Hey guys --

I need a glide track...or something like it. Would you call this a dolly system?

Can you recommend something for us to use? Ideally, we'd like something that mounts on our tripod.

What am I looking for?
~ Charles

what are you asking?

you basically have described a glidetrack, so why don't u just buy/google one?! :)

www.glidetrack.com (http://www.glidetrack.com)

there are alternatives (i think by cinevate for example), but nothing as mobile Vs cheap Vs easy

glidetrack gets 11 out of 10 from me! i've got 2 and i never leave home without them!

Hi Charles,

What you're after is commonly called a slider. There's a couple of well known ones - glidetrack and cinevates pegasus 'heavy lifter' come to mind...

There's also a dvinfo forum on them:

Dolly / Track / Cable - The Digital Video Information Network (http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/dolly-track-cable/)

Cheers,

Matt.

edit: beaten to the punch by Richard...

Thanks Matt! Slider...that's what I was after!

kleenex = tissue
glidetrack = slider

That's all I needed to get started! :-)
~ Charles

oh i see what you were asking now, sorry charles!

I cant think of anything cheaper than the Glidetrack and if there was Im sure it wont be any where as good. Philip Bloom has given it a bit of praise in his latest piece and I love it. We have a few vids now on our site which feature the Glidetrack including the latest post.

It now comes along to every single shoot... we even took it on holiday with us (some shots of which are in our demoreel). The track is also just the right length to fit on the parcel shelf of my VW Golf and secures nicely between the headrest. What more can one ask :)

Thanks Richard! I think I was a little tired when I wrote that post. The words weren't coming out in complete sentences! LOL!

It sounds like the Glidetrack is a fantastic investment. Maybe I don't really need to look any further than that!

~ Charles

Charles, Also look into Indisliderpro, I use it and it is a very good product.

IndiSYSTEM - Studio 4 Productions - The indiSLIDERpro (http://www.indifocus.com/products_indisliderpro.htm)

Here is a link to a video that I shot in May with the Indislider.
Untitled Document (http://www.dragonflyproduction.net/stephaine/)

I use Cinevates Heavy Lifter because of the EX3 with the Brevis can be heavy and it works great I love it.

So here's the voting so far:

a) Glide Track system (3 votes)
b) IndiSystem (1 vote)
c) Cinevate system (2 votes)

Has anyone out there used more than one of these? Any comparisons you can offer?

~ Charles

PS -- I couldn't help but notice that there is not one, but TWO IndiSystem sliders for sale in the private classifieds area. Me thinks this is a bad sign...

Hi Charles,

You might want to have a look here for more traffic and/or answers:

Dolly / Track / Cable - The Digital Video Information Network (http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/dolly-track-cable/)

FYI I believe Glidetrack was developed & made by one of dvinfos own, Alastair Brown (http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/dolly-track-cable/121309-my-diy-dolly.html) - he's very obliging with any questions.

Cheers,

Matt.

There's also the Pocket Dolly from Kessler (http://www.kesslercrane.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=230&Itemid=82). It looks interesting because of the addition of the crank. I've never used one, but I have one of their cranes and that's built very well. I plan on buying one if I could ever sell my Axis dolly...

I've used both the GlideTrack HD and the Pegasus Heavy Lifter. Honestly, using the GT is what convinced me to buy the Pegasus. My friend brought his GT on a shoot and I took it for a test drive and I didn't like the way it would stick in certain places of the track. You could really feel a change in the resistance as you moved the camera along the track. I know the Pegasus is twice as much as the GT, but I think there's a world of difference between the two products as well.

I've used both the GlideTrack HD and the Pegasus Heavy Lifter. Honestly, using the GT is what convinced me to buy the Pegasus. My friend brought his GT on a shoot and I took it for a test drive and I didn't like the way it would stick in certain places of the track. You could really feel a change in the resistance as you moved the camera along the track. I know the Pegasus is twice as much as the GT, but I think there's a world of difference between the two products as well.

I agree. This is the main reason I purchased the Heavy Lifter system also. It's super smooth. One of my best purchases to date.

Steve + Shaun -- awesome. Thanks for the feedback. Without having used either of these, this was my gut feeling just by looking at those two options.

Now the wrinkle is that GlideTrack just introduced a heavy duty version. I wonder if that addresses any of these concerns.

~ Charles

Hey Charles

Actually I used the GlideTrack heavy duty version and that's the one that would stick. Keep in mind, this particular unit was very new. My friend that owns it is planning on selling it to get the pegasus. Having said that, I know a lot of other people who have the GT and are very happy with it.

If you fancy doing it yourself, go have a look over at DVXUser's DIY section, there is an in-debt discussion on making your own glidetrack. The commercial glidetrack is pretty much industrial parts you can order off the shelf at a fraction of the cost.

A new glidetrack does stick yes, you need to work in the bearings with use or do a little trick where you apply pressure to the bearings and it breaks them in within a minute.

Our demo reel features some glidetrack footage and you can see its a bit juddery in place.

And here is our latest piece using the track and its silky smooth.

Radiation Disco Promo on Vimeo (http://vimeo.com/5560297)

The SD version will take out FX1 with heavy battery just nicely although the HD would have been better. The compact looks great, the ability to have a dolly that size for those short, sharp shots.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but this was a brand new GT HD, and there were no bearings at all. I only used it once so I may have missed it but I didn't notice the distinct sound of ball bearings, nor did it feel as if it had them. Again, I'm sure it works great for those that love it, it just wasn't for me so I went another direction.

Does anyone else have experience with Cinevate Pegasus? That looks really lightweight compared to GT. I DIYed something very similar to the glidetrack. Works well with a little friction. Only wished that it was lighter like the Pegasus. But that is only from my visual impression. I'm not sure if the Pegasus is really lighter??

Steve, they dont use ball bearings. There known as "self lubricating plastic bearings"

GT is lighter than the Pegasus from what ive seen.

Does anyone else have experience with Cinevate Pegasus? That looks really lightweight compared to GT. I DIYed something very similar to the glidetrack. Works well with a little friction. Only wished that it was lighter like the Pegasus. But that is only from my visual impression. I'm not sure if the Pegasus is really lighter??

I have the Pegasus and it's as smooth as butter. Best part is that we're able to travel and not have to lug around a set of rods.

Having said that, I know a lot of other people who have the GT and are very happy with it.

is that not the exact same thing as saying 'i know a lot of people who have a glidecam and are very happy with it' because there absolutely are but i don't think anybody would suggest it is anywhere near a steadicam and one is a clearly superior product. some are happy working harder for their shots, or getting them 'pretty good', and saving money on the up front investment. i think that says less about the product and more about the studio. i do know a lot of top studios such as joe simon, ray roman, kevin shahinian, mindcastle, glen elliott, all use the pegasus - and i think that should certainly say something.

P.

Good point. However I believe there are steps in making purchases. I purchased the pegasus because I didn't like how the glidetrack performed. But if I didn't have that initial experience with the glidetrack, I probably would've purchased that instead of the pegasus, based on the the clips I've seen from others that have the GT and the cost difference. Regarding the glidecam vs steadicam, don't get me wrong, I'd kill to have a steadicam and I have it on my short list to get one very soon, but I chose to purchase the glidecam first because its far cheaper and once I had the principle down, I could carry that experience over to the steadicam. Also just wanted to point out that a few of the people on your top studios list use the glidecam, not the steadicam.

Hi Guys,

Alastair (Glidetrack) here.

Only just back from vacation, and see we have a bit of a flag waving competition going on.

All I can say is go over to Vimeo, search for Glidetrack and you will find hundreds of clips from happy Glidetrack customers. You can then decide for yourself if it delivers the goods.

It has also been used in quite a few BBC productions here in the UK.

There is a really nice four page review of the Glidetrack in the July/August edition of Event DV by Loyd Calomay of Red5Studios.

For those of you concerned about size/weight, we do a compact half length version of both models, and are just about to launch new lightweight versions, as well as an even larger XD one.

All this will be detailed in full on the new website which is coming very soon.

If your are experiencing any sticking, your bearings may simply need re-aligned which takes seconds (Steve, tell your friend to give me a shout and I can talk him through it)

Happy Gliding!

Alastair

All I can say is go over to Vimeo, search for Glidetrack and you will find hundreds of clips from happy Glidetrack customers. You can then decide for yourself if it delivers the goods.

Having just done that, it's what I have been looking for, and affordable price.
I will soon order one.

Affordable price, thats the biggie for me.

If I said I wanted a pegasus and it will only cost me just over $1,000 I dont think I would have got it. While it looks nice can many justify the cost? The glidetrack however was so cheap for us it's just pocket change and it paid off.

Our new Steadicam is great, an improvement over the glidecam in so many ways but when we got the glidecam there would have been no way I could have justified £4,000 on something which might do us no good or that I couldnt even get on with. As pointed out, many of the top studios still use a Glidecam and dream of a Steadicam. Correct me if i'm wrong but didnt Patrick also start on a Glidecam?

Lets not get into "My dads better than your dad" type discussion. They are two products which do similar things. Each has their pros, each can be used in different situations.

I have no doubt an EX3 would be better than my FX1. But the FX1 does the job and I can afford it.

Does the glidetrack give you what you want and for an acceptable price? Then go for it.
Does you have a different need and require the pegasus, can you afford it? Then go for it.

Also, Philip Bloom's latest piece used a Glidetrack with some great results.

Actually, Glidecam vs Steadicam is a great comparison.

I love my new steadicam, but its infinatly more fragile than the Glidecam. The glidecam was so simple I could sling it arond, drop it, throw it on a table and move on and it would be fine. But the Steadicam has more to go wrong. But I wanted to do something different with my shots which I couldnt achieve with the glidecam.

Now the Glidetrack is very much the same. When you see one its so simple. Its a solid, alloy rail with a little sled/shuttle you screw onto. Thats it. Rock solid, throw it in the back of the car, hit an annoying bride around the head with it. No worries, it will come out fine.

Certainly here in the UK we dont get a lot of time in a wedding and being able to abuse your gear a bit helps. The steadicam has changed how we work a little. I slap the track down, click in the camera, film and onto the next.

Ive also found out that my Glidetrack is the older model with the fixed bearings and the new ones have an adjustable sled so if it sticks, just tweak your settings.

i love my glidetracks - next to no setup time - it's one solid piece - it can be setup in almost any space possible - and most importantly,

can withstand the blast from a bbq i recently filmed :)

This is a password protected video on Vimeo (http://www.vimeo.com/5590569) (password = krishna)

i love my glidetracks - next to no setup time - it's one solid piece - it can be setup in almost any space possible

have you tried a pegasus? they set up super quick, work faster (so if it takes you to couple more seconds to setup, your still out in half the time since your not redoing the shots 6-7 times to get one good take), they are 5 pieces that can go as one solid piece or be taken apart to travel smaller or replace individual pieces if you damaged anything, and it can be setup in more places because you also have a bowl to deal with inclines.

know how many people love a glidecam before they try a steadicam. we have had die hard glidecam fans change their mind in seconds when they get into a real rig.

they certainly can work - we have one and share it at the evolution experience - but in having everybody play with all the options (indislider too) not one preferred the indislider for anything other than the lower investment, and that is a fairly large subject pool. i should say though, i am certainly biased as i helped in the design and pestered cinevate to bring this to the market.

P.

i watched the 3 part series and it goes against my own way of working of keeping light, mobile, having things be quick and easy. the pegasus has quite a few parts to it, and i can't see me getting shots within seconds like i can with the glidetrack (btw, '6-7' times to get one good take??? nearly all of my shots have to be first-time shots, no time for repetition :). yes, with a team of people and/or time on your side, you can set up cool incline shots...but i'm learning how to do soft-incline shots with the glidetrack anyway, and that takes me seconds from the moment i think of the shot itself...no faffing around adjusting angles of components etc. also, the element that allows you to dolly along the floor - hmmm, it's not often you find ultra-smooth floors like in those behind-the-scenes shots ;)

p.s. we would ALL love a steadicam - it's only the money aspect that keeps us all from getting one :)

Money is a big thing for most. Steadicam vs glidecam. Steadicam is great but expensive.

My VW Golf vs a Bentley. Im sure the bentley gives a great ride but my car does the job and a fraction of the price.

Geography also plays a part. For me to import a Pegasus, including postage, taxes, import duty I would be looking at over £900 GBP. Thats an awful lot of a british wedding videographer. Its a sad fact that the british wedding video/film/cinema market is no where near as evolved as the US. You guys think you have it bad, try being over here. As such what we can charge is a lot less. At reframe I met a lot of US studios who are quite large and have a number of people working for them. In the UK I can think of about 2 studios which do that. The rest just dont have the volume of work to justify anything more than 1 or 2 people working for them. The market also isnt willing to pay a high price for videos, thus we dont have an awful lot to spend on gear. The number of other vendors we meet who are facinated by the Steadicam, they all say they have never seen one used in a wedding, or a Glidetrack. They are used to one man with one camera on his shoulder, usually the man has a beard and is called Bob.

Alastair, living in this same market (from Scotland to the south of the UK, its all pretty much the same) has created a product that fits the needs of the videographers as well as their budgets. Thankfully for Alastair the rest of the world saw a benefit in the Glidtrack.

Again, the pegasus, Glidetrack and indislider (plus others) all cost different ammounts. All have different capabilities. Find one which fits your needs and your budget.

Surprising how smooth the glide-track is.
Just ordered one yesterday and arrived prompt this morning.
I have yet to test this and I will be using it this coming Saturday at a wedding.

How do you do incline shots with the Glidetrack. Obivously the tripod underneath sets the angle of the incline but how do you level the camera head on top - especially if it's a flat base like the Manfrotto 501?

Rock solid, throw it in the back of the car, hit an annoying bride around the head with it. No worries, it will come out fine.

I dunno, personally I think the Pegasus is "head and shoulders" above the Glidetrack when it comes to hitting the annoying bride. When the impact really counts, I want a piece that will hold its own and withstand multiple uses. Annoying brides tend to bounce back like those inflatable clowns - so it's really important to have the best heavy duty gear possible. Although, I hear the Glidetrack is good for slamming fingers, so maybe that's something to consider.

So far my Glide Track experience has been great. There is some performance limitations but sometimes we need to come up with our own solutions. Here in Florida is very humid. Adding baby powder before weddings works better!
The Pegasus looks good and perfect for traveling but we already had 2 Gtracks when this one came out.

I have to admit that my "Hero" Patrick is right about Steadicam Vs. Glidecam. The reality is the money is a big factor and Glidecam can do great things too.

Check this recent video love story done with Glidetrack, Glidecam HD 1000 and Canon 5D.

http://www.vimeo.com/6805938

How do you do incline shots with the Glidetrack. Obivously the tripod underneath sets the angle of the incline but how do you level the camera head on top - especially if it's a flat base like the Manfrotto 501?

hiya Dave,

simple: you tilt the glidetrack on the tripod to ur specified angle, then tilt the camcorder/DSLR back so it's facing forward again. (assuming the glidetrack is on the tripod head, and the camcorder is on a head on a glidetrack)

cheers

p.s. i notice you're in the UK. Canon invited me to do 2 seminars at the Pro Photo Solutions show - 27th and 28th October. I'm showcasing the Glidetrack (as well as other products), so come along if you can and say hi!

I had the GT HD and it works but not the way I wanted it to work. I sold it and purchased the Pegasus Heavy Lifter. This thing will last a lifetime. I got the 48" rods, which easily pack in a tripod bag and the ends and the carriage can go in the same or another bag. Very easy to transport. You can pan up down sideways and there is no resistance in the carriage movement. I didn't notice it being cumbersome while shooting weddings at all. Yes its more expensive on the front end but again the quality of this unit is solid.

hiya Dave,

simple: you tilt the glidetrack on the tripod to ur specified angle, then tilt the camcorder/DSLR back so it's facing forward again. (assuming the glidetrack is on the tripod head, and the camcorder is on a head on a glidetrack)

cheers

p.s. i notice you're in the UK. Canon invited me to do 2 seminars at the Pro Photo Solutions show - 27th and 28th October. I'm showcasing the Glidetrack (as well as other products), so come along if you can and say hi!

Hi Richard

The method I mean is with the camera at right angles to the glidecam. Is that achievable in any way?

Pro Photo Solutions sounds good, unfortunately it's during the week...not good for me.

Can somebody clarify for me how to mount the Pegasus? The Glidetrack can sit flat on the floor (convenient) or sit on a tripod (or 2).

In the Cinevate video, the Pegasus Heavy Lifter appears to be mounted on 2 grip stands. For weddings, that's too much gear, and too much time to set it up. Can it sit on the floor? Can it live on one tripod?

Thanks for all your help.

Yes...it can easily work on the floor. That's the way I mostly use it. Floor, tables, etc. I also use 2 quick release plate for my 501 heads. Buy a couple extra plates and slide both ends onto each tripod. There are other ways to use. 3/8" adapters for other stands.

I'd have to agree that 2 tripods + a slider is a lot of gear on top of the usual stuff. BUT the setup will open up a whole book of shots that can knock your bride's garter off.

The 2 rail blocks on the Pegasus have 'feet' that prop your rails about 1-2 inches above ground level. So yes, you can use them on the floor (unless the carpet fibers are extra long and fluffy).

Now we have the glidetrack compact and a decent tripod head we now use the GT compact a fair bit on the tripod. A few times during the ceremony too.

We have a new highlights coming out in a few days which features a fair bit of glidetrack with stunning effect. Well worth a watch for anyone still on the fence.

In the Cinevate video, the Pegasus Heavy Lifter appears to be mounted on 2 grip stands. For weddings, that's too much gear, and too much time to set it up. Can it live on one tripod?

The problem with all these track things (I have Glidetrack but they all suffer from the same problem) is that they really need support at both ends unless you have a very light camera. I asked the question before I purchased and was assured by the maker/designer that the Glidetrack would carry the Z1 without flex. It doesn't.

Additionally the plastic "bearings" are affected by the climate and you need to carry lube like WD40 to guarantee smooth movement when you arrive on site.

The other problem is that manually moving the camera doesn't guarantee smoothness. We're currently converting ours to a braked pulley system where a weight/gravity will, we hope, give better results. However, for weddings where taking along two extra tripods simply isn't practical (an environment in which people simply don't want too much gear around anyway) our view is that it's a non-starter, sorry.

Finally to the poster who was going to try a Glidetrack out at his next wedding, could I urge him to practice a great deal before using it on a job?

Philip: WD40?! all you need to do (i've done this like 2-3 times in a year), is slightly loosen the carriage fixtures with an allan key. that's it

re: support at both ends... i've never once needed that on any of my GT/tripod setups (i'm using XH-A1s by the way). if you absolutely need to, then it helps to lightly support the furthest end with your hand as you glide towards it, or lightly push down on the nearest end as you glide away from it

i hope the above help.

Maybe I'm unlucky but we always seem to have a building edge or a flagpole or some other strong vertical which gives away the flexibility at once. We're using a heavy (and old) Manfrotto which is very stable.

The allen nuts on the carriage are slackened as far as they can be (the very helpful designer suggested that) but still there's a tendency to stick, especially if there's been a significant change of climate (temp-humidity) in the intervening period. It also takes practice - especially avoiding hitting the central mount.

Don't misunderstand me, for the money it's not bad and reasonable value but I've spent my entire career avoiding "nearly right" things and saving to buy the best I can afford for the job. This IMHO is "nearly right".

I'm hoping the braked pulley (and two tripods) modification will help but we can't expect to use it on weddings as I explained. I would have gladly paid for a unit with a larger carriage on proper bearings but they would have cost of course. I also wish we'd bought the heavier unit but the designer's opinion was that it wasn't necessary.

I often read comments that there is additional equipment that is needed. For example a couple extra tripods...not always necessary. But it is a benefit to use the GC or Pegasus, etc, elevated. Depends on the shot you have in mind. Sometimes its going to take a little extra equipment to get the kind of shots you want. Whether that be a jib a steadicam, GC, track system. No doubt its extra work but the benefits of using the extra tools to make the kind of film you want is going to raise the production value. I only say this because I used to be concerned with the amount of equipment but soon realized that it is worth it. If it causes you to have to arrive a bit early stay a bit later, so what....your product and your brand will certainly reflect this. I'm not saying that you have to have this equipment but use the tools that you think will polish off the production. If its cost, thats one thing, but if its not cost and just an effort factor, we need to figure out a way to make it work.

I just think that we are too quick to write off a particular piece of equipment because of the additional effort it is going to require.

(snipped)... use the tools that you think will polish off the production. If its cost, thats one thing, but if its not cost and just an effort factor, we need to figure out a way to make it work.

I just think that we are too quick to write off a particular piece of equipment because of the additional effort it is going to require.

I think John's point is well made. The problem is at weddings specifically the balance between investment/profitability and time/polish is often critical and the time you think you have to invest in getting say a GT shot done suddenly disappears because something unexpected has occurred - and unexpected occurrences are the very stuff of weddings.

Perhaps I didn't make it clear that I now concentrate specifically on weddings and it was in that context that I gave my opinion, in other circumstances I agree with John's point.

Here is our latest piece which features shots from the GT compact.

Elizabeth & Dave | Highlights at Notley Abbey Mintyslippers.com Wedding Blog (http://www.mintyslippers.com/blog/elizabeth-dave-highlights-notley-abbey.html)

I have a glidetrack and it's good for its money, although repetition is the key to getting the right shot. But recently I discovered the ultimate gear for this job. It's the Miniskater and you can see it here

P+S TECHNIK | Professional Cine Equipment Manufacture | SKATER Camera Dolly Product Family (http://www.pstechnik.de/en/skater.php)

And here is a video demo

SKATER Mini - Trailer (http://www.ready2roll.de/Skatertest/Player/01Trailer.html)

Not only it can do the glidetrack moves but also circular moves and more! Strange thing is, there is no price anywhere, it says there are rental spots and for a buying price you must contact them via email! Bizarre, but this device is certainly outstanding!