I wonder how many DVC80 owners are willing to spend $500 to get a DVC80 hack which will enable the build-in 24p?

(the hacking voids the warranty)

when and if i buy a dvc80, i would stongly consider it.

Or you could just sell your DVC80, spend $500 and buy a used DVX100 without voiding the warranty.

<<<-- Originally posted by Stephen van Vuuren : Or you could just sell your DVC80, spend $500 and buy a used DVX100 without voiding the warranty. -->>>

check out my post in private classifieds :)

but put an empasis on the word USED and it makes a whole difference. (ebay=farud) and my father is high maintenance who i paying for a quarter of my dvc80 wants to buy new from a reputable seller like bh.

Love Mov --

Is this just conjecture on your part, or have you uncovered some secret to hacking the DVC80? It's been my impression that there are specific differences in the electronics of the DVC and the DVX that would preclude a simple flashing of the firmware. So what are you suggesting in terms of modification?

Regardless, I agree with Stephen -- use that extra $500 to get a used DVX100. If I want a DVX instead of my DVC, I'll just sell the 80, put together the rest of the money on my own and simply buy a 100. I don't see a point in spending $500 to muss up a perfectly good, brand new camera -- just to make it do what the DVX100 already does.

If you were talking about a *free* firmware upgrade, or modding the DVC80 to make it do something that no other camera can (or something like Juan P. is doing with his DVX to capture the rawest video) I might consider it. But spending $500 just to save $500 seems like a waste. I'd say just put in that extra week at work, save the money up, and buy the DVX100.


Michael--
<<<-- Originally posted by Michael Summers : but put an empasis on the word USED and it makes a whole difference. (ebay=farud) and my father is high maintenance who i paying for a quarter of my dvc80 wants to buy new from a reputable seller like bh. -->>>


But your father won't mind you spending $500 to mod your brand new DVC80 that he helped you buy from B&H and void the warranty and possibly break it? I doubt he feels that way, to be honest.

Buying a used camera is like buying a used car. Take your time, do your research, and don't buy if you don't feel comfortable. I just bought a used car and got a pretty good deal on a nice car -- partly because I took months and months to do it

but, does he have to know i modded it? he knows when he spends money, but im going to spend cash on modding it. when you bring up the "breaking it" part i was like... oh yeah... but ive had many things modded by people mwho know what theyre doing and its all come out ok (ps2,xbox,my mac)

Michael

But why spend $500 just to save $500 (ish)? Put in the extra time at work and wait that extra week or two and just get the DVX100. Especially for someone who doesn't even own a DVC80 *or* a DVX100 yet, it seems silly to even consider buying the 80 just to mod it so it will be the 100. What do you have to do right now that you can't wait to get the $$ together for the DVX?

school ends in early june. i have a script ready and when the school year rolls around, i wont have time to do anything. shooting will take more than 1.5 months and then editing. its either make this film now, or wait a year, and not make any other short films within the school year because we all know junior year is the hardest. i wont have enough money for an dvx100a until january when everything has come and gone and finals are up. theres no time, so i need a camera by june to film. i love filming, why wait and not do anything over the summer? thats the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard. ill im saying is, itll be hard for me to buy a used dvx100 unless i can meet the person and test it out. i just may invest that 500$ in january to upgrade it fr summer 2005.
*sigh*

-edit-

it wouldnt be an extra "week or two". im getting paid 6.50 an hour, and i need to live.

I don't want to stray too far from the topic of the thread, but a good question for any DVC80 owner to ask is, Why do you need 24p? Are you doing a final transfer to film? Or do you just think that 24p looks cool? I don't mean that as a slight, Michael -- I admire your initiative and interest in filmmaking, but it's an important question to ask yourself. 24p does not automatically equal "film-look." Do you even need to buy a new camera at all? I've seen some surprisingly good looking footage shot on some inexpensive cameras. Spend that $500 on lights, a good mic or two, and a "film-look" plug-in for your editing app (there's one for $100 that's been touted by some on this board, I don't know it's name). Those tools will serve you better than 24p (good audio in particular will make a huge difference)

I admire your desire to spend your summer making a movie -- but the camera does not make the movie; you do. If you just have to be creative this summer, why not just use the tools at your disposal? Perhaps your school will let you borrow the VX2000?Then you can save up for the camera you really want in the meantime.

Again, this question is posed to anyone who would consider this offer: Why do you want 24p? Why did you buy the DVC80 in the first place, and not the DVX?

Not to knock the concept -- it's certainly interesting as an intellectual exercise. I'd love to see the results. Just not on my camera :D heh heh

Love is talking about thing. There is no such hack

I am asking the possibility or worth investing into such a hack...yeah, basically am thinking firmware update, but if there is hardware difference, it's difficult to say then...

As the proud owner of a DVC-80, why mess up a perfectly good camera when you can get DV movie maker (I think that is the one) for around a $100 bucks a get the "film look"? It seems since price is a major consideration, why not just use what you have and get the software plug in and spend a lot less than $500?

<<<-- Originally posted by Love Mov : I am asking the possibility or worth investing into such a hack...yeah, basically am thinking firmware update, but if there is hardware difference, it's difficult to say then... -->>>

OH.. from your originaly post, it sounded like you were offering to hack ppl's DVC80 for $500. HA!

mmmm ....

Just to think about Love Mov, even if it is possible and it works, and yet you havent even give any details about it...

What i think is, when i came into the homemade mini35 project, and made the Agus35, i just release it, FREE.... man believe me, i didnt get a penny and i never ask nothing for it.. but guess what, is the most readed thread in this forum it has passed to many others webpage. And what more important many peole modded it, and even came up with many more options and solutions for that idea, that wasnt even mine, but i helped.. you know why ?

Cause it was a way to help many people that dont have the money for a Mini35. Same case here.. i own a DVC80, cause i didnt have the money for a DVX100 in that moment... and i loved the 24p, i travel from Guatemala, to NY, and only went to BH, and i passed 6 hours seeing the DVX100, but knowing that i will buy the DVC80.

If you have such hack.. give us more details for a start, and then i would suggest it to test it, or ask for beta testing.. and then ... man.. give it for free.. how many stuff did you got free from the internet ? Damn i got a lot. And i will give many more in the future.

Greetings.. and hoping this isnt a hoax.. cause that wont be funny.

John & Aaron:

While you can get a 24p plugin (DV Filmmaker is the best price performance product on the market at around $100), it's not the same as a DVX100. Why?

(1) You lose resolution. Even though DV Filmmaker (and Magic Bullet et. al) are very good, the picture is still noticeably softer than shooting 24p. Depending on the footage, plugin and settings, you can lose 30-50% of your vertical resolution.

(2) Render time is abusive, even on fast computers and render farms. If you're shooting 10 minute shorts and music videos, filmlook is a great invention. If you have shot 100 hours on a documentary, it's practically impossible. Most people forget to add the cost in drive space (those rendered files have to go somewhere), processors, plugins etc.

(3) You cannot see temporal issues from pans, tilts etc. until you are in the editing room. If you are going to create 24fps, you must be extremely careful when shooting otherwise you will get strobing and other problems in post.

And the big one:

(4) You don't get true progressive 24fps. The DVX100/a is capturing 24 moments in time, full frame, every second. Those moments in time are different than 60i from a DVC80. Even if you had the cameras side by side, they will capture different moments of motion - no filmlook plugin can recreate this (Twixtor can sort of do it, but not really).

And because it's progressive, it's far more resolution than 60i (see Steve Mullen's article for more).

Bottom line is that DVC80 + filmlook does NOT equal a DVX100.

DVC80 + filmlook does equal a DVC30 running in frame mode or an XL1s in framemode.

If you want 24p or 30p output, sell your DVC80 and get a DVX100. It will save you vast amounts of time and money over trying to get 24p or 30p in post.

DVC80 is for 60i shooters only.

Stephen

I am fully aware of all those points you mention. My point was that if you can't afford a DVX100 there are better ways to try and achieve a film look than cannibalizing your DVC80 with some $500 hack-- you might notice that lighting and audio took priority in my list over the plug-in.

You are correct that if you want 24p, then buy the DVX. As I stated earlier in this thread: "If I want a DVX instead of my DVC, I'll just sell the 80, put together the rest of the money on my own and simply buy a 100."

I'll make it clear, though: If you want 24p/30p/etc, buy a DVX100. If you want to get the most out of your DVC80, then lighting, audio, and yes, even a plug-in, will serve you better than paying $500 to have your camera torn apart and "hacked" (even if said hack is imaginary).

I agree John - hacking the DVC80 for 24p does not go on the list of "great ideas", especially since no one has actually posted information on how...

Of course, "imaginary hack" is a pretty good band name...

I think it's more likely that Pana will lower the price of the DVX100A to US$500 more than the '80.

Stephen;
We are all aware of the differences of true 24 p as opposed to a software plug-in but he/she was asking about hacking a DVC-80 (a camera I happen to love for its 60i and would never consider altering for 24p) to get a film look.

It still begs the question, as others have said, if he/she can't wait to get a DVX 100A and absolutely MUST make the film NOW, a viable and cost effective comprimise would be a software plug in saving him time, effort and money.

Aaron:

Unless the film is very simple and short, I fail to see how a film look plugin in will save time, effort and money. I've used most of them (only used DigiEffects demo) and sold the ones I had except for Revision FX's Fields Kit.

Effort and time is much greater with a plugin than selling and upgrading the cam (or renting a DVX100 for that matter). Money is iffy. Extra storage, cost of plugin and big increase in post-production could end up costing much more

<<<-- Originally posted by Stephen van Vuuren : Aaron:

Unless the film is very simple and short, I fail to see how a film look plugin in will save time, effort and money. -->>>

Stephen: I hear you, but Lov Mov seemed to be in a real hurry to make his film NOW!

You and I probably know about patience, waiting, the sun really will come up tomorrow, taking our time to get what we really want, etc. but this guy doesn't. So for him, to get his movie made immediately with what he has and then do the 24p thing in post might be the cure for his impatience.

Besides, I can remember being young (back in the time of the dinosaurs;) and feeling like if I didn't do whatever right then and there, I might as well stop living.

So why not do his film now with the DVC-80, get a film like look in post, then he can still sell it later for the DVC- 100A for his next film that he is just going to have to make like right NOW or just die.

Aaron:

You have a point - if my choice between hacking a DVC80 for 24p and running a 24p plugin, the 24p plugin would be my choice everytime.

I bought my DVX100 hoping to hack it until i cam turn it into a varicam

:P