So far my path to starting my documentary has been through many highs and lows. And today i just found another reason to be low. Two films that really inspired me to make a documenatary were Roger & Me and SuperSize Me. I love the satire angle and the fact that you can take the most serious of a subject and make people laugh, from a perspectivly cheap manner.

Now this is where i hit my low. S.S.M was made for (what they consider cheap) $65,000! Really, that grass root project spent that much cash. They didn't even use film. If i heard right it was shot with a pd170.
My true inspiration, Roger & Me, cost an astonishing $250,000.00! What. You think i'm kidding. No, I just heard it on CNN . Where did the money go? Holy Cow. Ok, he did use film and stuff like that, but how and where did he rake up a bill that high? I understand he likely paid for the music, but does archive footage cost money as well? I just watched that movie today and i can't for the life of me see where most of the money went (i'm assuming music/archive and legal).

So i want to make my docu., but can it be done for $10,000 ? I want it to be presentable and my goal is to enter it in film festivals. I have almost all my equipment so i'm fine in that regard. I need to find out where do all these films blow there load (so to speak). And i guess i'm going to need some grant money if making one is this expensive - where do you go about getting that, anyone have a good link? Have you seen a nationaly successful docu made for cheap?

As always, like to hear from all angles and views (like I have a choice :)

I just shot a documentry for nothing yesterday. It's not what you spend it's how much creativity you put into it. (and technical skill)

Don't worry about it so much - just shoot it.

Murph

Don't believe in the propaganda.

No, I am not against the two doc's you mentioned, but I doubt the non-political sides of them that had been publisized. They are probably big-money operations to start with, using "masquarading as small-timer" to get publicity.

The same way I doubt the Democratic Party is for the "little guy", which of course is even less so for the Republicans.

Remember, when these guys say stuff in public, they are not under oath... :-)

BTW, Andy Dufrain, how was Mexico?

So you're telling me that S.S.E was possibly a puppet for a bigger company? I heard that he used all his own money to finance the film.

Mexico? I may be going in a couple months, but how did you know. I don't recall i ever said it here.

Oh, don't tell me you believe everything they say. :-)

Who knows what's true. Sometimes even Hollywood stars get conned by their very own lies. Remember that saying "don't believe in your own propaganda"?

Of course, you are the same guy trying to get people to believe your real name is "Andy Dufrain"... :-)

Supersize Me had a number of expensive animated segments, likely the bulk of the budget; also, budgets on documentaries are stuffed with overhead: office space, internet access bills, phone bills, cell phone bills, and the crew probably milked the budget for travel, meals, and the like sundry expenses. (There's even a line early in the film with Spurlock holding up a taxi receipt, saying, "These cab fares are really going to add up." Think he means from his own pocket?) Add to that bills from three doctors, a nutritionist, and a physical fitness expert, and it's easy to see where the money went. (It wasn't just a bunch of $2.29 Big Macs.)

Many good documentaries are produced every year for under $10,000. Not all of them have the high-concept hook and comedic execution of a Spurlock or Moore film, so most of the best ones end up at film festivals or on television, rather than being the hit of Sundance or Cannes and subsequently enjoying nationwide release.

Just watch the credits at the end. You have to remeber that ALL of those people are on the payroll.

And if they are shooting in 35mm or 16mm a lot of cost is in processing film. If you shoot dv and your film gets picked up by a distributor, they will pay for the transfer to film.

Not that it was a documentary, but El Mariachi was filmed for 7k.

Keep the faith.

Mariachi was NOT filmed for 7k.

Urban myth my friend.

That's funny, because that's about the price Rodruigez quotes in Rebel Without A Crew...

Or do you mean that the FINAL version, including blow up to 35mm, sound, re-editing, etc... cost more than $7000.

Nope,

Rodriguez also admiitted the price on his credit card was that low, but he also got thousands of "in kind" services for free from UT, and others.

So the rough cut, that no one ever sees, before it was "fixed" was closer to a hundred thousand.

IMHO, free services still count as free.
If he was only $7k out of pocket, then IMHO he made it for $7k. Free still counts as free in my book.

Check your book... defered payments cost you. His credit card loan was defered, his payments to his actors and vendors were defered. If you think defaulting on any defered payment is a good idea, you won't be in business long. They all have to be paid sooner or later.

Check out some of his earliest inteviews in the Houston Chronicle. The credit card story starts out at "under five grand not counting other deferred expenses".

So if I use my credit card, taking out a five grand loan, convince people and vendors to go in on the deal, and paying them a huge percentage for the risk if/when it goes through. It goes through and I pay people the three hundred thousand I owe them out of my profits...

(Of course, if it doesn't go through, I declare bankruptcy and nobody gets paid, including the credit card company... but that's another story)

Did it still cost "Only five grand" to make. Or did I leverage five grand into several hundred thousand?

This is a very, very important distinction that lost of people don't understand.

(File this under the "No such thing as a free lunch" menu)

I think that a documentary costs as much as you have. If you have 10K, you'll spend 10K. If you have 100K, believe me ... you'll find a way to spend 100K. I know that I could!

In fact, I'm sure that SSM would have turned out pretty much the same, had he spent only half that amount.

All good points about Rodriquez. I think in today's circumstances a film maker can make a dv documentary for 10k up to the point of distribution. If the film is chosen for distribution then more money will be required in terms of transferring to film and advertising but that money will be supplied by the distributor.

Richard, don't be a hater.

How about "his investment in the film was $7000"?

Seems to me the real question is, can you make over $10,000 with your documentary? <grin>

Look, we can do a lot for less money because we don't:

1) buy or rent a camera for a movie (we usually already have one and it usually itsn't as high end)

2) pay people like producers, editors, runners, people who look through archives, legal counsil, marketing people etc. etc.

3) buy music (we tend to make it or get it free somewhere)

4) pay for marketing stuff like commercials / posters etc.

5) pay actors

6) rent an editing room or a company/person/people to do it for you

7) get effects done (like credits or color correction work)

Even a simple documentary might have a lot of things on this
list. It quickly adds up. Also keep in mind that hiring certain folk
is expensive. I think I cost around $125 an hour at my current
company (for the customer). For $65,000 you could hire me for
13 weeks straight (40 hours a week).

Then the money is gone. Now have 10 people working full time
for a week and your budget is nearly gone already.

I can imagine people in the documentary/film business are even
more expensive....

I'm not sure of the exact budget, but if you seek inspiration for a doc under $10k, take a look at "Hands on a Hard Body." This doc maker made a really shrewd choice of subject matter -- a three-day competition with plenty of human drama plus pre- and post-interviews. He had the entire film in the can in two weeks. That incredibly engaging film played for months in the University of Texas Dobie theater.

Consider your subject. How long and how much will it take to acquire the footage? How far would you have to travel to get the story? How easy or difficult are the people you are observing to get? What special equipment would you need to get it in the can. Etc.

where does the $$ go ?

well if you are paying persons ... 1500 day to cameraperson , 400 day sound , 450 day gaffer ... 2500wk editor X 16-26 weeks ..
5K production insurance, 2K month office rent ,$$ overhead ... then you have producer , director , PM , PA 's ... adds up quick ...

if you only have 10K then you don't have production insurance , you shoot-edit it your self ... what ever amount you have is what you fit into your budget so maybe you only pay 500 day to camera etc ...

YES - you can make a good doc for 10K !!! and you have to do most of it yourself ...

You can easily do a documentary for $10,000 or $5000 or $2500 or... Trick is to document something in the present so all your footage is "in the present."
Re-creations, airline travel, archival footage etc. is where documentaries start to get expensive.
Find something of interest around where you live and go from there. (The best are human interest stories.) In this way local businesses may agree to help you out with donations or food or product.