look" where it was debated whether size really does matter, so far as client perception.) Your thoughts on this,
from the point of view of someone who's really been there, would be appreciated.

Hi Dave,

I'm still relatively new at video - have shot around 10 weddings, couple of stage productions etc etc. I would say that the 250 does carry a little more clout than the 150 - the general comment is 'will I be on TV?' which usually translates to a little more cooperation from others when trying to shoot the bride and groom without getting crowded out by the relatives :).

At the end of the day having both cameras allows me more flexability when shooting e.g. being able to shoot for 4+ hours continuously on the 250 without a tape change and better ergonomics versus using the 150 to grab high shots over a crowd, shooting in tight quarters and fitting into a small backpack.

IMHO If a client is paying for a service they are probably expecting a bit more than a guy turning up with a $50 tripod and a $500 handycam.

As an aside I recently shot an interview for a local politician using both the 250 and 150. When I showed them the final tape in front of the party, I used my little TRV-15 handycam as a play deck(plays DVCAM fine) - one of the committee members piped up 'We were expecting a bigger camera??'.

Opps.....;)



Jon

Jon,
If a videographer wanted to use the viewfinder on the 250 with their left eye rather than the right eye, do you think that would work? Is there any provision for adjustment of the viewfinder regarding the eyepiece's distance from the camera?
And are you able to shoot the ceremony with the 250 while it is shoulder mounted or must you use a tripod?

The viewfinder is the DXR-801 which is the same unit fitted to sonys higher end camcorders (DSR-390,570,D35). It has an adjustment that allows the eyepiece to slide left/right 2-3 inchs and forward/back around an inch or so. I just tried it via the left eye and it worked ok. Probably best to have a play first to make sure your happy with the setup.

I usually shoot the processions shoulder mounted then transfer the camera to the tripod for the ceremony. The 150 is set wide as my cutaway/safety cam to cover the moving feet - back of grooms head, minister, random sky shots that occur when I duck and head for the tripod ;). If the ceremony is going to be fairly short (15-20min??) you could probably get away with being on the shoulder preferably without using too much zoom to avoid the shakes. A good tripod with a fluid head will save your arm/back long term and be nice and stable.

There is a major difference in respect afforded the camera person between the DSR-PD150 and the DSR-300. I can go almost anyplace I want with the 300 on my shoulder. Add a boom operator and there are very few barriers to entry. Only on tightly controlled events with press passes do I have to have a badge.

Clients, even when they know my work, are impressed when I arrive with the 'big' camera. They appreciate my matching the camera to the job. But when it comes to planned and formal executive head shots, I'd better show up with the 300.

The DSR-300 certainly delivers a better picture in difficult situations (except low light) than the PD150.

Case in point. Last night I shot footage in a rehersal hall that is illuminated by the same crappy overhead lights they use in large discount stores. I had shot some footage with my PD150 several days before in the same location and the same people.

Admittedly I had a softlight on the top of the DSR-300 to fill shadows (this is footage to be used in a television commercial) but it's not strong enough (100 watts input) to overshadow the overhead lamps in any way.

The difference in processing shadows out beyond the reach of the camera-top light was significantly better with the 300.

When conditions are 'normal' the 150 does about as good a job as the 300. Detail and image processing are slightly better in the 300 images.

The one place where the 150 cannot compete, as has already been mentioned, is where the action is fast and the optics need rapid adjustment. Direct (and stepless aperature) control over lens settings is an overwhelming advantage of the 300.

I've reversed my use of the 150 and 300 on some shoots. I used to use the 300 for the locked-down wide shots and carry the 150. If I have to move around or the talent is moving around or the shooting conditions are changing, I now carry the 300 and put the 150 on the tripod because it is too slow to adjust.

Backache at the end of the day is about the same.

I have just started to use this feature. It does seem to make a difference.

I note in the instructions that it says to Turn Off Steadyshot when filming on a tripod.

If I "forget" to do this will I cause any harm to the camera/footage.

Do others use this feature?

It won't harm the machine but it can cause problems in your shots. What happens is that the camera thinks it is still moving when it isn't and adjusts the OIS.

Try panning onto a flag pole in stiff breeze with Steady Shot both on and off. You will likely find that it is very difficult to get the pan to stop where you want with Steady Shot on while on a tripod.

Thanks for the quick reply :)

Hi Allan,

I use my 250 for shooting weddings and generally leave it on all the time. Turning it on and off means diving into the menu usually at just the wrong moment :(.

Try it either way and see what effect it has. I was quite surprised how much shake it took out especially at max zoom when shooting off the shoulder.

Cheerio

Jon

Thanks Jon.

Its weddings that I am also filming.

Cheers.