please be very patient with me an amateur. This is the problem : I took loads of lovely video using a Canon HG10 last year but have been unable to view it on a PC screen cos as you know AVCHD format is a resources hungry beast !

all i have at the moment is 4-yr old Pentium 4 with only 1.5 gb memory.

So guys what is the optimum PC spec to see and edit these AVCHD files ? in terms of memory, graphics card, processor, hard drive space etc,.. plus anything else?

And what is good software to edit the files ? is video studio 11.5 + by Corel good for this ?

I'm in the UK so might not be able to source the software u states guys do.

many many thanks!

Welcome to the forum. You would do well to search this topic, as it has been covered for some time now. Try this for a start http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/avchd-format-discussion/234762-regarding-editing-avchd-new-news.html

thanks oren, but yipes...that is VERY tecchie chat and only understand bits of it ...please understand i'm a TOTAL camera newbie and this the first camcorder ...min spec for avchd files ?

thanks!

To summarize -

quad core highly recommended, although you can slug along on a fast dual core. BEST would be an i7 quad core.

2G RAM, 4-6 probably better.

7200 RPM Hard drives minimum, have a "system" and a "media" drive for better performance.

You want a fast system bus if possible (communication channel between CPU/RAM/HDD subsystem) - Hard disk space depends mainly on how much you need to store files while you work, but you need speed between components to handle the demands of all the decompression AVCHD requires without choking. Faster the better...

Video cards depend on which NLE (non linear editing) program you use - some don't care much about the video card... so choose the program first and meet the specs. I use Vegas, but I used VS in the past and liked it, there are forums here for most major NLE's, best to peruse them a bit, but Vegas studio is probably a fairly safe bet, and not terribley video card dependent.

That's a sort of laymans summary, might have some minor technical holes in it, but should provide you some "non-geek" guidance.

How much money do you have?

Send it in!

Get the fastest computer you can get.

No matter how fast the computer, don't edit avchd! Convert it to another format. AVCHD, like HDV, was designed as an aquisition format and never intended to be edited directly.

Software is a very personal choice. I use Grass Valley/Canopus Edius for most things and Sony Vegas for the occasional thing that Edius doesn't do particularly well. Pretty much every company has a free trial version.

thanks guys ! but excuse another daft question - in the meantime can I connect my HG10 to a digital TV - to view the videos ?

and Andy convert avchd to WHICH format for editing ? and during process of conversion is there any loss of picture quality ?

And PLEASE most important - for backing up the files I've just copied the whole kit-caboodle onto a usb stick - is that sufficient ? only I'm really stuck until I buy a new pc

cheers!

and Andy convert avchd to WHICH format for editing ? and during process of conversion is there any loss of picture quality ?


From MTS-->AVI.

The biggest player is Cineform--lots of information here. I believe a small portion of the full package is built into Vegas.

I'm an Edius user. It comes with (no addtional cost) the Canopus HQ codec.

Either way, you are moving from an aquisition codec to a post-production codec. Specifically designed to retain all the quality of the original and also allow a good deal of manipulation.

You can connect direct to a TV; the HG10 comes with various leads. Which one is best depends on the TV. If you're struggling, it might be worth going into somewhere like Jessops and asking for help.

As to which format for editing - depends on the software.

If you go the Mac route, Macs come with iMovie which automatically uses an Apple codec.

If you the PC route, different software will offer different options, each of which has its fans. Many people swear by Sony Vegas as great beginners software, but which allows you to advance a lot - and cheap.

On hardware: you need as much memory as you can get (4GB is good). Fast processor are great, but 2-core will be fine for the time being. If you can afford quad-core or better, go for it, but it's not necessary. You need a decent graphics card in the PC.

I would recommend nothing less than a quadcore, at best a i7Core for video rendering..
Either one will handle AVCHD footage...My i7 core setup handles AVCHD footage from my HG10 and HG21 with ease...editing is a breeze in Vegas without the need for cineform.....

thanks guys just come back to this site about this ongoing problem not yet tackled due to laziness ...please tell me whether this spec :

AMD Phenom™ X4 9650 Quad Core Processor

ATI Radeon™ HD4550 DirectX® 10.1 graphic card with 512 MB dedicated memory onboard and integrated HDMI-/DVI-interface

640 GB hard disk

4 GB 4096 MB DDR2 Dual Channel SDRAM with 800 MHz 64 Bit1

would be OK to deal with these home movie AVCHD files ?

Thanks so much,
Em

I would not recommend the AMD chips, I would most CERTAINLY recommend an NVidia graphics card over an ATI, and you're definitely going to want more than 1 drive in the machine.

Perrone Ford - thank you!

please explain why more than 1 drive ?

Perrone Ford - thank you!

please explain why more than 1 drive ?

Because when you work with video, three things are going on.

1. Your operating system is generally accessing the paging file to make up for you not having enough RAM. (that means reads and writes to your hard drive)

2. You video program is trying to read the source video file.

3. Your video program is trying to write the rendered file.

Thus you have multiple reads and writes all competing for the same slow hard drive all the time. Dragging performance down a LOT. This is why it's generally recommended to keep your OS drive away from any videos, and why it's recommended to keep your project source files away from the drive where you render or capture. One drive is the worst of all scenarios.

Perrone - please give me the ideal spec for AVCHD edit and viewing home movies.

Its the summer ! - find myself with time to built a machine to suit the purpose...
thanks guys

Perrone - please give me the ideal spec for AVCHD edit and viewing home movies.

Its the summer ! - find myself with time to built a machine to suit the purpose...
thanks guys

I can't give you an ideal machine, because it doesn't exist. The machine I might spec could be totally unsuitable to you. In general, you want 2-3 drives (the OS drive doesn't need to be that large), as much RAM as you can afford, an Intel i7 processor as fast as you can afford, and preferably two monitors. They don't need to be the latest and greatest, but once you edit with two monitors, you'll wonder how you ever got along without them.

If you can add BluRay to the machine, do that. If not for the movie capability, at least for the excellent storage for your projects. I utterly love having mine.

Best of luck!

Hey.

First off, you've got two options - convert the footage to Cineform and keep the P4 system, or get a better system and edit natively.

I use an HG10 at work, and I edit in Sony Vegas on a Core 2 Duo 2.4Ghz system with 2GB RAM. It plays smoothly when I'm viewing it in a window on "Preview" even after applying color correction effects; it's jittery when I go full-screen or view as full-resolution "best" rendering quality. I'm fine with it and converting to an intermediate codec would probably just slow me down.

At home I use an HG20, and I edit in Sony Vegas on a Core 2 Quad 2.4Ghz system with 4GB RAM.

bryan -so do you think this setup would play 10 minutes home movies avchd files ?

AMD Phenom™ X4 9650 Quad Core Processor

ATI Radeon™ HD4550 DirectX® 10.1 graphic card with 512 MB dedicated memory onboard and integrated HDMI-/DVI-interface

640 GB hard disk

4 GB 4096 MB DDR2 Dual Channel SDRAM with 800 MHz 64 Bit1


---only i'm desperate to see the avchd files, this setup is on cheap offer nr me and waited so long !....

Em,

I can't cleanly preview AVCHD with effects on my 8-core system with 3 drives and 8GB of RAM. Does that help answer your question?

There are a number of ways to solve the problem. You can work with proxy files. You can purchase Cineform, you can transcode the footage into something more computer friendly. But at this time, the i7 systems are doing better than anything else in editing AVCHD which is why I suggested that path to you.

now i don't know what the fook to do !...two people saying different things

perrone please explain 'You can work with proxy files. You can purchase Cineform, you can transcode the footage into something more computer friendly...'

I'm just so desperate to see these videos, been waiting one year becos they're in wretched (i think it is) avchd format. Just phoned COREL who said this spec would be more than enough! going to speak to CANON when i can get hold of them.

??????????????

Em,

Ok, let's back this up.

If all you want to do is LOOK at the footage, then the machine you specified is going to be just fine. If however, you want to do the editing that most people on this site are trying to do, then the machine you specified is going to be a bit underpowered.

There is nothing wrong with AVCHD. It does EXACTLY what it is designed to do. Which is to capture very nice HD images in cameras with minimal artifacting, on small hardware. It is exceptional at that. What it is NOT good at, is being placed on the timeline of a video editing program, and being edited. It was not built for that purpose, and it is totally unsuitable for this purpose.

However, most consumers are unaware of most professional workflows, or refuse to use them, so we see complaint after complaint about how bad AVCHD is to edit. This comes as no surprise to any professional who understand that the format was never designed for that.

To smoothly edit HD footage captured in AVCHD, it is usually necessary to convert (transcode) that footage into a format that was designed to edit with. These formats tend to make far larger files, but offer a great many advantages. One of these formats is offered by a company called Cineform. They do a very nice job, but the solution tends to be a bit pricey. There are other editing formats that do a good job also. Another solution is to use a process called proxy editing. This is where you make a low resolution copy of your footage, edit that, and then at the very end of editing, before you create your final video, you substitute the original footage back in so you get excellent results. This is a very popular workflow with professionals who have to work with footage that makes AVCHD look like a cakewalk.

Again, if all you want to do is LOOK at the footage you shot with your camera, buy the machine you were thinking of. It will work just fine. But when it comes to doing anything more than the most basic editing of that footage, the machine will be slow unless you use one of the other methods outlined here.

aha.. now am starting to get the gist of things thanks a lot perrone..yes i see this site is more for professionals - which I'm not !

So, in conclusion, do you think I could at least join up about 25 short snippets of avchd so that they would run together and copy it to a DVD ? I'm going to try and use Corel VideoStudio X2 Pro. for this, it was recomm. to me by the seller of the HG10.

some other questions about what you said ?

' it is usually necessary to convert (transcode) that footage into a format that was designed to edit with...' 'There are other editing formats that do a good job also. '
what format(s) do you mean here ?

The proxy editing sounds really good - in your opinion do you think I would have any chance of doing this using the Corel software ?

Many many thanks !

Em,

Yes, I think you can certainly join some snippets and convert that for use on a DVD. Many people do it with less hardware than you are looking to buy. The problem comes in when combine many layers, or look to do heavy color correction AND you want that file to play back smoothly. Most machines just aren't fast enough to do that. It will play back stutttery. If you understand that, then you'll be ok.

I am not a fan of Corel anything. And I think if you look around this forums and others like it, you'll see the same few names coming up for editors in the $75-$200 price range. There is a reason for that. Vegas Movie Studio is VERY full featured, at a reasonable price. There are others. I hesitate to recommend anything because I don't have direct experience with these programs as they don't do some things that are crucial to my work. But you can get PLENTY pf help here with recommendations.

In terms of what formats to use for editing, there are several, but choose an editor first. Some editors like to convert that footage into something that is particularly easy for them. And that changes editor to editor. So what works in Adobe, doesn't work in Final Cut, and Canopus might want something yet different again. Cineform is popular because it works in practically any editor and offers good speed. If you can absorb the few hundred bucks it costs, I generally recommend it.

Proxy editing is common and works in just about any editor. Some even have the feature built in. It has it's drawbacks though. It does take more disk space because you have two full copies. It also demands more time because you need to CREATE that second copy before you begin your work. It is for these two reasons that most consumers simply want to drop on the AVCHD file and go straight to work. Not many people are keen to spend a few hours transcoding BEFORE they sit down to edit their videos. For pro's it's just part of the basic workflow that we're used to.

For those who work with film, first you have to get the film developed. Then you get the film scanned at high resolution, then you convert the high res scans to a lo res proxy. Then you being the work, when done then you substitute in the high res version and create the master, then you output the master to a special file format, then you commit the master back to real film! AVCHD is a walk in the park after all that! :)

bryan -so do you think this setup would play 10 minutes home movies avchd files ?

AMD Phenom™ X4 9650 Quad Core Processor

ATI Radeon™ HD4550 DirectX® 10.1 graphic card with 512 MB dedicated memory onboard and integrated HDMI-/DVI-interface

640 GB hard disk

4 GB 4096 MB DDR2 Dual Channel SDRAM with 800 MHz 64 Bit1


---only i'm desperate to see the avchd files, this setup is on cheap offer nr me and waited so long !....

Shouldn't be a problem, so long as you preview at decreased resolution. It's different depending on what NLE you use, however.

If you just want to -view- the files, you can always download VLC media player.

I have a question regarding this topic.

I have a dual core with CS4 and just started loading MTS files. My question: Even if I purchase Neoscene and use the CineForm avi will it edit in real time? I'm near the bottom of Cineforms specs. It's a good dual core though. E6550, 3 gigs ram.