I just did a wedding last Saturday where the dance floor was very nicely lighten up with "disco" lights (multiple colors and strobes). My camera handled it very well and it allowed me to run on +3 or +6 dB gain. Of course I had to use additional light (I have Bescor 50W on camera light) to fill-in for faces.

I'm just curious what you guys use as a fill-in on-camera light for darker scenes. What kind of lights and batteries and how long it last? I would love to run a 5-6 hrs reception on the least amount of batteries - currently I need at least 3-4 12v 7Ah Lead-Acid rechargeables.

For 50w lights you should stick with what you have or go with Anton Bauer batteries. But with a charging system an AB battery system for your light starts at at well over $1K.

I'd stick with what you have or if you can get by with less light then you could try the Micropanel on camera light for $300, which uses AA batteries (I think) or the SIMA SL20 for $39 which lasts for 40 minutes and is rechargeable. I have six of them, they do well.

The Sony 10/20 watt light that uses 970 batteries is my other light, and it goes for a couple of hours and throws out a decent amount of light. I also own a Lowell ID light for use with a lead acid battery, but I don't use it much.

I would also check in the lighting forum, as they keep up to date on this stuff pretty well.

Some guys put two Lowell or Bescor 50w or 100W lights on light stands, hook them up to batteries, and let them run. You put them up high, and they work great. You should bounce one off the ceiling for the best effect.

I use the the Sony 10/20 with the 970 battery as well and it's enough to cover the whole wedding (the times of course that you need the extra light).

Stelios

The Sony 10/20 works but it's junk. If you can't dim the light in someones face it's worthless. I have a Swit light which works great. It put's out about 35 watts, works with Sony batteries, lasts all night and is just as light (meaning weight) as the 10/20. I'm about to buy a Comer 1800 light and I'll let you know how that goes. Take a look at the thread going on in the Z7 forum.

For the Sony light I use the Stoffen diffuser which fits on the front and softens the light perfectly for interviews. It cost about $10 and will fit in your pocket if your trousers aren't too tight.

I don't have a link but google the stoffen and the sony light together if interested and you'll find it quickly enough.

Jeff, I have one of those lights. I actually keep it thrown in my bag in case of an emergency. I know they make some diffusers for them now but at the time I was using it they made nothing for it. I bought a diffuser for a camera flash, and with velcro on the sides, made my own. It worked better but there is still no substitute for a good light with a dimmer. I haven't even wanted to use that light for over 2 years. Yes, these other lights are 3 times the cost of the 10/20 but they make up for it in every way possible. Use one of these LED lights on one shoot and you would never go back to the 10/20. I'm not putting down your equipment and workflow, I'm just saying there is a much better way, especially since you're in the wedding market.

I have a Swit light which works great. It put's out about 35 watts, works with Sony batteries,

Rob which one have you got and what is the Luminance at 1m?

Stelios

I have the Swit model 2010 I believe. I'm not sure what the light output is at a meter. I can tell you even with the filter and diffuser it's brighter than the Sony and much more even spread of light. I just purchased a Comer 1800 and I've heard it has nice color output and much brighter than the Swit. I should get it next week. If I have time I'll dig out my light meter and see if I can give you the comparison you're looking for between the three units.

Rob

I found out that the luminance of the Sony light 10/20 is 800 lux at 1m and the Swit S-2010 is 550 lux at 1m. This means, theoretically, that the Sony one is brighter than the Swit model.

Stelios

The Swit looks too much like the poorly reviewed Sony LED for me, though I'm sure it's a fine light.

As I mentioned earlier I have an Lowell ID light (with dimmer) up to 100 watts but I actually use both the Sony and the Sima 20 LCD instead.

The Sima LCDs only last 40 minutes but I run two at a time and they are plenty bright when combined. No dimmer but I just run either one or two and it seems to work out fine.

I admit the Comer 1800 looks nice, but at $400 cannot be worth the price to me. Considering a 100w professional broadcast light by Lowell runs $229 and is at least twice as powerful it is too much.

Jeff, the reason these LED lights are appealing to me is the fact that I don't have to carry around a battery pack all night. I keep my 100 watt light & battery pack attached to my tripod so when I'm not mobile, and need additional light, it's there. I know by the end of the night my butt is usually dragging.

Stelios, as soon as I get the other light I'll do a side by side comparison and try to shoot some footage.

The Comer is actually tempting Rob, and appears to be pretty nice. I criticized it's price but actually almost ordered one last night anyway, as I would love to have one. I might see what you think of yours and consider it again.

The Simas used in an array of two are nice because they weigh almost nothing, about an ounce. When I need less light I switch one off and presto I'm good for an interview.

The Sony battery is heavy and I hate the way it throws off the balance of the camera.

I purchased the Comer 1800 last week from lacolorshop (Taky Cheung) and it is much more powerful than one might think. I own the Sony 10/20w, have used the Sony HVL-LBP LED and now added the Comer 1800 LED, and I will tell you that the Comer is at least 4x as powerful as the Sony 10/20 (set to 20w), and 1.5 to 2X as powerful as the Sony HVL-LBP LED. Also, it has the best spread of light that I have seen on any on camera light that I have used. The Sony 10/20w looks like a small flashlight with a hotspot (adding my Stofen diffuser makes it better, but cuts the light output significantly).

The Comer 1800 is rated at 1800 lux at 1M, and with the condenser, I would say that the light puts out power equivalent to 75w while only consuming 20W. There are many threads on the Comer 1800 already on DVInfo, a search will yield a lot of positive feedback on this light.

I should have mine by Wednesday. I'm glad to hear the positive feedback.

I ordered one. Pricey, yes, but it does appear to be rather nice.

I purchased the Comer 1800 last week from lacolorshop (Taky Cheung) and it is much more powerful than one might think. I own the Sony 10/20w, have used the Sony HVL-LBP LED and now added the Comer 1800 LED, and I will tell you that the Comer is at least 4x as powerful as the Sony 10/20 (set to 20w...

Sony 10/20w = $87
Comer 1800 = $410

It better be more powerful...

Stelios

For the about the same amount of money the Micro Pro seems quite good also. I'm thinking of getting one of those as well but MUCH lighter.

I'm tired of lighting issues and decided to just spend and be done with it.

What I've been using has worked, but the Simas run out in 40 minutes and while the Sony isn't horrible, it really is more like a flashlight with a narrow dispersion of light. I was watching a video with my customers and the Sony really didn't do that well on a large dance floor.

Stelios,

Its not just more powerful, it has a built-in condenser, diffuser (w/3200K gel) and barn doors to protect the light. It spreads light that covers the full range of my Z7 (which is about 32mm on the wide end). The Sony 10/20w without the diffuser is like a small flashlight, and with the diffuser is simply not powerful enough to use for anything but close-up work.

Jeff,

Are you planning to use the Comer 1800 on an FX1000 or Z5/Z7? The reason I ask is because the light is somewhat heavy with the NPF-970, and mounting it on the front of a FX1000 will make it very front heavy. On the Z5/Z7 you can mount it on the handle (see attachments), which on the Z7 actually balances the camera better than with no light at all (as the Z7 is already front-heavy with its stock lens).

Alex, I just attempted to cancel my order. That thing with a battery is REALLY big. I had no idea. I cannot thank you enought for the pics.

I am hoping to cancel and go with the Micro Pro. Not as good of a light but weight-wise definitely superior.

What I've read of the Micro Pro it seems pretty darn effective compared to the older version. Can anyone confirm that?

Jeff, while the Comer 1800 may look big in the pics, it really does balance very well on the handle, so if you have a Z5/Z7, I don't think it will be an issue. I would be curious to see the LightPanels Micro Pro against the Comer 1800, but from what I've seen online (YouTube - Cool New MicroPro LED Lighting from Litepanels (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hev2DtcN5rA)) they claim that the MicroPro consumes only 9 watts and outputs 55 watts, which I find hard to believe considering it doesn't even come with a condenser lens. From a cost perspective, the MicroPro is about $60-70 more expensive (but there is probably some savings in being able to use NiMH AA batteries).

Would you care to get both and be the first on the site to do a test? I'm sure there are many people who would be curious (myself included). Maybe Taky would be willing to let you return the Comer 1800 if you decide on the MicroPro, and vice versa there are many reputable vendors online that will take back the MicroPro if the Comer 1800 becomes the light of choice.

Alex, I just attempted to cancel my order. That thing with a battery is REALLY big. I had no idea. I cannot thank you enought for the pics.

I am hoping to cancel and go with the Micro Pro. Not as good of a light but weight-wise definitely superior.

What I've read of the Micro Pro it seems pretty darn effective compared to the older version. Can anyone confirm that?

Jeff, Jeff, Jeff you are really very impulsive (like me) in getting all excited about buying products before you do a thorough research if it is the right product for you. I can't tell you how many times I have ordered things on the spare of the moment, only to regret it later on.

Stelios

I don't have a Z5, I have an FX1000. The light will not balance on my camera.

It is not coming out of the box. He has shipped it but I will be returning it unopened. I appreciate that he has a full refund policy if the box if unopened.

Stelios, I was never "excited" about the light.

After I ordered the light Gene posted the first pics I have seen of the light mounted on a camera.

There is very little on the web about the light and very little to go on other than the "glowing" reviews.

I was just watching a demo of the condenser lens trick. Wow, that is very cool.

I was just watching a demo of the condenser lens trick. Wow, that is very cool.

Where can we see that Jeff?

I can't find it Stelios...I originally found the link on his site but I cannot find it again....I have to leave but will look for it later.

Stelios, below is a link to a demo of the Comer 1800 w/the Condenser trick (around 1:20 into the video):

YouTube - Shooting with Comer CM-LBPS1800 with Backlighting (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81OlZFBJoeE&feature=related&fmt=18)

Thx guys for all suggestions. I'm just not too happy with Comer 1800 battery solutions which adds extra weight - especially for handheld/shoulder usage.

What would you guys say about following choice of lights in $400 price range:
1) new Comer 1800
or
2) used Zylight 50

This is another video showing the condenser trick too

YouTube - Comer CM-LBPS1800 Backlight Test and Zooming in with the the Condenser Trick (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhvxJl53M3E)

[QUOTE=Alex Goldshteyn;1166873]Stelios, below is a link to a demo of the Comer 1800 w/the Condenser trick (around 1:20 into the video):

What is a "condenser lens trick" ?

Stelios

[QUOTE=Alex Goldshteyn;1166873]Stelios, below is a link to a demo of the Comer 1800 w/the Condenser trick (around 1:20 into the video):

What is a "condenser lens trick" ?

Stelios

The condensor lens trick is when you apply the condensor lens but leave approximately a 15 degree angle between the lens and the light, which intensifies the spotlight effect and generates more power into a smaller space. If you look at Taky's video, he provides a good example of how it works.

I don't have a Z5, I have an FX1000. The light will not balance on my camera.

It is not coming out of the box. He has shipped it but I will be returning it unopened. I appreciate that he has a full refund policy if the box if unopened.

Jeff - I used the Sony HVL-LBP (exactly same size and weight) on both my FX1 and V1U and didn't find it a problem - you can use the 770 battery and get about an hour to an hour and a half out of it. I now use the Comer 1800 on my Sony PMW-EX1 and have no problem although I am using the Hoodman Wrist Shot -
WristShot® Camcorder Support System-Hoodman Corporation (http://www.hoodmanusa.com/prodinfo.asp?number=H%2DWS1)
and found that it works quite well in freeing up your left hand for manual adjustments to the camera.

I did try the Litepanels MicroPro and ended up sending it back - the beam is much narrower than the Comer 1800 and the light output is much less than the Comer.

Thanks for the info Barry.

I might try the light out, it really seems to be the best bang for the buck.

Jeff - I used the Sony HVL-LBP (exactly same size and weight) on both my FX1 and V1U and didn't find it a problem - you can use the 770 battery and get about an hour to an hour and a half out of it. I now use the Comer 1800 on my Sony PMW-EX1 and have no problem although I am using the Hoodman Wrist Shot -
WristShot® Camcorder Support System-Hoodman Corporation (http://www.hoodmanusa.com/prodinfo.asp?number=H%2DWS1)
and found that it works quite well in freeing up your left hand for manual adjustments to the camera.

I did try the Litepanels MicroPro and ended up sending it back - the beam is much narrower than the Comer 1800 and the light output is much less than the Comer.

Barry, do you have any video comparing the Comer 1800 and the Litepanels MicroPro? I'd be curious to see the difference, especially since the MicroPro is about $70 more expensive.

If you go to youtube you can find videos if you do a search. What I saw yesterday evening was not impressive at all.

It seems it doesn’t matter what product you buy, there are concessions to be made somewhere. We continually strive to put out better video and sometimes that means having to be inconvenienced at times. I was carrying around S-VHS tapes at one point. That was a hassle. I’ll give you my report once my light comes in.

[QUOTE=Stelios Christofides;1166966]

The condensor lens trick is when you apply the condensor lens but leave approximately a 15 degree angle between the lens and the light, which intensifies the spotlight effect and generates more power into a smaller space. If you look at Taky's video, he provides a good example of how it works.

So, I presume, that this condensor lens is part of the Comer 1800 light then.

Stelios

Barry, do you have any video comparing the Comer 1800 and the Litepanels MicroPro? I'd be curious to see the difference, especially since the MicroPro is about $70 more expensive.

I don't have a video comparing them directly - at the time I shot my first comparison I compared the Sony HVL-LBP and the MicroPro - it (the MicroPro) really didn't put out much more light and, using the condenser lens on the Sony, it was much less bright + the beam field with the MicroPro was much narrower than the Sony. I then sent the MicroPro back and bought the Comer 1800 and compared it to the Sony light under the exact same conditions as the previous test and there was no comparison - at least 2-3 times the light output of the Sony. I then sent the Sony back for resale with BHphotovideo and bought a second Comer!

That is a pretty good breakdown, thanks for sharing Barry.

[QUOTE=Alex Goldshteyn;1167034]

So, I presume, that this condensor lens is part of the Comer 1800 light then.

Stelios

Yes, the condensor lens is attached to the bottom of the light and flips up when you want to apply it (see images on page 2). It has small magnifiers for each of the 10 LEDs that turn them into a strong spotlight.

On a side note, my recent battery test has this light running 188 minutes at full power on a Sony NPF-970! Thats 48 minutes longer than the Comer brochure states that the light would run.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/photon-management/238456-comer-1800-battery-test.html

I’m not used to posting any pictures so hopefully this helps. I haven’t had time to really mess with the Comer 1800 Light but on initial try out, it clearly is superior to the other 2 lights. I shot at aperture 3.4, shutter 60, manual WB. I shot at 5 feet and 10 feet. Giving the Sony 10/20 the benefit of the doubt, it was turned sideways. I’m so busy right now but hopefully this is enough to help anyone interested. I’ll shoot with it this weekend and will give more feedback.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/members/rob-morse-albums-misc-picture304-sony-10-20-light.jpg

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/members/rob-morse-albums-misc-picture305-swit-5-feet.jpg

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/members/rob-morse-albums-misc-picture307-comer-5feet.jpg

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/members/rob-morse-albums-misc-picture306-swit-10-feet.jpg

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/members/rob-morse-albums-misc-picture308-comer-10-feet.jpg

The order of quality was Comer 1800, Swit 2010 and Sony 10/20 clearly last.

The Comer is the clear champ, quite a light.

Thank you Rob, nice work.

Thanks Jeff, I hope it helps. One of the things I didn't mention was that the room was completely dark. Also, all the lights were at full intensity. The Comer 1800 was actually too bright at 5', even with the filter, but I didn't want to change the aperture on the camera or dim the light in order the keep everything the same. From what I've seen so far, this is going to be an awesome light.

I dont feel bad about the Sony 10/20w for the money....

For $90 its certainly OK. The Sima SL 20 is somewhat close and costs only $35 and weighs almost nothing, and is self charging. It does have a slight cast to it though. The Comer from what we're seeing in photos and video samples kills the others.

I dont feel bad about the Sony 10/20w for the money....

You can get by with the light in a 4:3 environment. In widescreen, it just doesn't cut it for me. If it works for you, then it's a bargain. For me, I would rather spend the extra money and have a more professional product that enhances my productions. Someone else might want to spend the extra money and get a Zylight or other high dollar items on the market.
If something works for you and your customers are happy with the quality of your finished product, that's all that matters. I'm not selling the product, I'm just throwing it out there for anyone who is interested.

Actually the Comer 900 light is a cheaper alternative. It's smaller and lighter. the light output is also significantly better than the Canon VL-10, LP Micro, and SWIT/Varisoom light too.

You can check out these clips

YouTube - 6 On-Camera Video Lights Shootout - Test #2 Medium Size Room (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2CbyVIY4ak)

YouTube - Comer CM-LBPS900 LED Light (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucrlI-GQ6AI)

Well Taky, I'm looking forward to receiving my Comer 900.

To all, I switched to the 900 strictly for weight reasons, but am confident the light will work fine even if not as strong as the 1800.

Thanks for the excellent customer service Taky, you're the best!

Jeff, Do you think that you will see a big difference between the Sony 10/20 (800 lux, $90) and the Comer 900 (900 lux,$280)?

Stelios

I do. I'll actually set up the light next to the sony and take photographs with my Canon 40d and we'll see exactly. I could be wrong, but I expect much better results with the Comer based on Taky's videos.

I'll keep you posted.